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Northstar Horizon - Boot Problem

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  • B. Degnan
    First the situation and then the questions My formerly working Northstar Horizon will no longer boot formerly known-to-work boot disks. This system used to
    Message 1 of 14 , Nov 20, 2007
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      First the situation and then the questions

      My formerly working Northstar Horizon will no longer boot formerly
      known-to-work boot disks. This system used to boot up a number of NS
      disks, worked very well with present hardware. Not sure what happened.

      I did all of the standard stuff with chips and connections, but I did not
      do any electrical probing or anything like that.

      Now, when the system is powered on the drive does not engage the disk. It
      spins for a spell and then stops. Both the A and B drives will spin
      together upon boot for 30 seconds and then stop. The left / boot drive is
      a Tandon TM100-2A with all the jumpers off. The right drive is a MPI
      model 52 with the first two jumpers on. I have temporarily disconnected
      this drive.

      I have a North Star MDS AD3 controller/interface card with no visible
      modifications.
      I tried a MDS card (model = MDS, without the AD3) and there no change -
      drives spin for 30 seconds then stop.

      1) Does anyone know what the correct jumper settings are for thes
      drives? I am guessing that somehow I accidentally popped a jumper
      switch. The other possibility is that this be a new mechanical problem
      with the drive. I have manuals, I will see if I can find an answer on my
      own, but I appreciate anyone's help.

      2) In the mean time, how can I get to the machine monitor?
      I am doing my own research and I have manuals, but so far I have not found
      a way to get to the monitor.


      Here are some pics:
      http://vintagecomputer.net/northstar/horizon/

      note - some of these are old pics, note the file dates.

      Bill
    • Jim
      I am trying to remember how to make a windows computer a DOS computer. If I remember correctly, I will have to make a DOS startup disk, and then I can
      Message 2 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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        I am trying to remember how to make a windows computer a DOS computer.  If I remember correctly, I will have to make a DOS startup disk, and then I can reformat the hard drive with the format command.  Is this correct?  It’s been a while since I’ve worked with DOS.

         

        Thanks,

        Jim K.

         


        From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of B. Degnan
        Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 9:36 PM
        To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [midatlanticretro] Northstar Horizon - Boot Problem

         

        First the situation and then the questions

        My formerly working Northstar Horizon will no longer boot formerly
        known-to-work boot disks. This system used to boot up a number of NS
        disks, worked very well with present hardware. Not sure what happened.

        I did all of the standard stuff with chips and connections, but I did not
        do any electrical probing or anything like that.

        Now, when the system is powered on the drive does not engage the disk. It
        spins for a spell and then stops. Both the A and B drives will spin
        together upon boot for 30 seconds and then stop. The left / boot drive is
        a Tandon TM100-2A with all the jumpers off. The right drive is a MPI
        model 52 with the first two jumpers on. I have temporarily disconnected
        this drive.

        I have a North Star MDS AD3 controller/interfac e card with no visible
        modifications.
        I tried a MDS card (model = MDS, without the AD3) and there no change -
        drives spin for 30 seconds then stop.

        1) Does anyone know what the correct jumper settings are for thes
        drives? I am guessing that somehow I accidentally popped a jumper
        switch. The other possibility is that this be a new mechanical problem
        with the drive. I have manuals, I will see if I can find an answer on my
        own, but I appreciate anyone's help.

        2) In the mean time, how can I get to the machine monitor?
        I am doing my own research and I have manuals, but so far I have not found
        a way to get to the monitor.

        Here are some pics:
        http://vintagecompu ter.net/northsta r/horizon/

        note - some of these are old pics, note the file dates.

        Bill

      • Richard A. Cini
        That would always work. By the comment I¹m guessing that it¹s a Windows 9x or later version? I¹d have to check my notes but I think there is a 2gb partition
        Message 3 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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          Re: [midatlanticretro] Windows to DOS 6.22 That would always work. By the comment I’m guessing that it’s a Windows 9x or later version? I’d have to check my notes but I think there is a 2gb partition limit in DOS 6.


          On 11/21/07 6:06 AM, "Jim" <ibm_typewriter_freak@...> wrote:


           
           

          I am trying to remember how to make a windows computer a DOS computer.  If I remember correctly, I will have to make a DOS startup disk, and then I can reformat the hard drive with the format command.  Is this correct?  It’s been a while since I’ve worked with DOS.
           
          Thanks,
          Jim K.
           


          From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of B. Degnan
          Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 9:36 PM
          To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [midatlanticretro] Northstar Horizon - Boot Problem


          First the situation and then the questions

          My formerly working Northstar Horizon will no longer boot formerly
          known-to-work boot disks. This system used to boot up a number of NS
          disks, worked very well with present hardware. Not sure what happened.

          I did all of the standard stuff with chips and connections, but I did not
          do any electrical probing or anything like that.

