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  • curtwuollet
    That sounds interesting, I bought a clone to try and cut up various rod stock. Not good. By the way, I found your moving article with the relative weights to
    Message 1 of 20 , Sep 1, 2007
      That sounds interesting, I bought a clone to
      try and cut up various rod stock. Not good.
      By the way, I found your moving article with
      the relative weights to be useful. I haven't
      decided yet whether to move the thing in the
      crate or do the cleanup outside and split it
      into manageable chunks. I am fortunate in
      that my basement has a walkout. But it's a
      long ways due to terrain to move from the
      driveway to the basement door. I think it
      might be easiest to seperate the top half
      from the bottom half at the column bolts if
      I can find a good way to cradle the head and
      column. That way I'm not taking apart any
      precision parts on the lawn. I've got a
      husky two wheeler for the base which would
      have a low CG and one of those big wheel
      wagons for the head and column minus the
      sheet metal. Years ago, I built a tripod
      for changing engines, Neither piece should
      tax that, but the rigging might be a problem.




      --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, rgsparber@... wrote:
      >
      > I've been making chips all day long :-))
      >
      > My latest project is a die filer attachment for a Sawzall.
      >
      > Rick Sparber
      > rgsparber@...
      > web site: http://rick.sparber.org
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the
      all-new AOL at
      > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
      >
    • rgsparber@aol.com
      In a message dated 9/1/2007 5:34:08 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, wideopen@ecenet.com writes: That sounds interesting, I bought a clone to try and cut up
      Message 2 of 20 , Sep 1, 2007
        In a message dated 9/1/2007 5:34:08 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
        wideopen@... writes:


        That sounds interesting, I bought a clone to
        try and cut up various rod stock. Not good.
        By the way, I found your moving article with
        the relative weights to be useful. I haven't
        decided yet whether to move the thing in the
        crate or do the cleanup outside and split it
        into manageable chunks. I am fortunate in
        that my basement has a walkout. But it's a
        long ways due to terrain to move from the
        driveway to the basement door. I think it
        might be easiest to separate the top half
        from the bottom half at the column bolts if
        I can find a good way to cradle the head and
        column. That way I'm not taking apart any
        precision parts on the lawn. I've got a
        husky two wheeler for the base which would
        have a low CG and one of those big wheel
        wagons for the head and column minus the
        sheet metal. Years ago, I built a tripod
        for changing engines, Neither piece should
        tax that, but the rigging might be a problem.

        ---------------------------------------------------------------

        I'm glad to hear that you understand CG (center of gravity). It takes a
        fraction of a second for one of these top heavy mills to flip down with
        incredible force. If you have something like a RF30, then you will probably have to
        split the column from the base to tram the head so there is no additional work
        doing it before you move the machine to your shop.

        Above all, be safe!

        Rick




        ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at
        http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
      • Druid Noibn
        Hi Curt, Congratulations. Lots of offerings on accessories by the usual vendors and many on e-bay. So far I had very little trouble on e-bay but it is a
        Message 3 of 20 , Sep 1, 2007
          Hi Curt,
           
          Congratulations.  Lots of offerings on accessories by the usual vendors and many on e-bay.  So far I had very little trouble on e-bay but it is a gamble.  Very often the packing is poor and sometimes the item arrives damaged - this leads to an uncomfortable situation as the  damage is not due to shipping.  Also, some sellers have a wry sense of humor regarding shipping costs.   
           
          There was a Homier show by me a few weeks ago but I convinced myself not to attend as I was suspicious that nothing great (i.e., a mill/drill) would be there. 
           
          The plan here is to pick up a square-column '45 type this month.  Still didn't finalize the vendor however. The "Top-Tech" dealer is a 30-minute drive so that is a strong draw.
           
          Post your thoughts on the mill-drill when it arrives and what you did to "tune-it-up" -<smile>.
           
          Of course, project issues are always nice.
           
          Take care,
          DBN

          Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...> wrote:
          It was just real quiet all of a sudden.
          But. I did it, I hit the button that will send
          700 lbs of Chinese Cast Iron careening
          towards my shack in the woods. There
          was a local Homier show in St Cloud
          where I work, so I took the afternoon
          off and attended. All I got was blank looks.
          I'm not sure there was anyone there that
          could spell mill drill. So, I drove home and
          ordered one. Now I need to find a vise and
          collets to arrive hopefully at the same time.
          I hope the spindle will pass a 1/2-13
          drawbar. Thats how the collets I"m looking
          at are threaded. Sounds like there's no
          standard for MT3 collets.

          Regards

          cww

          Druid Noibn wrote:
          > Hi Curt,
          >
          > Sorry - on a ship this past week - lousy Internet connection.
          >
          > So - what is the Latest and Greatest?
          >
          > Take care,
          > DBN
          >
          > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com>/* wrote:
          >
          > anybody home?
          >
          > cww
          >
          > --
          > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
          > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
          > growth of
          > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
          > democratic State
          > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
          > by an
          > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
          > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
          > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
          >
          >
          > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
          > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks
          > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/> on Yahoo! TV.
          >

          --
          Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
          "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
          private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
          itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
          individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
          conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
          against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.



          Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge to see what's on, when.

        • Curt Wuollet
          Well, I just got the whole set of 11 MT3 collets for the princely sum of $40.50 and I ve got a line on a suitable screwless vise for about $40. All I need then
          Message 4 of 20 , Sep 2, 2007
            Well, I just got the whole set of 11 MT3 collets for the
            princely sum of $40.50 and I've got a line on a suitable
            screwless vise for about $40. All I need then is an end
            mill or two and I should be in business. I also need a
            clamping set, but I probably need to measure the slots
            before I get one of those. I'm not sure how these vises
            fasten down, there aren't any visible ears but I can
            find something at the hardware store till I get the
            proper t nuts and such. I guess they weren't kidding
            about having one 03988 mill left, shortly after I
            ordered, the mill is no longer on their website. Too
            bad really, we can use a little pricing pressure to
            keep the other guys honest. I looked at the 45s
            too, but the bucks just weren't there :^).

