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Re: Failed work day :(

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  • Herb Johnson
    ... done. (Pictures coming soon.) Evan and I got some stuff moved around, and the new exhibit room is mostly cleared except for two large IBM pieces of
    Message 1 of 18 , Aug 26, 2007
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      "Evan" <evan@...> wrote:
      >
      > Not failed after all. Herb came over and we actually got a lot
      done. (Pictures coming soon.)

      Evan and I got some stuff moved around, and the "new" exhibit room is
      mostly cleared except for two large IBM pieces of equipment, one which
      must be disassembled. Also, we shuffled stuff in another room to lay a
      used carpet.

      I also got a chance to see the most recent PDP 11/20 donation. It
      looks like a pretty complete 11/20 with a lot of manuals, schematic
      sets, and paper tape software. The 11's had a paper tape based OS
      which could be used to run software. I think that set of stuff, by
      itself, could be a good "static" display of 1970's DEC minicomputer
      technology. It shows what could be done without hard drives or even
      floppy drives! this is something Herb Johnson will think about.

      I took some photos and a short video, which I'll get to Evan.

      Herb Johnson

      Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
      http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/ web site
      http://www.retrotechnology.net/herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
      my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
      if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
      "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
      S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"
    • Evan
      ... But only in the third person. :)
      Message 2 of 18 , Aug 26, 2007
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        >>> this is something Herb Johnson will think about.

        But only in the third person. :)
      • Jim Scheef
        ...................... ... From: Evan To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 1:58:00 PM
        Message 3 of 18 , Aug 27, 2007
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          <chuckle>......................</chuckle>

          ----- Original Message ----
          From: Evan <evan@...>
          To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 1:58:00 PM
          Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: Failed work day :(

          >>> this is something Herb Johnson will think about.

          But only in the third person. :)




          Yahoo! Groups Links
        • Herb Johnson
          ... My use of the third person got some attention, didn t it? Thank you. Now, is anyone interested in MARCH s DEC equipment? Or not? Let me know. I have an
          Message 4 of 18 , Aug 28, 2007
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            > ----- Original Message ----
            > From: Evan <evan@...>
            > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 1:58:00 PM
            > Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: Failed work day :(
            >
            > [Herb wrote:]
            > >>> this is something Herb Johnson will think about.
            >
            > But only in the third person. :)
            >
            Jim Scheef <jscheef@...> wrote:
            >
            > <chuckle>......................</chuckle>
            >

            My use of the third person got some attention, didn't it? Thank you.
            Now, is anyone interested in MARCH's DEC equipment? Or not? Let me
            know. I have an idea about a display.

            Herb

            Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
            http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/ web site
            http://www.retrotechnology.net/herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
            my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
            if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
            "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
            S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"
          • Bob Applegate
            Bob Dole said Bob Dole is interested. We SHOULD be interested in DEC stuff. While Maynard might not be considered Mid-Atlantic, DEC was certainly a major
            Message 5 of 18 , Aug 28, 2007
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              Bob Dole said "Bob Dole is interested."
               
              We SHOULD be interested in DEC stuff.  While Maynard might not be considered Mid-Atlantic, DEC was
              certainly a major player in the early days.  Reading through the first issues of Dr Dobb's, lots of people
              discussed ways to run PDP-8 and PDP-11 software on their micros.  DEC had a big impact on a lot of us
              folks back in the 70s.
               
              Bob
               
               
               
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 11:14 AM
              Subject: [midatlanticretro] Re: DEC exhibit? (was: Failed work day :( )

              > ----- Original Message ----
              > From: Evan <evan@...>
              > To: midatlanticretro@ yahoogroups. com
              > Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 1:58:00 PM
              > Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: Failed work day :(
              >
              > [Herb wrote:]
              > >>> this is something Herb Johnson will think about.
              >
              > But only in the third person. :)
              >
              Jim Scheef <jscheef@... > wrote:
              >
              > <chuckle>... ......... ......... .</chuckle>
              >

              My use of the third person got some attention, didn't it? Thank you.
              Now, is anyone interested in MARCH's DEC equipment? Or not? Let me
              know. I have an idea about a display.

