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Re: OOPS! -- RE: [midatlanticretro] Report -- InfoAge work day...

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  • Bob Grieb
    Evan, That s OK. Guess I can keep the Hero-1, since I couldn t have taken it since I wasn t there... ...
    Message 1 of 7 , Nov 13 3:26 PM
      Evan,

      That's OK. Guess I can keep the Hero-1, since
      I couldn't have taken it since I wasn't there...



      --- Evan <evan947@...> wrote:

      > I forgot to mention that Bob Grieb also was there all day.
      >
      > Sorry!
      >
      > _____
      >
      > From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
      > [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evan
      > Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:27 PM
      > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: [midatlanticretro] Report -- InfoAge work day...
      >
      >
      > Hi all,
      >
      > We have some news that everyone will like ... and some news that'll
      > make
      > Treasurer Jim want to kill me. :)
      >
      > Myself, Bill Degnan, Andy Mayer, John Allain, John Montenigro, Chris
      > Keegan,
      > and David Gesswein (all the way from the D.C. area!) participated
      > today.
      > InfoAge's Frank O'Brien spoke with us for a while about our mission,
      > etc.,
      > and Fred Carl was very helpful today just as always. (Mark Dodel was
      > supposed to bring us his OS/2 collection but was sick.)
      >
      > We began at 10-ish with doughnuts and a discussion of how to tackle
      > InfoAge's Grabbe collection and our items. The original plan was to
      > start
      > by cataloging everything, but we called an audible and decided to
      > first
      > reorganize where everything is physically stored.
      >
      > We previously talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's main
      > building ("the hotel") but there is too much happening there (events,
      > construction) and there is too little security. So, per Fred's
      > original
      > idea, we scoped out a nice part of the second building (I forget what
      > it's
      > called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where the
      > National
      > Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be located.) We realized that a
      > couple
      > of the rooms where John M. already placed some items from his recent
      > rescues
      > are actually in an ideal location -- an otherwise unclaimed hallway
      > which
      > locks on both ends. We vaguely had Fred's permission to make this
      > claim,
      > but he had to leave for a few hours. The conclusion: "It's easier to
      > do now
      > and ask for forgiveness later than to get permission first."
      >
      > We began moving all the heavy computers (lots of DEC, teletypes,
      > servers,
      > etc.) from the NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of the rooms in
      > "our"
      > new turf. We spread out the items across a few of the rooms... each
      > room we
      > use for storage makes it one less room another group can claim,
      > right? Once
      > completed, we stopped for a pizza lunch and then moved to the hotel
      > basement, where Fred in the morning showed us a quasi-hidden room
      > with
      > strong shelves, decent lighting, and decent security. We moved many
      > of the
      > basement items (mostly Grabbe collection stuff) into this adjacent
      > room and
      > organized it quite nicely. Many of the items from John M.'s recent
      > rescue
      > are not of interest for our museum, but are things we can use to sell
      > /
      > barter / share with other groups, so we put those all in one group of
      > shelves. Thus we now actually have some (gasp!) organization to our
      > collection. Other parts of the collection were too big / heavy to
      > move into
      > the adjacent room or to the upstairs hallway in the next building,
      > but we
      > still made progress with those items by getting most of them off the
      > floor
      > and wrapped in plastic. Perhaps most important, in both areas where
      > our
      > collection now sits, we made clear distinctions between what belongs
      > to
      > InfoAge and what belongs to MARCH.
      >
      > Fred returned and we explained our claim for the second building's
      > hallway
      > rooms. He asked us to scale back that plan just a tad. :) However,
      > we
      > reached a compromise -- we'll start with just the rooms on one side
      > of the
      > hallway, and Fred will change the locks on those rooms' doors,
      > keeping one
      > key and giving the other to us exclusively. Those rooms are pretty
      > good for
      > serving as a computer museum. Many of them have pass-through doors
      > between
      > the rooms, and Fred said it's fine if we want to install
      > pass-throughs in
      > the rooms which lack them. We envision giving each room a theme --
      > the
      > minicomputer room, the microcomputer room, the gaming room, and so
      > on.
      >
      > Finally, we had an impromptu meeting with Fred about InfoAge's
      > mission / our
      > mission, fundraising opportunities, etc. ... I'll follow-up on these
      > topics
      > in other messages in the near future. One highlight: the vast
      > InfoAge
      > collection is only LESS THAN HALF of Mr. Grabbe's full collection.
      > The
      > other half is yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the
      > Harrisburg, PA
      > area to InfoAge. Fred is working on setting this up. When the time
      > comes,
      > he'll need three assistants -- "two to move the collection and one to
      > keep
      > Mr. Grabbe occupied" -- Fred's words, not mine.
      >
      > No real cataloging was done today (although there was some
      > photography).
      > When you have a big intimidating mess of stuff to clean up, like a
      > child's
      > pile of toys, the first problem is figuring out where to start.
      > Today, we
      > accomplished that and more -- we not only started but we now have a
      > much
      > clearer understanding of what's "our" space at InfoAge.
      >
      > Fred also told us that April 1 will be the ceremony for officially
      > turning
      > over the buildings from the town to InfoAge. As with the WWII
      > dedication
      > day a few months ago, he'd like us to have a (small) exhibit
      > presence. A few
      > weeks later (April 22-23) is the Trenton show. Unlike this year's
      > Trenton
      > show, we only should have a MARCH booth, not a whole room / exhibit
      > again.
      > The reason is because we don't want the public to say "Well I just
      > saw your
      > old computers in Trenton, why should I come to VCF East a few weeks
      > later?"
      > Joe Public doesn't know what VCF is, so we absolutely can't afford to
      > cannibalize our event by doing too much at Trenton next year.
      > Instead, at
      > Trenton we'll just man a booth and sign up people for our list and
      > distribute flyers and stuff.
      >
      > One month from tomorrow is T-minus six months to VCF East. If you're
      > reading this and did not yet start thinking about fundraising ideas
      > and your
      > exhibit plans, please do so now!! Six months will transpire FAST if
      > we're
      > not careful planners.
      >
      > Thanks to everyone who showed up to help today. Let's do it again in
      > a
      > couple of months, but hopefully not when it snows.
      >
      > - Evan
      >
      > -----------------------------------------
      > Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net
      >
      > Computer Collector Newsletter:
      > >> http://news.computercollector.com
      >
      > Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum:
      > >> http://www.marchclub.org
      > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/
      >
      >
      >
      > _____
      >
      > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
      >
      >
      >
      > * Visit your group "midatlanticretro
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro> " on the web.
      >
      >
      > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > midatlanticretro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      >
      <mailto:midatlanticretro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
      >
      >
      >
      > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
      > Service
      > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
      >
      >
      > _____
      >
      >
      === message truncated ===




