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Re: weight of pieces following RF45 disassembly

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  • John Hansford
    I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:) It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it by myself in
    Message 1 of 19 , May 1 10:16 PM
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      I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
      and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:)

      It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
      by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)

      Pictures here...

      http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mill_drill/photos/browse/40a7

      John





      --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@...> wrote:
      >
      > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a problem
      > then I had feared.
      >
      > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
      > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280# jointer
      > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the RF45
      > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the much
      > lighter weight X3.
      >
      > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200 S&H)
      > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
      >
      > tim
      > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y...> wrote:
      > > Approximate weights are:
      > > Motor 50 pounds
      > > Head without motor 200 pounds
      > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
      > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
      > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
      > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
      >
    • John Hansford
      FWIW.... I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts. A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF was out
      Message 2 of 19 , May 1 10:53 PM
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        FWIW....
        I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
        A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
        think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
        was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
        near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)

        I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
        procedures....very similar. I also downloaded
        the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
        very helpful to see how things fit.

        3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
        2 for the first hour...;)
        But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
        head didn't bind into motor wires or against
        any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
        balance of the head with the motor still
        attached when lifted away from the column.
        scary, but it was a near perfect balance.

        The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
        "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
        top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
        it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
        to avoid too much scratching up.

        The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.

        I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
        getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
        it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
        somewhat permanently in place. The roll
        pins need to be carefully punched out to
        get the table off. I think I found out that
        from the Industrial Hobbies site.

        So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
        condition! Nothing like what I feared from
        weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
        no attention. I have to say that after those
        long hours of studying up on which mill to
        buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster...then
        Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
        I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.

        Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
        amount of cosmoline....mine works out of the box.
        Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
        is easy.

        But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!

        Hope that's useful...;)

        John





        --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@...> wrote:
        >
        > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
        > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:)
        >
        > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
        > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
        >
        > Pictures here...
        >
        > http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mill_drill/photos/browse/40a7
        >
        > John
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
        > >
        > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a problem
        > > then I had feared.
        > >
        > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
        > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280# jointer
        > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the RF45
        > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the
        much
        > > lighter weight X3.
        > >
        > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200 S&H)
        > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
        > >
        > > tim
        > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y...> wrote:
        > > > Approximate weights are:
        > > > Motor 50 pounds
        > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
        > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
        > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
        > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
        > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
        > >
        >
      • Druid Noibn
        Hi John, Congrats! My 45 is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200 LB cast iron
        Message 3 of 19 , May 2 4:11 AM
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          Hi John,
           
          Congrats!  My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200 LB cast iron base.
           
          To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
           
          Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
           
          Take care,
          DBN

          John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
          FWIW....
          I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
          A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
          think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
          was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
          near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)

          I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
          procedures.. ..very similar. I also downloaded
          the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
          very helpful to see how things fit.

          3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
          2 for the first hour...;)
          But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
          head didn't bind into motor wires or against
          any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
          balance of the head with the motor still
          attached when lifted away from the column.
          scary, but it was a near perfect balance.

          The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
          "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
          top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
          it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
          to avoid too much scratching up.

          The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.

          I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
          getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
          it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
          somewhat permanently in place. The roll
          pins need to be carefully punched out to
          get the table off. I think I found out that
          from the Industrial Hobbies site.

          So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
          condition! Nothing like what I feared from
          weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
          no attention. I have to say that after those
          long hours of studying up on which mill to
          buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster. ..then
          Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
          I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.

          Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
          amount of cosmoline... .mine works out of the box.
          Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
          is easy.

          But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!

          Hope that's useful...;)

          John

          --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@...> wrote:
          >
          > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
          > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition... :)
          >
          > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
          > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
          >
          > Pictures here...
          >
          > http://ph.groups. yahoo.com/ group/mill_ drill/photos/ browse/40a7
          >
          > John
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
          > >
          > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a problem
          > > then I had feared.
          > >
          > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
          > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280# jointer
          > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the RF45
          > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the
          much
          > > lighter weight X3.
          > >
          > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200 S&H)
          > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
          > >
          > > tim
          > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y. ..> wrote:
          > > > Approximate weights are:
          > > > Motor 50 pounds
          > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
          > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
          > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
          > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
          > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
          > >
          >



          Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.

        • John Hansford
          Thanks DBN! Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3 for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...;) I d have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
          Message 4 of 19 , May 2 8:58 AM
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            Thanks DBN!

            Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
            for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...;)
            I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
            much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
            dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
            extremely careful...

            My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
            only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
            Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
            little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
            But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
            do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
            extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
            I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
            I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!

            I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
            move that big table for the first time....it's much
            like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
            made a goooood decision...:)

            John


            --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi John,
            >
            > Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to
            be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200
            LB cast iron base.
            >
            > To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done
            as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
            >
            > Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
            >
            > Take care,
            > DBN
            >
            > John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
            > FWIW....
            > I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
            > A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
            > think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
            > was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
            > near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
            >
            > I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
            > procedures....very similar. I also downloaded
            > the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
            > very helpful to see how things fit.
            >
            > 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
            > 2 for the first hour...;)
            > But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
            > head didn't bind into motor wires or against
            > any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
            > balance of the head with the motor still
            > attached when lifted away from the column.
            > scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
            >
            > The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
            > "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
            > top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
            > it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
            > to avoid too much scratching up.
            >
            > The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
            >
            > I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
            > getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
            > it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
            > somewhat permanently in place. The roll
            > pins need to be carefully punched out to
            > get the table off. I think I found out that
            > from the Industrial Hobbies site.
            >
            > So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
            > condition! Nothing like what I feared from
            > weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
            > no attention. I have to say that after those
            > long hours of studying up on which mill to
            > buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster...then
            > Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
            > I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
            >
            > Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
            > amount of cosmoline....mine works out of the box.
            > Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
            > is easy.
            >
            > But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
            >
            > Hope that's useful...;)
            >
            > John
            >
            > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@> wrote:
            > >
            > > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
            > > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:)
            > >
            > > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
            > > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
            > >
            > > Pictures here...
            > >
            > > http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mill_drill/photos/browse/40a7
            > >
            > > John
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a
            problem
            > > > then I had feared.
            > > >
            > > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
            > > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280# jointer
            > > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the
            RF45
            > > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the
            > much
            > > > lighter weight X3.
            > > >
            > > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200
            S&H)
            > > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
            > > >
            > > > tim
            > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y...> wrote:
            > > > > Approximate weights are:
            > > > > Motor 50 pounds
            > > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
            > > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
            > > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
            > > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
            > > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
            > > >
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
            Try it now.
            >
          • Druid Noibn
            Hi John, I do like my 45 although I was hit with a few snags - the head leaked and I took the approach that I would only do so much to address a warranty
            Message 5 of 19 , May 2 9:11 AM
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              Hi John,
               
              I do like my "45" although I was hit with a few snags - the head leaked and I took the approach that I would only do so much to address a warranty item.  Truth be told, Grizzly offered to repair/replace the whole system - BUT...after moving the tonnage (long story, posted earlier) I was inclined to only have the head repaired.  They did, and it looks to be working fine, so far.  I need to do a few more tests.
               
