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Need a car for VCF

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  • Joe Giliberti
    Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I ve been monitoring Craigslist and
    Message 1 of 15 , May 22, 2008
      Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I've been monitoring Craigslist and ebay, but nothing good thus far. I want to do something similar to the old Buick Reatta in a car, with a computer control center, which acts as both a customizable engine management system, as well as control for climate, radio, etc, running off of either an older computer or a older style homebrew or kit computer. I know some of you will be thinking that it would never happen in time, but I'd like to give it my best shot. Even if it isn't finished in time, this would be a project which would combine my two loves as far as engineering: computer and automotive. So, Evan, do you by any chance still have the S.S. Evan lying around? :D
    • Evan Koblentz
      Sorry, the S.S. Evan was sold during my sophomore year of college (1993-1994) ... it was a 79 Caprice Classic. For the engine management part, the best and
      Message 2 of 15 , May 22, 2008
        Sorry, the S.S. Evan was sold during my sophomore year of college
        (1993-1994) ... it was a '79 Caprice Classic.

        For the engine management part, the best and cheapest way to start is by
        using the D-I-Y version of the Megasquirt (www.megasquirt.info) ... I'm
        close to buying a pre-assembled version for my Miata.

        As for actually controlling a car's engine and multimedia with a VINTAGE
        computer ... I seriously recommend that you buy a gas-powered R/C car
        instead! That way you're not wasting a bunch of money, it's no massive
        lost if you break stuff, and you can demo it inside the VCF exhibits.





        > Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably
        > automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I've been
        > monitoring
        > Craigslist and ebay, but nothing good thus far. I want to do something
        > similar to the old Buick Reatta in a car, with a computer control center,
        > which acts as both a customizable engine management system, as well as
        > control for climate, radio, etc, running off of either an older computer
        > or
        > a older style homebrew or kit computer. I know some of you will be
        > thinking
        > that it would never happen in time, but I'd like to give it my best shot.
        > Even if it isn't finished in time, this would be a project which would
        > combine my two loves as far as engineering: computer and automotive. So,
        > Evan, do you by any chance still have the S.S. Evan lying around? *:*D
        >
      • Evan
        Also: you can use the Megasquirt on ANY car and it will improve the gas mileage. So it is a good investment, even post-VCF. They have a Linux client program
        Message 3 of 15 , May 22, 2008
          Also: you can use the Megasquirt on ANY car and it will improve the gas mileage. So it is a good investment, even post-VCF. They have a Linux client program for tuning. How old of a computer can you make that run on...? To be determined. :)

          -----Original Message-----

          From: "Evan Koblentz" <evan@...>
          Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF
          Date: Thu May 22, 2008 12:47 pm
          Size: 2K
          To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com

          Sorry, the S.S. Evan was sold during my sophomore year of college
          (1993-1994) ... it was a '79 Caprice Classic.

          For the engine management part, the best and cheapest way to start is by
          using the D-I-Y version of the Megasquirt (www.megasquirt.info) ... I'm
          close to buying a pre-assembled version for my Miata.

          As for actually controlling a car's engine and multimedia with a VINTAGE
          computer ... I seriously recommend that you buy a gas-powered R/C car
          instead! That way you're not wasting a bunch of money, it's no massive
          lost if you break stuff, and you can demo it inside the VCF exhibits.





          > Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably
          > automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I've been
          > monitoring
          > Craigslist and ebay, but nothing good thus far. I want to do something
          > similar to the old Buick Reatta in a car, with a computer control center,
          > which acts as both a customizable engine management system, as well as
          > control for climate, radio, etc, running off of either an older computer
          > or
          > a older style homebrew or kit computer. I know some of you will be
          > thinking
          > that it would never happen in time, but I'd like to give it my best shot.
          > Even if it isn't finished in time, this would be a project which would
          > combine my two loves as far as engineering: computer and automotive. So,
          > Evan, do you by any chance still have the S.S. Evan lying around? *:*D
          >



          ------------------------------------

          Yahoo! Groups Links
        • Jeffrey Frady
          There is a Palm OS based system for using with a car to tune your engine. Runs on a T|E2 I think. Don t remember the name. I m was planning on making a car
          Message 4 of 15 , May 22, 2008
            There is a Palm OS based system for using with a car to tune your engine.  Runs on a T|E2 I think.  Don't remember the name.

