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  • yahoo@scoraigwind.co.uk
    Important textfile! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    Message 1 of 20 , Jan 1, 2005
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      Important textfile!



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Nando
      For the text file to be displayed, it must be placed in the main message area if it is attached, to the main message, the file will be removed automatically.
      Message 2 of 20 , Jan 1, 2005
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        For the text file to be displayed, it must be placed in the main message
        area if it is attached, to the main message, the file will be removed
        automatically.

        Please insert the text file in the main message area, again.

        Nando

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: <yahoo@...>
        To: <microhydro@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Saturday, January 01, 2005 5:44 AM
        Subject: [microhydro] Hello


        >
        >
        > Important textfile!
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Does your company feature in the microhydro business directory at
        http://microhydropower.net/directory ? If not, please register free of
        charge and be exposed to the microhydro community world wide!
        >
        > NOTE: The advertisements in this email are added by Yahoogroups who
        provides us with free email group services. The microhydro-group does not
        endorse products or support the advertisements in any way.
        >
        > More information on micro hydropower at http://microhydropower.net
        >
        > To unsubscribe: send empty message to
        microhydro-unsubscribe@...
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
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      • Bill Shanner
        Doesn t work on this group, at least for me. This group doesn t support HTML ... From: microhydro@yahoogroups.com Date: 01/01/05 09:45:02 To:
        Message 3 of 20 , Jan 1, 2005
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          Doesn't work on this group, at least for me.

          This group doesn't support HTML

          -------Original Message-------

          From: microhydro@yahoogroups.com
          Date: 01/01/05 09:45:02
          To: microhydro@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [microhydro] Hello


          For the text file to be displayed, it must be placed in the main message
          area if it is attached, to the main message, the file will be removed
          automatically.

          Please insert the text file in the main message area, again.

          Nando

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: <yahoo@...>
          To: <microhydro@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Saturday, January 01, 2005 5:44 AM
          Subject: [microhydro] Hello


          >
          >
          > Important textfile!
          >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Does your company feature in the microhydro business directory at
          http://microhydropower.net/directory ? If not, please register free of
          charge and be exposed to the microhydro community world wide!
          >
          > NOTE: The advertisements in this email are added by Yahoogroups who
          provides us with free email group services. The microhydro-group does not
          endorse products or support the advertisements in any way.
          >
          > More information on micro hydropower at http://microhydropower.net
          >
          > To unsubscribe: send empty message to
          microhydro-unsubscribe@...
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >






          Does your company feature in the microhydro business directory at
          http://microhydropower.net/directory ? If not, please register free of
          charge and be exposed to the microhydro community world wide!

          NOTE: The advertisements in this email are added by Yahoogroups who provides
          us with free email group services. The microhydro-group does not endorse
          products or support the advertisements in any way.

          More information on micro hydropower at http://microhydropower.net

          To unsubscribe: send empty message to microhydro-unsubscribe@...





          Yahoo! Groups Links

          To visit your group on the web, go to:
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          To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          microhydro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Hugh Piggott
          I am not sure what entity sent this message but I suspect it was a virus. They steal addresses and use them to send messages with. In this case it was an
          Message 4 of 20 , Jan 9, 2005
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            I am not sure what entity sent this message but I suspect it was a
            virus. They steal addresses and use them to send messages with. In
            this case it was an address that I use for my yahoo groups. But I
            did not send the message.

            My computer is a mac and appears to be free of virus troubles,
            however a virus on another computer can easily use my address to send
            infected messages that appear to come from my computer.

            >Important textfile!
            >
            >
            >
            >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >Does your company feature in the microhydro business directory at
            >http://microhydropower.net/directory ? If not, please register free
            >of charge and be exposed to the microhydro community world wide!
            >
            >NOTE: The advertisements in this email are added by Yahoogroups who
            >provides us with free email group services. The microhydro-group
            >does not endorse products or support the advertisements in any way.
            >
            >More information on micro hydropower at http://microhydropower.net
            >
            >To unsubscribe: send empty message to microhydro-unsubscribe@...
            >Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >


            --
            Hugh
            Scoraig Wind Electric
            http://www.scoraigwind.co.uk/
          • Frank Leslie
            Hi, Hugh, I am also a group member here, but haven t sent anything to you. You might look at Internet Explorer View Options to examine addresses. I found
            Message 5 of 20 , Jan 10, 2005
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              Hi, Hugh,

              I am also a group member here, but haven't sent anything to you. You might
              look at Internet Explorer View Options to examine addresses. I found
              eventually this, so it's Yahoo bulk mail.

              http://www.senderbase.org/?searchBy=ipaddress&searchString=66.218.66.167

              This group is the small hydro equivalent of awea forum, but just different
              form of energy. Same analogous discussions.

              Frank Leslie
              ---
              |=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
              -=-=-|
              | Frank R. Leslie, M.S. Space Tech | Adjunct Professor of Renewable
              Energy |
              | Florida Tech, 150 W. University Blvd., Melbourne FL 32901, DMES, Rm. 104
              |
              | (321) 674-7377 | http://my.fit.edu/~fleslie/ (Renewable
              Energy) |
              | Florida Tech email: fleslie@...
              |
              | Home: 1017 Glenham Drive, NE, Palm Bay FL 32905-4855 | (321)
              768-6629 |
              | Home email: mailto:f.leslie@... | 28-01.3130N /
              80-35.6136W |
              | www.geocities.com/windy4us (Wind Energy Experimenters) | KD4EYQ
              041110 |
              |=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
              -=-=-|

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Hugh Piggott [mailto:yahoo@...]
              Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2005 9:02 AM
              To: microhydro@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [microhydro] Hello
              Importance: High



              I am not sure what entity sent this message but I suspect it was a
              virus. They steal addresses and use them to send messages with. In
              this case it was an address that I use for my yahoo groups. But I
              did not send the message.

              My computer is a mac and appears to be free of virus troubles,
              however a virus on another computer can easily use my address to send
              infected messages that appear to come from my computer.

              >Important textfile!
              >
              >
              >
              >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >Does your company feature in the microhydro business directory at
              >http://microhydropower.net/directory ? If not, please register free
              >of charge and be exposed to the microhydro community world wide!
              >
              >NOTE: The advertisements in this email are added by Yahoogroups who
              >provides us with free email group services. The microhydro-group
              >does not endorse products or support the advertisements in any way.
              >
              >More information on micro hydropower at http://microhydropower.net
              >
              >To unsubscribe: send empty message to
              microhydro-unsubscribe@...
              >Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >
              >


              --
              Hugh
              Scoraig Wind Electric
              http://www.scoraigwind.co.uk/





              Does your company feature in the microhydro business directory at
              http://microhydropower.net/directory ? If not, please register free of
              charge and be exposed to the microhydro community world wide!