              Is the system perfect?  No.  If I wanted an order of magnitude better, I would pay the far higher $$$.  I am happy with the unit so far, but I will keep an objective eye open <smile>.
               
              My next projects on the mill-drill is to add the DRO and install a 3-ph, VFD motor. 
               
              Take care,
              DBN
               
               

              John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
              Thanks DBN!

              Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
              for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...; )
              I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
              much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
              dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
              extremely careful...

              My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
              only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
              Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
              little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
              But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
              do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
              extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
              I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
              I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!

              I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
              move that big table for the first time....it's much
              like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
              made a goooood decision...: )

              John

              --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@ ...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi John,
              >
              > Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to
              be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200
              LB cast iron base.
              >
              > To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done
              as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
              >
              > Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
              >
              > Take care,
              > DBN
              >
              > John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
              > FWIW....
              > I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
              > A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
              > think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
              > was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
              > near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
              >
              > I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
              > procedures.. ..very similar. I also downloaded
              > the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
              > very helpful to see how things fit.
              >
              > 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
              > 2 for the first hour...;)
              > But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
              > head didn't bind into motor wires or against
              > any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
              > balance of the head with the motor still
              > attached when lifted away from the column.
              > scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
              >
              > The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
              > "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
              > top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
              > it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
              > to avoid too much scratching up.
              >
              > The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
              >
              > I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
              > getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
              > it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
              > somewhat permanently in place. The roll
              > pins need to be carefully punched out to
              > get the table off. I think I found out that
              > from the Industrial Hobbies site.
              >
              > So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
              > condition! Nothing like what I feared from
              > weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
              > no attention. I have to say that after those
              > long hours of studying up on which mill to
              > buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster. ..then
              > Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
              > I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
              >
              > Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
              > amount of cosmoline... .mine works out of the box.
              > Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
              > is easy.
              >
              > But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
              >
              > Hope that's useful...;)
              >
              > John
              >
              > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@> wrote:
              > >
              > > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
              > > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition... :)
              > >
              > > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
              > > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
              > >
              > > Pictures here...
              > >
              > > http://ph.groups. yahoo.com/ group/mill_ drill/photos/ browse/40a7
              > >
              > > John
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a
              problem
              > > > then I had feared.
              > > >
              > > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
              > > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280# jointer
              > > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the
              RF45
              > > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the
              > much
              > > > lighter weight X3.
              > > >
              > > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200
              S&H)
              > > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
              > > >
              > > > tim
              > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y. ..> wrote:
              > > > > Approximate weights are:
              > > > > Motor 50 pounds
              > > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
              > > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
              > > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
              > > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
              > > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
              > > >
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ------------ --------- --------- ---
              > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
              Try it now.
              >



              Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.

            • fignoggle
              using an engine hoist really helps! even with the metal stand in place, the standard 2-ton hoist can get its legs around it and move the entire unit. we just
              Message 6 of 19 , May 2 9:30 AM
              • 0 Attachment
                using an engine hoist really helps! even with the metal stand in place,
                the standard 2-ton hoist can get its legs around it and move the entire
                unit. we just put a strap around the underside of the head at the column
                and lift.

                our website shows taking the machine apart, but it's very doable in one
                piece, though it tilts forward...
                http://www.fignoggle.com/machines/rf45-dovetail-square-column-mill/enco-rong-fu-45-dovetail-column-mill-reassembly.htm

                congrats on the purchases!
                david


                On Fri, 2 May 2008, John Hansford wrote:

                > Thanks DBN!
                >
                > Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
                > for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...;)
                > I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
                > much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
                > dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
                > extremely careful...
                >
                > My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
                > only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
                > Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
                > little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
                > But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
                > do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
                > extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
                > I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
                > I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!
                >
                > I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
                > move that big table for the first time....it's much
                > like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
                > made a goooood decision...:)
                >
                > John
                >
                >
                > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@...> wrote:
                >>
                >> Hi John,
                >>
                >> Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to
                > be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200
                > LB cast iron base.
                >>
                >> To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done
                > as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
                >>
                >> Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
                >>
                >> Take care,
                >> DBN
                >>
                >> John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
                >> FWIW....
                >> I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
                >> A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
                >> think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
                >> was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
                >> near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
                >>
                >> I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
                >> procedures....very similar. I also downloaded
                >> the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
                >> very helpful to see how things fit.
                >>
                >> 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
                >> 2 for the first hour...;)
                >> But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
                >> head didn't bind into motor wires or against
                >> any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
                >> balance of the head with the motor still
                >> attached when lifted away from the column.
                >> scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
                >>
                >> The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
                >> "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
                >> top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
                >> it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
                >> to avoid too much scratching up.
                >>
                >> The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
                >>
                >> I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
                >> getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
                >> it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
                >> somewhat permanently in place. The roll
                >> pins need to be carefully punched out to
                >> get the table off. I think I found out that
                >> from the Industrial Hobbies site.
                >>
                >> So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
                >> condition! Nothing like what I feared from
                >> weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
                >> no attention. I have to say that after those
                >> long hours of studying up on which mill to
                >> buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster...then
                >> Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
                >> I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
                >>
                >> Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
                >> amount of cosmoline....mine works out of the box.
                >> Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
                >> is easy.
                >>
                >> But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
                >>
                >> Hope that's useful...;)
                >>
                >> John
                >>
                >> --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@> wrote:
                >>>
                >>> I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
                >>> and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:)
                >>>
                >>> It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
                >>> by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
                >>>
                >>> Pictures here...
                >>>
                >>> http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mill_drill/photos/browse/40a7
                >>>
                >>> John
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>> --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
                >>>>
                >>>> That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a
                > problem
                >>>> then I had feared.
                >>>>
                >>>> I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
                >>>> While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280# jointer
                >>>> down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the
                > RF45
                >>>> definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the
                >> much
                >>>> lighter weight X3.
                >>>>
                >>>> Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200
                > S&H)
                >>>> and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
                >>>>
                >>>> tim
                >>>> --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y...> wrote:
                >>>>> Approximate weights are:
                >>>>> Motor 50 pounds
                >>>>> Head without motor 200 pounds
                >>>>> Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
                >>>>> X axis 100 to 125 pounds
                >>>>> Column 125 to 150 pounds
                >>>>> Base 75 to 100 pounds
                >>>>
                >>>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> ---------------------------------
                >> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                > Try it now.
                >>
                >
                >
                >
                >

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              • John Hansford
                I was thinking about the DRO...but I m going to do another one of my usual bending of common sense rules here...;) I noticed the motion is much smoother than
                Message 7 of 19 , May 2 10:23 AM
                • 0 Attachment
                  I was thinking about the DRO...but I'm going to
                  do another one of my usual bending of common
                  sense rules here...;)

                  I noticed the motion is much smoother than I'd
                  have expected. A plain old 250 oz. stepper motor at
                  34VDC will move it with no trouble I'm 100%
                  sure. So as I have some 1/2-10 2-start acme on
                  hand, I'm going to cnc the X & Y for now with
                  just plain old Delrin nuts. It'll be a pretty
                  easy 1 day project. That'll work very well enough
                  to go ahead and mill out some better aluminum
                  parts for the longer term.