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    • Evan
      We have photos. :) _____ From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bob Grieb Sent: Sunday, November 13,
      Message 2 of 7 , Nov 13 3:32 PM
        We have photos.  :)


        From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bob Grieb
        Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 6:27 PM
        To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: OOPS! -- RE: [midatlanticretro] Report -- InfoAge work day...

        Evan,

           That's OK.  Guess I can keep the Hero-1, since
        I couldn't have taken it since I wasn't there...

          

        --- Evan <evan947@...> wrote:

        > I forgot to mention that Bob Grieb also was there all
        day.

        > Sorry!
        >
        >   _____ 
        >
        > From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
        >
        [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evan
        > Sent:
        Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:27 PM
        > To:
        midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [midatlanticretro] Report --
        InfoAge work day...
        >
        >
        > Hi all,
        >
        > We have
        some news that everyone will like ... and some news that'll
        > make
        >
        Treasurer Jim want to kill me.  :)
        >
        > Myself, Bill Degnan,
        Andy Mayer, John Allain, John Montenigro, Chris
        > Keegan,
        > and
        David Gesswein (all the way from the D.C. area!) participated
        >
        today.
        > InfoAge's Frank O'Brien spoke with us for a while about our
        mission,
        > etc.,
        > and Fred Carl was very helpful today just as
        always.  (Mark Dodel was
        > supposed to bring us his OS/2 collection
        but was sick.)
        >
        > We began at 10-ish with doughnuts and a
        discussion of how to tackle
        > InfoAge's Grabbe collection and our
        items.  The original plan was to
        > start
        > by cataloging
        everything, but we called an audible and decided to
        > first
        >
        reorganize where everything is physically stored.
        >
        > We previously
        talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's main
        > building ("the
        hotel") but there is too much happening there (events,
        > construction) and
        there is too little security.  So, per Fred's
        > original
        >
        idea, we scoped out a nice part of the second building (I forget what
        >
        it's
        > called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where
        the
        > National
        > Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be
        located.)  We realized that a
        > couple
        > of the rooms where
        John M. already placed some items from his recent
        > rescues
        > are
        actually in an ideal location -- an otherwise unclaimed hallway
        >
        which
        > locks on both ends.  We vaguely had Fred's permission to make
        this
        > claim,
        > but he had to leave for a few hours.  The
        conclusion: "It's easier to
        > do now
        > and ask for forgiveness later
        than to get permission first."
        >
        > We began moving all the heavy
        computers (lots of DEC, teletypes,
        > servers,
        > etc.) from the
        NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of the rooms in
        > "our"
        > new
        turf.  We spread out the items across a few of the rooms... each
        >
        room we
        > use for storage makes it one less room another group can
        claim,
        > right?  Once
        > completed, we stopped for a pizza lunch
        and then moved to the hotel
        > basement, where Fred in the morning showed
        us a quasi-hidden room
        > with
        > strong shelves, decent lighting, and
        decent security.  We moved many
        > of the
        > basement items
        (mostly Grabbe collection stuff) into this adjacent
        > room and
        >
        organized it quite nicely.  Many of the items from John M.'s recent
        >
        rescue
        > are not of interest for our museum, but are things we can use to
        sell
        > /
        > barter / share with other groups, so we put those all in
        one group of
        > shelves.  Thus we now actually have some (gasp!)
        organization to our
        > collection.  Other parts of the collection were
        too big / heavy to
        > move into
        > the adjacent room or to the
        upstairs hallway in the next building,
        > but we
        > still made
        progress with those items by getting most of them off the
        > floor
        >
        and wrapped in plastic.  Perhaps most important, in both areas where
        > our
        > collection now sits, we made clear distinctions
        between what belongs
        > to
        > InfoAge and what belongs to
        MARCH.
        >