              NOTE: The advertisements in this email are added by Yahoogroups who
              provides us with free email group services. The microhydro-group does not
              endorse products or support the advertisements in any way.

              More information on micro hydropower at http://microhydropower.net

              To unsubscribe: send empty message to
              microhydro-unsubscribe@...



              ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
              --
              Yahoo! Groups Links

              a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/microhydro/

              b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              microhydro-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

              c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • sameullah amarkhel
              hi this is sameullah amarkhel one of the member of micro hydro group i hope all of you be ok i need some photos about micro hydro electric power ( turbines,
              Message 6 of 20 , Jun 19, 2007
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                hi this is sameullah "amarkhel" one of the member of micro hydro group i hope all of you be ok i need some photos about micro hydro electric power ( turbines, smal thems,.......) can you send me this i will be very thankful of you by


                ---------------------------------
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                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Alan Voice
                Just joined your group and saying hello, I personally am interested in any thing people are doing to be more energy efficient in there work/home life. I have
                Message 7 of 20 , Sep 12, 2007
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                  Just joined your group and saying hello,

                  I personally am interested in any thing people are doing to be more
                  energy efficient in there work/home life. I have glanced and read a
                  few posts and will try to read more past posts to see what you guys
                  are up to.

                  Hydro is a big part of energy resources especially where the grid is
                  not available or expensive to use.

                  I'm very interested in the break down of costs vs. expected life as
                  a cost per KW.

                  I'm learning more and more since building a web site on energy
                  efficiency.
                  Any feed back on the web site will be welcome.
                  I look forward to exchange some ideas/links in the future.

                  Alan Voice
                  Editor-Energy Efficiency
                  World of Renewables
                  www.worldofrenewables.com/EnergyEfficiency/index.html
                • matt humphrey
                  Hello All I have just joined this group & thought I d drop in a note about what I m doing. I live off-grid in NW Scotland. I have 1000 Ah 24 VDC battery with
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 23, 2010
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                    Hello All

                    I have just joined this group & thought I'd drop in a note about what I'm doing.
                    I live off-grid in NW Scotland. I have 1000 Ah 24 VDC battery with Trace PS2524 Inverter Charger. My charging sources are a community hydro generator and a Lister ST1 with Brush 3.5 KVA generator. I also have a Lister CS6/1 with 2.5KVA genrator which I am installing over the winter.

                    What may interest this group is the home-brew micro hydro which I am building...

                    I have stream which I have dammed giving me a 3.2 bar static head and a flow rate of about 10 litres/sec through a 120mm ID pipe about 200 metres in length.
                    At the business end I have a pelton runner connected to an Ametek 99VDC motor which I am shortly to bring online. This is feeding DC directly to the batteries over 50 metres of 35mm2 cable.
                    The battery has a Trace C40 as a diversion controller which will dump into a 24 VDC 40 Amp immersion heater.

                    It's all experimental but the prototype runner box & motor housing performed well. I am still waiting for the last bits to return from the metal shop. Everything is made from stainless steel. The penstock goes into a manifold which splits the flow into 4 25mm outlets. These connect to the runner box on adjustable nozzle mounts and the rain bird nozzles themselves, which I got from Joe Hartvigsen in the US, are easily interchangeable.
                    The runner box mounts on a large concrete slab with a sump under which discharges back to the stream.

                    For monitoring I am building a web enabled DC sensor / data recorder using an Arduino micro controller and a DC shunt.

                    I have been developing this project in my spare time for about 6 months & except the metal work and wiring to be finally assembled & ready for live runs & performance tuning in about 2 months.

                    I'll post up the numbers when I have them.

                    I have plans to automatically open and close the nozzles depending on available water at the dam but this will wait until the system is optimised.

                    Cheers
                    Matt
                  • rockwallaby@ymail.com
                    Hi Matt, Sounds really interesting, and I note you have similar ways and interests to me. I put in a post last week or so to this group about my ideas and
                    Message 9 of 20 , Nov 24, 2010
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                      Hi Matt,
                      Sounds really interesting, and I note you have similar ways and interests to me.
                      I put in a post last week or so to this group about my ideas and plans of building a micro-hydro controller, to control the voltage so as to maintain a more constant voltage into my 24 volt battery bank.

                      I have a small stream, a little smaller than yours possibly, about 3 litres per second with a 37 metre static head. It turns a good old 3 phase induction motor as 240VAC generator. Then I bring up the 3 phase to my little mountain cabin some 150 metres away via real nice good quality armoured VSD cable. Then I pick off 1 phase and through a transformer and full wave bridge and nice big capacitor to feed the battery.

                      This system of mine has been running quite happily for a number of years now, but I have always wanted to build an electronic controller, enter the Arduino.
                      I mentioned this in my post, but, alas, not a peep or a boo or a squeak of interest.
                      I felt really disheartened. But I have been playing with micro-controllers for many many years and have done a few Arduino projects now too. It's a fantastic little board that is just so versatile.
                      Hence, I have made a start on my programming and have the basic PID loop working now.
                      The PID, allows the controller to smoothly maintain the controlled value close to the required set point. Those who read this in the group who don't understand PID you will need to google, but it can get complex. I have a bunch of nice OPTO-22 solid state relays as well, which are zero crossing point turn on, which could be good for the controlling the load or loads. I indicated in my post that safeties was a thing I really also wanted, actually I should say need. So this need to be in the design criteria for sure.

                      Also, in my post, I mentioned that I would try to make it web enabled, just a ethernet shield and then plugged into my router, or you could go WiFi too.
                      That means when I am not home, say in France rather than Tasmania I can simply monitor the whole system. I can see historical trends, alarms, you name it, it is all quite possible.
                      I do industrial controls systems, so things like PLC's and SCADA have been my mainstay for many a year.

                      I would be happy if maybe you might be interested to discuss your ideas further with the possibilities of using an Arduino.