                  I'm figuring for basically the same $$$ as the DRO,
                  I'll just cnc it in a few steps. I Know already
                  that many will say you *Must* use ballscrews, but
                  from my experience here with Delrin and Acme,
                  absolute satisfactory results are very easily
                  and cheaply done. Just how well it works is yet
                  to be seen, but I swear I have some great faith that
                  it'll be far more durable than many would expect....;)

                  Once I get a little free time...

                  :)
                  John

                  --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi John,
                  >
                  > I do like my "45" although I was hit with a few snags - the head
                  leaked and I took the approach that I would only do so much to address
                  a warranty item. Truth be told, Grizzly offered to repair/replace the
                  whole system - BUT...after moving the tonnage (long story, posted
                  earlier) I was inclined to only have the head repaired. They did, and
                  it looks to be working fine, so far. I need to do a few more tests.
                  >
                  > Is the system perfect? No. If I wanted an order of magnitude
                  better, I would pay the far higher $$$. I am happy with the unit so
                  far, but I will keep an objective eye open <smile>.
                  >
                  > My next projects on the mill-drill is to add the DRO and install a
                  3-ph, VFD motor.
                  >
                  > Take care,
                  > DBN
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
                  > Thanks DBN!
                  >
                  > Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
                  > for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...;)
                  > I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
                  > much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
                  > dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
                  > extremely careful...
                  >
                  > My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
                  > only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
                  > Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
                  > little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
                  > But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
                  > do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
                  > extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
                  > I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
                  > I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!
                  >
                  > I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
                  > move that big table for the first time....it's much
                  > like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
                  > made a goooood decision...:)
                  >
                  > John
                  >
                  > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hi John,
                  > >
                  > > Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to
                  > be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200
                  > LB cast iron base.
                  > >
                  > > To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done
                  > as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
                  > >
                  > > Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
                  > >
                  > > Take care,
                  > > DBN
                  > >
                  > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                  > > FWIW....
                  > > I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
                  > > A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
                  > > think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
                  > > was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
                  > > near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
                  > >
                  > > I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
                  > > procedures....very similar. I also downloaded
                  > > the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
                  > > very helpful to see how things fit.
                  > >
                  > > 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
                  > > 2 for the first hour...;)
                  > > But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
                  > > head didn't bind into motor wires or against
                  > > any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
                  > > balance of the head with the motor still
                  > > attached when lifted away from the column.
                  > > scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
                  > >
                  > > The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
                  > > "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
                  > > top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
                  > > it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
                  > > to avoid too much scratching up.
                  > >
                  > > The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
                  > >
                  > > I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
                  > > getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
                  > > it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
                  > > somewhat permanently in place. The roll
                  > > pins need to be carefully punched out to
                  > > get the table off. I think I found out that
                  > > from the Industrial Hobbies site.
                  > >
                  > > So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
                  > > condition! Nothing like what I feared from
                  > > weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
                  > > no attention. I have to say that after those
                  > > long hours of studying up on which mill to
                  > > buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster...then
                  > > Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
                  > > I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
                  > >
                  > > Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
                  > > amount of cosmoline....mine works out of the box.
                  > > Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
                  > > is easy.
                  > >
                  > > But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
                  > >
                  > > Hope that's useful...;)
                  > >
                  > > John
                  > >
                  > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
                  > > > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:)
                  > > >
                  > > > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
                  > > > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
                  > > >
                  > > > Pictures here...
                  > > >
                  > > > http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mill_drill/photos/browse/40a7
                  > > >
                  > > > John
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a
                  > problem
                  > > > > then I had feared.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
                  > > > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280#
                  jointer
                  > > > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the
                  > RF45
                  > > > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the
                  > > much
                  > > > > lighter weight X3.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200
                  > S&H)
                  > > > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
                  > > > >
                  > > > > tim
                  > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y...>
                  wrote:
                  > > > > > Approximate weights are:
                  > > > > > Motor 50 pounds
                  > > > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
                  > > > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
                  > > > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
                  > > > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
                  > > > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ---------------------------------
                  > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                  > Try it now.
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > ---------------------------------
                  > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                  Try it now.
                  >
                • John Hansford
                  Thanks David! Yep...I did forget to mention that your site was VERRRRY helpful to both my decision to go with the Enco and do the dis/re assembling of it...:)
                  Message 8 of 19 , May 2 1:11 PM
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Thanks David!

                    Yep...I did forget to mention that your site was
                    VERRRRY helpful to both my decision to go with
                    the Enco and do the dis/re assembling of it...:)

                    They must have a really good batch of them
                    right at the moment, because I couldn't
                    find a single problem with mine. I AM very
                    close to the Atlanta warehouse, so even shipping
                    was perfect.