              Herb

              Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
              http://www.retrotec hnology.com/ herbs_stuff/ web site
              http://www.retrotec hnology.net/ herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
              my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
              if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
              "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
              S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"

            • Evan Koblentz
              Of course we re interested! I just think it makes more sense to save our best DEC items for the exhibit on minicomputers, and/or other to-be-determined
              Message 6 of 18 , Aug 28, 2007
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                Of course we're interested! I just think it makes more sense to save our
                best DEC items for the exhibit on minicomputers, and/or other
                to-be-determined exhibits, instead of using it for this first exhibit on
                local products.

                That being said, I suppose we can make a THIRD "first" exhibit, which
                would just be a "best of the rest of our collection" while we continue
                planning and restoring things. And the PDP-11 certainly would fit into
                that category too.



                > Bob Dole said "Bob Dole is interested."
                >
                > We SHOULD be interested in DEC stuff. While Maynard might not be
                > considered Mid-Atlantic, DEC was
                > certainly a major player in the early days. Reading through the first
                > issues of Dr Dobb's, lots of people
                > discussed ways to run PDP-8 and PDP-11 software on their micros. DEC had
                > a big impact on a lot of us
                > folks back in the 70s.
                >
                > Bob
                >
                >
                >
                > ----- Original Message -----
                > From: Herb Johnson
                > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 11:14 AM
                > Subject: [midatlanticretro] Re: DEC exhibit? (was: Failed work day :( )
                >
                >
                > > ----- Original Message ----
                > > From: Evan <evan@...>
                > > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                > > Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 1:58:00 PM
                > > Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: Failed work day :(
                > >
                > > [Herb wrote:]
                > > >>> this is something Herb Johnson will think about.
                > >
                > > But only in the third person. :)
                > >
                > Jim Scheef <jscheef@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > <chuckle>......................</chuckle>
                > >
                >
                > My use of the third person got some attention, didn't it? Thank you.
                > Now, is anyone interested in MARCH's DEC equipment? Or not? Let me
                > know. I have an idea about a display.
                >
                > Herb
                >
                > Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
                > http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/ web site
                > http://www.retrotechnology.net/herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
                > my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
                > if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
                > "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
                > S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"
                >
                >
                >
                >
              • Jim Scheef
                Herb, I was waiting to see who else commented. Using the PDP as a static exhibit (at least to start) sounds like a great idea. It has a lot of substance with
                Message 7 of 18 , Aug 28, 2007
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                  Herb,

                  I was waiting to see who else commented. Using the PDP as a static exhibit (at least to start) sounds like a great idea. It has a lot of substance with its size, the manuals and many learning opportunities with the tape OS (I'd never heard of that), etc. Do you envision signs or display cards to explain things? I'm listening...

                  Jim


                  ----- Original Message ----
                  From: Herb Johnson <herbjohnson@...>
                  To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 11:14:58 AM
                  Subject: [midatlanticretro] Re: DEC exhibit? (was: Failed work day :( )

                  > ----- Original Message ----
                  > From: Evan <evan@...>
                  > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 1:58:00 PM
                  > Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: Failed work day :(
                  >
                  > [Herb wrote:]
                  > >>> this is something Herb Johnson will think about.
                  >
                  > But only in the third person. :)
                  >
                  Jim Scheef <jscheef@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > <chuckle>......................</chuckle>
                  >

                  My use of the third person got some attention, didn't it? Thank you.
                  Now, is anyone interested in MARCH's DEC equipment? Or not? Let me
                  know. I have an idea about a display.