                      Best regards, from the other end of the Earth, Tasmania,
                      Paul



                      --- In microhydro@yahoogroups.com, "matt humphrey" <matt@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Hello All
                      >
                      > I have just joined this group & thought I'd drop in a note about what I'm doing.
                      > I live off-grid in NW Scotland. I have 1000 Ah 24 VDC battery with Trace PS2524 Inverter Charger. My charging sources are a community hydro generator and a Lister ST1 with Brush 3.5 KVA generator. I also have a Lister CS6/1 with 2.5KVA genrator which I am installing over the winter.
                      >
                      > What may interest this group is the home-brew micro hydro which I am building...
                      >
                      > I have stream which I have dammed giving me a 3.2 bar static head and a flow rate of about 10 litres/sec through a 120mm ID pipe about 200 metres in length.
                      > At the business end I have a pelton runner connected to an Ametek 99VDC motor which I am shortly to bring online. This is feeding DC directly to the batteries over 50 metres of 35mm2 cable.
                      > The battery has a Trace C40 as a diversion controller which will dump into a 24 VDC 40 Amp immersion heater.
                      >
                      > It's all experimental but the prototype runner box & motor housing performed well. I am still waiting for the last bits to return from the metal shop. Everything is made from stainless steel. The penstock goes into a manifold which splits the flow into 4 25mm outlets. These connect to the runner box on adjustable nozzle mounts and the rain bird nozzles themselves, which I got from Joe Hartvigsen in the US, are easily interchangeable.
                      > The runner box mounts on a large concrete slab with a sump under which discharges back to the stream.
                      >
                      > For monitoring I am building a web enabled DC sensor / data recorder using an Arduino micro controller and a DC shunt.
                      >
                      > I have been developing this project in my spare time for about 6 months & except the metal work and wiring to be finally assembled & ready for live runs & performance tuning in about 2 months.
                      >
                      > I'll post up the numbers when I have them.
                      >
                      > I have plans to automatically open and close the nozzles depending on available water at the dam but this will wait until the system is optimised.
                      >
                      > Cheers
                      > Matt
                      >
                    • Nando
                      Matt: Sink you have a small hydro driving a 90 Vdc motor can you define the setup for such hydro and how you are feeding the charge to the battery bank . You
                      Message 10 of 20 , Nov 24, 2010
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                        Matt:

                        Sink you have a small hydro driving a 90 Vdc motor can you define the setup for such hydro and how you are feeding the charge to the battery bank .

                        You say you have a Pelton though say that Joe H supplied 4 nozzles -- Do please detail you hydro setup

                        Why did you select a Pelton versus a Turgo turbine ?.

                        Loaded RPM of the Pelton and output power ?.

                        Your site head seems good for a direct Vac generator, in this case a 3 phase, as well, for easier charger set up --- Generating Vac in your case, you could use the hydro directly for most of your needs and the battery bank for heavy power needs -- the battery bank this way may last quite longer time since it is not power cycled so often.

                        Systems like yours, if the battery bank is less worked could extend its life 2 to 4 fold, I have seen banks with more than 15 - 20 years still strong - since the charge/discharge is shallow keeping the bank at 100 %the great majority of time .

                        Is your water source volume limited ?.

                        If so multiple nozzles may be better than just 2 nozzles with the microprocessor to maintain the proper pipe pressure with water volume changes . 4 nozzles can give up to the equivalent of 15 jets size changes.

                        Nando



                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: matt humphrey
                        To: microhydro@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2010 11:29 AM
                        Subject: [microhydro] Hello



                        Hello All

                        I have just joined this group & thought I'd drop in a note about what I'm doing.
                        I live off-grid in NW Scotland. I have 1000 Ah 24 VDC battery with Trace PS2524 Inverter Charger. My charging sources are a community hydro generator and a Lister ST1 with Brush 3.5 KVA generator. I also have a Lister CS6/1 with 2.5KVA genrator which I am installing over the winter.

                        What may interest this group is the home-brew micro hydro which I am building...

                        I have stream which I have dammed giving me a 3.2 bar static head and a flow rate of about 10 litres/sec through a 120mm ID pipe about 200 metres in length.
                        At the business end I have a pelton runner connected to an Ametek 99VDC motor which I am shortly to bring online. This is feeding DC directly to the batteries over 50 metres of 35mm2 cable.
                        The battery has a Trace C40 as a diversion controller which will dump into a 24 VDC 40 Amp immersion heater.

                        It's all experimental but the prototype runner box & motor housing performed well. I am still waiting for the last bits to return from the metal shop. Everything is made from stainless steel. The penstock goes into a manifold which splits the flow into 4 25mm outlets. These connect to the runner box on adjustable nozzle mounts and the rain bird nozzles themselves, which I got from Joe Hartvigsen in the US, are easily interchangeable.
                        The runner box mounts on a large concrete slab with a sump under which discharges back to the stream.

                        For monitoring I am building a web enabled DC sensor / data recorder using an Arduino micro controller and a DC shunt.

                        I have been developing this project in my spare time for about 6 months & except the metal work and wiring to be finally assembled & ready for live runs & performance tuning in about 2 months.

                        I'll post up the numbers when I have them.

                        I have plans to automatically open and close the nozzles depending on available water at the dam but this will wait until the system is optimised.

                        Cheers
                        Matt





                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • matt humphrey
                        Hi Paul I agree the Ardiuno is a fantastic device and coupled with an ethernet/micro SD shield makes a nice basis for any web enabled data logging device you
                        Message 11 of 20 , Nov 24, 2010
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                          Hi Paul

                          I agree the Ardiuno is a fantastic device and coupled with an ethernet/micro SD shield makes a nice basis for any web enabled data logging device you might care to code up. I have built an add on board using an LT1495 opamp, 2N3904 transistor and 100A 50mV shunt. The explanation of how this works and the circuit schematics can be found in Trystan Lea's content at http://openenergymonitor.org/emon
                          I'm still fiddling around with the code, (when I need it I'll finish it - should be easy - I'm a C++ programmer by profession), but the idea is to have the current across the shunt sampled periodically and saved onto the SD card. I'd like to get some kind of Hall effect sensor fitted to the motor shaft so I can log rpm too. In the long term I want to log water level at the dam, flow in the penstock and also what nozzles are open. Idea is the web server will hand out data which i can view from where ever I am. I spend a lot of time away from home which is part of the reason why it is taking me so long to deliver the project. Clearly the Ardiuno stuff is secondary to getting the turbine spinnign in anger.
                          The PID controller algorithms sound just like what I need for the other Arduino based project I hope to hook into this system: because my water is not constant I hope to build some level sensing at the dam then use this to control up to 4 linear actuators to open valves which will control the amount of water hitting my runner.

