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Re: [milgenire] Green Howards medal

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  • Donnacha
    Hi Éamann, I m afraid that the knowledgeable one on the NA records is yourself these days since you have so much personal experience of hunting them down in
    Message 1 of 18 , Feb 20, 2011
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      Hi Éamann,
      I'm afraid that the knowledgeable one on the NA records is yourself these days since you have so much personal experience of hunting them down in the new outsourcing climate under which they are being scattered to the four quarters, all of course with the object of "improving service".
       
      Your best bet is probably to access WO16. "From 1878 to 1898, all muster rolls and pay lists are in WO 16 ." If you look at the following you will see that there are records for the Green Howards under the designation the 19th Foot; both 1st and 2nd Bns are shown:
       
      http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/searchresults.asp?SearchInit=0&txtsearchterm=19th&txtfirstdate=&txtlastdate=&txtrestriction=wo16&hdnsorttype=Reference&image1.x=38&image1.y=16

      I wouldn't take it as read that the 'coverung dates' signify the records are just for this span. e.g. A similar return for WO97 will give a covering date that is simply the date of the latest record, obviously with WO97 this is most likely to be the discharge date.
       
      Problem is of course getting access. There is a note here attached to the description of the series indication that it is part of the Regiments Indexing Project and is currently in use. So I guess it's limbo again for that one.
       
       
      As for WO97, over the years I've seen many accounts of gaps in that series quite apart from the notorious 'misfiled' papers. My grandfathers record failed to show in a search of WO97 although I did locate him in one muster taken in Hong Kong in 1894.
       
      Happy Hunting,
       
      Donnacha
       
      --- On Sun, 2/20/11, Éamann Ó Ruairc <eamann@...> wrote:

      From: Éamann Ó Ruairc <eamann@...>
      Subject: Re: [milgenire] Green Howards medal
      To: milgenire@yahoogroups.com
      Received: Sunday, February 20, 2011, 10:36 AM

       
      Thank you, Donnacha for that additional information! You’re a very knowledgeable man and we are blessed to have you on this mailing list!

      On the “Victorian Wars” forum two contributors, including one specialist in medals, have also said that the medal was a (semi)-unofficial one, sometimes used for sporting events.

      It is now clear that the medal is not firm evidence that my ggf served in the Green Howards. However, it is no coincidence that he possessed the medal. The only way to know for sure is to consult the Green Howards records, hence my question: do you know if Kew has individual soldier records for the Green Howards for the period 1874-1886? 

      I am going on the assumption at present that my ggf enlisted in the Green Howards in 1874 when he was about 15. He liked army life and when his 12 year stint came to an end in 1886 he signed up again in the Liverpool Regiment. Likewise in 1915, despite his age and disability, he enlisted again.

      As regards the Kew records: do I remember you saying in a previous mail that FMP is in the process of digitalising them?

      Which prompts me to say that despite the firm proof I now have that my ggf was invalided out of the Liverpool Regiment in 1887, I cannot find any trace of him in the Chelsea Pensioners records on FMP. (On another thread Johnny White pointed out to me that the WWI pension file of my grandfather, Michael Magee, was on Ancestry. A friend downloaded the eight images for me last night to my great excitement and satisfaction! It confirms what I knew already and provides new facts that I did not know about.)

      Beannachtai,

      Éamann

      Le 20 févr. 2011 à 01:46, Donnacha a écrit :

       
      It wouldn't surprise me then if this was a blank. These are often held in stock by the supplier against requirements of mainly sporting events. It is then an easy business to add the appropriate inscription. Reduces costs also.
       
      Regards,
       
      Donnacha

      --- On Sat, 2/19/11, Éamann Ó Ruairc <eamann@...> wrote:

      From: Éamann Ó Ruairc <eamann@...>
      Subject: Re: [milgenire] Green Howards medal
      To: milgenire@yahoogroups.com
      Received: Saturday, February 19, 2011, 11:04 AM

       
      Hi Donnacha,

      The reverse side of the medal is blank and there is nothing around the rim.

      I’m taking up John’s advice and I am going to contact the Green Howards Museum.

      Slan,

      Éamann

      Le 19 févr. 2011 à 08:14, Donnacha a écrit :

       
      Hi  Éamann .
      Do you have an image of the obverse of the medal and is George Magee name inscribed on it?
       
      If there is no direct identification of him on the medal and there is no other evidence it is quite possible that he merely came across this possibly as a keepsake from a friend or in one of many other circumstances.
       
      Regards,
       
      Donnacha 

      --- On Fri, 2/18/11, Éamann Ó Ruairc <eamann@...> wrote:

      From: Éamann Ó Ruairc <eamann@...>
      Subject: [milgenire] Green Howards medal
      To: milgenire@yahoogroups.com
      Received: Friday, February 18, 2011, 4:22 PM

      A Dhonncha, a chara, and other readers,

      I didn’t know what you said in your reply about medals.

      Here’s the Green Howards medal that my ggfather had. In case you cannot make out the details, it has the Princess of Wales' cypher "A" combined with the Dannebrog or Danish cross and is topped by her coronet. In the middle of this you have the date "1875" and beneath "XIX". The scroll at the bottom says "The Green Howards A.P.W.O. (= Alexandra, Princess of Wales Own) Yorkshire Regt.”

      The Green Howards was raised in 1751 as the 19th Regt of Foot and, according to Wikipedia, in 1875 Princess Alexandra, Princess of Wales presented new colours to the 1st Battalion at Sheffield and consented to the regiment bearing her name, thus becoming the 19th (1st Yorkshire North Riding - Princess of Wales's Own) Regiment of Foot.The regiment adopted a cap badge consisting of the Princess's cypher "A" combined with the Dannebrog or Danish cross and topped by her coronet. The “XIX” is probably a reference to the old 19th foot Regt.

      Looking forward to hearing your comments,

      Beannachtai,

      Éamann 








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