            Regards

            cww

            Druid Noibn wrote:
            > Hi Curt,
            >
            > Congratulations. Lots of offerings on accessories by the usual
            > vendors and many on e-bay. So far I had very little trouble on e-bay
            > but it is a gamble. Very often the packing is poor and sometimes the
            > item arrives damaged - this leads to an uncomfortable situation as
            > the damage is not due to shipping. Also, some sellers have a wry
            > sense of humor regarding shipping costs.
            >
            > There was a Homier show by me a few weeks ago but I convinced myself
            > not to attend as I was suspicious that nothing great (i.e., a
            > mill/drill) would be there.
            >
            > The plan here is to pick up a square-column '45 type this month.
            > Still didn't finalize the vendor however. The "Top-Tech" dealer is a
            > 30-minute drive so that is a strong draw.
            >
            > Post your thoughts on the mill-drill when it arrives and what you did
            > to "tune-it-up" -<smile>.
            >
            > Of course, project issues are always nice.
            >
            > Take care,
            > DBN
            >
            > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...>/* wrote:
            >
            > It was just real quiet all of a sudden.
            > But. I did it, I hit the button that will send
            > 700 lbs of Chinese Cast Iron careening
            > towards my shack in the woods. There
            > was a local Homier show in St Cloud
            > where I work, so I took the afternoon
            > off and attended. All I got was blank looks.
            > I'm not sure there was anyone there that
            > could spell mill drill. So, I drove home and
            > ordered one. Now I need to find a vise and
            > collets to arrive hopefully at the same time.
            > I hope the spindle will pass a 1/2-13
            > drawbar. Thats how the collets I"m looking
            > at are threaded. Sounds like there's no
            > standard for MT3 collets.
            >
            > Regards
            >
            > cww
            >
            > Druid Noibn wrote:
            > > Hi Curt,
            > >
            > > Sorry - on a ship this past week - lousy Internet connection.
            > >
            > > So - what is the Latest and Greatest?
            > >
            > > Take care,
            > > DBN
            > >
            > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...
            > <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>>/* wrote:
            > >
            > > anybody home?
            > >
            > > cww
            > >
            > > --
            > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
            > 1938:
            > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
            > > growth of
            > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
            > > democratic State
            > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
            > > by an
            > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
            > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
            > powerless
            > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
            > >
            > >
            > > ----------------------------------------------------------
            > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks
            > > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/
            > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/>> on
            > Yahoo! TV.
            > >
            >
            > --
            > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
            > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
            > growth of
            > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
            > democratic State
            > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
            > by an
            > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
            > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
            > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
            > Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge
            > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47093/*http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222>to
            > see what's on, when.
            >


            --
            Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
            "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
            private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
            itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
            individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
            conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
            against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
          • Druid Noibn
            Hi Curt, It sounds like you are on your way. As you know some vices have ears for hold-down bolts. Some, like the small machinist vices either have a slot or
            Message 5 of 20 , Sep 3, 2007
              Hi Curt,
               
              It sounds like you are on your way.
               
              As you know some vices have ears for hold-down bolts.  Some, like the small machinist vices either have a slot or a series of holes for the same purpose.  There are some variations on this.
               
              There are sellers who have these at good prices on eBay and we also have good vendors like LMS (Little machine Shop) and Lathemaster, among others who have them.
               
              With all that said - depending on the work you are doing, you might wish to look at one of the traditional milling vices, a 4" or 5" might work well.
               
              As for the "last one" yes, the company seems to remove items that aren't in-stock - while philosophically interesting, business-wise it might not be a good idea.
               
              Take care,
              DBN

              Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...> wrote:
              Well, I just got the whole set of 11 MT3 collets for the
              princely sum of $40.50 and I've got a line on a suitable
              screwless vise for about $40. All I need then is an end
              mill or two and I should be in business. I also need a
              clamping set, but I probably need to measure the slots
              before I get one of those. I'm not sure how these vises
              fasten down, there aren't any visible ears but I can
              find something at the hardware store till I get the
              proper t nuts and such. I guess they weren't kidding
              about having one 03988 mill left, shortly after I
              ordered, the mill is no longer on their website. Too
              bad really, we can use a little pricing pressure to
              keep the other guys honest. I looked at the 45s
              too, but the bucks just weren't there :^).

              Regards

              cww

              Druid Noibn wrote:
              > Hi Curt,
              >
              > Congratulations. Lots of offerings on accessories by the usual
              > vendors and many on e-bay. So far I had very little trouble on e-bay
              > but it is a gamble. Very often the packing is poor and sometimes the
              > item arrives damaged - this leads to an uncomfortable situation as
              > the damage is not due to shipping. Also, some sellers have a wry
              > sense of humor regarding shipping costs.
              >
              > There was a Homier show by me a few weeks ago but I convinced myself
              > not to attend as I was suspicious that nothing great (i.e., a
              > mill/drill) would be there.
              >
              > The plan here is to pick up a square-column '45 type this month.
              > Still didn't finalize the vendor however. The "Top-Tech" dealer is a
              > 30-minute drive so that is a strong draw.
              >
              > Post your thoughts on the mill-drill when it arrives and what you did
              > to "tune-it-up" -<smile>.
              >
              > Of course, project issues are always nice.
              >
              > Take care,
              > DBN
              >
              > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com>/* wrote:
              >
              > It was just real quiet all of a sudden.
              > But. I did it, I hit the button that will send
              > 700 lbs of Chinese Cast Iron careening
              > towards my shack in the woods. There
              > was a local Homier show in St Cloud
              > where I work, so I took the afternoon
              > off and attended. All I got was blank looks.
              > I'm not sure there was anyone there that
              > could spell mill drill. So, I drove home and
              > ordered one. Now I need to find a vise and
              > collets to arrive hopefully at the same time.
              > I hope the spindle will pass a 1/2-13
              > drawbar. Thats how the collets I"m looking
              > at are threaded. Sounds like there's no
              > standard for MT3 collets.
              >
              > Regards
              >
              > cww
              >
              > Druid Noibn wrote:
              > > Hi Curt,
              > >
              > > Sorry - on a ship this past week - lousy Internet connection.
              > >
              > > So - what is the Latest and Greatest?
              > >
              > > Take care,
              > > DBN
              > >
              > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com
              > <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>>/* wrote:
              > >
              > > anybody home?
              > >
              > > cww
              > >
              > > --
              > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
              > 1938:
              > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
              > > growth of
              > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
              > > democratic State
              > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
              > > by an
              > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
              > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
              > powerless
              > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
              > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks
              > > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/
              > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/>> on
              > Yahoo! TV.
              > >
              >
              > --
              > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
              > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
              > growth of
              > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
              > democratic State
              > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
              > by an
              > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
              > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
              > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
              >
              >
              > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
              > Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge
              > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=47093/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/ collections/ 222>to
              > see what's on, when.
              >

              --
              Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
              "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
              private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
              itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
              individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
              conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
              against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.



              Got a little couch potato?
              Check out fun summer activities for kids.

            • Curt Wuollet
              Hi Druid By the time I m done, I ll need a variety of vises and workholding gear. I need to be able to do automation panels, so I ll need a two piece vise or
              Message 6 of 20 , Sep 3, 2007
                Hi Druid

                By the time I'm done, I'll need a variety of
                vises and workholding gear. I need to be
                able to do automation panels, so I'll need
                a two piece vise or two. The screwless
                vise I'm looking at has the angle locking
                like the Kurt vises without hanging half
                off the table. Even if I later find a traditional
                vise I like at a reasonable price, which will
                happen in time, there will be a need for a
                3 or 4" vise with V grooves for shaft work.
                My (kinda weak) reason for getting this
                is making parts for my corn stove. The
                agitator runs in the fire and is consumed
                even when I make them from 314 SS.
                Now, I turn these on my 7x14 lathe and
                cross drill as best I can with a POS drill
                press, and grind flats on the end for the
                coupling. With the mill, I can spot face
                the hole locations and accurately drill
                them and mill the flats for the coupling.
                Instead of threading them, which is
                extremely difficult and hard on taps,
                (SS work hardens while hand tapping)
                I can drill and ream for press fit pins.
                My scrap rate should go down. I go
                through at least 4 of these a winter and
                they are $60 to purchase and about $10
                to make. I might even be able to sell a
                few. And the panel work is profitable.
                So, it's not _entirely_ a toy :^)