                          To be honest I'm still making it up as I go along and I'm not sure yet what to expect.

                          It's great fun though.

                          Cheers
                          Matt

                          --- In microhydro@yahoogroups.com, "rockwallaby@..." <paul.alting@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Hi Matt,
                          > Sounds really interesting, and I note you have similar ways and interests to me.
                          > I put in a post last week or so to this group about my ideas and plans of building a micro-hydro controller, to control the voltage so as to maintain a more constant voltage into my 24 volt battery bank.
                          >
                          > I have a small stream, a little smaller than yours possibly, about 3 litres per second with a 37 metre static head. It turns a good old 3 phase induction motor as 240VAC generator. Then I bring up the 3 phase to my little mountain cabin some 150 metres away via real nice good quality armoured VSD cable. Then I pick off 1 phase and through a transformer and full wave bridge and nice big capacitor to feed the battery.
                          >
                          > This system of mine has been running quite happily for a number of years now, but I have always wanted to build an electronic controller, enter the Arduino.
                          > I mentioned this in my post, but, alas, not a peep or a boo or a squeak of interest.
                          > I felt really disheartened. But I have been playing with micro-controllers for many many years and have done a few Arduino projects now too. It's a fantastic little board that is just so versatile.
                          > Hence, I have made a start on my programming and have the basic PID loop working now.
                          > The PID, allows the controller to smoothly maintain the controlled value close to the required set point. Those who read this in the group who don't understand PID you will need to google, but it can get complex. I have a bunch of nice OPTO-22 solid state relays as well, which are zero crossing point turn on, which could be good for the controlling the load or loads. I indicated in my post that safeties was a thing I really also wanted, actually I should say need. So this need to be in the design criteria for sure.
                          >
                          > Also, in my post, I mentioned that I would try to make it web enabled, just a ethernet shield and then plugged into my router, or you could go WiFi too.
                          > That means when I am not home, say in France rather than Tasmania I can simply monitor the whole system. I can see historical trends, alarms, you name it, it is all quite possible.
                          > I do industrial controls systems, so things like PLC's and SCADA have been my mainstay for many a year.
                          >
                          > I would be happy if maybe you might be interested to discuss your ideas further with the possibilities of using an Arduino.
                          >
                          > Best regards, from the other end of the Earth, Tasmania,
                          > Paul
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > --- In microhydro@yahoogroups.com, "matt humphrey" <matt@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Hello All
                          > >
                          > > I have just joined this group & thought I'd drop in a note about what I'm doing.
                          > > I live off-grid in NW Scotland. I have 1000 Ah 24 VDC battery with Trace PS2524 Inverter Charger. My charging sources are a community hydro generator and a Lister ST1 with Brush 3.5 KVA generator. I also have a Lister CS6/1 with 2.5KVA genrator which I am installing over the winter.
                          > >
                          > > What may interest this group is the home-brew micro hydro which I am building...
                          > >
                          > > I have stream which I have dammed giving me a 3.2 bar static head and a flow rate of about 10 litres/sec through a 120mm ID pipe about 200 metres in length.
                          > > At the business end I have a pelton runner connected to an Ametek 99VDC motor which I am shortly to bring online. This is feeding DC directly to the batteries over 50 metres of 35mm2 cable.
                          > > The battery has a Trace C40 as a diversion controller which will dump into a 24 VDC 40 Amp immersion heater.
                          > >
                          > > It's all experimental but the prototype runner box & motor housing performed well. I am still waiting for the last bits to return from the metal shop. Everything is made from stainless steel. The penstock goes into a manifold which splits the flow into 4 25mm outlets. These connect to the runner box on adjustable nozzle mounts and the rain bird nozzles themselves, which I got from Joe Hartvigsen in the US, are easily interchangeable.
                          > > The runner box mounts on a large concrete slab with a sump under which discharges back to the stream.
                          > >
                          > > For monitoring I am building a web enabled DC sensor / data recorder using an Arduino micro controller and a DC shunt.
                          > >
                          > > I have been developing this project in my spare time for about 6 months & except the metal work and wiring to be finally assembled & ready for live runs & performance tuning in about 2 months.
                          > >
                          > > I'll post up the numbers when I have them.
                          > >
                          > > I have plans to automatically open and close the nozzles depending on available water at the dam but this will wait until the system is optimised.
                          > >
                          > > Cheers
                          > > Matt
                          > >
                          >
                        • Steve Spence
                          I have a ethernet / sd shield for my Arduino, and will be posting projects and code shortly at http://arduinotronics.blogspot.com/ Steve Spence Renewable
                          Message 12 of 20 , Nov 24, 2010
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                            I have a ethernet / sd shield for my Arduino, and will be posting
                            projects and code shortly at http://arduinotronics.blogspot.com/

                            Steve Spence
                            Renewable energy and self sufficiency
                            http://www.green-trust.org
                            http://arduinotronics.blogspot.com/