                    :)
                    John



                    --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, fignoggle <david@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > using an engine hoist really helps! even with the metal stand in place,
                    > the standard 2-ton hoist can get its legs around it and move the entire
                    > unit. we just put a strap around the underside of the head at the
                    column
                    > and lift.
                    >
                    > our website shows taking the machine apart, but it's very doable in one
                    > piece, though it tilts forward...
                    >
                    http://www.fignoggle.com/machines/rf45-dovetail-square-column-mill/enco-rong-fu-45-dovetail-column-mill-reassembly.htm
                    >
                    > congrats on the purchases!
                    > david
                    >
                    >
                    > On Fri, 2 May 2008, John Hansford wrote:
                    >
                    > > Thanks DBN!
                    > >
                    > > Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
                    > > for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...;)
                    > > I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
                    > > much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
                    > > dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
                    > > extremely careful...
                    > >
                    > > My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
                    > > only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
                    > > Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
                    > > little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
                    > > But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
                    > > do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
                    > > extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
                    > > I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
                    > > I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!
                    > >
                    > > I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
                    > > move that big table for the first time....it's much
                    > > like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
                    > > made a goooood decision...:)
                    > >
                    > > John
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@> wrote:
                    > >>
                    > >> Hi John,
                    > >>
                    > >> Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to
                    > > be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200
                    > > LB cast iron base.
                    > >>
                    > >> To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done
                    > > as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
                    > >>
                    > >> Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
                    > >>
                    > >> Take care,
                    > >> DBN
                    > >>
                    > >> John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                    > >> FWIW....
                    > >> I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
                    > >> A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
                    > >> think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
                    > >> was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
                    > >> near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
                    > >>
                    > >> I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
                    > >> procedures....very similar. I also downloaded
                    > >> the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
                    > >> very helpful to see how things fit.
                    > >>
                    > >> 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
                    > >> 2 for the first hour...;)
                    > >> But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
                    > >> head didn't bind into motor wires or against
                    > >> any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
                    > >> balance of the head with the motor still
                    > >> attached when lifted away from the column.
                    > >> scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
                    > >>
                    > >> The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
                    > >> "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
                    > >> top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
                    > >> it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
                    > >> to avoid too much scratching up.
                    > >>
                    > >> The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
                    > >>
                    > >> I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
                    > >> getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
                    > >> it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
                    > >> somewhat permanently in place. The roll
                    > >> pins need to be carefully punched out to
                    > >> get the table off. I think I found out that
                    > >> from the Industrial Hobbies site.
                    > >>
                    > >> So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
                    > >> condition! Nothing like what I feared from
                    > >> weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
                    > >> no attention. I have to say that after those
                    > >> long hours of studying up on which mill to
                    > >> buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster...then
                    > >> Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
                    > >> I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
                    > >>
                    > >> Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
                    > >> amount of cosmoline....mine works out of the box.
                    > >> Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
                    > >> is easy.
                    > >>
                    > >> But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
                    > >>
                    > >> Hope that's useful...;)
                    > >>
                    > >> John
                    > >>
                    > >> --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@> wrote:
                    > >>>
                    > >>> I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
                    > >>> and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:)
                    > >>>
                    > >>> It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
                    > >>> by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
                    > >>>
                    > >>> Pictures here...
                    > >>>
                    > >>> http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mill_drill/photos/browse/40a7
                    > >>>
                    > >>> John
                    > >>>
                    > >>>
                    > >>>
                    > >>>
                    > >>>
                    > >>> --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
                    > >>>>
                    > >>>> That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a
                    > > problem
                    > >>>> then I had feared.
                    > >>>>
                    > >>>> I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
                    > >>>> While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280# jointer
                    > >>>> down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the
                    > > RF45
                    > >>>> definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the
                    > >> much
                    > >>>> lighter weight X3.
                    > >>>>
                    > >>>> Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200
                    > > S&H)
                    > >>>> and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
                    > >>>>
                    > >>>> tim
                    > >>>> --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y...>
                    wrote:
                    > >>>>> Approximate weights are:
                    > >>>>> Motor 50 pounds
                    > >>>>> Head without motor 200 pounds
                    > >>>>> Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
                    > >>>>> X axis 100 to 125 pounds
                    > >>>>> Column 125 to 150 pounds
                    > >>>>> Base 75 to 100 pounds
                    > >>>>
                    > >>>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >>
                    > >> ---------------------------------
                    > >> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                    > > Try it now.
                    > >>
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                    > --
                    > Free photo storage for hobbyists - share pics!
                    <http://www.hobbysnap.com>
                    > MetalWorkingFAQ.NET - Over 50 content sites!
                    <http://www.metalworkingfaq.net>
                    > CNC, Plans/Kits, 8x12 Lathe, Mini-Mill, How-Tos
                    <http://www.fignoggle.com>
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                    <http://www.superx3.com>
                    >
                  • Druid Noibn
                    Hi John, I used to design and manufacture stepper motor drivers and power supplies, but that was a few decades ago and most were for optical systems. We used
                    Message 9 of 19 , May 2 1:20 PM
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Hi John,
                       
                      I used to design and manufacture stepper motor drivers and power supplies, but that was a few decades ago and most were for optical systems.  We used the 87xx series of Intel prcesors and developed a rather nice micro-stepping routine.  Now it is all a bit easier.
                       
                      The DRO here is only because I got it cheap (it's a Grizzly and $200, I was lucky).  I do plan on adding steppers to the system, but there is no strong need at the moment, especially as this unit has x-axis and head-lift motors.  But it will be done.  
                       
                      Also keep in mind that you are not only moving the table, but also whatever you put on it and the force of cutting the material.  It does seem that some vendors are being rather creative with motor specifications of late, e.g., very high holding power but low drive torque.
                       
                      Several members have CNCed their systems, you will hear from others.
                       
                      Enjoy making chips!
                       
                      Take care,
                      DBN  

                      John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
                      I was thinking about the DRO...but I'm going to
                      do another one of my usual bending of common
                      sense rules here...;)

                      I noticed the motion is much smoother than I'd
                      have expected. A plain old 250 oz. stepper motor at
                      34VDC will move it with no trouble I'm 100%
                      sure. So as I have some 1/2-10 2-start acme on
                      hand, I'm going to cnc the X & Y for now with
                      just plain old Delrin nuts. It'll be a pretty
                      easy 1 day project. That'll work very well enough
                      to go ahead and mill out some better aluminum
                      parts for the longer term.

                      I'm figuring for basically the same $$$ as the DRO,
                      I'll just cnc it in a few steps. I Know already
                      that many will say you *Must* use ballscrews, but
                      from my experience here with Delrin and Acme,
                      absolute satisfactory results are very easily
                      and cheaply done. Just how well it works is yet
                      to be seen, but I swear I have some great faith that
                      it'll be far more durable than many would expect....;)

                      Once I get a little free time...