        > Fred returned and we explained our claim for the second
        building's
        > hallway
        > rooms.  He asked us to scale back that
        plan just a tad. :)  However,
        > we
        > reached a compromise --
        we'll start with just the rooms on one side
        > of the
        > hallway, and
        Fred will change the locks on those rooms' doors,
        > keeping one
        >
        key and giving the other to us exclusively.  Those rooms are pretty
        >
        good for
        > serving as a computer museum.  Many of them have
        pass-through doors
        > between
        > the rooms, and Fred said it's fine if
        we want to install
        > pass-throughs in
        > the rooms which lack
        them.  We envision giving each room a theme --
        > the
        >
        minicomputer room, the microcomputer room, the gaming room, and so
        >
        on.
        >
        > Finally, we had an impromptu meeting with Fred about
        InfoAge's
        > mission / our
        > mission, fundraising opportunities, etc.
        ... I'll follow-up on these
        > topics
        > in other messages in the near
        future.  One highlight: the vast
        > InfoAge
        > collection is only
        LESS THAN HALF of Mr. Grabbe's full collection.
        > The
        > other half
        is yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the
        > Harrisburg,
        PA
        > area to InfoAge.  Fred is working on setting this up.  When
        the time
        > comes,
        > he'll need three assistants -- "two to move the
        collection and one to
        > keep
        > Mr. Grabbe occupied" -- Fred's words,
        not mine.
        >
        > No real cataloging was done today (although there was
        some
        > photography).
        > When you have a big intimidating mess of
        stuff to clean up, like a
        > child's
        > pile of toys, the first
        problem is figuring out where to start.
        > Today, we
        > accomplished
        that and more -- we not only started but we now have a
        > much
        >
        clearer understanding of what's "our" space at InfoAge.
        >
        > Fred
        also told us that April 1 will be the ceremony for officially
        >
        turning
        > over the buildings from the town to InfoAge.  As with the
        WWII
        > dedication
        > day a few months ago, he'd like us to have a
        (small) exhibit
        > presence. A few
        > weeks later (April 22-23) is the
        Trenton show. Unlike this year's
        > Trenton
        > show, we only should
        have a MARCH booth, not a whole room / exhibit
        > again.
        > The reason
        is because we don't want the public to say "Well I just
        > saw your
        >
        old computers in Trenton, why should I come to VCF East a few weeks
        >
        later?"
        > Joe Public doesn't know what VCF is, so we absolutely can't
        afford to
        > cannibalize our event by doing too much at Trenton next year.
        > Instead, at
        > Trenton we'll just man a booth and sign up people
        for our list and
        > distribute flyers and stuff.
        >
        > One month
        from tomorrow is T-minus six months to VCF East.  If you're
        > reading
        this and did not yet start thinking about fundraising ideas
        > and
        your
        > exhibit plans, please do so now!!  Six months will transpire
        FAST if
        > we're
        > not careful planners.
        >
        > Thanks to
        everyone who showed up to help today.  Let's do it again in
        >
        a
        > couple of months, but hopefully not when it snows.
        >
        > -
        Evan
        >
        > -----------------------------------------
        > Evan
        Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net
        >
        > Computer
        Collector Newsletter:
        > >>
        href="http://news.computercollector.com">http://news.computercollector.com
        >
        > Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum:
        > >>
        http://www.marchclub.org
        > >>
        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/
        >
        >
        >
        >   _____ 
        >
        > YAHOO!
        GROUPS LINKS
        >
        >
        >      
        >
        *      Visit your group "midatlanticretro
        >
        <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro> " on the web.
        >  
        >
        >
        *      To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        midatlanticretro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        >
        <mailto:midatlanticretro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
        >
        >  
        >
        > *      Your use
        of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
        > Service
        >
        <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
        >
        >
        >   _____ 
        >
        >
        === message truncated ===