          Now, when the system is powered on the drive does not engage the disk. It
          spins for a spell and then stops. Both the A and B drives will spin
          together upon boot for 30 seconds and then stop. The left / boot drive is
          a Tandon TM100-2A with all the jumpers off. The right drive is a MPI
          model 52 with the first two jumpers on. I have temporarily disconnected
          this drive.

          I have a North Star MDS AD3 controller/interface card with no visible
          modifications.
          I tried a MDS card (model = MDS, without the AD3) and there no change -
          drives spin for 30 seconds then stop.

          1) Does anyone know what the correct jumper settings are for thes
          drives? I am guessing that somehow I accidentally popped a jumper
          switch. The other possibility is that this be a new mechanical problem
          with the drive. I have manuals, I will see if I can find an answer on my
          own, but I appreciate anyone's help.

          2) In the mean time, how can I get to the machine monitor?
          I am doing my own research and I have manuals, but so far I have not found
          a way to get to the monitor.

          Here are some pics:
          http://vintagecomputer.net/northstar/horizon/

          note - some of these are old pics, note the file dates.

          Bill

           
              



          Rich

          --
          Rich Cini
          Collector of Classic Computers
          Build Master and lead engineer, Altair32 Emulator
          http://www.altair32.com
          http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp
        • Evan
          Www.bootdisks.com
          Message 4 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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            Www.bootdisks.com
          • Bryan Pope
            ... That site goes to endless ads.. I believe it is made to catch common typos... I think you meant http://www.bootdisk.com/ Cheers, Bryan
            Message 5 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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              Evan wrote:
              > Www.bootdisks.com
              >
              That site goes to endless ads.. I believe it is made to catch common
              typos... I think you meant http://www.bootdisk.com/

              Cheers,

              Bryan
            • Evan
              Thanks Bryan.
              Message 6 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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                Thanks Bryan.
              • billdeg@degnanco.com
                ... Windows version ??
                Message 7 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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                  > I am trying to remember how to make a windows computer a DOS computer. If
                  > I
                  > remember correctly, I will have to make a DOS startup disk, and then I can
                  > reformat the hard drive with the format command. Is this correct? It's
                  > been a while since I've worked with DOS.
                  >
                  >

                  Windows version ??
                • billdeg@degnanco.com
                  Let s just assume this is a machine capable of running DOS 6.22, the BIOS is set to boot from the A drive then the C drive, etc. 1. Insert startup disk. fdisk
                  Message 8 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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                    Let's just assume this is a machine capable of running DOS 6.22, the BIOS
                    is set to boot from the A drive then the C drive, etc.

                    1. Insert startup disk.

                    fdisk [enter]

                    a. remove all partitions, extended partitions, etc.

                    b. create primary partition. (Only 2 GB will be avail per partition, but
                    that's OK)

                    c. you can create extended partitions if you want

                    d. exit (it'll reboot)

                    2. with disk still in the drive:

                    format c: /s/v [enter]

                    3. reboot with disk out of the drive - if it works and gives you a c>
                    prompt, proceed with the standard 6.22 installation OR just copy all of
                    the files into a DOS subdirectory (easier).

                    4. create autoexec.bat and config.sys to suit your needs.

                    Bill
                  • Jeffrey Frady
                    I d like to butt in a recommend FreeDos opposed to MS-DOS. I have used it and it works quite well. Dell even offers it to come with
                    Message 9 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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                      I'd like to butt in a recommend FreeDos opposed to MS-DOS.  I have used it and it works quite well.  Dell even offers it to come with their servers opposed to Windows/Linux.

                      On Nov 21, 2007 10:36 AM, Evan <evan@...> wrote:

                      Thanks Bryan.




                      --
                      See you spare cowboy...
                    • Evan
                      While we re at it, Herb would like to suggest CP/M and Mark would like to suggest OS/2. :) ... From: Jeffrey Frady Subj: Re:
                      Message 10 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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                        While we're at it, Herb would like to suggest CP/M and Mark would like to suggest OS/2. :)

                        -----Original Message-----

                        From: "Jeffrey Frady" <Legodude522@...>
                        Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Windows to DOS 6.22
                        Date: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:54 pm
                        Size: 2K
                        To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com

                        Id like to butt in a recommend FreeDos opposed to MS-DOS. I have used it and it works quite well. Dell even offers it to come with their servers opposed to Windows/Linux.

                        On Nov 21, 2007 10:36 AM, Evan <evan@...> wrote:
                        Thanks Bryan.







