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Report -- InfoAge work day...

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  • Evan
    Hi all, We have some news that everyone will like ... and some news that ll make Treasurer Jim want to kill me. :) Myself, Bill Degnan, Andy Mayer, John
    Message 1 of 7 , Nov 12, 2005
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      Hi all,

      We have some news that everyone will like ... and some news that'll make
      Treasurer Jim want to kill me. :)

      Myself, Bill Degnan, Andy Mayer, John Allain, John Montenigro, Chris Keegan,
      and David Gesswein (all the way from the D.C. area!) participated today.
      InfoAge's Frank O'Brien spoke with us for a while about our mission, etc.,
      and Fred Carl was very helpful today just as always. (Mark Dodel was
      supposed to bring us his OS/2 collection but was sick.)

      We began at 10-ish with doughnuts and a discussion of how to tackle
      InfoAge's Grabbe collection and our items. The original plan was to start
      by cataloging everything, but we called an audible and decided to first
      reorganize where everything is physically stored.

      We previously talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's main
      building ("the hotel") but there is too much happening there (events,
      construction) and there is too little security. So, per Fred's original
      idea, we scoped out a nice part of the second building (I forget what it's
      called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where the National
      Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be located.) We realized that a couple
      of the rooms where John M. already placed some items from his recent rescues
      are actually in an ideal location -- an otherwise unclaimed hallway which
      locks on both ends. We vaguely had Fred's permission to make this claim,
      but he had to leave for a few hours. The conclusion: "It's easier to do now
      and ask for forgiveness later than to get permission first."

      We began moving all the heavy computers (lots of DEC, teletypes, servers,
      etc.) from the NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of the rooms in "our"
      new turf. We spread out the items across a few of the rooms... each room we
      use for storage makes it one less room another group can claim, right? Once
      completed, we stopped for a pizza lunch and then moved to the hotel
      basement, where Fred in the morning showed us a quasi-hidden room with
      strong shelves, decent lighting, and decent security. We moved many of the
      basement items (mostly Grabbe collection stuff) into this adjacent room and
      organized it quite nicely. Many of the items from John M.'s recent rescue
      are not of interest for our museum, but are things we can use to sell /
      barter / share with other groups, so we put those all in one group of
      shelves. Thus we now actually have some (gasp!) organization to our
      collection. Other parts of the collection were too big / heavy to move into
      the adjacent room or to the upstairs hallway in the next building, but we
      still made progress with those items by getting most of them off the floor
      and wrapped in plastic. Perhaps most important, in both areas where our
      collection now sits, we made clear distinctions between what belongs to
      InfoAge and what belongs to MARCH.

      Fred returned and we explained our claim for the second building's hallway
      rooms. He asked us to scale back that plan just a tad. :) However, we
      reached a compromise -- we'll start with just the rooms on one side of the
      hallway, and Fred will change the locks on those rooms' doors, keeping one
      key and giving the other to us exclusively. Those rooms are pretty good for
      serving as a computer museum. Many of them have pass-through doors between
      the rooms, and Fred said it's fine if we want to install pass-throughs in
      the rooms which lack them. We envision giving each room a theme -- the
      minicomputer room, the microcomputer room, the gaming room, and so on.

      Finally, we had an impromptu meeting with Fred about InfoAge's mission / our
      mission, fundraising opportunities, etc. ... I'll follow-up on these topics
      in other messages in the near future. One highlight: the vast InfoAge
      collection is only LESS THAN HALF of Mr. Grabbe's full collection. The
      other half is yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the Harrisburg, PA
      area to InfoAge. Fred is working on setting this up. When the time comes,
      he'll need three assistants -- "two to move the collection and one to keep
      Mr. Grabbe occupied" -- Fred's words, not mine.

      No real cataloging was done today (although there was some photography).
      When you have a big intimidating mess of stuff to clean up, like a child's
      pile of toys, the first problem is figuring out where to start. Today, we
      accomplished that and more -- we not only started but we now have a much
      clearer understanding of what's "our" space at InfoAge.

      Fred also told us that April 1 will be the ceremony for officially turning
      over the buildings from the town to InfoAge. As with the WWII dedication
      day a few months ago, he'd like us to have a (small) exhibit presence. A few
      weeks later (April 22-23) is the Trenton show. Unlike this year's Trenton
      show, we only should have a MARCH booth, not a whole room / exhibit again.
      The reason is because we don't want the public to say "Well I just saw your
      old computers in Trenton, why should I come to VCF East a few weeks later?"
      Joe Public doesn't know what VCF is, so we absolutely can't afford to
      cannibalize our event by doing too much at Trenton next year. Instead, at
      Trenton we'll just man a booth and sign up people for our list and
      distribute flyers and stuff.

      One month from tomorrow is T-minus six months to VCF East. If you're
      reading this and did not yet start thinking about fundraising ideas and your
      exhibit plans, please do so now!! Six months will transpire FAST if we're
      not careful planners.

      Thanks to everyone who showed up to help today. Let's do it again in a
      couple of months, but hopefully not when it snows.

      - Evan

      -----------------------------------------
      Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net

      Computer Collector Newsletter:
      >> http://news.computercollector.com

      Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum:
      >> http://www.marchclub.org
      >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/
    • Evan
      I forgot to mention that Bob Grieb also was there all day. Sorry! _____ From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On
      Message 2 of 7 , Nov 12, 2005
      • 0 Attachment
        I forgot to mention that Bob Grieb also was there all day.
         