                  Herb

                  Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
                  http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/ web site
                  http://www.retrotechnology.net/herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
                  my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
                  if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
                  "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
                  S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"




                  Yahoo! Groups Links
                • Evan Koblentz
                  So, I was just sending an email to Herb, and started thinking more about this idea from the second paragraph of my previous email (below), re: making a third
                  Message 8 of 18 , Aug 28, 2007
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                    So, I was just sending an email to Herb, and started thinking more about
                    this idea from the second paragraph of my previous email (below), re:
                    making a third "first" exhibit which would be "best of the rest' of our
                    collections. In addition to just showing off some of our more fun
                    systems, this is a good way to keep everyone interested while the club
                    focuses on other current exhibits. For example, say the current
                    under-construction exhibit in six months from now happens to be about
                    data storage, but you don't care much about data storage ... you could
                    do what Herb's doing and work on a pet project for the "best of"
                    exhibit. We can also use this exhibit space as a way to highlight
                    members' personal collections, and we can rotate that space frequently.
                    Again, for example, say there's a month when Andy is spontaneously
                    inclined to show off his Sony SMC-70, or perhaps Mark will want to do a
                    mini-OS2 exhibit around Warpstock time -- no problem, they'd just use
                    part of our exhibit space designated for this purpose. The more I
                    explain the idea, the more I like it ... keep everyone involved, use
                    more of our physical exhibit space, vary the exhibits beyond what MARCH
                    owns ... sounds good right???


                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: Evan Koblentz [mailto:evan@...]
                    Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 12:02 PM
                    To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: DEC exhibit? (was: Failed work day
                    :( )

                    Of course we're interested! I just think it makes more sense to save
                    our
                    best DEC items for the exhibit on minicomputers, and/or other
                    to-be-determined exhibits, instead of using it for this first exhibit on
                    local products.

                    That being said, I suppose we can make a THIRD "first" exhibit, which
                    would just be a "best of the rest of our collection" while we continue
                    planning and restoring things. And the PDP-11 certainly would fit into
                    that category too.



                    > Bob Dole said "Bob Dole is interested."
                    >
                    > We SHOULD be interested in DEC stuff. While Maynard might not be
                    > considered Mid-Atlantic, DEC was
                    > certainly a major player in the early days. Reading through the first
                    > issues of Dr Dobb's, lots of people
                    > discussed ways to run PDP-8 and PDP-11 software on their micros. DEC
                    had
                    > a big impact on a lot of us
                    > folks back in the 70s.
                    >
                    > Bob
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ----- Original Message -----
                    > From: Herb Johnson
                    > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                    > Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 11:14 AM
                    > Subject: [midatlanticretro] Re: DEC exhibit? (was: Failed work day
                    :( )
                    >
                    >
                    > > ----- Original Message ----
                    > > From: Evan <evan@...>
                    > > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                    > > Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 1:58:00 PM
                    > > Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: Failed work day :(
                    > >
                    > > [Herb wrote:]
                    > > >>> this is something Herb Johnson will think about.
                    > >
                    > > But only in the third person. :)
                    > >
                    > Jim Scheef <jscheef@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > <chuckle>......................</chuckle>
                    > >
                    >
                    > My use of the third person got some attention, didn't it? Thank you.
                    > Now, is anyone interested in MARCH's DEC equipment? Or not? Let me
                    > know. I have an idea about a display.
                    >
                    > Herb
                    >
                    > Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
                    > http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/ web site
                    > http://www.retrotechnology.net/herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
                    > my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
                    > if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
                    > "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
                    > S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >




                    Yahoo! Groups Links
                  • John Allain
                    ... Yup, Home Run. ( or, run home
                    Message 9 of 18 , Aug 29, 2007
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                      > The more I
                      > explain the idea, the more I like it ... keep everyone involved, use
                      > more of our physical exhibit space, vary the exhibits beyond what MARCH
                      > owns ... sounds good right???

                      Yup, Home Run.
                      ( or, >run home<, clean up systems, bring in to MARCH. )

                      I'll ramble on and add that I want to Pretend the MARCH DEC
                      systems are my own in that I'd like to spend a few _days_ treating
                      them nicely and making them runnable/clean enough for display,
                      ready to go/Inventoried/Researched, 100% museum quality.