                Regards
                cww


                Druid Noibn wrote:
                > Hi Curt,
                >
                > It sounds like you are on your way.
                >
                > As you know some vices have ears for hold-down bolts. Some, like the
                > small machinist vices either have a slot or a series of holes for the
                > same purpose. There are some variations on this.
                >
                > There are sellers who have these at good prices on eBay and we also
                > have good vendors like LMS (Little machine Shop) and Lathemaster,
                > among others who have them.
                >
                > With all that said - depending on the work you are doing, you might
                > wish to look at one of the traditional milling vices, a 4" or 5" might
                > work well.
                >
                > As for the "last one" yes, the company seems to remove items that
                > aren't in-stock - while philosophically interesting, business-wise it
                > might not be a good idea.
                >
                > Take care,
                > DBN
                >
                > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...>/* wrote:
                >
                > Well, I just got the whole set of 11 MT3 collets for the
                > princely sum of $40.50 and I've got a line on a suitable
                > screwless vise for about $40. All I need then is an end
                > mill or two and I should be in business. I also need a
                > clamping set, but I probably need to measure the slots
                > before I get one of those. I'm not sure how these vises
                > fasten down, there aren't any visible ears but I can
                > find something at the hardware store till I get the
                > proper t nuts and such. I guess they weren't kidding
                > about having one 03988 mill left, shortly after I
                > ordered, the mill is no longer on their website. Too
                > bad really, we can use a little pricing pressure to
                > keep the other guys honest. I looked at the 45s
                > too, but the bucks just weren't there :^).
                >
                > Regards
                >
                > cww
                >
                > Druid Noibn wrote:
                > > Hi Curt,
                > >
                > > Congratulations. Lots of offerings on accessories by the usual
                > > vendors and many on e-bay. So far I had very little trouble on
                > e-bay
                > > but it is a gamble. Very often the packing is poor and sometimes
                > the
                > > item arrives damaged - this leads to an uncomfortable situation as
                > > the damage is not due to shipping. Also, some sellers have a wry
                > > sense of humor regarding shipping costs.
                > >
                > > There was a Homier show by me a few weeks ago but I convinced
                > myself
                > > not to attend as I was suspicious that nothing great (i.e., a
                > > mill/drill) would be there.
                > >
                > > The plan here is to pick up a square-column '45 type this month.
                > > Still didn't finalize the vendor however. The "Top-Tech" dealer
                > is a
                > > 30-minute drive so that is a strong draw.
                > >
                > > Post your thoughts on the mill-drill when it arrives and what
                > you did
                > > to "tune-it-up" -<smile>.
                > >
                > > Of course, project issues are always nice.
                > >
                > > Take care,
                > > DBN
                > >
                > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...
                > <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>>/* wrote:
                > >
                > > It was just real quiet all of a sudden.
                > > But. I did it, I hit the button that will send
                > > 700 lbs of Chinese Cast Iron careening
                > > towards my shack in the woods. There
                > > was a local Homier show in St Cloud
                > > where I work, so I took the afternoon
                > > off and attended. All I got was blank looks.
                > > I'm not sure there was anyone there that
                > > could spell mill drill. So, I drove home and
                > > ordered one. Now I need to find a vise and
                > > collets to arrive hopefully at the same time.
                > > I hope the spindle will pass a 1/2-13
                > > drawbar. Thats how the collets I"m looking
                > > at are threaded. Sounds like there's no
                > > standard for MT3 collets.
                > >
                > > Regards
                > >
                > > cww
                > >
                > > Druid Noibn wrote:
                > > > Hi Curt,
                > > >
                > > > Sorry - on a ship this past week - lousy Internet connection.
                > > >
                > > > So - what is the Latest and Greatest?
                > > >
                > > > Take care,
                > > > DBN
                > > >
                > > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@... <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>
                > > <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>>/* wrote:
                > > >
                > > > anybody home?
                > > >
                > > > cww
                > > >
                > > > --
                > > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                > > 1938:
                > > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                > > > growth of
                > > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                > > > democratic State
                > > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                > > > by an
                > > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power."
                > But the
                > > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                > > powerless
                > > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks
                > > > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/
                > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/>
                > > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/
                > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/>>> on
                > > Yahoo! TV.
                > > >
                > >
                > > --
                > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                > 1938:
                > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                > > growth of
                > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                > > democratic State
                > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                > > by an
                > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                > powerless
                > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                > >
                > >
                > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                > > Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge
                > >
                > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47093/*http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222
                > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47093/*http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222>>to
                >
                > > see what's on, when.
                > >
                >
                > --
                > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                > growth of
                > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                > democratic State
                > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                > by an
                > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                > Got a little couch potato?
                > Check out fun summer activities for kids.
                > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48248/*http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz>
                >
                >


                --
                Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
                private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
                itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
                individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
              • Druid Noibn
                Hi Curt, it all sounds great to me - the small buiness idea of making the agitators is perfect - and allows one to build-up a nice toy collection. I worked
                Message 7 of 20 , Sep 3, 2007
                  Hi Curt,
                   
                  it all sounds great to me - the small buiness idea of making the agitators is perfect - and allows one to build-up a nice "toy" collection.  I worked in the the biotech business for 17 years and we used 316L and sometimes 304L (non-process work) and it worked out well.  I don't know the 314 product. 
                   
                  Curious if using Carpenter 20 alloy (might be a tad expensive) would address the corrosion rate in the application.
                   
                  The vise sounds like a good deal.  I picked up (on eBay) a 4" Starrett mill vise (they no longer make them) and in the process of refinishing it - this is a bit of fun for me.  I would like to powder coat it but decided to not buy all the "stuff" needed to do it. 
                   
                  Take care,
                  DBN

                  Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...> wrote:
                  Hi Druid

                  By the time I'm done, I'll need a variety of
                  vises and workholding gear. I need to be
                  able to do automation panels, so I'll need
                  a two piece vise or two. The screwless
                  vise I'm looking at has the angle locking
                  like the Kurt vises without hanging half
                  off the table. Even if I later find a traditional
                  vise I like at a reasonable price, which will
                  happen in time, there will be a need for a
                  3 or 4" vise with V grooves for shaft work.
                  My (kinda weak) reason for getting this
                  is making parts for my corn stove. The
                  agitator runs in the fire and is consumed
                  even when I make them from 314 SS.
                  Now, I turn these on my 7x14 lathe and
                  cross drill as best I can with a POS drill
                  press, and grind flats on the end for the
                  coupling. With the mill, I can spot face
                  the hole locations and accurately drill
                  them and mill the flats for the coupling.
                  Instead of threading them, which is
                  extremely difficult and hard on taps,
                  (SS work hardens while hand tapping)
                  I can drill and ream for press fit pins.
                  My scrap rate should go down. I go
                  through at least 4 of these a winter and
                  they are $60 to purchase and about $10
                  to make. I might even be able to sell a
                  few. And the panel work is profitable.
                  So, it's not _entirely_ a toy :^)