        Sorry!


        From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evan
        Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:27 PM
        To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [midatlanticretro] Report -- InfoAge work day...

        Hi all,

        We have some news that everyone will like ... and some news that'll make
        Treasurer Jim want to kill me.  :)

        Myself, Bill Degnan, Andy Mayer, John Allain, John Montenigro, Chris Keegan,
        and David Gesswein (all the way from the D.C. area!) participated today.
        InfoAge's Frank O'Brien spoke with us for a while about our mission, etc.,
        and Fred Carl was very helpful today just as always.  (Mark Dodel was
        supposed to bring us his OS/2 collection but was sick.)

        We began at 10-ish with doughnuts and a discussion of how to tackle
        InfoAge's Grabbe collection and our items.  The original plan was to start
        by cataloging everything, but we called an audible and decided to first
        reorganize where everything is physically stored.

        We previously talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's main
        building ("the hotel") but there is too much happening there (events,
        construction) and there is too little security.  So, per Fred's original
        idea, we scoped out a nice part of the second building (I forget what it's
        called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where the National
        Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be located.)  We realized that a couple
        of the rooms where John M. already placed some items from his recent rescues
        are actually in an ideal location -- an otherwise unclaimed hallway which
        locks on both ends.  We vaguely had Fred's permission to make this claim,
        but he had to leave for a few hours.  The conclusion: "It's easier to do now
        and ask for forgiveness later than to get permission first."

        We began moving all the heavy computers (lots of DEC, teletypes, servers,
        etc.) from the NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of the rooms in "our"
        new turf.  We spread out the items across a few of the rooms... each room we
        use for storage makes it one less room another group can claim, right?  Once
        completed, we stopped for a pizza lunch and then moved to the hotel
        basement, where Fred in the morning showed us a quasi-hidden room with
        strong shelves, decent lighting, and decent security.  We moved many of the
        basement items (mostly Grabbe collection stuff) into this adjacent room and
        organized it quite nicely.  Many of the items from John M.'s recent rescue
        are not of interest for our museum, but are things we can use to sell /
        barter / share with other groups, so we put those all in one group of
        shelves.  Thus we now actually have some (gasp!) organization to our
        collection.  Other parts of the collection were too big / heavy to move into
        the adjacent room or to the upstairs hallway in the next building, but we
        still made progress with those items by getting most of them off the floor
        and wrapped in plastic.  Perhaps most important, in both areas where our
        collection now sits, we made clear distinctions between what belongs to
        InfoAge and what belongs to MARCH.

        Fred returned and we explained our claim for the second building's hallway
        rooms.  He asked us to scale back that plan just a tad. :)  However, we
        reached a compromise -- we'll start with just the rooms on one side of the
        hallway, and Fred will change the locks on those rooms' doors, keeping one
        key and giving the other to us exclusively.  Those rooms are pretty good for
        serving as a computer museum.  Many of them have pass-through doors between
        the rooms, and Fred said it's fine if we want to install pass-throughs in
        the rooms which lack them.  We envision giving each room a theme -- the
        minicomputer room, the microcomputer room, the gaming room, and so on.

        Finally, we had an impromptu meeting with Fred about InfoAge's mission / our
        mission, fundraising opportunities, etc. ... I'll follow-up on these topics
        in other messages in the near future.  One highlight: the vast InfoAge
        collection is only LESS THAN HALF of Mr. Grabbe's full collection.  The
        other half is yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the Harrisburg, PA
        area to InfoAge.  Fred is working on setting this up.  When the time comes,
        he'll need three assistants -- "two to move the collection and one to keep
        Mr. Grabbe occupied" -- Fred's words, not mine.

        No real cataloging was done today (although there was some photography).
        When you have a big intimidating mess of stuff to clean up, like a child's
        pile of toys, the first problem is figuring out where to start.  Today, we
        accomplished that and more -- we not only started but we now have a much
        clearer understanding of what's "our" space at InfoAge.

        Fred also told us that April 1 will be the ceremony for officially turning
        over the buildings from the town to InfoAge.  As with the WWII dedication
        day a few months ago, he'd like us to have a (small) exhibit presence. A few
        weeks later (April 22-23) is the Trenton show. Unlike this year's Trenton
        show, we only should have a MARCH booth, not a whole room / exhibit again.
        The reason is because we don't want the public to say "Well I just saw your
        old computers in Trenton, why should I come to VCF East a few weeks later?"
        Joe Public doesn't know what VCF is, so we absolutely can't afford to
        cannibalize our event by doing too much at Trenton next year.  Instead, at
        Trenton we'll just man a booth and sign up people for our list and
        distribute flyers and stuff.

        One month from tomorrow is T-minus six months to VCF East.  If you're
        reading this and did not yet start thinking about fundraising ideas and your
        exhibit plans, please do so now!!  Six months will transpire FAST if we're
        not careful planners.

        Thanks to everyone who showed up to help today.  Let's do it again in a
        couple of months, but hopefully not when it snows.