                            On 11/24/2010 05:42 PM, matt humphrey wrote:
                            >
                            >
                            > Hi Paul
                            >
                            > I agree the Ardiuno is a fantastic device and coupled with an
                            > ethernet/micro SD shield makes a nice basis for any web enabled data
                            > logging device you might care to code up. I have built an add on board
                            > using an LT1495 opamp, 2N3904 transistor and 100A 50mV shunt. The
                            > explanation of how this works and the circuit schematics can be found in
                            > Trystan Lea's content at http://openenergymonitor.org/emon
                            > I'm still fiddling around with the code, (when I need it I'll finish it
                            > - should be easy - I'm a C++ programmer by profession), but the idea is
                            > to have the current across the shunt sampled periodically and saved onto
                            > the SD card. I'd like to get some kind of Hall effect sensor fitted to
                            > the motor shaft so I can log rpm too. In the long term I want to log
                            > water level at the dam, flow in the penstock and also what nozzles are
                            > open. Idea is the web server will hand out data which i can view from
                            > where ever I am. I spend a lot of time away from home which is part of
                            > the reason why it is taking me so long to deliver the project. Clearly
                            > the Ardiuno stuff is secondary to getting the turbine spinnign in anger.
                            > The PID controller algorithms sound just like what I need for the other
                            > Arduino based project I hope to hook into this system: because my water
                            > is not constant I hope to build some level sensing at the dam then use
                            > this to control up to 4 linear actuators to open valves which will
                            > control the amount of water hitting my runner.
                            >
                            > To be honest I'm still making it up as I go along and I'm not sure yet
                            > what to expect.
                            >
                            > It's great fun though.
                            >
                            > Cheers
                            > Matt
                            >
                            > --- In microhydro@yahoogroups.com <mailto:microhydro%40yahoogroups.com>,
                            > "rockwallaby@..." <paul.alting@...> wrote:
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> Hi Matt,
                            >> Sounds really interesting, and I note you have similar ways and
                            > interests to me.
                            >> I put in a post last week or so to this group about my ideas and plans
                            > of building a micro-hydro controller, to control the voltage so as to
                            > maintain a more constant voltage into my 24 volt battery bank.
                            >>
                            >> I have a small stream, a little smaller than yours possibly, about 3
                            > litres per second with a 37 metre static head. It turns a good old 3
                            > phase induction motor as 240VAC generator. Then I bring up the 3 phase
                            > to my little mountain cabin some 150 metres away via real nice good
                            > quality armoured VSD cable. Then I pick off 1 phase and through a
                            > transformer and full wave bridge and nice big capacitor to feed the battery.
                            >>
                            >> This system of mine has been running quite happily for a number of
                            > years now, but I have always wanted to build an electronic controller,
                            > enter the Arduino.
                            >> I mentioned this in my post, but, alas, not a peep or a boo or a
                            > squeak of interest.
                            >> I felt really disheartened. But I have been playing with
                            > micro-controllers for many many years and have done a few Arduino
                            > projects now too. It's a fantastic little board that is just so versatile.
                            >> Hence, I have made a start on my programming and have the basic PID
                            > loop working now.
                            >> The PID, allows the controller to smoothly maintain the controlled
                            > value close to the required set point. Those who read this in the group
                            > who don't understand PID you will need to google, but it can get
                            > complex. I have a bunch of nice OPTO-22 solid state relays as well,
                            > which are zero crossing point turn on, which could be good for the
                            > controlling the load or loads. I indicated in my post that safeties was
                            > a thing I really also wanted, actually I should say need. So this need
                            > to be in the design criteria for sure.
                            >>
                            >> Also, in my post, I mentioned that I would try to make it web enabled,
                            > just a ethernet shield and then plugged into my router, or you could go
                            > WiFi too.
                            >> That means when I am not home, say in France rather than Tasmania I
                            > can simply monitor the whole system. I can see historical trends,
                            > alarms, you name it, it is all quite possible.
                            >> I do industrial controls systems, so things like PLC's and SCADA have
                            > been my mainstay for many a year.
                            >>
                            >> I would be happy if maybe you might be interested to discuss your
                            > ideas further with the possibilities of using an Arduino.
                            >>
                            >> Best regards, from the other end of the Earth, Tasmania,
                            >> Paul
                            >>
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> --- In microhydro@yahoogroups.com
                            > <mailto:microhydro%40yahoogroups.com>, "matt humphrey" <matt@> wrote:
                            >> >
                            >> > Hello All
                            >> >
                            >> > I have just joined this group & thought I'd drop in a note about
                            > what I'm doing.
                            >> > I live off-grid in NW Scotland. I have 1000 Ah 24 VDC battery with
                            > Trace PS2524 Inverter Charger. My charging sources are a community hydro
                            > generator and a Lister ST1 with Brush 3.5 KVA generator. I also have a
                            > Lister CS6/1 with 2.5KVA genrator which I am installing over the winter.
                            >> >
                            >> > What may interest this group is the home-brew micro hydro which I am
                            > building...
                            >> >
                            >> > I have stream which I have dammed giving me a 3.2 bar static head
                            > and a flow rate of about 10 litres/sec through a 120mm ID pipe about 200
                            > metres in length.
                            >> > At the business end I have a pelton runner connected to an Ametek
                            > 99VDC motor which I am shortly to bring online. This is feeding DC
                            > directly to the batteries over 50 metres of 35mm2 cable.
                            >> > The battery has a Trace C40 as a diversion controller which will
                            > dump into a 24 VDC 40 Amp immersion heater.
                            >> >
                            >> > It's all experimental but the prototype runner box & motor housing
                            > performed well. I am still waiting for the last bits to return from the
                            > metal shop. Everything is made from stainless steel. The penstock goes
                            > into a manifold which splits the flow into 4 25mm outlets. These connect
                            > to the runner box on adjustable nozzle mounts and the rain bird nozzles
                            > themselves, which I got from Joe Hartvigsen in the US, are easily
                            > interchangeable.
                            >> > The runner box mounts on a large concrete slab with a sump under
                            > which discharges back to the stream.
                            >> >
                            >> > For monitoring I am building a web enabled DC sensor / data recorder
                            > using an Arduino micro controller and a DC shunt.
                            >> >
                            >> > I have been developing this project in my spare time for about 6
                            > months & except the metal work and wiring to be finally assembled &
                            > ready for live runs & performance tuning in about 2 months.
                            >> >
                            >> > I'll post up the numbers when I have them.
                            >> >
                            >> > I have plans to automatically open and close the nozzles depending
                            > on available water at the dam but this will wait until the system is
                            > optimised.
                            >> >
                            >> > Cheers
                            >> > Matt
                            >> >
                            >>
                            >
                            >
                          • matt humphrey
                            Hi Nando I typed up a long reply to your post last night but lost it somehow so here goes with another attempt ro remember the key points of what I wrote.
                            Message 13 of 20 , Nov 24, 2010
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                              Hi Nando

