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Re: MG Chemicals Flux remover vs Ecoline Flux Remover

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  • corey986
    What do you normally use on Vintage Stuff then? I was cleaning some pretty fluxy MITS ram cards yesterday that I just got and 99% ISP barely did anything.
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 17, 2013
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      What do you normally use on Vintage Stuff then? I was cleaning some pretty "fluxy" MITS ram cards yesterday that I just got and 99% ISP barely did anything. Ecoline worked but I had 3 ram cards to do so it took 1/2 a can (they were really bad). I was saving that can for my Sol which was a kit so I'm sure once I get the main board out will need a good cleaning. I'm going with the Bill D method of troubleshooting, clean the darn thing up so you can see what you actually have going on when you start debugging. I also have my SIO-A and 88-PMC card to clean this week before I install them and I'm guessing they will finish off my Ecoline supply.

      Thanks,
      Corey

      --- In midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com, Dave McGuire wrote:
      >
      > On 01/16/2013 04:28 PM, corey986 wrote:
      > > Yes Evan this is on topic...
      > >
      > > I currently use Ecoline Flux remover to clean up old cards, this
      > > stuff is expensive and I have to mail order it. I noticed when I was
      > > picking up some 99.99% ISP the other day that my local electronics
      > > store carries MG Chemicals Flux remover which was about $5 cheaper a
      > > bottle not counting its local without shipping.
      > >
      > > Has anyone used the MG one? Is it as safe as the Ecoline for old
      > > cards and systems (plastic safe)? Does it work as well?
      >
      > I use one of MG's flux removers, product #4140. I've had no problems
      > with it attacking plastics. It's tough on your hands, though...use
      > gloves! I've mostly used it on new stuff, but I've used it on vintage
      > boards on occasion as well.
      >
      > -Dave
      >
      > --
      > Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
      > New Kensington, PA
      >
    • corey986
      Evan, You do know I m only razzing you because I haven t seen you since before the holidays. When things calm down, I ll see if I can help with some sorting
      Message 2 of 12 , Jan 17, 2013
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        Evan,
        You do know I'm only "razzing" you because I haven't seen you since before the holidays. When things calm down, I'll see if I can help with some sorting in the H building.

        Cheers,
        Corey

        --- In midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com, evan@... wrote:
        >
        > >> Yes Evan this is on topic...
        >
        > I agree.
        >
      • ekoblentz
        ... Razz away, just be prepared to be razzed. :) ... Thanks.
        Message 3 of 12 , Jan 17, 2013
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          >> You do know I'm only "razzing" you

          Razz away, just be prepared to be razzed. :)

          >> When things calm down, I'll see if I can help with some sorting in the H building.

          Thanks.
        • joshbensadon
          I do use flux remover, but I do not let it contact the case or switch plastics (IC and connector plastic seem to fare well). Don t buy just 1 can, I suggest
          Message 4 of 12 , Jan 17, 2013
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            I do use flux remover, but I do not let it contact the case or switch plastics (IC and connector plastic seem to fare well).

            Don't buy just 1 can, I suggest buying 3 cans, this stuff goes.

            Bill D is right. Clean it so you can see the solder connections.
            Then check for the usual solder bridges. Between pins they are easy to spot, look for them between an IC pin and a trace passing very close. Hold the board up to the light, it's easier to see these. Also look for micro short between traces or any trace opens, very easy to see when you put your bench light behind the board.

            I did a Mark-8 project like this.

            Tips on how to use less flux remover.
            -Spray on area, let soak for 20-30 seconds
            -Use a tooth brush to scrub the area (scrub for 10 seconds)
            -Spray more to sweep the area clear, letting the solvent drip off the board.
            -Use air to blow (chase) the rest of the solvent off, otherwise it evaporates and leaves the dissolved flux else where.

            When I'm doing multiple boards, I let the solvent drip off onto the next board, scrub it, spray it off onto the next board, etc.