        - Evan

        -----------------------------------------
        Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net

        Computer Collector Newsletter:
        >>
        href="http://news.computercollector.com">http://news.computercollector.com

        Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum:
        >>
        href="http://www.marchclub.org">http://www.marchclub.org
        >>
        href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/

      • Frank_OBrien
        Hi all; Yes, it was great to get to know everyone - I m sure that we ll have a lot of fun in the future. Apologies for not being able to stay longer - but at
        Message 3 of 7 , Nov 13, 2005
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          Hi all;

          Yes, it was great to get to know everyone - I'm sure that we'll have
          a lot of fun in the future. Apologies for not being able to stay
          longer - but at least my meetings at another museum (Sarnoff) were
          productive... Apologies further for my inablility to remember faces
          and names - over time I promise to get better!

          > We previously talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's main
          > building ("the hotel") but there is too much happening there
          (events,
          > construction) and there is too little security. So, per Fred's
          original
          > idea, we scoped out a nice part of the second building (I forget
          what it's
          > called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where the
          National
          > Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be located.)

          Since I wasn't there, is this what we refer to as "The Library"? -
          It's the "L" shaped building behind the hotel.

          > We vaguely had Fred's permission to make this claim,
          > but he had to leave for a few hours. The conclusion: "It's easier
          to do now
          > and ask for forgiveness later than to get permission first."

          Wrong! You guys have to understand that you are now affiliated with
          our organization, and that kind or attitude certainly doesn't endear
          us to MARCH. Fred has a cellphone, as do I. Both of us are available
          to answer questions or help organize.

          > We began moving all the heavy computers (lots of DEC, teletypes,
          servers,
          > etc.) from the NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of the rooms
          in "our"
          > new turf. We spread out the items across a few of the rooms...
          each room we
          > use for storage makes it one less room another group can claim,
          right?

          Wrong again. Very Wrong. It's not "your" turf. It's Infoage's turf.
          We make the final call. You cannot make claims for space that we may
          have plans for in the future. Additionally, in the future when
          the "H" buildings come online, everything will probably get moved
          around in ways that none of us can imagine. Honestly, Evan, this kind
          of attitude is really going to endanger our relationship. I suggest
          you think about what your expectations are, and how you think you can
          fit in. As with the other organizations that are under the
          Infoage "umbrella", we have to paraphrase JFK:

          "Ask not, what Infoage can do for you - ask what you can do for
          Infoage"

          (O.K., it's a bit of a stretch, but you get the idea....)

          > One highlight: the vast InfoAge
          > collection is only LESS THAN HALF of Mr. Grabbe's full collection.
          The
          > other half is yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the
          Harrisburg, PA
          > area to InfoAge. Fred is working on setting this up. When the
          time comes,
          > he'll need three assistants -- "two to move the collection and one
          to keep
          > Mr. Grabbe occupied" -- Fred's words, not mine.

          As we discussed in the meeting yesterday, Dr. Grabbe is first and
          foremost an Electical Engineer, and quite honestly, is not into old
          computers as much as his collection might imply. His focus is on
          computer design, "packaging" and associated technologies. This means
          that any kind or oral histories should probably focus on this area.
          We can get all kinds of info elsewhere on PDP-8's and -11's for
          example, but where else are we going to going to get a talk about
          Gene Amdahl's wafer scale integration program (incredible stuff!)?
          The computer (actually, more of a programmable sequencer) for Mariner
          4? Etc. Dr. Grabbe *loves* to get "down and dirty" when talking about
          the technologies - it's our job to translate a lot of this into
          understandable English for the public. I suggest that one or two of
          your folks with EE backgrounds come with you to help probe his mind
          for these kinds of things. I'll bet it will be a blast for everyone!

          By the way, if you go, we have to make sure you bring something nice
          for Mrs. Grabbe. Flowers, a basket of homemade fruits/jams/etc. or
          whatever. She is the most wonderful person you will ever meet, and
          don't be surprised if she invites you for lunch. It's in everyone's
          best interest to do something nice (besides, I'm still guilty about
          what we did to her lawn the last time I was there....)

          > Fred also told us that April 1 will be the ceremony for officially
          turning
          > over the buildings from the town to InfoAge. As with the WWII
          dedication
          > day a few months ago, he'd like us to have a (small) exhibit
          presence.

          As I said in previous E-mail, I would strongly suggest a big showing
          of MARCH members, complete with polo shirts (hats, underwear or
          whatever) and such to make a great impression. The local politicos
          plus probably a few DOD/BRAC folks will be there. It's important that
          we show everyone that their efforts in helping to create Infoage were
          not for naught.

          > A few weeks later (April 22-23) is the Trenton show.
          > Unlike this year's Trenton
          > show, we only should have a MARCH booth, not a whole room / exhibit
          again.
          > The reason is because we don't want the public to say "Well I just
          saw your
          > old computers in Trenton, why should I come to VCF East a few weeks
          later?"
          > Joe Public doesn't know what VCF is, so we absolutely can't afford
          to
          > cannibalize our event by doing too much at Trenton next year.
          Instead, at
          > Trenton we'll just man a booth and sign up people for our list and
          > distribute flyers and stuff.