                              I typed up a long reply to your post last night but lost it somehow so here goes with another attempt ro remember the key points of what I wrote.
                              Thank you for the questions and suggestions and I do realise that most people in this group know much more about hydro power than I can ever hope to learn.
                              You are right about my water source being volume limited. It is a small stream about 2 feet wide which has quite a large catchment area for rain but the flow is very volatile. Sometimes there is a huge quantity of water coming down, at others the flow dries up to a useless trickle.
                              There were many reasons that the project has developed to where it is now and I anticipate sucking of teeth at some my reasons and decisions. Motivation surrounded cost, reuse of parts I already had, simplicity, fluctuating water volume and that I already had the battery/inverter fully integrated into the house and hope to add various charging sources to it. I chose to use the Ametek 99VDC motor as my generator rather than an AC one because it had been in my workshop for many years after I bought it off ebay for a song. I had intended to build a wind turbine but the project never flew. The wind where I live is all or nothing and other factors prevented me from hoisting the motor onto a pole.
                              Why did I choose the pelton? Again, I had been collecting parts and had the small pelton sitting there begging me to try it out. I also have a 4" plastic spooned turgo but with limited woodworking skills, when it came to making up a prototype runner box/motor and nozzle mount, it was easier (for me) to go for the pelton first. It may not be the most efficient and it is quite possible that once I have run the pelton for a while to harvest data I will focus on the turgo. I believe the Ametek 99VDC is an awesome power producer when used as a generator: once it is up to 650 rpm it produces more than 24VDC. For my prototype I built a wooden runner housing. This had 4 nozzles and I was able with 3 nozzles to get 72VDC open voltage which is way above any reference data I have for this motor. The fourth nozzle was not aligned correctly. When I clamped this onto a 24VDC battery it very quickly got up to over 30VDC and the acid was fizzing furiously. I had to shut it down. Alas I did not have a meter to measure the current but this was enough for me to decide to commit the prototype into metalwork.
                              The nozzles I bought from Joe were selected based on the flow data he publishes and are really just so that I can get the thing assembled and running and have a baseline for my tests. I intend to buy more in various sizes later once I start to experiment.
                              The power will come directly off the motor into the batteries via nice thick armoured cable, a diode to stop the motor running as a motor and a DC disconnect.
                              I hope to have everything fully assembled in the next couple of months and will post up the data as I collect it.

                              At this stage what I am building is clearly sub-optimal but once I can start collecting live data and experimenting the real fun will begin. I anticipate that the project will evolve as it goes and I fail/learn/improve.

                              Cheers
                              Matt


                              --- In microhydro@yahoogroups.com, "Nando" <nando37@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Matt:
                              >
                              > Sink you have a small hydro driving a 90 Vdc motor can you define the setup for such hydro and how you are feeding the charge to the battery bank .
                              >
                              > You say you have a Pelton though say that Joe H supplied 4 nozzles -- Do please detail you hydro setup
                              >
                              > Why did you select a Pelton versus a Turgo turbine ?.
                              >
                              > Loaded RPM of the Pelton and output power ?.
                              >
                              > Your site head seems good for a direct Vac generator, in this case a 3 phase, as well, for easier charger set up --- Generating Vac in your case, you could use the hydro directly for most of your needs and the battery bank for heavy power needs -- the battery bank this way may last quite longer time since it is not power cycled so often.
                              >
                              > Systems like yours, if the battery bank is less worked could extend its life 2 to 4 fold, I have seen banks with more than 15 - 20 years still strong - since the charge/discharge is shallow keeping the bank at 100 %the great majority of time .
                              >
                              > Is your water source volume limited ?.
                              >
                              > If so multiple nozzles may be better than just 2 nozzles with the microprocessor to maintain the proper pipe pressure with water volume changes . 4 nozzles can give up to the equivalent of 15 jets size changes.
                              >
                              > Nando
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > ----- Original Message -----
                              > From: matt humphrey
                              > To: microhydro@yahoogroups.com
                              > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2010 11:29 AM
                              > Subject: [microhydro] Hello
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > Hello All
                              >
                              > I have just joined this group & thought I'd drop in a note about what I'm doing.
                              > I live off-grid in NW Scotland. I have 1000 Ah 24 VDC battery with Trace PS2524 Inverter Charger. My charging sources are a community hydro generator and a Lister ST1 with Brush 3.5 KVA generator. I also have a Lister CS6/1 with 2.5KVA genrator which I am installing over the winter.
                              >
                              > What may interest this group is the home-brew micro hydro which I am building...
                              >
                              > I have stream which I have dammed giving me a 3.2 bar static head and a flow rate of about 10 litres/sec through a 120mm ID pipe about 200 metres in length.
                              > At the business end I have a pelton runner connected to an Ametek 99VDC motor which I am shortly to bring online. This is feeding DC directly to the batteries over 50 metres of 35mm2 cable.
                              > The battery has a Trace C40 as a diversion controller which will dump into a 24 VDC 40 Amp immersion heater.
                              >
                              > It's all experimental but the prototype runner box & motor housing performed well. I am still waiting for the last bits to return from the metal shop. Everything is made from stainless steel. The penstock goes into a manifold which splits the flow into 4 25mm outlets. These connect to the runner box on adjustable nozzle mounts and the rain bird nozzles themselves, which I got from Joe Hartvigsen in the US, are easily interchangeable.
                              > The runner box mounts on a large concrete slab with a sump under which discharges back to the stream.
                              >
                              > For monitoring I am building a web enabled DC sensor / data recorder using an Arduino micro controller and a DC shunt.
                              >
                              > I have been developing this project in my spare time for about 6 months & except the metal work and wiring to be finally assembled & ready for live runs & performance tuning in about 2 months.
                              >
                              > I'll post up the numbers when I have them.
                              >
                              > I have plans to automatically open and close the nozzles depending on available water at the dam but this will wait until the system is optimised.
                              >
                              > Cheers
                              > Matt
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >
                            • Manfred Mornhinweg
                              Hi Paul, ... I feel guilty... I almost answered to that post of yours, but then didn t, because I don t think I will spend much time on the Arduino! I develop
                              Message 14 of 20 , Nov 25, 2010
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                                Hi Paul,

                                > I have always wanted to build an electronic
                                > controller, enter the Arduino. I mentioned this in my post, but,
                                > alas, not a peep or a boo or a squeak of interest. I felt really
                                > disheartened.

                                I feel guilty... I almost answered to that post of yours, but then
                                didn't, because I don't think I will spend much time on the Arduino! I
                                develop typically around three or four microprocessor-based projects per
                                year, and I like to standarize as much as possible on a given family of
                                microcontrollers. Firts it was the MCS-48 series, which was quite
                                capable for its day, and inexpensive. Then the Basic Stamp, a joy to
                                use, but limited in its capability, and expensive. Nowadays I use PICs,
                                which are really powerful and very inexpensive. So I don't see much use
                                for an Arduino, which is really a complete board rather than a single
                                chip solution!