                      :)
                      John

                      --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@ ...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Hi John,
                      >
                      > I do like my "45" although I was hit with a few snags - the head
                      leaked and I took the approach that I would only do so much to address
                      a warranty item. Truth be told, Grizzly offered to repair/replace the
                      whole system - BUT...after moving the tonnage (long story, posted
                      earlier) I was inclined to only have the head repaired. They did, and
                      it looks to be working fine, so far. I need to do a few more tests.
                      >
                      > Is the system perfect? No. If I wanted an order of magnitude
                      better, I would pay the far higher $$$. I am happy with the unit so
                      far, but I will keep an objective eye open <smile>.
                      >
                      > My next projects on the mill-drill is to add the DRO and install a
                      3-ph, VFD motor.
                      >
                      > Take care,
                      > DBN
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
                      > Thanks DBN!
                      >
                      > Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
                      > for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...; )
                      > I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
                      > much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
                      > dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
                      > extremely careful...
                      >
                      > My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
                      > only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
                      > Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
                      > little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
                      > But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
                      > do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
                      > extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
                      > I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
                      > I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!
                      >
                      > I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
                      > move that big table for the first time....it's much
                      > like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
                      > made a goooood decision...: )
                      >
                      > John
                      >
                      > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@ > wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Hi John,
                      > >
                      > > Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to
                      > be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200
                      > LB cast iron base.
                      > >
                      > > To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done
                      > as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
                      > >
                      > > Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
                      > >
                      > > Take care,
                      > > DBN
                      > >
                      > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                      > > FWIW....
                      > > I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
                      > > A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
                      > > think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
                      > > was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
                      > > near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
                      > >
                      > > I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
                      > > procedures.. ..very similar. I also downloaded
                      > > the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
                      > > very helpful to see how things fit.
                      > >
                      > > 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
                      > > 2 for the first hour...;)
                      > > But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
                      > > head didn't bind into motor wires or against
                      > > any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
                      > > balance of the head with the motor still
                      > > attached when lifted away from the column.
                      > > scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
                      > >
                      > > The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
                      > > "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
                      > > top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
                      > > it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
                      > > to avoid too much scratching up.
                      > >
                      > > The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
                      > >
                      > > I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
                      > > getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
                      > > it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
                      > > somewhat permanently in place. The roll
                      > > pins need to be carefully punched out to
                      > > get the table off. I think I found out that
                      > > from the Industrial Hobbies site.
                      > >
                      > > So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
                      > > condition! Nothing like what I feared from
                      > > weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
                      > > no attention. I have to say that after those
                      > > long hours of studying up on which mill to
                      > > buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster. ..then
                      > > Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
                      > > I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
                      > >
                      > > Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
                      > > amount of cosmoline... .mine works out of the box.
                      > > Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
                      > > is easy.
                      > >
                      > > But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
                      > >
                      > > Hope that's useful...;)
                      > >
                      > > John
                      > >
                      > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
                      > > > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition... :)
                      > > >
                      > > > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
                      > > > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
                      > > >
                      > > > Pictures here...
                      > > >
                      > > > http://ph.groups. yahoo.com/ group/mill_ drill/photos/ browse/40a7
                      > > >
                      > > > John
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
                      > > > >
                      > > > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a
                      > problem
                      > > > > then I had feared.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall weight.
                      > > > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280#
                      jointer
                      > > > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the
                      > RF45
                      > > > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention to the
                      > > much
                      > > > > lighter weight X3.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200
                      > S&H)
                      > > > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
                      > > > >
                      > > > > tim
                      > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y. ..>
                      wrote:
                      > > > > > Approximate weights are:
                      > > > > > Motor 50 pounds
                      > > > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
                      > > > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
                      > > > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
                      > > > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
                      > > > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > ------------ --------- --------- ---
                      > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                      > Try it now.
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ------------ --------- --------- ---
                      > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                      Try it now.
                      >



                      Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.

                    • John Hansford
                      $200!!! Hey, you wouldn t want me to test it out for you.... you know...just to be sure it works OK. I can give you a few years and that should tell us if it s
                      Message 10 of 19 , May 2 8:02 PM
                      • 0 Attachment
                        $200!!!

                        Hey, you wouldn't want me to test it out for you....
                        you know...just to be sure it works OK. I can give
                        you a few years and that should tell us if it's good
                        to go...