          Honestly, I'll disagree with this - you are targeting two very
          different audiences. VCF, from what little I know about it, is a
          highly targeted event, with a small, select, but dedicated following.
          In essence, you are playing to the converted. TCF is a bit different -
          there are folks that probably never heard of retro computing, or
          were not aware of the extent of such a thing. As such, TCF is far
          better in terms of "community outreach", which is now the whole name
          of our game. Think of the number of folks who came to your room at
          TCF - I'll bet 90% of the folks you saw were just walk-in's, and they
          walked out with a new appreciation of the stuff from "back in the
          day". Don't worry about cannibalizing one attendance for another -
          many folks appreciate a second opportunity to see things.
          Additionally, there are often time/schedule conflicts that might
          preclude someone from going to VCF, but they will be able to attend
          TCF.

          As always, just my USD $0.02

          All the very best,

          Frank
        • evan
          Frank, no worries, your opinion as an InfoAge officer is worth a lot more than two cents to us. :) We in MARCH already knew each other yesterday but we were
          Message 4 of 7 , Nov 13, 2005
          • 0 Attachment
            Frank, no worries, your opinion as an InfoAge officer is worth a lot more than
            two cents to us. :)

            We in MARCH already knew each other yesterday but we were glad to share our
            backgrounds and interests with you.

            However, please keep in mind that messages like my trip report on this mailing
            list are only intended as entertaining, informative, and informal updates for
            our general membership. So when I used phrases like turf its only in q casual
            way.

            I assure you that MARCH and specifically our officers fully understand that
            most of our collection is actually InfoAges collection/property. We are very
            careful to make this distinction when it really counts, for example, when we
            were organizing things in the basement yesterday. Im sure you understand that
            in the purely colloquial sense we just say our collection for simplicity on
            this mailing list rather than explaining the asterisk each time. We save the
            long explanation for newcomers, etc.

            (Sent from my cell phone so this message is brief, will follow-up with you
            later off-list.)

            - Evan
            --- midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
            > Hi all;
            >
            > Yes, it was great to get to know everyone - I'm sure that we'll have
            > a lot of fun in the future. Apologies for not being able to stay
            > longer - but at least my meetings at another museum (Sarnoff) were
            > productive... Apologies further for my inablility to remember faces
            > and names - over time I promise to get better!
            >
            > > We previously talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's main
            > > building ("the hotel") but there is too much happening there
            > (events,
            > > construction) and there is too little security. So, per Fred's
            > original
            > > idea, we scoped out a nice part of the second building (I forget
            > what it's
            > > called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where the
            > National
            > > Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be located.)
            >
            > Since I wasn't there, is this what we refer to as "The Library"? -
            > It's the "L" shaped building behind the hotel.
            >
            > > We vaguely had Fred's permission to make this claim,
            > > but he had to leave for a few hours. The conclusion: "It's easier
            > to do now
            > > and ask for forgiveness later than to get permission first."
            >
            > Wrong! You guys have to understand that you are now affiliated with
            > our organization, and that kind or attitude certainly doesn't endear
            > us to MARCH. Fred has a cellphone, as do I. Both of us are available
            > to answer questions or help organize.
            >
            > > We began moving all the heavy computers (lots of DEC, teletypes,
            > servers,
            > > etc.) from the NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of the rooms
            > in "our"
            > > new turf. We spread out the items across a few of the rooms...
            > each room we
            > > use for storage makes it one less room another group can claim,
            > right?
            >
            > Wrong again. Very Wrong. It's not "your" turf. It's Infoage's turf.
            > We make the final call. You cannot make claims for space that we may
            > have plans for in the future. Additionally, in the future when
            > the "H" buildings come online, everything will probably get moved
            > around in ways that none of us can imagine. Honestly, Evan, this kind
            > of attitude is really going to endanger our relationship. I suggest
            > you think about what your expectations are, and how you think you can
            > fit in. As with the other organizations that are under the
            > Infoage "umbrella", we have to paraphrase JFK:
            >
            > "Ask not, what Infoage can do for you - ask what you can do for
            > Infoage"
            >
            > (O.K., it's a bit of a stretch, but you get the idea....)
            >
            > > One highlight: the vast InfoAge
            > > collection is only LESS THAN HALF of Mr. Grabbe's full collection.
            > The
            > > other half is yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the
            > Harrisburg, PA
            > > area to InfoAge. Fred is working on setting this up. When the
            > time comes,
            > > he'll need three assistants -- "two to move the collection and one
            > to keep
            > > Mr. Grabbe occupied" -- Fred's words, not mine.
            >
            > As we discussed in the meeting yesterday, Dr. Grabbe is first and
            > foremost an Electical Engineer, and quite honestly, is not into old
            > computers as much as his collection might imply. His focus is on
            > computer design, "packaging" and associated technologies. This means
            > that any kind or oral histories should probably focus on this area.
            > We can get all kinds of info elsewhere on PDP-8's and -11's for
            > example, but where else are we going to going to get a talk about
            > Gene Amdahl's wafer scale integration program (incredible stuff!)?
            > The computer (actually, more of a programmable sequencer) for Mariner
            > 4? Etc. Dr. Grabbe *loves* to get "down and dirty" when talking about
            > the technologies - it's our job to translate a lot of this into
            > understandable English for the public. I suggest that one or two of
            > your folks with EE backgrounds come with you to help probe his mind
            === Message Truncated ===


            -----------------------------------------
            Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net

            Computer Collector Newsletter: http://news.computercollector.com

            Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/
          • Bob Grieb
            Evan, That s OK. Guess I can keep the Hero-1, since I couldn t have taken it since I wasn t there... ...
            Message 5 of 7 , Nov 13, 2005
            • 0 Attachment
              Evan,

              That's OK. Guess I can keep the Hero-1, since
              I couldn't have taken it since I wasn't there...