                  Regards
                  cww

                  Druid Noibn wrote:
                  > Hi Curt,
                  >
                  > It sounds like you are on your way.
                  >
                  > As you know some vices have ears for hold-down bolts. Some, like the
                  > small machinist vices either have a slot or a series of holes for the
                  > same purpose. There are some variations on this.
                  >
                  > There are sellers who have these at good prices on eBay and we also
                  > have good vendors like LMS (Little machine Shop) and Lathemaster,
                  > among others who have them.
                  >
                  > With all that said - depending on the work you are doing, you might
                  > wish to look at one of the traditional milling vices, a 4" or 5" might
                  > work well.
                  >
                  > As for the "last one" yes, the company seems to remove items that
                  > aren't in-stock - while philosophically interesting, business-wise it
                  > might not be a good idea.
                  >
                  > Take care,
                  > DBN
                  >
                  > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com>/* wrote:
                  >
                  > Well, I just got the whole set of 11 MT3 collets for the
                  > princely sum of $40.50 and I've got a line on a suitable
                  > screwless vise for about $40. All I need then is an end
                  > mill or two and I should be in business. I also need a
                  > clamping set, but I probably need to measure the slots
                  > before I get one of those. I'm not sure how these vises
                  > fasten down, there aren't any visible ears but I can
                  > find something at the hardware store till I get the
                  > proper t nuts and such. I guess they weren't kidding
                  > about having one 03988 mill left, shortly after I
                  > ordered, the mill is no longer on their website. Too
                  > bad really, we can use a little pricing pressure to
                  > keep the other guys honest. I looked at the 45s
                  > too, but the bucks just weren't there :^).
                  >
                  > Regards
                  >
                  > cww
                  >
                  > Druid Noibn wrote:
                  > > Hi Curt,
                  > >
                  > > Congratulations. Lots of offerings on accessories by the usual
                  > > vendors and many on e-bay. So far I had very little trouble on
                  > e-bay
                  > > but it is a gamble. Very often the packing is poor and sometimes
                  > the
                  > > item arrives damaged - this leads to an uncomfortable situation as
                  > > the damage is not due to shipping. Also, some sellers have a wry
                  > > sense of humor regarding shipping costs.
                  > >
                  > > There was a Homier show by me a few weeks ago but I convinced
                  > myself
                  > > not to attend as I was suspicious that nothing great (i.e., a
                  > > mill/drill) would be there.
                  > >
                  > > The plan here is to pick up a square-column '45 type this month.
                  > > Still didn't finalize the vendor however. The "Top-Tech" dealer
                  > is a
                  > > 30-minute drive so that is a strong draw.
                  > >
                  > > Post your thoughts on the mill-drill when it arrives and what
                  > you did
                  > > to "tune-it-up" -<smile>.
                  > >
                  > > Of course, project issues are always nice.
                  > >
                  > > Take care,
                  > > DBN
                  > >
                  > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com
                  > <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>>/* wrote:
                  > >
                  > > It was just real quiet all of a sudden.
                  > > But. I did it, I hit the button that will send
                  > > 700 lbs of Chinese Cast Iron careening
                  > > towards my shack in the woods. There
                  > > was a local Homier show in St Cloud
                  > > where I work, so I took the afternoon
                  > > off and attended. All I got was blank looks.
                  > > I'm not sure there was anyone there that
                  > > could spell mill drill. So, I drove home and
                  > > ordered one. Now I need to find a vise and
                  > > collets to arrive hopefully at the same time.
                  > > I hope the spindle will pass a 1/2-13
                  > > drawbar. Thats how the collets I"m looking
                  > > at are threaded. Sounds like there's no
                  > > standard for MT3 collets.
                  > >
                  > > Regards
                  > >
                  > > cww
                  > >
                  > > Druid Noibn wrote:
                  > > > Hi Curt,
                  > > >
                  > > > Sorry - on a ship this past week - lousy Internet connection.
                  > > >
                  > > > So - what is the Latest and Greatest?
                  > > >
                  > > > Take care,
                  > > > DBN
                  > > >
                  > > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>
                  > > <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>>/* wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > anybody home?
                  > > >
                  > > > cww
                  > > >
                  > > > --
                  > > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                  > > 1938:
                  > > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                  > > > growth of
                  > > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                  > > > democratic State
                  > > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                  > > > by an
                  > > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power."
                  > But the
                  > > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                  > > powerless
                  > > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                  > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks
                  > > > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/
                  > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/>
                  > > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/
                  > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/>>> on
                  > > Yahoo! TV.
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > > --
                  > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                  > 1938:
                  > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                  > > growth of
                  > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                  > > democratic State
                  > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                  > > by an
                  > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                  > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                  > powerless
                  > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                  > > Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge
                  > >
                  > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=47093/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/ collections/ 222
                  > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=47093/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/ collections/ 222>>to
                  >
                  > > see what's on, when.
                  > >
                  >
                  > --
                  > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                  > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                  > growth of
                  > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                  > democratic State
                  > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                  > by an
                  > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                  > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                  > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                  > Got a little couch potato?
                  > Check out fun summer activities for kids.
                  > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48248/ *http://search. yahoo.com/ search?fr= oni_on_mail& p=summer+ activities+ for+kids& cs=bz>
                  >
                  >

                  --
                  Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                  "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
                  private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
                  itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
                  individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                  conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                  against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.



                  Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us.

                • Curt Wuollet
                  To that end HF has their powder coat kit on sale for $50. If I could find Carpenter 20 or indeed, any more suitable alloy around I would give it a try. Running
                  Message 8 of 20 , Sep 3, 2007
                    To that end HF has their powder coat kit on sale for $50.
                    If I could find Carpenter 20 or indeed, any more suitable
                    alloy around I would give it a try. Running in an oxidizing
                    flame at orange heat is tough on most steels. My local
                    selection of 5/8" rounds is somewhat limited. Perhaps we
                    have a metallurgist on board who could recommend?
                    As having a mill becomes a reality all sorts of long
                    deferred projects come to mind, perfect for the long
                    nights approaching.