                        ;)
                        John

                        --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Hi John,
                        >
                        > I used to design and manufacture stepper motor drivers and power
                        supplies, but that was a few decades ago and most were for optical
                        systems. We used the 87xx series of Intel prcesors and developed a
                        rather nice micro-stepping routine. Now it is all a bit easier.
                        >
                        > The DRO here is only because I got it cheap (it's a Grizzly and
                        $200, I was lucky). I do plan on adding steppers to the system, but
                        there is no strong need at the moment, especially as this unit has
                        x-axis and head-lift motors. But it will be done.
                        >
                        > Also keep in mind that you are not only moving the table, but also
                        whatever you put on it and the force of cutting the material. It does
                        seem that some vendors are being rather creative with motor
                        specifications of late, e.g., very high holding power but low drive
                        torque.
                        >
                        > Several members have CNCed their systems, you will hear from others.
                        >
                        > Enjoy making chips!
                        >
                        > Take care,
                        > DBN
                        >
                        > John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
                        > I was thinking about the DRO...but I'm going to
                        > do another one of my usual bending of common
                        > sense rules here...;)
                        >
                        > I noticed the motion is much smoother than I'd
                        > have expected. A plain old 250 oz. stepper motor at
                        > 34VDC will move it with no trouble I'm 100%
                        > sure. So as I have some 1/2-10 2-start acme on
                        > hand, I'm going to cnc the X & Y for now with
                        > just plain old Delrin nuts. It'll be a pretty
                        > easy 1 day project. That'll work very well enough
                        > to go ahead and mill out some better aluminum
                        > parts for the longer term.
                        >
                        > I'm figuring for basically the same $$$ as the DRO,
                        > I'll just cnc it in a few steps. I Know already
                        > that many will say you *Must* use ballscrews, but
                        > from my experience here with Delrin and Acme,
                        > absolute satisfactory results are very easily
                        > and cheaply done. Just how well it works is yet
                        > to be seen, but I swear I have some great faith that
                        > it'll be far more durable than many would expect....;)
                        >
                        > Once I get a little free time...
                        >
                        > :)
                        > John
                        >
                        > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Hi John,
                        > >
                        > > I do like my "45" although I was hit with a few snags - the head
                        > leaked and I took the approach that I would only do so much to address
                        > a warranty item. Truth be told, Grizzly offered to repair/replace the
                        > whole system - BUT...after moving the tonnage (long story, posted
                        > earlier) I was inclined to only have the head repaired. They did, and
                        > it looks to be working fine, so far. I need to do a few more tests.
                        > >
                        > > Is the system perfect? No. If I wanted an order of magnitude
                        > better, I would pay the far higher $$$. I am happy with the unit so
                        > far, but I will keep an objective eye open <smile>.
                        > >
                        > > My next projects on the mill-drill is to add the DRO and install a
                        > 3-ph, VFD motor.
                        > >
                        > > Take care,
                        > > DBN
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                        > > Thanks DBN!
                        > >
                        > > Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
                        > > for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...;)
                        > > I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
                        > > much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
                        > > dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
                        > > extremely careful...
                        > >
                        > > My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
                        > > only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
                        > > Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
                        > > little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
                        > > But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
                        > > do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
                        > > extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
                        > > I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
                        > > I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!
                        > >
                        > > I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
                        > > move that big table for the first time....it's much
                        > > like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
                        > > made a goooood decision...:)
                        > >
                        > > John
                        > >
                        > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > Hi John,
                        > > >
                        > > > Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to
                        > > be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200
                        > > LB cast iron base.
                        > > >
                        > > > To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done
                        > > as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
                        > > >
                        > > > Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
                        > > >
                        > > > Take care,
                        > > > DBN
                        > > >
                        > > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                        > > > FWIW....
                        > > > I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
                        > > > A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
                        > > > think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
                        > > > was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
                        > > > near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
                        > > >
                        > > > I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
                        > > > procedures....very similar. I also downloaded
                        > > > the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
                        > > > very helpful to see how things fit.
                        > > >
                        > > > 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
                        > > > 2 for the first hour...;)
                        > > > But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
                        > > > head didn't bind into motor wires or against
                        > > > any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
                        > > > balance of the head with the motor still
                        > > > attached when lifted away from the column.
                        > > > scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
                        > > >
                        > > > The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
                        > > > "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
                        > > > top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
                        > > > it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
                        > > > to avoid too much scratching up.
                        > > >
                        > > > The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
                        > > >
                        > > > I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
                        > > > getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
                        > > > it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
                        > > > somewhat permanently in place. The roll
                        > > > pins need to be carefully punched out to
                        > > > get the table off. I think I found out that
                        > > > from the Industrial Hobbies site.
                        > > >
                        > > > So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
                        > > > condition! Nothing like what I feared from
                        > > > weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
                        > > > no attention. I have to say that after those
                        > > > long hours of studying up on which mill to
                        > > > buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster...then
                        > > > Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
                        > > > I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
                        > > >
                        > > > Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
                        > > > amount of cosmoline....mine works out of the box.
                        > > > Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
                        > > > is easy.
                        > > >
                        > > > But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
                        > > >
                        > > > Hope that's useful...;)
                        > > >
                        > > > John
                        > > >
                        > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@> wrote:
                        > > > >
                        > > > > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
                        > > > > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:)
                        > > > >
                        > > > > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
                        > > > > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Pictures here...
                        > > > >
                        > > > > http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mill_drill/photos/browse/40a7
                        > > > >
                        > > > > John
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a
                        > > problem
                        > > > > > then I had feared.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall
                        weight.
                        > > > > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280#
                        > jointer
                        > > > > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the
                        > > RF45
                        > > > > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention
                        to the
                        > > > much
                        > > > > > lighter weight X3.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200
                        > > S&H)
                        > > > > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > tim
                        > > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y...>
                        > wrote:
                        > > > > > > Approximate weights are:
                        > > > > > > Motor 50 pounds
                        > > > > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
                        > > > > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
                        > > > > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
                        > > > > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
                        > > > > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
                        > > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > ---------------------------------
                        > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                        > > Try it now.
                        > > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > ---------------------------------
                        > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                        > Try it now.
                        > >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ---------------------------------
                        > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
                        Try it now.
                        >
                      • Druid Noibn
                        Hi John, Sure, no problem. To keep in line with industry trends, a small s/h charge will be needed.... Yes, I was lucky on that one. Mounting the
                        Message 11 of 19 , May 3 3:16 AM
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Hi John,
                           
                          Sure, no problem.  To keep in line with industry trends, a "small" s/h charge will be needed.... <SMILE>
                           
                          Yes, I was lucky on that one.  Mounting the scales and placing the display will take a little work however.
                           
                          Take care,
                          DBN   

                          John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
                          $200!!!

                          Hey, you wouldn't want me to test it out for you....
                          you know...just to be sure it works OK. I can give
                          you a few years and that should tell us if it's good
                          to go...