            I'm was planning on making a car PC.  But after I figured out the price, I might as well buy an Asus EEE and buy a sub $100 touch screen kit and mount it to my dash.  I'm focusing on fixing the temperature gauge issue with my car first.

            On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 1:10 PM, Evan <evan@...> wrote:

            Also: you can use the Megasquirt on ANY car and it will improve the gas mileage. So it is a good investment, even post-VCF. They have a Linux client program for tuning. How old of a computer can you make that run on...? To be determined. :)



            -----Original Message-----

            From: "Evan Koblentz" <evan@...>
            Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF
            Date: Thu May 22, 2008 12:47 pm
            Size: 2K
            To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com

            Sorry, the S.S. Evan was sold during my sophomore year of college
            (1993-1994) ... it was a '79 Caprice Classic.

            For the engine management part, the best and cheapest way to start is by
            using the D-I-Y version of the Megasquirt (www.megasquirt.info) ... I'm
            close to buying a pre-assembled version for my Miata.

            As for actually controlling a car's engine and multimedia with a VINTAGE
            computer ... I seriously recommend that you buy a gas-powered R/C car
            instead! That way you're not wasting a bunch of money, it's no massive
            lost if you break stuff, and you can demo it inside the VCF exhibits.

            > Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably
            > automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I've been
            > monitoring
            > Craigslist and ebay, but nothing good thus far. I want to do something
            > similar to the old Buick Reatta in a car, with a computer control center,
            > which acts as both a customizable engine management system, as well as
            > control for climate, radio, etc, running off of either an older computer
            > or
            > a older style homebrew or kit computer. I know some of you will be
            > thinking
            > that it would never happen in time, but I'd like to give it my best shot.
            > Even if it isn't finished in time, this would be a project which would
            > combine my two loves as far as engineering: computer and automotive. So,
            > Evan, do you by any chance still have the S.S. Evan lying around? *:*D
            >

            ------------------------------------

            Yahoo! Groups Links




            --
            See you spare cowboy...
          • Evan Koblentz
            Jeff, just to clarify - the Megasquirt gets permanently installed in your car and monitors/adjusts the engine attributes in real-time. You leave it in the
            Message 5 of 15 , May 22, 2008
              Message
              Jeff, just to clarify - the Megasquirt gets permanently installed in your car and monitors/adjusts the engine attributes in real-time.  You leave it in the car, mounted under the hood, and and it actually does its magic while you drive. The software you're thinking of only plugs in for diagnosis and tells you what is happening -- but it can't do anything about it.  (However, now that I think about it, the Megasquirt has a Palm client as well, just like its Linux and Windows clients.  Still a whole different thing than what you mentioned.)
               
              -----Original Message-----
              From: Jeffrey Frady [mailto:Legodude522@...]
              Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2008 11:10 PM
              To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF

              There is a Palm OS based system for using with a car to tune your engine.  Runs on a T|E2 I think.  Don't remember the name.

              I'm was planning on making a car PC.  But after I figured out the price, I might as well buy an Asus EEE and buy a sub $100 touch screen kit and mount it to my dash.  I'm focusing on fixing the temperature gauge issue with my car first.

              On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 1:10 PM, Evan <evan@...> wrote:

              Also: you can use the Megasquirt on ANY car and it will improve the gas mileage. So it is a good investment, even post-VCF. They have a Linux client program for tuning. How old of a computer can you make that run on...? To be determined. :)



              -----Original Message-----

              From: "Evan Koblentz" <evan@...>
              Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF
              Date: Thu May 22, 2008 12:47 pm
              Size: 2K
              To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com

              Sorry, the S.S. Evan was sold during my sophomore year of college
              (1993-1994) ... it was a '79 Caprice Classic.