                    Regards

                    cww


                    Druid Noibn wrote:
                    > Hi Curt,
                    >
                    > it all sounds great to me - the small buiness idea of making the
                    > agitators is perfect - and allows one to build-up a nice "toy"
                    > collection. I worked in the the biotech business for 17 years and we
                    > used 316L and sometimes 304L (non-process work) and it worked out
                    > well. I don't know the 314 product.
                    >
                    > Curious if using Carpenter 20 alloy (might be a tad expensive) would
                    > address the corrosion rate in the application.
                    >
                    > The vise sounds like a good deal. I picked up (on eBay) a 4" Starrett
                    > mill vise (they no longer make them) and in the process of refinishing
                    > it - this is a bit of fun for me. I would like to powder coat it but
                    > decided to not buy all the "stuff" needed to do it.
                    >
                    > Take care,
                    > DBN
                    >
                    > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...>/* wrote:
                    >
                    > Hi Druid
                    >
                    > By the time I'm done, I'll need a variety of
                    > vises and workholding gear. I need to be
                    > able to do automation panels, so I'll need
                    > a two piece vise or two. The screwless
                    > vise I'm looking at has the angle locking
                    > like the Kurt vises without hanging half
                    > off the table. Even if I later find a traditional
                    > vise I like at a reasonable price, which will
                    > happen in time, there will be a need for a
                    > 3 or 4" vise with V grooves for shaft work.
                    > My (kinda weak) reason for getting this
                    > is making parts for my corn stove. The
                    > agitator runs in the fire and is consumed
                    > even when I make them from 314 SS.
                    > Now, I turn these on my 7x14 lathe and
                    > cross drill as best I can with a POS drill
                    > press, and grind flats on the end for the
                    > coupling. With the mill, I can spot face
                    > the hole locations and accurately drill
                    > them and mill the flats for the coupling.
                    > Instead of threading them, which is
                    > extremely difficult and hard on taps,
                    > (SS work hardens while hand tapping)
                    > I can drill and ream for press fit pins.
                    > My scrap rate should go down. I go
                    > through at least 4 of these a winter and
                    > they are $60 to purchase and about $10
                    > to make. I might even be able to sell a
                    > few. And the panel work is profitable.
                    > So, it's not _entirely_ a toy :^)
                    >
                    > Regards
                    > cww
                    >
                    > Druid Noibn wrote:
                    > > Hi Curt,
                    > >
                    > > It sounds like you are on your way.
                    > >
                    > > As you know some vices have ears for hold-down bolts. Some, like
                    > the
                    > > small machinist vices either have a slot or a series of holes
                    > for the
                    > > same purpose. There are some variations on this.
                    > >
                    > > There are sellers who have these at good prices on eBay and we also
                    > > have good vendors like LMS (Little machine Shop) and Lathemaster,
                    > > among others who have them.
                    > >
                    > > With all that said - depending on the work you are doing, you might
                    > > wish to look at one of the traditional milling vices, a 4" or 5"
                    > might
                    > > work well.
                    > >
                    > > As for the "last one" yes, the company seems to remove items that
                    > > aren't in-stock - while philosophically interesting,
                    > business-wise it
                    > > might not be a good idea.
                    > >
                    > > Take care,
                    > > DBN
                    > >
                    > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...
                    > <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>>/* wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Well, I just got the whole set of 11 MT3 collets for the
                    > > princely sum of $40.50 and I've got a line on a suitable
                    > > screwless vise for about $40. All I need then is an end
                    > > mill or two and I should be in business. I also need a
                    > > clamping set, but I probably need to measure the slots
                    > > before I get one of those. I'm not sure how these vises
                    > > fasten down, there aren't any visible ears but I can
                    > > find something at the hardware store till I get the
                    > > proper t nuts and such. I guess they weren't kidding
                    > > about having one 03988 mill left, shortly after I
                    > > ordered, the mill is no longer on their website. Too
                    > > bad really, we can use a little pricing pressure to
                    > > keep the other guys honest. I looked at the 45s
                    > > too, but the bucks just weren't there :^).
                    > >
                    > > Regards
                    > >
                    > > cww
                    > >
                    > > Druid Noibn wrote:
                    > > > Hi Curt,
                    > > >
                    > > > Congratulations. Lots of offerings on accessories by the usual
                    > > > vendors and many on e-bay. So far I had very little trouble on
                    > > e-bay
                    > > > but it is a gamble. Very often the packing is poor and sometimes
                    > > the
                    > > > item arrives damaged - this leads to an uncomfortable situation as
                    > > > the damage is not due to shipping. Also, some sellers have a wry
                    > > > sense of humor regarding shipping costs.
                    > > >
                    > > > There was a Homier show by me a few weeks ago but I convinced
                    > > myself
                    > > > not to attend as I was suspicious that nothing great (i.e., a
                    > > > mill/drill) would be there.
                    > > >
                    > > > The plan here is to pick up a square-column '45 type this month.
                    > > > Still didn't finalize the vendor however. The "Top-Tech" dealer
                    > > is a
                    > > > 30-minute drive so that is a strong draw.
                    > > >
                    > > > Post your thoughts on the mill-drill when it arrives and what
                    > > you did
                    > > > to "tune-it-up" -<smile>.
                    > > >
                    > > > Of course, project issues are always nice.
                    > > >
                    > > > Take care,
                    > > > DBN
                    > > >
                    > > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@... <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>
                    > > <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>>/* wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > It was just real quiet all of a sudden.
                    > > > But. I did it, I hit the button that will send
                    > > > 700 lbs of Chinese Cast Iron careening
                    > > > towards my shack in the woods. There
                    > > > was a local Homier show in St Cloud
                    > > > where I work, so I took the afternoon
                    > > > off and attended. All I got was blank looks.
                    > > > I'm not sure there was anyone there that
                    > > > could spell mill drill. So, I drove home and
                    > > > ordered one. Now I need to find a vise and
                    > > > collets to arrive hopefully at the same time.
                    > > > I hope the spindle will pass a 1/2-13
                    > > > drawbar. Thats how the collets I"m looking
                    > > > at are threaded. Sounds like there's no
                    > > > standard for MT3 collets.
                    > > >
                    > > > Regards
                    > > >
                    > > > cww
                    > > >
                    > > > Druid Noibn wrote:
                    > > > > Hi Curt,
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Sorry - on a ship this past week - lousy Internet connection.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > So - what is the Latest and Greatest?
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Take care,
                    > > > > DBN
                    > > > >
                    > > > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...
                    > <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com> <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>
                    > > > <mailto:wideopen%40ecenet.com>>/* wrote:
                    > > > >
                    > > > > anybody home?
                    > > > >
                    > > > > cww
                    > > > >
                    > > > > --
                    > > > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                    > > > 1938:
                    > > > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people
                    > tolerate the
                    > > > > growth of
                    > > > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                    > > > > democratic State
                    > > > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of
                    > government
                    > > > > by an
                    > > > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power."
                    > > But the
                    > > > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                    > > > powerless
                    > > > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                    > > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks
                    > > > > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/>
                    > > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/>>
                    > > > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/>
                    > > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48220/*http://tv.yahoo.com/>>>> on
                    > > > Yahoo! TV.
                    > > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > --
                    > > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                    > > 1938:
                    > > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                    > > > growth of
                    > > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                    > > > democratic State
                    > > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                    > > > by an
                    > > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power."
                    > But the
                    > > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                    > > powerless
                    > > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                    > > > Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47093/*http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47093/*http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222>
                    > >
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47093/*http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47093/*http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222>>>to
                    > >
                    > > > see what's on, when.
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > --
                    > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                    > 1938:
                    > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                    > > growth of
                    > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                    > > democratic State
                    > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                    > > by an
                    > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                    > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                    > powerless
                    > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                    > > Got a little couch potato?
                    > > Check out fun summer activities for kids.
                    > >
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48248/*http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48248/*http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=summer+activities+for+kids&cs=bz>>
                    >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                    > --
                    > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                    > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                    > growth of
                    > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                    > democratic State
                    > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                    > by an
                    > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                    > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                    > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                    > Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user
                    > panel
                    > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48516/*http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7%20>
                    > and lay it on us.
                    >


                    --
                    Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                    "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
                    private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
                    itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
                    individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                    conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                    against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                  • Druid Noibn
                    Hi Curt, HF is one of the places that I tend to haunt, much to the chagrin of the wife. In addition to the machine (a simple unit) one needs a hot oven and
                    Message 9 of 20 , Sep 3, 2007
                      Hi Curt,
                       
                      HF is one of the places that I tend to haunt, much to the chagrin of the wife.  In addition to the machine (a simple unit) one needs a hot oven and from the readings here and elsewhere, the use of the kitchen oven is a no-no.  I could make up my own small oven (not all that difficult) but the thought was just to use what others have done.  What the heck, if it doesn't work out well, I'll strip off the paint and start over.
                       