                      John A.
                    • Evan Koblentz
                      Cool! Nerd fight!! John has a height advantage, but Herb is clever.
                      Message 10 of 18 , Aug 29, 2007
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                        Cool! Nerd fight!! John has a height advantage, but Herb is clever.


                        >> I want to pretend the MARCH DEC systems are my own
                      • Herb Johnson
                        ... ...and Evan replied Cool! Nerd fight!! John has a height advantage, but Herb is clever.... The DEC is not mine , and I m glad this was brought up. I
                        Message 11 of 18 , Aug 29, 2007
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                          Evan wrote:

                          > > The more I
                          > > explain the idea, the more I like it ... keep everyone
                          > > involved, use
                          > > more of our physical exhibit space, vary the exhibits beyond
                          > > what MARCH
                          > > owns ... sounds good right???

                          "John Allain" <allain@...> wrote:
                          > Yup, Home Run.
                          > ( or, >run home<, clean up systems, bring in to MARCH. )
                          >
                          > I'll ramble on and add that I want to Pretend the MARCH DEC
                          > systems are my own in that I'd like to spend a few _days_ treating
                          > them nicely and making them runnable/clean enough for display,
                          > ready to go/Inventoried/Researched, 100% museum quality.
                          >
                          > John A.

                          ...and Evan replied "Cool! Nerd fight!! John has a height advantage,
                          but Herb is clever...."

                          The DEC is not "mine", and I'm glad this was brought up. I don't DO
                          projects as subtext for "ownership". If I "owned" this DEC, and did
                          the work, and went away (as always happens, eventually); then the work
                          would go away. And if no one "owned" the computer later, the DEC would
                          go away.

                          That means, to me, the work was a waste of time. If something only
                          lasts as long as I'm interested, then it has no permanance, no value
                          outside myself. What's the point, in my opinion? At age 54, I think
                          about these things.

                          MARCH (or InfoAge) "owns" the collection. Herb Johnson offers to work
                          on some part, to get OTHERS interested in doing more, and to get
                          OTHERS to see what we have. The point is to INVOLVE, not to gather
                          more toys. I have plenty of toys, thanks. I made my case about the
                          value of an exhibit - the proof will be 1) does it interest visitors
                          and 2) does it interest MEMBERS.

                          Evan "got" that: we have a "go". Welcome aboard, John.

                          http://www.retrotechnology.com/pdp11/

                          Herb Johnson

                          P.S.: there are several other PDP-11's on site. No shortage of 'em.
                          Two 11/10s or /05's are kinda cute...HJ

                          Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
                          http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/ web site
                          http://www.retrotechnology.net/herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
                          my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
                          if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
                          "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
                          S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"
                        • Evan Koblentz
                          Guys ... I was only kidding around ... smile it s funny. :) ... From: Evan Koblentz [mailto:evan@snarc.net] Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 11:01 AM To:
                          Message 12 of 18 , Aug 29, 2007
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                            Guys ... I was only kidding around ... smile it's funny. :)


                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: Evan Koblentz [mailto:evan@...]
                            Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 11:01 AM
                            To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: DEC exhibit? (was: Failed work day
                            :( )

                            Cool! Nerd fight!! John has a height advantage, but Herb is clever.


                            >> I want to pretend the MARCH DEC systems are my own



                            Yahoo! Groups Links
                          • Jim Scheef
                            Hello all, From the first mention of ownership I took this to mean the business sense where the owner is the sponsor or evangelist for a particular
                            Message 13 of 18 , Aug 30, 2007
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                              Hello all,

                              From the first mention of "ownership" I took this to mean the business sense where the "owner" is the sponsor or evangelist for a particular exhibit. I really like this concept because then the "owner" could commit to be the coordinator of all work on an exhibit over time, preparing documentation, signs, work on the hardware and software, etc. Certainly there could be more than one person as owner for large and complex exhibits like this PDP, but the owner would coordinate the efforts of any and all people working on the exhibit - cleaning, documenting, restoring, whatever.