                          ;)
                          John

                          --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@ ...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Hi John,
                          >
                          > I used to design and manufacture stepper motor drivers and power
                          supplies, but that was a few decades ago and most were for optical
                          systems. We used the 87xx series of Intel prcesors and developed a
                          rather nice micro-stepping routine. Now it is all a bit easier.
                          >
                          > The DRO here is only because I got it cheap (it's a Grizzly and
                          $200, I was lucky). I do plan on adding steppers to the system, but
                          there is no strong need at the moment, especially as this unit has
                          x-axis and head-lift motors. But it will be done.
                          >
                          > Also keep in mind that you are not only moving the table, but also
                          whatever you put on it and the force of cutting the material. It does
                          seem that some vendors are being rather creative with motor
                          specifications of late, e.g., very high holding power but low drive
                          torque.
                          >
                          > Several members have CNCed their systems, you will hear from others.
                          >
                          > Enjoy making chips!
                          >
                          > Take care,
                          > DBN
                          >
                          > John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
                          > I was thinking about the DRO...but I'm going to
                          > do another one of my usual bending of common
                          > sense rules here...;)
                          >
                          > I noticed the motion is much smoother than I'd
                          > have expected. A plain old 250 oz. stepper motor at
                          > 34VDC will move it with no trouble I'm 100%
                          > sure. So as I have some 1/2-10 2-start acme on
                          > hand, I'm going to cnc the X & Y for now with
                          > just plain old Delrin nuts. It'll be a pretty
                          > easy 1 day project. That'll work very well enough
                          > to go ahead and mill out some better aluminum
                          > parts for the longer term.
                          >
                          > I'm figuring for basically the same $$$ as the DRO,
                          > I'll just cnc it in a few steps. I Know already
                          > that many will say you *Must* use ballscrews, but
                          > from my experience here with Delrin and Acme,
                          > absolute satisfactory results are very easily
                          > and cheaply done. Just how well it works is yet
                          > to be seen, but I swear I have some great faith that
                          > it'll be far more durable than many would expect....;)
                          >
                          > Once I get a little free time...
                          >
                          > :)
                          > John
                          >
                          > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@ > wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Hi John,
                          > >
                          > > I do like my "45" although I was hit with a few snags - the head
                          > leaked and I took the approach that I would only do so much to address
                          > a warranty item. Truth be told, Grizzly offered to repair/replace the
                          > whole system - BUT...after moving the tonnage (long story, posted
                          > earlier) I was inclined to only have the head repaired. They did, and
                          > it looks to be working fine, so far. I need to do a few more tests.
                          > >
                          > > Is the system perfect? No. If I wanted an order of magnitude
                          > better, I would pay the far higher $$$. I am happy with the unit so
                          > far, but I will keep an objective eye open <smile>.
                          > >
                          > > My next projects on the mill-drill is to add the DRO and install a
                          > 3-ph, VFD motor.
                          > >
                          > > Take care,
                          > > DBN
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                          > > Thanks DBN!
                          > >
                          > > Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
                          > > for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...; )
                          > > I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
                          > > much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
                          > > dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
                          > > extremely careful...
                          > >
                          > > My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
                          > > only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
                          > > Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
                          > > little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
                          > > But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
                          > > do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
                          > > extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
                          > > I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
                          > > I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!
                          > >
                          > > I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
                          > > move that big table for the first time....it's much
                          > > like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
                          > > made a goooood decision...: )
                          > >
                          > > John
                          > >
                          > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@ > wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > Hi John,
                          > > >
                          > > > Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had to
                          > > be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was the 200
                          > > LB cast iron base.
                          > > >
                          > > > To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be done
                          > > as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
                          > > >
                          > > > Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
                          > > >
                          > > > Take care,
                          > > > DBN
                          > > >
                          > > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                          > > > FWIW....
                          > > > I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
                          > > > A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
                          > > > think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
                          > > > was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
                          > > > near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
                          > > >
                          > > > I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
                          > > > procedures.. ..very similar. I also downloaded
                          > > > the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
                          > > > very helpful to see how things fit.
                          > > >
                          > > > 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
                          > > > 2 for the first hour...;)
                          > > > But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
                          > > > head didn't bind into motor wires or against
                          > > > any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
                          > > > balance of the head with the motor still
                          > > > attached when lifted away from the column.
                          > > > scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
                          > > >
                          > > > The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
                          > > > "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
                          > > > top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
                          > > > it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
                          > > > to avoid too much scratching up.
                          > > >
                          > > > The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
                          > > >
                          > > > I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
                          > > > getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
                          > > > it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
                          > > > somewhat permanently in place. The roll
                          > > > pins need to be carefully punched out to
                          > > > get the table off. I think I found out that
                          > > > from the Industrial Hobbies site.
                          > > >
                          > > > So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
                          > > > condition! Nothing like what I feared from
                          > > > weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
                          > > > no attention. I have to say that after those
                          > > > long hours of studying up on which mill to
                          > > > buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster. ..then
                          > > > Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
                          > > > I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
                          > > >
                          > > > Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
                          > > > amount of cosmoline... .mine works out of the box.
                          > > > Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
                          > > > is easy.
                          > > >
                          > > > But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
                          > > >
                          > > > Hope that's useful...;)
                          > > >
                          > > > John
                          > > >
                          > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@> wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
                          > > > > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition... :)
                          > > > >
                          > > > > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
                          > > > > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Pictures here...
                          > > > >
                          > > > > http://ph.groups. yahoo.com/ group/mill_ drill/photos/ browse/40a7
                          > > > >
                          > > > > John
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less of a
                          > > problem
                          > > > > > then I had feared.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall
                          weight.
                          > > > > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280#
                          > jointer
                          > > > > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight of the
                          > > RF45
                          > > > > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention
                          to the
                          > > > much
                          > > > > > lighter weight X3.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG ($200
                          > > S&H)
                          > > > > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > tim
                          > > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogro ups.com, "Alford72" <alford72@y. ..>
                          > wrote:
                          > > > > > > Approximate weights are:
                          > > > > > > Motor 50 pounds
                          > > > > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
                          > > > > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
                          > > > > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
                          > > > > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
                          > > > > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
                          > > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---
                          > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
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                          > >
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                          > >
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                        • Denis
                          Druid, I hope after you install your DRO you will post pictures of the installation. I am sure I will have the same problems to solve when I receive my G0484.
                          Message 12 of 19 , May 3 12:38 PM
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Druid,
                            I hope after you install your DRO you will post pictures of the
                            installation. I am sure I will have the same problems to solve when I
                            receive my G0484. I already have the DRO, a Meister Top-10.