              --- Evan <evan947@...> wrote:

              > I forgot to mention that Bob Grieb also was there all day.
              >
              > Sorry!
              >
              > _____
              >
              > From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
              > [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evan
              > Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:27 PM
              > To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [midatlanticretro] Report -- InfoAge work day...
              >
              >
              > Hi all,
              >
              > We have some news that everyone will like ... and some news that'll
              > make
              > Treasurer Jim want to kill me. :)
              >
              > Myself, Bill Degnan, Andy Mayer, John Allain, John Montenigro, Chris
              > Keegan,
              > and David Gesswein (all the way from the D.C. area!) participated
              > today.
              > InfoAge's Frank O'Brien spoke with us for a while about our mission,
              > etc.,
              > and Fred Carl was very helpful today just as always. (Mark Dodel was
              > supposed to bring us his OS/2 collection but was sick.)
              >
              > We began at 10-ish with doughnuts and a discussion of how to tackle
              > InfoAge's Grabbe collection and our items. The original plan was to
              > start
              > by cataloging everything, but we called an audible and decided to
              > first
              > reorganize where everything is physically stored.
              >
              > We previously talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's main
              > building ("the hotel") but there is too much happening there (events,
              > construction) and there is too little security. So, per Fred's
              > original
              > idea, we scoped out a nice part of the second building (I forget what
              > it's
              > called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where the
              > National
              > Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be located.) We realized that a
              > couple
              > of the rooms where John M. already placed some items from his recent
              > rescues
              > are actually in an ideal location -- an otherwise unclaimed hallway
              > which
              > locks on both ends. We vaguely had Fred's permission to make this
              > claim,
              > but he had to leave for a few hours. The conclusion: "It's easier to
              > do now
              > and ask for forgiveness later than to get permission first."
              >
              > We began moving all the heavy computers (lots of DEC, teletypes,
              > servers,
              > etc.) from the NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of the rooms in
              > "our"
              > new turf. We spread out the items across a few of the rooms... each
              > room we
              > use for storage makes it one less room another group can claim,
              > right? Once
              > completed, we stopped for a pizza lunch and then moved to the hotel
              > basement, where Fred in the morning showed us a quasi-hidden room
              > with
              > strong shelves, decent lighting, and decent security. We moved many
              > of the
              > basement items (mostly Grabbe collection stuff) into this adjacent
              > room and
              > organized it quite nicely. Many of the items from John M.'s recent
              > rescue
              > are not of interest for our museum, but are things we can use to sell
              > /
              > barter / share with other groups, so we put those all in one group of
              > shelves. Thus we now actually have some (gasp!) organization to our
              > collection. Other parts of the collection were too big / heavy to
              > move into
              > the adjacent room or to the upstairs hallway in the next building,
              > but we
              > still made progress with those items by getting most of them off the
              > floor
              > and wrapped in plastic. Perhaps most important, in both areas where
              > our
              > collection now sits, we made clear distinctions between what belongs
              > to
              > InfoAge and what belongs to MARCH.
              >
              > Fred returned and we explained our claim for the second building's
              > hallway
              > rooms. He asked us to scale back that plan just a tad. :) However,
              > we
              > reached a compromise -- we'll start with just the rooms on one side
              > of the
              > hallway, and Fred will change the locks on those rooms' doors,
              > keeping one
              > key and giving the other to us exclusively. Those rooms are pretty
              > good for
              > serving as a computer museum. Many of them have pass-through doors
              > between
              > the rooms, and Fred said it's fine if we want to install
              > pass-throughs in
              > the rooms which lack them. We envision giving each room a theme --
              > the
              > minicomputer room, the microcomputer room, the gaming room, and so
              > on.
              >
              > Finally, we had an impromptu meeting with Fred about InfoAge's
              > mission / our
              > mission, fundraising opportunities, etc. ... I'll follow-up on these
              > topics
              > in other messages in the near future. One highlight: the vast
              > InfoAge
              > collection is only LESS THAN HALF of Mr. Grabbe's full collection.
              > The
              > other half is yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the
              > Harrisburg, PA
              > area to InfoAge. Fred is working on setting this up. When the time
              > comes,
              > he'll need three assistants -- "two to move the collection and one to
              > keep
              > Mr. Grabbe occupied" -- Fred's words, not mine.
              >
              > No real cataloging was done today (although there was some
              > photography).
              > When you have a big intimidating mess of stuff to clean up, like a
              > child's
              > pile of toys, the first problem is figuring out where to start.
              > Today, we
              > accomplished that and more -- we not only started but we now have a
              > much
              > clearer understanding of what's "our" space at InfoAge.
              >
              > Fred also told us that April 1 will be the ceremony for officially
              > turning
              > over the buildings from the town to InfoAge. As with the WWII
              > dedication
              > day a few months ago, he'd like us to have a (small) exhibit
              > presence. A few
              > weeks later (April 22-23) is the Trenton show. Unlike this year's
              > Trenton
              > show, we only should have a MARCH booth, not a whole room / exhibit
              > again.
              > The reason is because we don't want the public to say "Well I just
              > saw your
              > old computers in Trenton, why should I come to VCF East a few weeks
              > later?"
              > Joe Public doesn't know what VCF is, so we absolutely can't afford to
              > cannibalize our event by doing too much at Trenton next year.
              > Instead, at
              > Trenton we'll just man a booth and sign up people for our list and
              > distribute flyers and stuff.
              >
              > One month from tomorrow is T-minus six months to VCF East. If you're
              > reading this and did not yet start thinking about fundraising ideas
              > and your
              > exhibit plans, please do so now!! Six months will transpire FAST if
              > we're
              > not careful planners.
              >
              > Thanks to everyone who showed up to help today. Let's do it again in
              > a
              > couple of months, but hopefully not when it snows.
              >
              > - Evan
              >
              > -----------------------------------------
              > Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net
              >
              > Computer Collector Newsletter:
              > >> http://news.computercollector.com
              >
              > Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum:
              > >> http://www.marchclub.org
              > >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/
              >
              >
              >
              > _____
              >
              > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
              >
              >
              >
              > * Visit your group "midatlanticretro
              > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro> " on the web.
              >
              >
              > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > midatlanticretro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              <mailto:midatlanticretro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
              >
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              >
              > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
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              >
              >
              > _____
              >
              >
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            • Evan
              We have photos. :) _____ From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bob Grieb Sent: Sunday, November 13,
              Message 6 of 7 , Nov 13, 2005
              • 0 Attachment
                We have photos.  :)