                        --
                        See you spare cowboy...
                      • madodel
                        ... Well at least these will most likely run on it. So no recommendations for DOS/VSE, OS/400, VMS, AmigaOS or MacOS. ;-) Mark -- From the eComStation
                        Message 11 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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                          Evan wrote:
                          > While we're at it, Herb would like to suggest CP/M and Mark would like to suggest OS/2. :)

                          Well at least these will most likely run on it. So no recommendations for
                          DOS/VSE, OS/400, VMS, AmigaOS or MacOS. ;-)

                          Mark


                          --

                          From the eComStation Desktop of: Mark Dodel


                          For a choice in the future of personal computing, Join VOICE -
                          http://www.os2voice.org

                          "The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the
                          growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their
                          democratic State itself. That in it's essence, is Fascism - ownership of
                          government by an individual, by a group or by any controlling private
                          power." Franklin Delano Roosevelt, Message proposing the Monopoly
                          Investigation, 1938
                        • Jim
                          Windows 2000 Professional J _____ From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of billdeg@degnanco.com Sent:
                          Message 12 of 14 , Nov 21, 2007
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                            Windows 2000 Professional

                             

                            J

                             

                             


                            From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of billdeg@...
                            Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 10:21 AM
                            To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Windows to DOS 6.22

                             

                            > I am trying to remember how to make a windows computer a DOS computer. If

                            > I
                            > remember correctly, I will have to make a DOS startup disk, and then I can
                            > reformat the hard drive with the format command. Is this correct? It's
                            > been a while since I've worked with DOS.
                            >
                            >

                            Windows version ??

                          • Herb Johnson
                            ... like to suggest OS/2. :) ... I have used it and it works quite well. Dell even offers it to come with their servers opposed to Windows/Linux. ...
                            Message 13 of 14 , Nov 22, 2007
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                              "Evan" <evan@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > While we're at it, Herb would like to suggest CP/M and Mark would
                              like to suggest OS/2. :)
                              >
                              > -----Original Message-----
                              >
                              > From: "Jeffrey Frady" <Legodude522@...>
                              > Subj: Re: [midatlanticretro] Windows to DOS 6.22
                              > Date: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:54 pm
                              > Size: 2K
                              > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                              >
                              > Id like to butt in a recommend FreeDos opposed to MS-DOS.
                              I have used it and it works quite well. Dell even offers it to come
                              with their servers opposed to Windows/Linux.
                              >

                              Actually, I privately wrote to Jim and suggested he buy a set of
                              MS-DOS disks. (It was private because 1) I offered some for sale and
                              2) extended discussion of modern computers is off-topic, but "help me"
                              posts are OK - this by consensus.) But there are occasional
                              discussions of how to run CP/M on modern systems, in the Usenet
                              newsgroup comp.os.cpm. Search archives for details.

                              Appros to MARCH interests in computer history, I also mentioned that
                              DR-DOS is avaiable, even new from drdos.com. That company owns the
                              rights to Digital Research's software including CP/M but also
                              including DR-DOS. A version of DR-DOS was offered for free by a former
                              DRI asset owner (Caldera), that too is available as open source.

                              Jeffrey, it's possible what you mentioned as "Freedos" may in fact be
                              a licensed version of DR-DOS, as many companies today buy DR-DOS for
                              use, when it's not appropriate to use Windows or Linux (hard drive
                              utility self-booting diskettes for instance). But it could also be
                              FreeDOS, which is another open source alternative.

                              The history of Digital Research, Gary Kildall's CP/M company, in the
                              1990's and beyond is of interest to me. Some companies associated with
                              DRI's software assets may surprise some of you. Check my Web site at
                              the link below for details: it's part of my comprehensive Web site on
                              early and late CP/M history.

                              http://www.retrotechnology.com/dri/dri_16bit.html#1990s

                              PS: For some reason, Jim's post also included Bill Degnan's help
                              request for Bill's Northstar. I privately referred Bill to someone; it
                              is up to the two of them to discuss it further. - Herb

                              Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
                              http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/ web site
                              http://www.retrotechnology.net/herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
                              my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
                              if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
                              "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
                              S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"
                            • Sridhar Ayengar
                              ... If memory serves, IBM also still sells an updated-for-Y2K edition of PC-DOS. Peace... Sridhar
                              Message 14 of 14 , Nov 22, 2007
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                                Herb Johnson wrote:
                                > Appros to MARCH interests in computer history, I also mentioned that
                                > DR-DOS is avaiable, even new from drdos.com. That company owns the
                                > rights to Digital Research's software including CP/M but also
                                > including DR-DOS. A version of DR-DOS was offered for free by a former
                                > DRI asset owner (Caldera), that too is available as open source.
                                >
                                > Jeffrey, it's possible what you mentioned as "Freedos" may in fact be
                                > a licensed version of DR-DOS, as many companies today buy DR-DOS for
                                > use, when it's not appropriate to use Windows or Linux (hard drive
                                > utility self-booting diskettes for instance). But it could also be
                                > FreeDOS, which is another open source alternative.

                                If memory serves, IBM also still sells an updated-for-Y2K edition of PC-DOS.

                                Peace... Sridhar
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