              For the engine management part, the best and cheapest way to start is by
              using the D-I-Y version of the Megasquirt (www.megasquirt.info) ... I'm
              close to buying a pre-assembled version for my Miata.

              As for actually controlling a car's engine and multimedia with a VINTAGE
              computer ... I seriously recommend that you buy a gas-powered R/C car
              instead! That way you're not wasting a bunch of money, it's no massive
              lost if you break stuff, and you can demo it inside the VCF exhibits.

              > Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably
              > automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I've been
              > monitoring
              > Craigslist and ebay, but nothing good thus far. I want to do something
              > similar to the old Buick Reatta in a car, with a computer control center,
              > which acts as both a customizable engine management system, as well as
              > control for climate, radio, etc, running off of either an older computer
              > or
              > a older style homebrew or kit computer. I know some of you will be
              > thinking
              > that it would never happen in time, but I'd like to give it my best shot.
              > Even if it isn't finished in time, this would be a project which would
              > combine my two loves as far as engineering: computer and automotive. So,
              > Evan, do you by any chance still have the S.S. Evan lying around? *:*D
              >

              ------------------------------------

              Yahoo! Groups Links




              --
              See you spare cowboy...
            • Bob Applegate
              One of the guys in our group at work (a combination of EEs and embedded software people such as myself) had a scope in his son s car for a while to fix all the
              Message 6 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                One of the guys in our group at work (a combination of EEs and embedded software
                people such as myself) had a scope in his son's car for a while to fix all the goofy
                "fixes" a previous owner had done to the car.  Blindly advancing timing on cars does
                NOT improve performance.  Using a multi-channel scope allowed him to monitor a
                number of signals between the computers and spark plugs (!!!!) to get the timing
                worked out.

                Bob


                On May 22, 2008, at 11:09 PM, Jeffrey Frady wrote:

                There is a Palm OS based system for using with a car to tune your engine.  Runs on a T|E2 I think.  Don't remember the name.

                I'm was planning on making a car PC.  But after I figured out the price, I might as well buy an Asus EEE and buy a sub $100 touch screen kit and mount it to my dash.  I'm focusing on fixing the temperature gauge issue with my car first.

                On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 1:10 PM, Evan <evan@...> wrote:

                Also: you can use the Megasquirt on ANY car and it will improve the gas mileage. So it is a good investment, even post-VCF. They have a Linux client program for tuning. How old of a computer can you make that run on...? To be determined. :)



                -----Original Message-----

                From: "Evan Koblentz" <evan@...>
                Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF
                Date: Thu May 22, 2008 12:47 pm
                Size: 2K
                To: midatlanticretro@ yahoogroups. com

                Sorry, the S.S. Evan was sold during my sophomore year of college
                (1993-1994) ... it was a '79 Caprice Classic.

                For the engine management part, the best and cheapest way to start is by
                using the D-I-Y version of the Megasquirt (www.megasquirt. info) ... I'm
                close to buying a pre-assembled version for my Miata.

                As for actually controlling a car's engine and multimedia with a VINTAGE
                computer ... I seriously recommend that you buy a gas-powered R/C car
                instead! That way you're not wasting a bunch of money, it's no massive
                lost if you break stuff, and you can demo it inside the VCF exhibits.

                > Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably
                > automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I've been
                > monitoring
                > Craigslist and ebay, but nothing good thus far. I want to do something
                > similar to the old Buick Reatta in a car, with a computer control center,
                > which acts as both a customizable engine management system, as well as
                > control for climate, radio, etc, running off of either an older computer
                > or
                > a older style homebrew or kit computer. I know some of you will be
                > thinking
                > that it would never happen in time, but I'd like to give it my best shot.
                > Even if it isn't finished in time, this would be a project which would
                > combine my two loves as far as engineering: computer and automotive. So,
                > Evan, do you by any chance still have the S.S. Evan lying around? *:*D




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              • Evan
                True. For example, in my world, you can gain a few HP by advancing timing a few degrees, buy beyond that it s diminishing returns and in some cases it s
                Message 7 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                  True. For example, in my world, you can gain a few HP by advancing timing a few degrees, buy beyond that it's diminishing returns and in some cases it's better to retard timing.