                From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bob Grieb
                Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 6:27 PM
                To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: OOPS! -- RE: [midatlanticretro] Report -- InfoAge work day...

                Evan,

                   That's OK.  Guess I can keep the Hero-1, since
                I couldn't have taken it since I wasn't there...

                  

                --- Evan <evan947@...> wrote:

                > I forgot to mention that Bob Grieb also was there all
                day.

                > Sorry!
                >
                >   _____ 
                >
                > From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                >
                [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evan
                > Sent:
                Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:27 PM
                > To:
                midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: [midatlanticretro] Report --
                InfoAge work day...
                >
                >
                > Hi all,
                >
                > We have
                some news that everyone will like ... and some news that'll
                > make
                >
                Treasurer Jim want to kill me.  :)
                >
                > Myself, Bill Degnan,
                Andy Mayer, John Allain, John Montenigro, Chris
                > Keegan,
                > and
                David Gesswein (all the way from the D.C. area!) participated
                >
                today.
                > InfoAge's Frank O'Brien spoke with us for a while about our
                mission,
                > etc.,
                > and Fred Carl was very helpful today just as
                always.  (Mark Dodel was
                > supposed to bring us his OS/2 collection
                but was sick.)
                >
                > We began at 10-ish with doughnuts and a
                discussion of how to tackle
                > InfoAge's Grabbe collection and our
                items.  The original plan was to
                > start
                > by cataloging
                everything, but we called an audible and decided to
                > first
                >
                reorganize where everything is physically stored.
                >
                > We previously
                talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's main
                > building ("the
                hotel") but there is too much happening there (events,
                > construction) and
                there is too little security.  So, per Fred's
                > original
                >
                idea, we scoped out a nice part of the second building (I forget what
                >
                it's
                > called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where
                the
                > National
                > Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be
                located.)  We realized that a
                > couple
                > of the rooms where
                John M. already placed some items from his recent
                > rescues
                > are
                actually in an ideal location -- an otherwise unclaimed hallway
                >
                which
                > locks on both ends.  We vaguely had Fred's permission to make
                this
                > claim,
                > but he had to leave for a few hours.  The
                conclusion: "It's easier to
                > do now
                > and ask for forgiveness later
                than to get permission first."
                >
                > We began moving all the heavy
                computers (lots of DEC, teletypes,
                > servers,
                > etc.) from the
                NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of the rooms in
                > "our"
                > new
                turf.  We spread out the items across a few of the rooms... each
                >
                room we
                > use for storage makes it one less room another group can
                claim,
                > right?  Once
                > completed, we stopped for a pizza lunch
                and then moved to the hotel
                > basement, where Fred in the morning showed
                us a quasi-hidden room
                > with
                > strong shelves, decent lighting, and
                decent security.  We moved many
                > of the
                > basement items
                (mostly Grabbe collection stuff) into this adjacent
                > room and
                >
                organized it quite nicely.  Many of the items from John M.'s recent
                >
                rescue
                > are not of interest for our museum, but are things we can use to
                sell
                > /
                > barter / share with other groups, so we put those all in
                one group of
                > shelves.  Thus we now actually have some (gasp!)
                organization to our
                > collection.  Other parts of the collection were
                too big / heavy to
                > move into
                > the adjacent room or to the
                upstairs hallway in the next building,
                > but we
                > still made
                progress with those items by getting most of them off the
                > floor
                >
                and wrapped in plastic.  Perhaps most important, in both areas where
                > our
                > collection now sits, we made clear distinctions
                between what belongs
                > to
                > InfoAge and what belongs to
                MARCH.
                >
                > Fred returned and we explained our claim for the second
                building's
                > hallway
                > rooms.  He asked us to scale back that
                plan just a tad. :)  However,
                > we
                > reached a compromise --
                we'll start with just the rooms on one side
                > of the
                > hallway, and
                Fred will change the locks on those rooms' doors,
                > keeping one
                >
                key and giving the other to us exclusively.  Those rooms are pretty
                >
                good for
                > serving as a computer museum.  Many of them have
                pass-through doors
                > between
                > the rooms, and Fred said it's fine if
                we want to install
                > pass-throughs in
                > the rooms which lack
                them.  We envision giving each room a theme --
                > the
                >
                minicomputer room, the microcomputer room, the gaming room, and so
                >
                on.
                >
                > Finally, we had an impromptu meeting with Fred about
                InfoAge's
                > mission / our