                              As we talk about exhibits, we should keep in mind that no exhibit should ever be "permanent" and hopefully all will evolve over time. To my mind, popular exhibits are the ones that several MARCHins want to work on and improve over time rather than computers that just sit there and gather dust - no matter how "cool" that computer might be. When an exhibit stops evolving it's probably time to look for something to replace it on display - some new exhibit that people are working on.

                              Filling the exhibit rooms is easy - they have been full for months! Making a *museum* educates and informs visitors will be much harder than we might think.

                              Jim

                              ----- Original Message ----
                              From: Herb Johnson <herbjohnson@...>
                              To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                              Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 6:02:59 PM
                              Subject: [midatlanticretro] Re: DEC exhibit? (was: Failed work day :( )

                              Evan wrote:

                              > > The more I
                              > > explain the idea, the more I like it ... keep everyone
                              > > involved, use
                              > > more of our physical exhibit space, vary the exhibits beyond
                              > > what MARCH
                              > > owns ... sounds good right???

                              "John Allain" <allain@...> wrote:
                              > Yup, Home Run.
                              > ( or, >run home<, clean up systems, bring in to MARCH. )
                              >
                              > I'll ramble on and add that I want to Pretend the MARCH DEC
                              > systems are my own in that I'd like to spend a few _days_ treating
                              > them nicely and making them runnable/clean enough for display,
                              > ready to go/Inventoried/Researched, 100% museum quality.
                              >
                              > John A.

                              ...and Evan replied "Cool! Nerd fight!! John has a height advantage,
                              but Herb is clever...."

                              The DEC is not "mine", and I'm glad this was brought up. I don't DO
                              projects as subtext for "ownership". If I "owned" this DEC, and did
                              the work, and went away (as always happens, eventually); then the work
                              would go away. And if no one "owned" the computer later, the DEC would
                              go away.

                              That means, to me, the work was a waste of time. If something only
                              lasts as long as I'm interested, then it has no permanance, no value
                              outside myself. What's the point, in my opinion? At age 54, I think
                              about these things.

                              MARCH (or InfoAge) "owns" the collection. Herb Johnson offers to work
                              on some part, to get OTHERS interested in doing more, and to get
                              OTHERS to see what we have. The point is to INVOLVE, not to gather
                              more toys. I have plenty of toys, thanks. I made my case about the
                              value of an exhibit - the proof will be 1) does it interest visitors
                              and 2) does it interest MEMBERS.

                              Evan "got" that: we have a "go". Welcome aboard, John.

                              http://www.retrotechnology.com/pdp11/

                              Herb Johnson

                              P.S.: there are several other PDP-11's on site. No shortage of 'em.
                              Two 11/10s or /05's are kinda cute...HJ

                              Herbert R. Johnson, New Jersey USA
                              http://www.retrotechnology.com/herbs_stuff/ web site
                              http://www.retrotechnology.net/herbs_stuff/ domain mirror
                              my email address: hjohnson AAT retrotechnology DOTT com
                              if no reply, try in a few days: herbjohnson ATT comcast DOTT net
                              "Herb's Stuff": old Mac, SGI, 8-inch floppy drives
                              S-100 IMSAI Altair computers, docs, by "Dr. S-100"




                              Yahoo! Groups Links
                            • Evan
                              ... Actually, now that we neatly rearranged everything, only two of our four rooms are full (and it s two of the small rooms!) ... But your point is very
                              Message 14 of 18 , Aug 30, 2007
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                                >>> Filling the exhibit rooms is easy - they have been full for months!

                                Actually, now that we neatly rearranged everything, only two of our four rooms are full (and it's two of the small rooms!) ... But your point is very valid.
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