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How Steve Wozniak Wrote BASIC for the Original Apple From Scratch

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  • joshbensadon
    Saw this posted on the COSMAC ELF group, I figured it would be appreciated here. Should be of interest to Bill D, if he hasn t already found and memorized this
    Message 1 of 12 , May 2, 2014
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      Saw this posted on the COSMAC ELF group, I figured it would be appreciated here.

       

      Should be of interest to Bill D, if he hasn't already found and memorized this story.

       

       

      How Steve Wozniak Wrote BASIC for the Original Apple From Scratch
      http://gizmodo.com/how-steve-wozniak-wrote-basic-for-the-original-apple-fr-1570573636
      ----

    • Evan Koblentz
      ... Saw that as well. Not sure if it s lifted from iWoz or if Woz wrote it fresh for this anniversary. Been a while since I read his book. I like that he
      Message 2 of 12 , May 2, 2014
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        >> Saw this posted on the COSMAC ELF group, I figured it would be appreciated here.

        Saw that as well. Not sure if it's lifted from iWoz or if Woz wrote it fresh for this anniversary. Been a while since I read his book.

        I like that he name-dropped Ted Nelson.

        Ted signed our first edition of Dream Machines / Computer Lib. It's in the museum. :)
      • corey986
        It s my Apple II rev 0 in the article playing breakout. Cheers, Corey
        Message 3 of 12 , May 2, 2014
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          It's my Apple II rev 0 in the article playing breakout.

          Cheers,
          Corey
        • Evan Koblentz
          ... Story!?
          Message 4 of 12 , May 2, 2014
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            >> It's my Apple II rev 0 in the article playing breakout

            Story!?
          • Evan Koblentz
            ... Ah.... nevermind. I see what you meant now. Thought you were saying that your Rev. 0 was the one from an original Apple ad or something. (Though with you
            Message 5 of 12 , May 2, 2014
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              >>>> It's my Apple II rev 0 in the article playing breakout

              >> Story!?

              Ah.... nevermind. I see what you meant now. Thought you were saying that your Rev. 0 was the one from an original Apple ad or something. (Though with you it wouldn't surprise me if it were!)
            • mwillega
              Woz s 4k integer basic actually requires an 8K Apple 1 in which to run programs. The iWoz book talks about how he searched for information on implementing
              Message 6 of 12 , May 3, 2014
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                Woz's "4k" integer basic actually requires an 8K Apple 1 in which to run programs.
                The iWoz book talks about how he searched for information on implementing BASIC in a lot of places.  If you look at the underlying implementation details, Woz clearly leveraged a lot of the concepts behind HP's 9830A BASIC implementation in order to make his 6502 BASIC.  
                 
                regards,
                Mike W.
              • joshbensadon
                Woz used an HP9830? Cool. I guess that makes total sense, since he worked at HP right? The HP9830 was the first commercial computer I ever operated (COSMAC
                Message 7 of 12 , May 3, 2014
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                  Woz used an HP9830?  Cool.  I guess that makes total sense, since he worked at HP right?

                  The HP9830 was the first commercial computer I ever operated (COSMAC ELF was technically my first).

                  I don't know Apple Basic, but from what I remember about the HP9830, it used a different command called "DISPLAY" to put characters on the LED Display.  While PRINT would output to the HP9866 printer on top of the machine.  Did Woz use separate commands for displaying on the screen and printing to a printer?

                  I think in the Commodore, we used PRINT for display and LPRINT for the external printer.  Or was this the way IBM BASIC did it??  Forgive me, I'm confused at the best of times.

                  :) Josh
                • Evan Koblentz
                  ... Yes. The other thing I had to get used to (when Corey taught me Integer BASIC so I could demo it in the museum) was having to dimension every character
                  Message 8 of 12 , May 3, 2014
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                    >>  Did Woz use separate commands for displaying on the screen and printing to a printer?

                    Yes.

                    The other thing I had to get used to (when Corey taught me Integer BASIC so I could demo it in the museum) was having to dimension every character string. I grew up on standard Applesoft (aka Microsoft) BASIC on Apple II+ and Apple IIe, so it confused me when I kept getting syntax errors / couldn't execute "INPUT N$" etc.
                  • Hagstrom, Paul
                    Unlurking for just a moment in order to be pedantic -- yes isn t strictly true I don t think here. Sending output to anywhere but the screen was handled in
                    Message 9 of 12 , May 3, 2014
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                      Unlurking for just a moment in order to be pedantic -- "yes" isn't strictly true I don't think here.  Sending output to anywhere but the screen was handled in Integer BASIC the same way as it was throughout the Apple II platform's life, you redirect output to a card slot (e.g., PR#1, PR#2, etc.) and then PRINT as usual.  There's no separate token for a command to PRINT to the printer.  So, sending a character over a modem is handled by the same mechanism.  Similarly you can redirect input to a card slot to get characters from an external device instead of from the keyboard (IN#2, etc.).