                > mission, fundraising opportunities, etc.
                ... I'll follow-up on these
                > topics
                > in other messages in the near
                future.  One highlight: the vast
                > InfoAge
                > collection is only
                LESS THAN HALF of Mr. Grabbe's full collection.
                > The
                > other half
                is yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the
                > Harrisburg,
                PA
                > area to InfoAge.  Fred is working on setting this up.  When
                the time
                > comes,
                > he'll need three assistants -- "two to move the
                collection and one to
                > keep
                > Mr. Grabbe occupied" -- Fred's words,
                not mine.
                >
                > No real cataloging was done today (although there was
                some
                > photography).
                > When you have a big intimidating mess of
                stuff to clean up, like a
                > child's
                > pile of toys, the first
                problem is figuring out where to start.
                > Today, we
                > accomplished
                that and more -- we not only started but we now have a
                > much
                >
                clearer understanding of what's "our" space at InfoAge.
                >
                > Fred
                also told us that April 1 will be the ceremony for officially
                >
                turning
                > over the buildings from the town to InfoAge.  As with the
                WWII
                > dedication
                > day a few months ago, he'd like us to have a
                (small) exhibit
                > presence. A few
                > weeks later (April 22-23) is the
                Trenton show. Unlike this year's
                > Trenton
                > show, we only should
                have a MARCH booth, not a whole room / exhibit
                > again.
                > The reason
                is because we don't want the public to say "Well I just
                > saw your
                >
                old computers in Trenton, why should I come to VCF East a few weeks
                >
                later?"
                > Joe Public doesn't know what VCF is, so we absolutely can't
                afford to
                > cannibalize our event by doing too much at Trenton next year.
                > Instead, at
                > Trenton we'll just man a booth and sign up people
                for our list and
                > distribute flyers and stuff.
                >
                > One month
                from tomorrow is T-minus six months to VCF East.  If you're
                > reading
                this and did not yet start thinking about fundraising ideas
                > and
                your
                > exhibit plans, please do so now!!  Six months will transpire
                FAST if
                > we're
                > not careful planners.
                >
                > Thanks to
                everyone who showed up to help today.  Let's do it again in
                >
                a
                > couple of months, but hopefully not when it snows.
                >
                > -
                Evan
                >
                > -----------------------------------------
                > Evan
                Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net
                >
                > Computer
                Collector Newsletter:
                > >>
                href="http://news.computercollector.com">http://news.computercollector.com
                >
                > Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum:
                > >>
                http://www.marchclub.org
                > >>
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/
                >
                >
                >
                >   _____ 
                >
                > YAHOO!
                GROUPS LINKS
                >
                >
                >      
                >
                *      Visit your group "midatlanticretro
                >
                <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro> " on the web.
                >  
                >
                >
                *      To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                midatlanticretro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                >
                <mailto:midatlanticretro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
                >
                >  
                >
                > *      Your use
                of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                > Service
                >
                <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
                >
                >
                >   _____ 
                >
                >
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              • Evan
                Egads everyone, I m replying to my own reply... My message earlier today was sent in a hurry from a Treo, because Frank s comments deserved an urgent reply.
                Message 7 of 7 , Nov 13, 2005
                • 0 Attachment
                  Egads everyone, I'm replying to my own reply...
                   
                  My message earlier today was sent in a hurry from a Treo, because Frank's comments deserved an urgent reply.  But my reply didn't come out as clearly as I hoped.
                   
                  Frank is absolutely correct -- everything in the Grabbe collection belongs to Infoage, not MARCH -- and so we have to be more considerate of Infoage leaders' opinions as we assemble the museum.  Granted, Fred's directive to us is simply "do your best with your limited resources," and we've done exactly that so far.  We just need to keep thinking in terms of the big picture.  Also, as we in MARCH start to get more items donated directly to us, it's going to be more tedious to organize it all.  But I think we did a pretty good job yesterday.
                   
                  Frank's also correct about what he said (or at least what I read) between the lines -- that I was too quick to open my big mouth.  My comments about "claiming" rooms and such, albeit mostly just joking around and referencing some inside jokes from Saturday, were obviously vague and inappropriate for the general list.  I apologize to Frank and anyone else who I offended.
                   
                  And now back to our regularly scheduled programming.
                   
                  Assuming no snow, who's up for another work day on Saturday, Dec. 10?  Now that we got some organizing done, we can begin real cataloging, as was the plan yesterday.
                   

                  From: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com [mailto:midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of evan
                  Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 12:36 PM
                  To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Re: Report -- InfoAge work day...