                                It is my humble opinion that an Arduino is overkill for an ELC. A much
                                cheaper PIC will do the job better, in a more flexible way. And it is
                                also my humble opinion that connecting an ELC to the web isn't very
                                useful at all! Now if you want to do it, there are PICs with USB support
                                too, but I just wouldn't do it. I like to think of an ELC as a little
                                black box that is built, tested, commissioned, installed in its corner
                                and forgotten, so that it can do its job year after year, without
                                requiring further attention.

                                Of course, you are entitled to a more playful approach to ELCs, and it's
                                surely fun to play with web connections and the like! Just not very
                                useful, as I see it.

                                > I would be happy if maybe you might be interested to discuss your
                                > ideas further with the possibilities of using an Arduino.

                                I built a PIC-based ELC about two years ago, and since then it's
                                controlling my system. I published it on my web site too. In the future
                                I intend to develop another, more sophisticated ELC, but it will
                                certainly use a PIC too, and not an Arduino. I see no good reason to
                                move to a device that is less common, more expensive, and really has no
                                advantages for this application over the one I normally use!

                                So, I'm sorry, I can't contribute anything specific to the Arduino. For
                                that you should probably go an Arduino board! Please don't misunderstand
                                this, no harshness is meant, but I just don't think you will find many
                                people here who have experience with the Arduino. On the other hand, if
                                you want to discuss ELC stuff in a more general way, I can contribute
                                some, but ELC internal workings might be a bit to high for most people
                                in this group, even if we keep it applicable to any microcontroller!

                                > Best regards, from the other end of the Earth, Tasmania, Paul

                                We down here in Chile too claim to be at the end of the earth... Does it
                                have so many ends? ;-)

                                Manfred.

                                ========================
                                Visit my hobby homepage!
                                http://ludens.cl
                                ========================
                              • Steve Spence
                                There s a few of us here who have a lot of Arduino experience. At $10-$30 each, it s a good solution. Steve Spence Renewable energy and self sufficiency
                                Message 15 of 20 , Nov 25, 2010
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                                  There's a few of us here who have a lot of Arduino experience. At
                                  $10-$30 each, it's a good solution.

                                  Steve Spence
                                  Renewable energy and self sufficiency
                                  http://www.green-trust.org
                                  http://arduinotronics.blogspot.com/



                                  On 11/25/2010 10:23 AM, Manfred Mornhinweg wrote:
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Hi Paul,
                                  >
                                  >> I have always wanted to build an electronic
                                  >> controller, enter the Arduino. I mentioned this in my post, but,
                                  >> alas, not a peep or a boo or a squeak of interest. I felt really
                                  >> disheartened.
                                  >
                                  > I feel guilty... I almost answered to that post of yours, but then
                                  > didn't, because I don't think I will spend much time on the Arduino! I
                                  > develop typically around three or four microprocessor-based projects per
                                  > year, and I like to standarize as much as possible on a given family of
                                  > microcontrollers. Firts it was the MCS-48 series, which was quite
                                  > capable for its day, and inexpensive. Then the Basic Stamp, a joy to
                                  > use, but limited in its capability, and expensive. Nowadays I use PICs,
                                  > which are really powerful and very inexpensive. So I don't see much use
                                  > for an Arduino, which is really a complete board rather than a single
                                  > chip solution!
                                  >
                                  > It is my humble opinion that an Arduino is overkill for an ELC. A much
                                  > cheaper PIC will do the job better, in a more flexible way. And it is
                                  > also my humble opinion that connecting an ELC to the web isn't very
                                  > useful at all! Now if you want to do it, there are PICs with USB support
                                  > too, but I just wouldn't do it. I like to think of an ELC as a little
                                  > black box that is built, tested, commissioned, installed in its corner
                                  > and forgotten, so that it can do its job year after year, without
                                  > requiring further attention.
                                  >
                                  > Of course, you are entitled to a more playful approach to ELCs, and it's
                                  > surely fun to play with web connections and the like! Just not very
                                  > useful, as I see it.
                                  >
                                  >> I would be happy if maybe you might be interested to discuss your
                                  >> ideas further with the possibilities of using an Arduino.
                                  >
                                  > I built a PIC-based ELC about two years ago, and since then it's
                                  > controlling my system. I published it on my web site too. In the future
                                  > I intend to develop another, more sophisticated ELC, but it will
                                  > certainly use a PIC too, and not an Arduino. I see no good reason to
                                  > move to a device that is less common, more expensive, and really has no
                                  > advantages for this application over the one I normally use!
                                  >
                                  > So, I'm sorry, I can't contribute anything specific to the Arduino. For
                                  > that you should probably go an Arduino board! Please don't misunderstand
                                  > this, no harshness is meant, but I just don't think you will find many
                                  > people here who have experience with the Arduino. On the other hand, if
                                  > you want to discuss ELC stuff in a more general way, I can contribute
                                  > some, but ELC internal workings might be a bit to high for most people
                                  > in this group, even if we keep it applicable to any microcontroller!
                                  >
                                  >> Best regards, from the other end of the Earth, Tasmania, Paul
                                  >
                                  > We down here in Chile too claim to be at the end of the earth... Does it
                                  > have so many ends? ;-)
                                  >
                                  > Manfred.
                                  >
                                  > ========================
                                  > Visit my hobby homepage!
                                  > http://ludens.cl
                                  > ========================
                                  >
                                  >
                                • Nando
                                  Hello Matt: Your motor , 90 V dc may produce power but to maximize its output the generated voltage and watts need to be close to the battery voltage to be
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Nov 25, 2010
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                                    Hello Matt:

                                    Your motor , 90 V dc may produce power but to maximize its output the generated voltage and watts need to be close to the battery voltage to be able to obtain the peak power.

                                    With the head you have and the bank voltage this 90 V motor will produce too much voltage and You may stop the turbine if the load is to great .

                                    My recommendation for you to maximize the harvesting is to produce Vac and use a transformer to bring the voltage down to the battery voltage -- one way is to get a Variac transformer to adjust the output to the needed voltage and current -- or transformers if 3 phase ( best idea ) to charge the battery bank.

                                    You are in a path I have seen before many times that end up in failure or problems -- corrected with the proper generator/conversion scheme to optimize the battery charge.

                                    This type of arrangement I used to "repair" constantly, small hydros built without the necessary calculations , just wild guesses -- like in one case, just producing 300 watts and after I changed the generator and charging system the power went up to 2.3 KW -- Vac plus charging a 1000 ah 48 volts bank. With excess power for 3 homes.