                      "We" used Carpenter 20 for a project that needed the extra corsion protection due to the acids involved.  As to sources, I don't know anymore (it was a few years ago) and the min quantity purchase might be an issue.
                       
                      Yes, one must plan for the long winter nights.
                       
                      Take care,
                      DBN  

                      Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...> wrote:
                      To that end HF has their powder coat kit on sale for $50.
                      If I could find Carpenter 20 or indeed, any more suitable
                      alloy around I would give it a try. Running in an oxidizing
                      flame at orange heat is tough on most steels. My local
                      selection of 5/8" rounds is somewhat limited. Perhaps we
                      have a metallurgist on board who could recommend?
                      As having a mill becomes a reality all sorts of long
                      deferred projects come to mind, perfect for the long
                      nights approaching.

                      Regards

                      cww

                      Druid Noibn wrote:
                      > Hi Curt,
                      >
                      > it all sounds great to me - the small buiness idea of making the
                      > agitators is perfect - and allows one to build-up a nice "toy"
                      > collection. I worked in the the biotech business for 17 years and we
                      > used 316L and sometimes 304L (non-process work) and it worked out
                      > well. I don't know the 314 product.
                      >
                      > Curious if using Carpenter 20 alloy (might be a tad expensive) would
                      > address the corrosion rate in the application.
                      >
                      > The vise sounds like a good deal. I picked up (on eBay) a 4" Starrett
                      > mill vise (they no longer make them) and in the process of refinishing
                      > it - this is a bit of fun for me. I would like to powder coat it but
                      > decided to not buy all the "stuff" needed to do it.
                      >
                      > Take care,
                      > DBN
                      >
                      > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com>/* wrote:
                      >
                      > Hi Druid
                      >
                      > By the time I'm done, I'll need a variety of
                      > vises and workholding gear. I need to be
                      > able to do automation panels, so I'll need
                      > a two piece vise or two. The screwless
                      > vise I'm looking at has the angle locking
                      > like the Kurt vises without hanging half
                      > off the table. Even if I later find a traditional
                      > vise I like at a reasonable price, which will
                      > happen in time, there will be a need for a
                      > 3 or 4" vise with V grooves for shaft work.
                      > My (kinda weak) reason for getting this
                      > is making parts for my corn stove. The
                      > agitator runs in the fire and is consumed
                      > even when I make them from 314 SS.
                      > Now, I turn these on my 7x14 lathe and
                      > cross drill as best I can with a POS drill
                      > press, and grind flats on the end for the
                      > coupling. With the mill, I can spot face
                      > the hole locations and accurately drill
                      > them and mill the flats for the coupling.
                      > Instead of threading them, which is
                      > extremely difficult and hard on taps,
                      > (SS work hardens while hand tapping)
                      > I can drill and ream for press fit pins.
                      > My scrap rate should go down. I go
                      > through at least 4 of these a winter and
                      > they are $60 to purchase and about $10
                      > to make. I might even be able to sell a
                      > few. And the panel work is profitable.
                      > So, it's not _entirely_ a toy :^)
                      >
                      > Regards
                      > cww
                      >
                      > Druid Noibn wrote:
                      > > Hi Curt,
                      > >
                      > > It sounds like you are on your way.
                      > >
                      > > As you know some vices have ears for hold-down bolts. Some, like
                      > the
                      > > small machinist vices either have a slot or a series of holes
                      > for the
                      > > same purpose. There are some variations on this.
                      > >
                      > > There are sellers who have these at good prices on eBay and we also
                      > > have good vendors like LMS (Little machine Shop) and Lathemaster,
                      > > among others who have them.
                      > >
                      > > With all that said - depending on the work you are doing, you might
                      > > wish to look at one of the traditional milling vices, a 4" or 5"
                      > might
                      > > work well.
                      > >
                      > > As for the "last one" yes, the company seems to remove items that
                      > > aren't in-stock - while philosophically interesting,
                      > business-wise it
                      > > might not be a good idea.
                      > >
                      > > Take care,
                      > > DBN
                      > >
                      > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com
                      > <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>>/* wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Well, I just got the whole set of 11 MT3 collets for the
                      > > princely sum of $40.50 and I've got a line on a suitable
                      > > screwless vise for about $40. All I need then is an end
                      > > mill or two and I should be in business. I also need a
                      > > clamping set, but I probably need to measure the slots
                      > > before I get one of those. I'm not sure how these vises
                      > > fasten down, there aren't any visible ears but I can
                      > > find something at the hardware store till I get the
                      > > proper t nuts and such. I guess they weren't kidding
                      > > about having one 03988 mill left, shortly after I
                      > > ordered, the mill is no longer on their website. Too
                      > > bad really, we can use a little pricing pressure to
                      > > keep the other guys honest. I looked at the 45s
                      > > too, but the bucks just weren't there :^).
                      > >
                      > > Regards
                      > >
                      > > cww
                      > >
                      > > Druid Noibn wrote:
                      > > > Hi Curt,
                      > > >
                      > > > Congratulations. Lots of offerings on accessories by the usual
                      > > > vendors and many on e-bay. So far I had very little trouble on
                      > > e-bay
                      > > > but it is a gamble. Very often the packing is poor and sometimes
                      > > the
                      > > > item arrives damaged - this leads to an uncomfortable situation as
                      > > > the damage is not due to shipping. Also, some sellers have a wry
                      > > > sense of humor regarding shipping costs.
                      > > >
                      > > > There was a Homier show by me a few weeks ago but I convinced
                      > > myself
                      > > > not to attend as I was suspicious that nothing great (i.e., a
                      > > > mill/drill) would be there.
                      > > >
                      > > > The plan here is to pick up a square-column '45 type this month.
                      > > > Still didn't finalize the vendor however. The "Top-Tech" dealer
                      > > is a
                      > > > 30-minute drive so that is a strong draw.
                      > > >
                      > > > Post your thoughts on the mill-drill when it arrives and what
                      > > you did
                      > > > to "tune-it-up" -<smile>.
                      > > >
                      > > > Of course, project issues are always nice.
                      > > >
                      > > > Take care,
                      > > > DBN
                      > > >
                      > > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>
                      > > <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>>/* wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > It was just real quiet all of a sudden.
                      > > > But. I did it, I hit the button that will send
                      > > > 700 lbs of Chinese Cast Iron careening
                      > > > towards my shack in the woods. There
                      > > > was a local Homier show in St Cloud
                      > > > where I work, so I took the afternoon
                      > > > off and attended. All I got was blank looks.
                      > > > I'm not sure there was anyone there that
                      > > > could spell mill drill. So, I drove home and
                      > > > ordered one. Now I need to find a vise and
                      > > > collets to arrive hopefully at the same time.
                      > > > I hope the spindle will pass a 1/2-13
                      > > > drawbar. Thats how the collets I"m looking
                      > > > at are threaded. Sounds like there's no
                      > > > standard for MT3 collets.
                      > > >
                      > > > Regards
                      > > >
                      > > > cww
                      > > >
                      > > > Druid Noibn wrote:
                      > > > > Hi Curt,
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Sorry - on a ship this past week - lousy Internet connection.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > So - what is the Latest and Greatest?
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Take care,
                      > > > > DBN
                      > > > >
                      > > > > */Curt Wuollet <wideopen@ecenet. com
                      > <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com> <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>
                      > > > <mailto:wideopen% 40ecenet. com>>/* wrote:
                      > > > >
                      > > > > anybody home?
                      > > > >
                      > > > > cww
                      > > > >
                      > > > > --
                      > > > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                      > > > 1938:
                      > > > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people
                      > tolerate the
                      > > > > growth of
                      > > > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                      > > > > democratic State
                      > > > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of
                      > government
                      > > > > by an
                      > > > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power."
                      > > But the
                      > > > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                      > > > powerless
                      > > > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                      > > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks
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                      > > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/
                      > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/>>
                      > > > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/
                      > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/>
                      > > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/
                      > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=48220/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/>>>> on
                      > > > Yahoo! TV.
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > --
                      > > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                      > > 1938:
                      > > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                      > > > growth of
                      > > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                      > > > democratic State
                      > > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                      > > > by an
                      > > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power."
                      > But the
                      > > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                      > > powerless
                      > > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                      > > > Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge
                      > > >
                      > >
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                      > >
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                      > <http://us.rd. yahoo.com/ evt=47093/ *http://tv. yahoo.com/ collections/ 222>>>to
                      > >
                      > > > see what's on, when.
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > > --
                      > > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in
                      > 1938:
                      > > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                      > > growth of
                      > > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                      > > democratic State
                      > > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                      > > by an
                      > > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                      > > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already
                      > powerless
                      > > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
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                      > > Check out fun summer activities for kids.
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                      >
                      > >
                      > >
                      >
                      > --
                      > Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                      > "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                      > growth of
                      > private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                      > democratic State
                      > itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government
                      > by an
                      > individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                      > conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                      > against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                      >
                      >
                      > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
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                      >