                   
        __________________________________
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        http://farechase.yahoo.com
      • Evan
        Egads everyone, I m replying to my own reply... My message earlier today was sent in a hurry from a Treo, because Frank s comments deserved an urgent reply.
        Message 3 of 7 , Nov 13 6:17 PM
          Egads everyone, I'm replying to my own reply...
           
          My message earlier today was sent in a hurry from a Treo, because Frank's comments deserved an urgent reply.  But my reply didn't come out as clearly as I hoped.
           
          Frank is absolutely correct -- everything in the Grabbe collection belongs to Infoage, not MARCH -- and so we have to be more considerate of Infoage leaders' opinions as we assemble the museum.  Granted, Fred's directive to us is simply "do your best with your limited resources," and we've done exactly that so far.  We just need to keep thinking in terms of the big picture.  Also, as we in MARCH start to get more items donated directly to us, it's going to be more tedious to organize it all.  But I think we did a pretty good job yesterday.
           
          Frank's also correct about what he said (or at least what I read) between the lines -- that I was too quick to open my big mouth.  My comments about "claiming" rooms and such, albeit mostly just joking around and referencing some inside jokes from Saturday, were obviously vague and inappropriate for the general list.  I apologize to Frank and anyone else who I offended.
           
          And now back to our regularly scheduled programming.
           
          Assuming no snow, who's up for another work day on Saturday, Dec. 10?  Now that we got some organizing done, we can begin real cataloging, as was the plan yesterday.
           

          From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of evan
          Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 12:36 PM
          To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: Report -- InfoAge work day...

          Frank, no worries, your opinion as an InfoAge officer is worth a lot more than
          two cents to us. :)

          We in MARCH already knew each other yesterday but we were glad to share our
          backgrounds and interests with you.

          However, please keep in mind that messages like my trip report on this mailing
          list are only intended as entertaining, informative, and informal updates for
          our general membership. So when I used phrases like turf its only in q casual
          way.