                  What's funny, Bob, is your friend might have spent hours with his 'scope ... while any ordinary gearhead could have done the same jon in 20 minutes using a timing light
                  :)

                  -----Original Message-----

                  From: Bob Applegate <bob@...>
                  Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF
                  Date: Fri May 23, 2008 5:10 am
                  Size: 12K
                  To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com

                  One of the guys in our group at work (a combination of EEs and embedded software
                  people such as myself) had a scope in his son's car for a while to fix all the goofy
                  "fixes" a previous owner had done to the car. Blindly advancing timing on cars does
                  NOT improve performance. Using a multi-channel scope allowed him to monitor a
                  number of signals between the computers and spark plugs (!!!!) to get the timing
                  worked out.


                  Bob



                  On May 22, 2008, at 11:09 PM, Jeffrey Frady wrote:
                  There is a Palm OS based system for using with a car to tune your engine. Runs on a T|E2 I think. Don't remember the name.I'm was planning on making a car PC. But after I figured out the price, I might as well buy an Asus EEE and buy a sub $100 touch screen kit and mount it to my dash. I'm focusing on fixing the temperature gauge issue with my car first.
                  On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 1:10 PM, Evan <evan@... wrote:Also: you can use the Megasquirt on ANY car and it will improve the gas mileage. So it is a good investment, even post-VCF. They have a Linux client program for tuning. How old of a computer can you make that run on...? To be determined. :)

                  -----Original Message-----From: "Evan Koblentz" <evan@...: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCFDate: Thu May 22, 2008 12:47 pmSize: 2KTo:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.comSorry, the S.S. Evan was sold during my sophomore year of college(1993-1994) ... it was a '79 Caprice Classic.For the engine management part, the best and cheapest way to start is byusing the D-I-Y version of the Megasquirt (www.megasquirt.info) ... I'mclose to buying a pre-assembled version for my Miata.As for actually controlling a car's engine and multimedia with a VINTAGEcomputer ... I seriously recommend that you buy a gas-powered R/C carinstead! That way you're not wasting a bunch of money, it's no massivelost if you break stuff, and you can demo it inside the VCF exhibits. Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I've been monitoring Craigslist and ebay, but nothing good thus far. I want to do something similar to
                  the old Buick Reatta in a car, with a computer control center, which acts as both a customizable engine management system, as well as control for climate, radio, etc, running off of either an older computer or a older style homebrew or kit computer. I know some of you will be thinking that it would never happen in time, but I'd like to give it my best shot. Even if it isn't finished in time, this would be a project which would combine my two loves as far as engineering: computer and automotive. So, Evan, do you by any chance still have the S.S. Evan lying around? *:*D













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                  make smart choices.

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                • Bob Applegate
                  ... He IS a gearhead. While the average mechanic might have used a simple timing light, Steve worked out all the timing, communications between the various
                  Message 8 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                    Evan <evan@...> wrote :

                    > True. For example, in my world, you can gain a few HP by advancing timing a few degrees, buy beyond that it's diminishing returns and in some cases it's better to retard timing.
                    >
                    > What's funny, Bob, is your friend might have spent hours with his 'scope ... while any ordinary gearhead could have done the same jon in 20 minutes using a timing light

                    He IS a gearhead. While the average mechanic might have used a simple
                    timing light, Steve worked out all the timing, communications between the
                    various processors, outputs from various sensors, etc. An analog EE with
                    30+ years of experience is pretty thorough in his analysis of problems and
                    understanding the data available.

                    The previous owner of the car simply advanced the timing, which is often
                    a bad idea since none of the processors and sensors are unaware of it, so
                    now various systems are no longer in synch with each other.