                      BTW, I don't think I ever posted an introduction when I started lurking, so: a) I'm occasionally pedantic, b) I top post because what is this, cctalk?, c) I'm based in Boston and push the envelope on the definition of "mid-Atlantic" but I do hope to make it to VCFE next year, d) I started with Apple in 1982, followed their lines through my current MBP, got re-interested in vintage computing a couple of years ago, and seem to have commenced a scorched-earth acquisition campaign "for the purpose of archiving and documenting" that has resulted in a couple of rooms completely stuffed with mostly Apple stuff, but also other notables (IBM 5150, 5155, Compaq II, III, Kaypro II, VIC-20, C64, CBM/PET, NeXT, Heathkit, TI, Atari, Epson, Casio, Sharp, Radio Shack, probably others not leaping to mind -- oh, I have a WaveMate Jupiter II to try to revive), e) I have more projects to do than I have projects done, f) I'm a regular co-host on Retrocomputing Roundtable and I tweet as @yesterbits.

                      I had a chance last summer to visit InfoAge and get a tour of the MARCH exhibit and Evan gave me a very interesting peek at the storage as well, it was very impressive.  I don't get down that way naturally very often, but I'm enjoying the discussions on the list and I hope I can get to an occasional event.

                      But there still wasn't a command equivalent to LPRINT in Integer BASIC.  :)

                       -Paul


                      On May 3, 2014, at 9:24 AM, Evan Koblentz <evan@...> wrote:



                      >>  Did Woz use separate commands for displaying on the screen and printing to a printer?

                      Yes.

                      The other thing I had to get used to (when Corey taught me Integer BASIC so I could demo it in the museum) was having to dimension every character string. I grew up on standard Applesoft (aka Microsoft) BASIC on Apple II+ and Apple IIe, so it confused me when I kept getting syntax errors / couldn't execute "INPUT N$" etc.



                    • Evan Koblentz
                      ... Oops. I was thinking of MARCH s Wang 2200 which uses a display command.
                      Message 10 of 12 , May 3, 2014
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                        >>>>  Did Woz use separate commands for displaying on the screen and printing to a printer?

                        >> Yes

                        Oops. I was thinking of MARCH's Wang 2200 which uses a "display" command.
                      • Joyce Weisbecker
                        No one s mentioned the NJ connection yet - 101 BASIC Computer Games was written by David Ahl, founder of Creative Computing Magazine, Morristown, NJ (and Ted
                        Message 11 of 12 , May 3, 2014
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                          No one's mentioned the NJ connection yet - 101 BASIC Computer Games was written by David Ahl, founder of Creative Computing Magazine, Morristown, NJ (and Ted Nelson worked there as an editor for awhile).

                          http://www.digibarn.com/collections/books/basicgames/
                          http://www.atarimagazines.com/creative/v10n11/66_Dave_tells_Ahl__the_hist.php

                          Same old story - New Jerseyans invent a new industry; Californians read about it and jump on the band wagon (Edison and moving pictures; Ahl and BASIC on a PC). Seems it happens all over NJ, not just in Trenton ("Trenton makes; the world takes") :).

                          Joyce













                           

                           



                             


                               
                                 
                                 
                                 >>>>  Did Woz use separate
                          commands for displaying on the screen and printing to a
                          printer?



                          >> Yes



                          Oops. I was thinking of MARCH's Wang 2200 which uses a
                          "display" command.


                               
                               

                               
                               






                             
                        • Evan Koblentz
                          ... Hi Joyce. Always nice to hear from you. I think nobody mentioned it because most MARCHins already know it. Dave Ahl has been a good friend to us through
                          Message 12 of 12 , May 3, 2014
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                            >> No one's mentioned the NJ connection yet - 101 BASIC Computer Games was written by David Ahl, founder of Creative Computing Magazine, Morristown, NJ (and Ted Nelson worked there as an editor for awhile).

                            Hi Joyce. Always nice to hear from you.

                            I think nobody mentioned it because most MARCHins already know it. Dave Ahl has been a good friend to us through the years .... he's lectured at our VCF East, made donations, etc.

                            Also, before Creative Computing, Ted was an advisor to the RESISTORS high school computer club in Hopewell (late 1960s-1970s). RESISTORS leader Claude Kagan was also a good friend to us; Ted and many of the original members visited us when Claude died a few years ago. Even though the memorial was all about Claude, Ted was nice enough to sign our first edition of Computer Lib / Dream Machines.  :)

                            You should come visit us. A lot has changed in the past few years
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