          I assure you that MARCH and specifically our officers fully understand that
          most of our collection is actually InfoAges collection/property. We are very
          careful to make this distinction when it really counts, for example, when we
          were organizing things in the basement yesterday. Im sure you understand that
          in the purely colloquial sense we just say our collection for simplicity on
          this mailing list rather than explaining the asterisk each time. We save the
          long explanation for newcomers, etc.

          (Sent from my cell phone so this message is brief, will follow-up with you
          later off-list.)

          - Evan
          --- midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
          >
          Hi all;
          >
          > Yes, it was great to get to know everyone - I'm sure
          that we'll have
          > a lot of fun in the future. Apologies for not being
          able to stay
          > longer - but at least my meetings at another museum
          (Sarnoff) were
          > productive... Apologies further for my inablility to
          remember faces
          > and names - over time I promise to get better!
          >
          > > We previously talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's
          main
          > > building ("the hotel") but there is too much happening there
          > (events,
          > > construction) and there is too little
          security.  So, per Fred's
          > original
          > > idea, we scoped
          out a nice part of the second building (I forget
          > what it's
          > >
          called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where the
          >
          National
          > > Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be located.)
          >
          > Since I wasn't there, is this what we refer to as "The Library"? -
          > It's the "L" shaped building behind the hotel.
          >
          > > We
          vaguely had Fred's permission to make this claim,
          > > but he had to
          leave for a few hours.  The conclusion: "It's easier
          > to do
          now
          > > and ask for forgiveness later than to get permission
          first."
          >
          > Wrong! You guys have to understand that you are now
          affiliated with
          > our organization, and that kind or attitude certainly
          doesn't endear
          > us to MARCH. Fred has a cellphone, as do I. Both of us
          are available
          > to answer questions or help organize.
          >
          > > We began moving all the heavy computers (lots of DEC, teletypes,
          >
          servers,
          > > etc.) from the NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of
          the rooms
          > in "our"
          > > new turf.  We spread out the items
          across a few of the rooms...
          > each room we
          > > use for storage
          makes it one less room another group can claim,
          > right? 
          >
          > Wrong again. Very Wrong. It's not "your" turf. It's Infoage's turf.
          > We make the final call. You cannot make claims for space that we may
          > have plans for in the future. Additionally, in the future when
          >
          the "H" buildings come online, everything will probably get moved
          >
          around in ways that none of us can imagine. Honestly, Evan, this kind
          >
          of attitude is really going to endanger our relationship. I suggest
          > you
          think about what your expectations are, and how you think you can
          > fit
          in. As with the other organizations that are under the
          > Infoage
          "umbrella", we have to paraphrase JFK:
          >
          > "Ask not, what Infoage
          can do for you - ask what you can do for
          > Infoage"
          >
          >
          (O.K., it's a bit of a stretch, but you get the idea....)
          >
          > >
          One highlight: the vast InfoAge
          > > collection is only LESS THAN HALF
          of Mr. Grabbe's full collection. 
          > The
          > > other half is
          yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the
          > Harrisburg, PA
          > > area to InfoAge.  Fred is working on setting this up.  When the
          > time comes,
          > > he'll need three assistants -- "two to move
          the collection and one
          > to keep
          > > Mr. Grabbe occupied" --
          Fred's words, not mine.
          >
          > As we discussed in the meeting
          yesterday, Dr. Grabbe is first and
          > foremost an Electical Engineer, and
          quite honestly, is not into old
          > computers as much as his collection
          might imply. His focus is on
          > computer design, "packaging" and
          associated technologies. This means
          > that any kind or oral histories
          should probably focus on this area.
          > We can get all kinds of info
          elsewhere on PDP-8's and -11's for
          > example, but where else are we going
          to going to get a talk about
          > Gene Amdahl's wafer scale integration
          program (incredible stuff!)?
          > The computer (actually, more of a
          programmable sequencer) for Mariner
          > 4? Etc. Dr. Grabbe *loves* to get
          "down and dirty" when talking about
          > the technologies - it's our job to
          translate a lot of this into
          > understandable English for the public. I
          suggest that one or two of
          > your folks with EE backgrounds come with you
          to help probe his mind
          === Message Truncated ===


          -----------------------------------------
          Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net

          Computer Collector Newsletter: http://news.computercollector.com

          Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/
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