                      --
                      Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                      "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
                      private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
                      itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
                      individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                      conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                      against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.



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                    • Paul
                      I am in the process of moving myself and if there is one thing that I have learned in the experience it is that I like heavy stuff. Though I do seem to collect
                      Message 10 of 20 , Sep 7, 2007
                        I am in the process of moving myself and if there is one thing that I
                        have learned in the experience it is that I like heavy stuff. Though I
                        do seem to collect rigging materials too. Choker straps, chains,
                        hoists those sorts of things. I was so happy when I got my mill/drill
                        moved.

                        --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, rgsparber@... wrote:
                        >
                        > In a message dated 9/1/2007 5:34:08 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
                        > wideopen@... writes:
                        >
                        >
                        > That sounds interesting, I bought a clone to
                        > try and cut up various rod stock. Not good.
                        > By the way, I found your moving article with
                        > the relative weights to be useful. I haven't
                        > decided yet whether to move the thing in the
                        > crate or do the cleanup outside and split it
                        > into manageable chunks. I am fortunate in
                        > that my basement has a walkout. But it's a
                        > long ways due to terrain to move from the
                        > driveway to the basement door. I think it
                        > might be easiest to separate the top half
                        > from the bottom half at the column bolts if
                        > I can find a good way to cradle the head and
                        > column. That way I'm not taking apart any
                        > precision parts on the lawn. I've got a
                        > husky two wheeler for the base which would
                        > have a low CG and one of those big wheel
                        > wagons for the head and column minus the
                        > sheet metal. Years ago, I built a tripod
                        > for changing engines, Neither piece should
                        > tax that, but the rigging might be a problem.
                        >
                        > ---------------------------------------------------------------
                        >
                        > I'm glad to hear that you understand CG (center of gravity). It
                        takes a
                        > fraction of a second for one of these top heavy mills to flip down
                        with
                        > incredible force. If you have something like a RF30, then you will
                        probably have to
                        > split the column from the base to tram the head so there is no
                        additional work
                        > doing it before you move the machine to your shop.
                        >
                        > Above all, be safe!
                        >
                        > Rick
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the
                        all-new AOL at
                        > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
                        >
                      • Curt Wuollet
                        I nearly ended up aborting the mission when UPSFreight started talking about $125 for liftgate service and $60 for residential service in addition to the $230
                        Message 11 of 20 , Sep 7, 2007
                          I nearly ended up aborting the mission when UPSFreight
                          started talking about $125 for liftgate service and $60 for
                          residential service in addition to the $230 charged for
                          freight. I was prepared to suggest they haul the damn
                          thing back to Indiana. Fortunately, they don't service
                          my area and the company they contract with concluded
                          our arrangements with "have a check for $75 waiting
                          for the driver and we'll be out between 10 and 2 on
                          Thursday" after our palaver. So, I have to wait till
                          Thursday, but it still won't be too bad a deal. Quite a
                          saga unfolding but I have a vise coming and collets and
                          a 3/8 end mill, so I should be making chips at long last,
                          by weeks end.

                          Regards

                          cww

                          Paul wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > I am in the process of moving myself and if there is one thing that I
                          > have learned in the experience it is that I like heavy stuff. Though I
                          > do seem to collect rigging materials too. Choker straps, chains,
                          > hoists those sorts of things. I was so happy when I got my mill/drill
                          > moved.
                          >
                          > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
                          > <mailto:mill_drill%40yahoogroups.com>, rgsparber@... wrote:
                          > >
                          > > In a message dated 9/1/2007 5:34:08 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
                          > > wideopen@... writes:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > That sounds interesting, I bought a clone to
                          > > try and cut up various rod stock. Not good.
                          > > By the way, I found your moving article with
                          > > the relative weights to be useful. I haven't
                          > > decided yet whether to move the thing in the
                          > > crate or do the cleanup outside and split it
                          > > into manageable chunks. I am fortunate in
                          > > that my basement has a walkout. But it's a
                          > > long ways due to terrain to move from the
                          > > driveway to the basement door. I think it
                          > > might be easiest to separate the top half
                          > > from the bottom half at the column bolts if
                          > > I can find a good way to cradle the head and
                          > > column. That way I'm not taking apart any
                          > > precision parts on the lawn. I've got a
                          > > husky two wheeler for the base which would
                          > > have a low CG and one of those big wheel
                          > > wagons for the head and column minus the
                          > > sheet metal. Years ago, I built a tripod
                          > > for changing engines, Neither piece should
                          > > tax that, but the rigging might be a problem.
                          > >
                          > > ----------------------------------------------------------
                          > >
                          > > I'm glad to hear that you understand CG (center of gravity). It
                          > takes a
                          > > fraction of a second for one of these top heavy mills to flip down
                          > with
                          > > incredible force. If you have something like a RF30, then you will
                          > probably have to
                          > > split the column from the base to tram the head so there is no
                          > additional work
                          > > doing it before you move the machine to your shop.
                          > >
                          > > Above all, be safe!
                          > >
                          > > Rick
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the
                          > all-new AOL at
                          > > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
                          > <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour>
                          > >
                          >
                          >