                                    With the head you have and the 90 V motor you are going to produce a too high voltage and the turbine will be overloaded -- be careful when you start it !! You will need a high voltage converter for proper charging.


                                    Nando



                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    From: matt humphrey
                                    To: microhydro@yahoogroups.com
                                    Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2010 1:40 AM
                                    Subject: [microhydro] Re: Hello



                                    Hi Nando

                                    I typed up a long reply to your post last night but lost it somehow so here goes with another attempt ro remember the key points of what I wrote.
                                    Thank you for the questions and suggestions and I do realise that most people in this group know much more about hydro power than I can ever hope to learn.
                                    You are right about my water source being volume limited. It is a small stream about 2 feet wide which has quite a large catchment area for rain but the flow is very volatile. Sometimes there is a huge quantity of water coming down, at others the flow dries up to a useless trickle.
                                    There were many reasons that the project has developed to where it is now and I anticipate sucking of teeth at some my reasons and decisions. Motivation surrounded cost, reuse of parts I already had, simplicity, fluctuating water volume and that I already had the battery/inverter fully integrated into the house and hope to add various charging sources to it. I chose to use the Ametek 99VDC motor as my generator rather than an AC one because it had been in my workshop for many years after I bought it off ebay for a song. I had intended to build a wind turbine but the project never flew. The wind where I live is all or nothing and other factors prevented me from hoisting the motor onto a pole.
                                    Why did I choose the pelton? Again, I had been collecting parts and had the small pelton sitting there begging me to try it out. I also have a 4" plastic spooned turgo but with limited woodworking skills, when it came to making up a prototype runner box/motor and nozzle mount, it was easier (for me) to go for the pelton first. It may not be the most efficient and it is quite possible that once I have run the pelton for a while to harvest data I will focus on the turgo. I believe the Ametek 99VDC is an awesome power producer when used as a generator: once it is up to 650 rpm it produces more than 24VDC. For my prototype I built a wooden runner housing. This had 4 nozzles and I was able with 3 nozzles to get 72VDC open voltage which is way above any reference data I have for this motor. The fourth nozzle was not aligned correctly. When I clamped this onto a 24VDC battery it very quickly got up to over 30VDC and the acid was fizzing furiously. I had to shut it down. Alas I did not have a meter to measure the current but this was enough for me to decide to commit the prototype into metalwork.
                                    The nozzles I bought from Joe were selected based on the flow data he publishes and are really just so that I can get the thing assembled and running and have a baseline for my tests. I intend to buy more in various sizes later once I start to experiment.
                                    The power will come directly off the motor into the batteries via nice thick armoured cable, a diode to stop the motor running as a motor and a DC disconnect.
                                    I hope to have everything fully assembled in the next couple of months and will post up the data as I collect it.

                                    At this stage what I am building is clearly sub-optimal but once I can start collecting live data and experimenting the real fun will begin. I anticipate that the project will evolve as it goes and I fail/learn/improve.

                                    Cheers
                                    Matt

                                    --- In microhydro@yahoogroups.com, "Nando" <nando37@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Matt:
                                    >
                                    > Sink you have a small hydro driving a 90 Vdc motor can you define the setup for such hydro and how you are feeding the charge to the battery bank .
                                    >
                                    > You say you have a Pelton though say that Joe H supplied 4 nozzles -- Do please detail you hydro setup
                                    >
                                    > Why did you select a Pelton versus a Turgo turbine ?.
                                    >
                                    > Loaded RPM of the Pelton and output power ?.
                                    >
                                    > Your site head seems good for a direct Vac generator, in this case a 3 phase, as well, for easier charger set up --- Generating Vac in your case, you could use the hydro directly for most of your needs and the battery bank for heavy power needs -- the battery bank this way may last quite longer time since it is not power cycled so often.
                                    >
                                    > Systems like yours, if the battery bank is less worked could extend its life 2 to 4 fold, I have seen banks with more than 15 - 20 years still strong - since the charge/discharge is shallow keeping the bank at 100 %the great majority of time .
                                    >
                                    > Is your water source volume limited ?.
                                    >
                                    > If so multiple nozzles may be better than just 2 nozzles with the microprocessor to maintain the proper pipe pressure with water volume changes . 4 nozzles can give up to the equivalent of 15 jets size changes.
                                    >
                                    > Nando
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                    > From: matt humphrey
                                    > To: microhydro@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2010 11:29 AM
                                    > Subject: [microhydro] Hello
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Hello All
                                    >
                                    > I have just joined this group & thought I'd drop in a note about what I'm doing.
                                    > I live off-grid in NW Scotland. I have 1000 Ah 24 VDC battery with Trace PS2524 Inverter Charger. My charging sources are a community hydro generator and a Lister ST1 with Brush 3.5 KVA generator. I also have a Lister CS6/1 with 2.5KVA genrator which I am installing over the winter.
                                    >
                                    > What may interest this group is the home-brew micro hydro which I am building...
                                    >
                                    > I have stream which I have dammed giving me a 3.2 bar static head and a flow rate of about 10 litres/sec through a 120mm ID pipe about 200 metres in length.
                                    > At the business end I have a pelton runner connected to an Ametek 99VDC motor which I am shortly to bring online. This is feeding DC directly to the batteries over 50 metres of 35mm2 cable.
                                    > The battery has a Trace C40 as a diversion controller which will dump into a 24 VDC 40 Amp immersion heater.
                                    >
                                    > It's all experimental but the prototype runner box & motor housing performed well. I am still waiting for the last bits to return from the metal shop. Everything is made from stainless steel. The penstock goes into a manifold which splits the flow into 4 25mm outlets. These connect to the runner box on adjustable nozzle mounts and the rain bird nozzles themselves, which I got from Joe Hartvigsen in the US, are easily interchangeable.
                                    > The runner box mounts on a large concrete slab with a sump under which discharges back to the stream.
                                    >
                                    > For monitoring I am building a web enabled DC sensor / data recorder using an Arduino micro controller and a DC shunt.
                                    >
                                    > I have been developing this project in my spare time for about 6 months & except the metal work and wiring to be finally assembled & ready for live runs & performance tuning in about 2 months.
                                    >
                                    > I'll post up the numbers when I have them.
                                    >
                                    > I have plans to automatically open and close the nozzles depending on available water at the dam but this will wait until the system is optimised.
                                    >
                                    > Cheers
                                    > Matt
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >





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