            --- In midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com, corey986 wrote:
            >
            > What do you normally use on Vintage Stuff then? I was cleaning some pretty "fluxy" MITS ram cards yesterday that I just got and 99% ISP barely did anything. Ecoline worked but I had 3 ram cards to do so it took 1/2 a can (they were really bad). I was saving that can for my Sol which was a kit so I'm sure once I get the main board out will need a good cleaning. I'm going with the Bill D method of troubleshooting, clean the darn thing up so you can see what you actually have going on when you start debugging. I also have my SIO-A and 88-PMC card to clean this week before I install them and I'm guessing they will finish off my Ecoline supply.
            >
            > Thanks,
            > Corey
            >
            > --- In midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com, Dave McGuire wrote:
            > >
            > > On 01/16/2013 04:28 PM, corey986 wrote:
            > > > Yes Evan this is on topic...
            > > >
            > > > I currently use Ecoline Flux remover to clean up old cards, this
            > > > stuff is expensive and I have to mail order it. I noticed when I was
            > > > picking up some 99.99% ISP the other day that my local electronics
            > > > store carries MG Chemicals Flux remover which was about $5 cheaper a
            > > > bottle not counting its local without shipping.
            > > >
            > > > Has anyone used the MG one? Is it as safe as the Ecoline for old
            > > > cards and systems (plastic safe)? Does it work as well?
            > >
            > > I use one of MG's flux removers, product #4140. I've had no problems
            > > with it attacking plastics. It's tough on your hands, though...use
            > > gloves! I've mostly used it on new stuff, but I've used it on vintage
            > > boards on occasion as well.
            > >
            > > -Dave
            > >
            > > --
            > > Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
            > > New Kensington, PA
            > >
            >
          • Dave McGuire
            ... Yes, the MG 4140 does as well. ... Yeah. I don t recall it ever having damaged anything, but I m pretty consistent about getting it where it s needed and
            Message 5 of 12 , Jan 17, 2013
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              On 01/17/2013 01:46 AM, joshbensadon wrote:
              >> Urrr? #4140? Tell me more. I use it all the time, and my boards
              >> usually have plastic on them.
              >
              > Well, I don't recall the MG Chemicals part number, I don't have any
              > cans here at the moment. I'm using a cheaper product from Asalco
              > called "FLUX-CLEAN" (Product No AE 101). Both are like you said,
              > hard on the hands. They really suck the moisture out and leave your
              > hands white.

              Yes, the MG 4140 does as well.

              > Both don't bother the plastic dip sockets but I did once see the MG
              > Chemicals Flux Remover discolour a plastic case, luckily it was on
              > the inside of the case only. I don't know enough about plastics to
              > tell you which type it was. Since then, I've played it safe.

              Yeah. I don't recall it ever having damaged anything, but I'm pretty
              consistent about getting it where it's needed and nowhere else.
              Sometimes you can't help overspray, though. Connector shells, sockets,
              beepers with plastic enclosures, etc...never had any issues.

              Interestingly, I was in a PCB assembly house yesterday, letting them
              schmooze me a bit because I'm shopping around a big board assembly job.
              They do full-board spray defluxing there, using MG #4140...but from
              MUCH MUCH larger containers. ;)

              > A real offensive product is that contact cleaner. I tried it once on
              > a switch, it got on the plastic button and within 10 minutes, the
              > button became so brittle, it came apart with the slightest pressure.

              That's scary. I use their contact cleaner quite a lot as well, but I
              try to avoid letting it touch anything but the contacts, just on general
              principle.

              -Dave

              --
              Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
              New Kensington, PA
            • Dave McGuire
              ... MG 4140. :) I do a lot of repairs on vintage stuff, but I do far more work on current hardware. (that s why my earlier response must ve been confusing)
              Message 6 of 12 , Jan 17, 2013
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                On 01/17/2013 06:02 AM, corey986 wrote:
                > What do you normally use on Vintage Stuff then?

                MG 4140. :) I do a lot of repairs on vintage stuff, but I do far more
                work on current hardware. (that's why my earlier response must've been
                confusing)

                > I was cleaning some
                > pretty "fluxy" MITS ram cards yesterday that I just got and 99% ISP
                > barely did anything. Ecoline worked but I had 3 ram cards to do so
                > it took 1/2 a can (they were really bad). I was saving that can for
                > my Sol which was a kit so I'm sure once I get the main board out will
                > need a good cleaning. I'm going with the Bill D method of
                > troubleshooting, clean the darn thing up so you can see what you
                > actually have going on when you start debugging. I also have my
                > SIO-A and 88-PMC card to clean this week before I install them and
                > I'm guessing they will finish off my Ecoline supply.

                Yeah isopropyl alcohol won't both most fluxes very much. Even the MG
                4140 has trouble with very old, discolored flux. Scrub scrub scrub..

                -Dave



                > Thanks, Corey
                >
                > --- In midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com, Dave McGuire wrote:
                >>
                >> On 01/16/2013 04:28 PM, corey986 wrote:
                >>> Yes Evan this is on topic...
                >>>
                >>> I currently use Ecoline Flux remover to clean up old cards, this
                >>> stuff is expensive and I have to mail order it. I noticed when I
                >>> was picking up some 99.99% ISP the other day that my local
                >>> electronics store carries MG Chemicals Flux remover which was
                >>> about $5 cheaper a bottle not counting its local without
                >>> shipping.
                >>>
                >>> Has anyone used the MG one? Is it as safe as the Ecoline for
                >>> old cards and systems (plastic safe)? Does it work as well?
                >>
                >> I use one of MG's flux removers, product #4140. I've had no
                >> problems with it attacking plastics. It's tough on your hands,
                >> though...use gloves! I've mostly used it on new stuff, but I've
                >> used it on vintage boards on occasion as well.
                >>
                >> -Dave
                >>
                >> -- Dave McGuire, AK4HZ New Kensington, PA
                >>
                >
                >
                >
                >
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                --
                Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
                New Kensington, PA
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