                          --
                          Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                          "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
                          private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
                          itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
                          individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                          conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                          against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
                        • Paul
                          I got in on the Harbor Freight deal of free shipping for any order over $50. I think Yellow Freight delivered my machine to me. The guy had a lift gate and a
                          Message 12 of 20 , Sep 8, 2007
                            I got in on the Harbor Freight deal of free shipping for any order
                            over $50. I think Yellow Freight delivered my machine to me. The guy
                            had a lift gate and a pallet jack, so he was able to drop the thing
                            off in the driveway for me. Now when I loaded my machine into a U-Haul
                            truck to move I used my cherry picker engine hoist and a heavy duty
                            dolly I'd made out of 5 inch I beams for final positioning in the
                            truck. To this day I still laugh whenever I see a U-Haul truck and
                            read on it, "An adventure in moving". They ain't a kidding!

                            Though if the whole story would be told I should add that I had a bit
                            of a makeshift gantry hoist disaster getting my machine down off its
                            stand. That was one of those religious epiphany times, you know the
                            Father, the Son, and the Wholly Smokes! moments if you know what I
                            mean. At the time I could not get my cherry picker into the garage as
                            I was storing a disabled car in the garage. That was one of those real
                            run away! sorts of situations there. I had a whole 17 foot U-Haul
                            truck to pack that day and the mill was only one thing that was going
                            into it. Needless to say I was not able to devote the attention that
                            moving it really deserved.

                            The next time I move my machine I think I will move the machine in two
                            pieces, the head, then the base, table, and column. All together these
                            machines seem rather top heavy to me when trying to lift them. That,
                            and the machine planes off funny when I've had it suspended. If the
                            instruction booklet that comes with these machines was worth anything
                            at all it would come with rigging instructions for picking these
                            battleship anchors up.

                            Choker straps are hard to get very tight, and they are a bit stretchy,
                            if you don't have the height. This has been an issue with me. Clevis
                            hook chains seem to be the way to fly to me rigging these machines to
                            lift. I can get them tight, and they have no stretch.

                            --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com, Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > I nearly ended up aborting the mission when UPSFreight
                            > started talking about $125 for liftgate service and $60 for
                            > residential service in addition to the $230 charged for
                            > freight. I was prepared to suggest they haul the damn
                            > thing back to Indiana. Fortunately, they don't service
                            > my area and the company they contract with concluded
                            > our arrangements with "have a check for $75 waiting
                            > for the driver and we'll be out between 10 and 2 on
                            > Thursday" after our palaver. So, I have to wait till
                            > Thursday, but it still won't be too bad a deal. Quite a
                            > saga unfolding but I have a vise coming and collets and
                            > a 3/8 end mill, so I should be making chips at long last,
                            > by weeks end.
                            >
                            > Regards
                            >
                            > cww
                            >
                          • Curt Wuollet
                            Yeah, I ll let you know on the two piece move. I ll still hafta pull the sheet metal as I think you d bend it if you set the head down on it s side. With the
                            Message 13 of 20 , Sep 8, 2007
                              Yeah, I'll let you know on the two piece move. I'll
                              still hafta pull the sheet metal as I think you'd bend
                              it if you set the head down on it's side. With the
                              belt cover off you can drop a chain down the middle
                              and maybe get close enough to balancing to put
                              it back on the column. The base and column will
                              require some eyeballing to lift. Perhaps one can
                              get the balance behind the table with careful
                              positioning. I don't have a cherry picker but
                              I'm parking it under the 8x8 support beam in
                              the basement and next to the block wall so I
                              should be able to just throw a chain around
                              that beam and lift. Gonna use a comealong,
                              but it's the real deal from Ramsden not a
                              shaky import. Trying to keep the total cost
                              of the operation within reason or I'd buy a
                              cherry picker at the local unclaimed freight
                              store.

                              Regards

                              cww


                              Paul wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > I got in on the Harbor Freight deal of free shipping for any order
                              > over $50. I think Yellow Freight delivered my machine to me. The guy
                              > had a lift gate and a pallet jack, so he was able to drop the thing
                              > off in the driveway for me. Now when I loaded my machine into a U-Haul
                              > truck to move I used my cherry picker engine hoist and a heavy duty
                              > dolly I'd made out of 5 inch I beams for final positioning in the
                              > truck. To this day I still laugh whenever I see a U-Haul truck and
                              > read on it, "An adventure in moving". They ain't a kidding!
                              >
                              > Though if the whole story would be told I should add that I had a bit
                              > of a makeshift gantry hoist disaster getting my machine down off its
                              > stand. That was one of those religious epiphany times, you know the
                              > Father, the Son, and the Wholly Smokes! moments if you know what I
                              > mean. At the time I could not get my cherry picker into the garage as
                              > I was storing a disabled car in the garage. That was one of those real
                              > run away! sorts of situations there. I had a whole 17 foot U-Haul
                              > truck to pack that day and the mill was only one thing that was going
                              > into it. Needless to say I was not able to devote the attention that
                              > moving it really deserved.
                              >
                              > The next time I move my machine I think I will move the machine in two
                              > pieces, the head, then the base, table, and column. All together these
                              > machines seem rather top heavy to me when trying to lift them. That,
                              > and the machine planes off funny when I've had it suspended. If the
                              > instruction booklet that comes with these machines was worth anything
                              > at all it would come with rigging instructions for picking these
                              > battleship anchors up.
                              >
                              > Choker straps are hard to get very tight, and they are a bit stretchy,
                              > if you don't have the height. This has been an issue with me. Clevis
                              > hook chains seem to be the way to fly to me rigging these machines to
                              > lift. I can get them tight, and they have no stretch.
                              >
                              > --- In mill_drill@yahoogroups.com
                              > <mailto:mill_drill%40yahoogroups.com>, Curt Wuollet <wideopen@...> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > I nearly ended up aborting the mission when UPSFreight
                              > > started talking about $125 for liftgate service and $60 for
                              > > residential service in addition to the $230 charged for
                              > > freight. I was prepared to suggest they haul the damn
                              > > thing back to Indiana. Fortunately, they don't service
                              > > my area and the company they contract with concluded
                              > > our arrangements with "have a check for $75 waiting
                              > > for the driver and we'll be out between 10 and 2 on
                              > > Thursday" after our palaver. So, I have to wait till
                              > > Thursday, but it still won't be too bad a deal. Quite a
                              > > saga unfolding but I have a vise coming and collets and
                              > > a 3/8 end mill, so I should be making chips at long last,
                              > > by weeks end.
                              > >
                              > > Regards
                              > >
                              > > cww
                              > >
                              >
                              >


                              --
                              Franklin D. Roosevelt Wrote about that other famous monopoly in 1938:
                              "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of
                              private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic State
                              itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of government by an
                              individual, by a group or by any controlling private power." But the
                              conviction of Standard Oil stood. Our government is already powerless
                              against today's monopoly. Only the people can prevail.
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