                    Bob


                    ___________________________________
                    NOCC, http://nocc.sourceforge.net
                  • Joe Giliberti
                    Does Megasquirt interfere with the standard OBD II in the car, making you fail state inspection? Joe
                    Message 9 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                      Does Megasquirt interfere with the standard OBD II in the car, making you fail state inspection?

                      Joe

                      On Fri, May 23, 2008 at 8:05 AM, Bob Applegate <bob@...> wrote:

                      Evan <evan@...> wrote :

                      > True. For example, in my world, you can gain a few HP by advancing timing a few degrees, buy beyond that it's diminishing returns and in some cases it's better to retard timing.
                      >
                      > What's funny, Bob, is your friend might have spent hours with his 'scope ... while any ordinary gearhead could have done the same jon in 20 minutes using a timing light

                      He IS a gearhead. While the average mechanic might have used a simple
                      timing light, Steve worked out all the timing, communications between the
                      various processors, outputs from various sensors, etc. An analog EE with
                      30+ years of experience is pretty thorough in his analysis of problems and
                      understanding the data available.

                      The previous owner of the car simply advanced the timing, which is often
                      a bad idea since none of the processors and sensors are unaware of it, so
                      now various systems are no longer in synch with each other.

                      Bob

                      ___________________________________
                      NOCC, http://nocc.sourceforge.net


                    • Evan
                      Nope! ... From: Joe Giliberti Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF Date: Fri May 23, 2008 1:59 pm Size: 4K To:
                      Message 10 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                        Nope!

                        -----Original Message-----

                        From: "Joe Giliberti" <Starbase89@...>
                        Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF
                        Date: Fri May 23, 2008 1:59 pm
                        Size: 4K
                        To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com

                        Does Megasquirt interfere with the standard OBD II in the car, making you fail state inspection?

                        Joe

                        On Fri, May 23, 2008 at 8:05 AM, Bob Applegate <bob@...> wrote:

                        Evan <evan@...> wrote :


                        > True. For example, in my world, you can gain a few HP by advancing timing a few degrees, buy beyond that its diminishing returns and in some cases its better to retard timing.
                        >
                        > Whats funny, Bob, is your friend might have spent hours with his scope ... while any ordinary gearhead could have done the same jon in 20 minutes using a timing light


                        He IS a gearhead. While the average mechanic might have used a simple
                        timing light, Steve worked out all the timing, communications between the
                        various processors, outputs from various sensors, etc. An analog EE with
                        30+ years of experience is pretty thorough in his analysis of problems and
                        understanding the data available.

                        The previous owner of the car simply advanced the timing, which is often
                        a bad idea since none of the processors and sensors are unaware of it, so
                        now various systems are no longer in synch with each other.

                        Bob

                        ___________________________________
                        NOCC, http://nocc.sourceforge.net
                      • Joe Giliberti
                        All right, scratch the car idea. I have something better. I am going to build a John Baird Style mechanical video monitor, and set it up as a computer
                        Message 11 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                          All right, scratch the car idea. I have something better.

                          I am going to build a John Baird Style mechanical video monitor, and set it up as a computer terminal. It is less dangerous, and requires much less of an investment..

                          On Fri, May 23, 2008 at 3:00 PM, Evan <evan@...> wrote:

                          Nope!



                          -----Original Message-----

                          From: "Joe Giliberti" <Starbase89@...>
                          Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF
                          Date: Fri May 23, 2008 1:59 pm
                          Size: 4K
                          To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com

                          Does Megasquirt interfere with the standard OBD II in the car, making you fail state inspection?

                          Joe

                          On Fri, May 23, 2008 at 8:05 AM, Bob Applegate <bob@...> wrote:

                          Evan <evan@...> wrote :


                          > True. For example, in my world, you can gain a few HP by advancing timing a few degrees, buy beyond that its diminishing returns and in some cases its better to retard timing.
                          >
                          > Whats funny, Bob, is your friend might have spent hours with his scope ... while any ordinary gearhead could have done the same jon in 20 minutes using a timing light



                          He IS a gearhead. While the average mechanic might have used a simple
                          timing light, Steve worked out all the timing, communications between the
                          various processors, outputs from various sensors, etc. An analog EE with
                          30+ years of experience is pretty thorough in his analysis of problems and
                          understanding the data available.