                  Frank, no worries, your opinion as an InfoAge officer is worth a lot more than
                  two cents to us. :)

                  We in MARCH already knew each other yesterday but we were glad to share our
                  backgrounds and interests with you.

                  However, please keep in mind that messages like my trip report on this mailing
                  list are only intended as entertaining, informative, and informal updates for
                  our general membership. So when I used phrases like turf its only in q casual
                  way.

                  I assure you that MARCH and specifically our officers fully understand that
                  most of our collection is actually InfoAges collection/property. We are very
                  careful to make this distinction when it really counts, for example, when we
                  were organizing things in the basement yesterday. Im sure you understand that
                  in the purely colloquial sense we just say our collection for simplicity on
                  this mailing list rather than explaining the asterisk each time. We save the
                  long explanation for newcomers, etc.

                  (Sent from my cell phone so this message is brief, will follow-up with you
                  later off-list.)

                  - Evan
                  --- midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                  >
                  Hi all;
                  >
                  > Yes, it was great to get to know everyone - I'm sure
                  that we'll have
                  > a lot of fun in the future. Apologies for not being
                  able to stay
                  > longer - but at least my meetings at another museum
                  (Sarnoff) were
                  > productive... Apologies further for my inablility to
                  remember faces
                  > and names - over time I promise to get better!
                  >
                  > > We previously talked about having our museum space at InfoAge's
                  main
                  > > building ("the hotel") but there is too much happening there
                  > (events,
                  > > construction) and there is too little
                  security.  So, per Fred's
                  > original
                  > > idea, we scoped
                  out a nice part of the second building (I forget
                  > what it's
                  > >
                  called -- I mean the building directly behind the hotel where the
                  >
                  National
                  > > Broadcasters Hall of Fame will also be located.)
                  >
                  > Since I wasn't there, is this what we refer to as "The Library"? -
                  > It's the "L" shaped building behind the hotel.
                  >
                  > > We
                  vaguely had Fred's permission to make this claim,
                  > > but he had to
                  leave for a few hours.  The conclusion: "It's easier
                  > to do
                  now
                  > > and ask for forgiveness later than to get permission
                  first."
                  >
                  > Wrong! You guys have to understand that you are now
                  affiliated with
                  > our organization, and that kind or attitude certainly
                  doesn't endear
                  > us to MARCH. Fred has a cellphone, as do I. Both of us
                  are available
                  > to answer questions or help organize.
                  >
                  > > We began moving all the heavy computers (lots of DEC, teletypes,
                  >
                  servers,
                  > > etc.) from the NJBHOF room down the hall to a couple of
                  the rooms
                  > in "our"
                  > > new turf.  We spread out the items
                  across a few of the rooms...
                  > each room we
                  > > use for storage
                  makes it one less room another group can claim,
                  > right? 
                  >
                  > Wrong again. Very Wrong. It's not "your" turf. It's Infoage's turf.
                  > We make the final call. You cannot make claims for space that we may
                  > have plans for in the future. Additionally, in the future when
                  >
                  the "H" buildings come online, everything will probably get moved
                  >
                  around in ways that none of us can imagine. Honestly, Evan, this kind
                  >
                  of attitude is really going to endanger our relationship. I suggest
                  > you
                  think about what your expectations are, and how you think you can
                  > fit
                  in. As with the other organizations that are under the
                  > Infoage
                  "umbrella", we have to paraphrase JFK:
                  >
                  > "Ask not, what Infoage
                  can do for you - ask what you can do for
                  > Infoage"
                  >
                  >
                  (O.K., it's a bit of a stretch, but you get the idea....)
                  >
                  > >
                  One highlight: the vast InfoAge
                  > > collection is only LESS THAN HALF
                  of Mr. Grabbe's full collection. 
                  > The
                  > > other half is
                  yet to be transported from Grabbe's home in the
                  > Harrisburg, PA
                  > > area to InfoAge.  Fred is working on setting this up.  When the
                  > time comes,
                  > > he'll need three assistants -- "two to move
                  the collection and one
                  > to keep
                  > > Mr. Grabbe occupied" --
                  Fred's words, not mine.
                  >
                  > As we discussed in the meeting
                  yesterday, Dr. Grabbe is first and
                  > foremost an Electical Engineer, and
                  quite honestly, is not into old
                  > computers as much as his collection
                  might imply. His focus is on
                  > computer design, "packaging" and
                  associated technologies. This means
                  > that any kind or oral histories
                  should probably focus on this area.
                  > We can get all kinds of info
                  elsewhere on PDP-8's and -11's for
                  > example, but where else are we going
                  to going to get a talk about
                  > Gene Amdahl's wafer scale integration
                  program (incredible stuff!)?
                  > The computer (actually, more of a
                  programmable sequencer) for Mariner
                  > 4? Etc. Dr. Grabbe *loves* to get
                  "down and dirty" when talking about
                  > the technologies - it's our job to
                  translate a lot of this into
                  > understandable English for the public. I
                  suggest that one or two of
                  > your folks with EE backgrounds come with you
                  to help probe his mind
                  === Message Truncated ===


                  -----------------------------------------
                  Evan Koblentz's personal homepage: http://www.snarc.net

                  Computer Collector Newsletter: http://news.computercollector.com

                  Mid-Atlantic Retro Computing Hobbyists & Museum: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlanticretro/
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