                            Denis

                            --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@...>
                            wrote:
                            >
                            > Hi John,
                            >
                            > Sure, no problem. To keep in line with industry trends,
                            a "small" s/h charge will be needed.... <SMILE>
                            >
                            > Yes, I was lucky on that one. Mounting the scales and placing
                            the display will take a little work however.
                            >
                            > Take care,
                            > DBN
                            >
                            > John Hansford <kz1927@...> wrote:
                            > $200!!!
                            >
                            > Hey, you wouldn't want me to test it out for you....
                            > you know...just to be sure it works OK. I can give
                            > you a few years and that should tell us if it's good
                            > to go...
                            >
                            > ;)
                            > John
                            >
                            > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@> wrote:
                            > >
                            > > Hi John,
                            > >
                            > > I used to design and manufacture stepper motor drivers and power
                            > supplies, but that was a few decades ago and most were for optical
                            > systems. We used the 87xx series of Intel prcesors and developed a
                            > rather nice micro-stepping routine. Now it is all a bit easier.
                            > >
                            > > The DRO here is only because I got it cheap (it's a Grizzly and
                            > $200, I was lucky). I do plan on adding steppers to the system, but
                            > there is no strong need at the moment, especially as this unit has
                            > x-axis and head-lift motors. But it will be done.
                            > >
                            > > Also keep in mind that you are not only moving the table, but also
                            > whatever you put on it and the force of cutting the material. It
                            does
                            > seem that some vendors are being rather creative with motor
                            > specifications of late, e.g., very high holding power but low drive
                            > torque.
                            > >
                            > > Several members have CNCed their systems, you will hear from
                            others.
                            > >
                            > > Enjoy making chips!
                            > >
                            > > Take care,
                            > > DBN
                            > >
                            > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                            > > I was thinking about the DRO...but I'm going to
                            > > do another one of my usual bending of common
                            > > sense rules here...;)
                            > >
                            > > I noticed the motion is much smoother than I'd
                            > > have expected. A plain old 250 oz. stepper motor at
                            > > 34VDC will move it with no trouble I'm 100%
                            > > sure. So as I have some 1/2-10 2-start acme on
                            > > hand, I'm going to cnc the X & Y for now with
                            > > just plain old Delrin nuts. It'll be a pretty
                            > > easy 1 day project. That'll work very well enough
                            > > to go ahead and mill out some better aluminum
                            > > parts for the longer term.
                            > >
                            > > I'm figuring for basically the same $$$ as the DRO,
                            > > I'll just cnc it in a few steps. I Know already
                            > > that many will say you *Must* use ballscrews, but
                            > > from my experience here with Delrin and Acme,
                            > > absolute satisfactory results are very easily
                            > > and cheaply done. Just how well it works is yet
                            > > to be seen, but I swear I have some great faith that
                            > > it'll be far more durable than many would expect....;)
                            > >
                            > > Once I get a little free time...
                            > >
                            > > :)
                            > > John
                            > >
                            > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@>
                            wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > Hi John,
                            > > >
                            > > > I do like my "45" although I was hit with a few snags - the head
                            > > leaked and I took the approach that I would only do so much to
                            address
                            > > a warranty item. Truth be told, Grizzly offered to repair/replace
                            the
                            > > whole system - BUT...after moving the tonnage (long story, posted
                            > > earlier) I was inclined to only have the head repaired. They did,
                            and
                            > > it looks to be working fine, so far. I need to do a few more
                            tests.
                            > > >
                            > > > Is the system perfect? No. If I wanted an order of magnitude
                            > > better, I would pay the far higher $$$. I am happy with the unit
                            so
                            > > far, but I will keep an objective eye open <smile>.
                            > > >
                            > > > My next projects on the mill-drill is to add the DRO and
                            install a
                            > > 3-ph, VFD motor.
                            > > >
                            > > > Take care,
                            > > > DBN
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                            > > > Thanks DBN!
                            > > >
                            > > > Like Tim, I was undecided between the 45 and the X3
                            > > > for the same reasons....size and *WEIGHT*...;)
                            > > > I'd have to say...for me anyway...the Enco was
                            > > > much heavier than I'd guessed. It can be a very
                            > > > dangerous thing to try to move by oneself. I was
                            > > > extremely careful...
                            > > >
                            > > > My X2 just doesn't have quite enough Y travel at
                            > > > only 4 or so inches, so the 7.5" travel on the
                            > > > Enco made the decision easier. IF...I had that
                            > > > little extra $$$, I'd have went with the IH Version.
                            > > > But I figure mills are easy enough to sell and
                            > > > do hold their value pretty well, so if I want the
                            > > > extra travel it has, I can always sell the Enco later.
                            > > > I am highly impressed with the quality of the one
                            > > > I have. Very smooth motion and rigid as all heck!!
                            > > >
                            > > > I have to say...once it's finally in place and you
                            > > > move that big table for the first time....it's much
                            > > > like your first cnc moves....you just know you've
                            > > > made a goooood decision...:)
                            > > >
                            > > > John
                            > > >
                            > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Druid Noibn <druid_noibn@>
                            wrote:
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Hi John,
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Congrats! My '45' is from Grizzly, the G0485 and it also had
                            to
                            > > > be disassembled to move into my place; the added feature was
                            the 200
                            > > > LB cast iron base.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > To remove the table, you need to pull the gib - it had to be
                            done
                            > > > as it was too dangerous to leave the table on here.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Again great news, you will have a lot of fun with the unit!
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Take care,
                            > > > > DBN
                            > > > >
                            > > > > John Hansford <kz1927@> wrote:
                            > > > > FWIW....
                            > > > > I used a sort of crane to do the moving of parts.
                            > > > > A thing that lifts people into a wheelchair I
                            > > > > think...I got it from somewhere for parts. HF
                            > > > > was out of the engine hoist cranes and nobody
                            > > > > near me rents one. I just got lucky...;)
                            > > > >
                            > > > > I looked at the Industrial Hobbies disassembly
                            > > > > procedures....very similar. I also downloaded
                            > > > > the similar model manual from Grizzly. Both
                            > > > > very helpful to see how things fit.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > 3 bolts hold the head on. I thought it was only
                            > > > > 2 for the first hour...;)
                            > > > > But, a chain placed in about the middle of the
                            > > > > head didn't bind into motor wires or against
                            > > > > any parts of concern. It proved to be a perfect
                            > > > > balance of the head with the motor still
                            > > > > attached when lifted away from the column.
                            > > > > scary, but it was a near perfect balance.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > The 4 bolts for the column were next. I just
                            > > > > "walked" it off the pallet....took off the plastic
                            > > > > top cap and used a chain to lift it and move
                            > > > > it. I used an old towel wrapped under the chain
                            > > > > to avoid too much scratching up.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > The bondo cracks away...but no avoiding that.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > I *was* going to remove the table, but it was
                            > > > > getting late and cloudy and couldn't figure
                            > > > > it out. It has roll pins locking the screw
                            > > > > somewhat permanently in place. The roll
                            > > > > pins need to be carefully punched out to
                            > > > > get the table off. I think I found out that
                            > > > > from the Industrial Hobbies site.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > So anyways....the Enco ways were in Great
                            > > > > condition! Nothing like what I feared from
                            > > > > weeks of homework. VERY nice enough to need
                            > > > > no attention. I have to say that after those
                            > > > > long hours of studying up on which mill to
                            > > > > buy....I was going to go with Lathemaster...then
                            > > > > Grizzly...then WT....but everyone was out!
                            > > > > I'm Exceptionally pleased with the Enco.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Aside from cleaning of a relatively small
                            > > > > amount of cosmoline....mine works out of the box.
                            > > > > Well fitted and smooth operation. Even tramming
                            > > > > is easy.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > But it is one Heavy S.O.B.!
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Hope that's useful...;)
                            > > > >
                            > > > > John
                            > > > >
                            > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "John Hansford" <kz1927@>
                            wrote:
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > I just got one from Enco....they have them in stock
                            > > > > > and on sale. It came in Excellent condition...:)
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > It took a LOT of VERY careful work to move it
                            > > > > > by myself in 3 pieces. I won't try that again...;)
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > Pictures here...
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/mill_drill/photos/browse/40a7
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > John
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Tim" <tmarks11@> wrote:
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > That is great news. It sounds like it will be much less
                            of a
                            > > > problem
                            > > > > > > then I had feared.
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > I have been hesitant to get a RF45 based upon the overall
                            > weight.
                            > > > > > > While I have moved a 250# tablesaw, 200# bandsaw, and 280#
                            > > jointer
                            > > > > > > down to the basement by myself, the 800# shipping weight
                            of the
                            > > > RF45
                            > > > > > > definitely gave me some concerns, and steered my attention
                            > to the
                            > > > > much
                            > > > > > > lighter weight X3.
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > Now I just have to decide between a Lathemaster ZAY7045FG
                            ($200
                            > > > S&H)
                            > > > > > > and a WTTool ZAY 7045M (90 mile drive to pickup).
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > tim
                            > > > > > > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, "Alford72"
                            <alford72@y...>
                            > > wrote:
                            > > > > > > > Approximate weights are:
                            > > > > > > > Motor 50 pounds
                            > > > > > > > Head without motor 200 pounds
                            > > > > > > > Y axis saddle 50 to 75 pounds
                            > > > > > > > X axis 100 to 125 pounds
                            > > > > > > > Column 125 to 150 pounds
                            > > > > > > > Base 75 to 100 pounds
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > ---------------------------------
                            > > > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo!
                            Mobile.
                            > > > Try it now.
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                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
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                            > >
                            > >
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