                          The previous owner of the car simply advanced the timing, which is often
                          a bad idea since none of the processors and sensors are unaware of it, so
                          now various systems are no longer in synch with each other.

                          Bob

                          ___________________________________
                          NOCC, http://nocc.sourceforge.net






                        • John Allain
                          From: Joe Giliberti ... FWIW, Will Donzelli (with March) was in temporary posession of a rotating sequenced light device of some sort built to test Teletypes.
                          Message 12 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                            From: Joe Giliberti
                            > All right, scratch the car idea. I have something better.
                            > I am going to build a John Baird Style mechanical video monitor,
                            > and set it up as a computer terminal. It is less dangerous, and
                            > requires much less of an investment..

                            FWIW, Will Donzelli (with March) was in temporary posession of a rotating
                            sequenced light device of some sort built to test Teletypes. His commentary
                            here might be interesting.

                            John A.
                          • Evan
                            ... Joe, that is a MUCH better idea! But first, you must cut down the tallest tree in New Jersey using ... a herring.
                            Message 13 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                              >>> I am going to build a John Baird Style mechanical video monitor, and set it up as a computer terminal. It is less dangerous, and requires much less of an investment.

                              Joe, that is a MUCH better idea!

                              But first, you must cut down the tallest tree in New Jersey using ... a herring.
                            • Evan
                              PS - the guys in NJARC have LOTS of antique TV experience and always like to help young kids - say, anyone under 50. :) (They really are good neighbors.
                              Message 14 of 15 , May 23, 2008
                                PS - the guys in NJARC have LOTS of antique TV experience and always like to help young kids - say, anyone under 50. :)

                                (They really are good neighbors. Tonight one of them stopped at my house with his van to transport an 8-foot table to InfoAge for us.)

                                -----Original Message-----

                                From: "Evan" <evan@...>
                                Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Need a car for VCF
                                Date: Fri May 23, 2008 8:23 pm
                                Size: 955 bytes
                                To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com

                                >>> I am going to build a John Baird Style mechanical video monitor, and set it up as a computer terminal. It is less dangerous, and requires much less of an investment.

                                Joe, that is a MUCH better idea!

                                But first, you must cut down the tallest tree in New Jersey using ... a herring.


                                ------------------------------------

                                Yahoo! Groups Links
                              • schwepes@moog.netaxs.com
                                Taking space in my driveway is a Mercury Sable GS sedan from 1994 that is in (according to Kelly) fair condition and worth $1150. The man who owns it wants to
                                Message 15 of 15 , May 24, 2008
                                  Taking space in my driveway is a Mercury Sable GS sedan from 1994 that is
                                  in (according to Kelly) fair condition and worth $1150. The man who owns
                                  it wants to sell it badly. Cosmetically, the paint job is going but,
                                  mechanically, the only problem is an oil drip.
                                  Note I said drip. That's part of the reason I want this off my driveway.
                                  bs


                                  On Thu, 22 May 2008, Joe Giliberti wrote:

                                  > Does anyone know where I could get a small, cheap, older, preferably
                                  > automatic trans car? It is related to my idea for VCF. I've been monitoring
                                  > Craigslist and ebay, but nothing good thus far. I want to do something
                                  > similar to the old Buick Reatta in a car, with a computer control center,
                                  > which acts as both a customizable engine management system, as well as
                                  > control for climate, radio, etc, running off of either an older computer or
                                  > a older style homebrew or kit computer. I know some of you will be thinking
                                  > that it would never happen in time, but I'd like to give it my best shot.
                                  > Even if it isn't finished in time, this would be a project which would
                                  > combine my two loves as far as engineering: computer and automotive. So,
                                  > Evan, do you by any chance still have the S.S. Evan lying around? *:*D
                                  >
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