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Heart and mind Re: Self-Improvement & Physical Practices

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  • asimpjoy
    ... **** T: Rather, it is imperative that one see directly for one s self the limits and problems associated with the identification and attachment to the
    Message 1 of 53 , Jul 5, 2003
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      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Nina"
      <murrkis@y...> wrote:

      > N: Hi, Tony,

      **** T: Hi Nina. : -)

      > N: It seems there is a tendency to
      > denigrate the affects of embodied
      > and ego-ed life, which include
      > the ability to set goals, to entertain
      > a practice (physical or otherwise),
      > to experience suffering and pain,
      > to listen to the mind.

      **** T: Rather, it is imperative that one
      see directly for one's self the limits and
      problems associated with the identification
      and attachment to the body, as well as with
      all the many physical goals that are the
      outcome of one's egotistical demands in the
      process of psychological becoming – "the me"
      always wanting to improve and become more.

      Physical pain and suffering, and well as pleasure,
      are inherent in body dynamics, but psychological
      suffering ends at the very moment that identification
      and attachment to body, and ego, with its desires, ends.

      > N: It seems there is also a parallel tendency to
      > elevate residing in the heart, letting go of action,
      > desire, and connection to the ego and body.

      **** T: The "Heart" is only a word to symbolize
      "Consciousness" that is NOT bound by the limits of
      one's ego, and therefore is NOT identified or
      attached to the body.

      Ego is nothing but thought thinking that it is a
      separate and independent entity apart form the
      thinking process itself - it is thought that identifies
      with the body, and it is thought that projects goals in
      which it can fulfill itself.
      ... But is there an Action that is not the product of
      ego, with all of its desires, and its identification
      and attachment to the body???

      > N: What I observe is that these two 'ends' are merely that,
      > ends of a spectrum, which is, perhaps, more of a cycle.
      > Permanent residence in one or the other, seems to be a sham.

      **** T: What is NOT contained in ANY "cycle", and is NEVER
      limited to a particular position on some "spectrum",
      ... And has no opposite???

      "Heart Consciousness" is never in conflict with mind or ego
      or thought, although they themselves are in perpetual conflict,
      because Heart embraces them all, without ever being "touched"
      by their incessant struggle, pain and suffering.

      > N: To say one residence is better
      > than the other, reveals an attraction to one and
      > an aversion to the other, but it also reveals the
      > particular place one happens to be on the cycle.

      **** T: It is the ending of ALL attraction and aversion
      that must be directly encountered, and THAT is not contained
      in any "cycle", nor does IT hold a particular position on
      a "spectrum" – IT is not comparative,
      ... And the sense of being a individual entity is absent.

      > N: So, if the pressures of bearing the ego and body have
      > become too oppressive, then why not remind oneself of the
      > other end of the spectrum?

      **** T: Letting go of ego, and its identification with the body,
      together with the struggle to reach some goal, requires surrender,
      and it cannot be manufactured by any manipulative intent on the
      part of thought.

      The release of oppression is in the absolute serenity of
      "Being", and the Spontaneous Action that it produces,
      ... Without having any preoccupation with the outcome.

      > N; Conversely, if the dissociations and detachments
      > commensurate with the other end have left you unable
      > to engage life, or even to admit that you are a living
      > being, capable of being differentiated, then why not
      > bend in that direction for a bit?

      **** T: Intimate engagement with Life requires "direct contact",
      without any motive whatsoever! It means the complete absence
      of any egotistical demands, or any personal agenda,
      ... Otherwise everything is merely used to promote one's own end.

      "Heart Consciousness" cannot be fabricated by the manipulations
      of thought – it requires surrender to what is actually there in
      the moment.

      > N: Somewhere, between the two, is a fine balance point,
      > where both ends may be equally appreciated. Instead of
      > 'either or', it is a case of 'both and'.

      **** T: Thought can find it's natural creative expression
      only in an ego-less personality, because then identity is
      only the means of a social identity, and thought no longer
      persists in the illusion of being an inward entity. Otherwise
      thought remains a slave of ego in the process of achieving
      some goal in order to become something more - psychologically.
      ... Action without ego has inherent Goodness, because its
      worth is in the very doing, without respect to whether or
      not it progresses one towards a predetermined goal dictated
      by the desires of the mind.

      > N: That said, my goal for today is to get my wall sections
      > drawn and start on those roof details. Hop to, girl! You
      > have a deadline! No heart until mind is finished! Right! Lol!

      **** T: Give precedence to the "Heart", and let IT control
      the mind, instead of putting the Heart on the "back burner"
      until the mind is "finished", because the mind is insatiable,
      and knows not "The Way".
      ... Then see what happens. :-)

      > Nina

      > > ************************
      > >
      > > Physical practices have
      > > a limit, as do all self-
      > > improvement programs.
      > >
      > > Controlling action with an
      > > agenda keeps one confined to
      > > a pattern, and caught in the
      > > conflict of overcoming.
      > >
      > > There is the pleasure of achievement,
      > > and the pain of failure, both which
      > > results in a preoccupation with the "I",
      > > the "self" - the "me" and the "mine".
      > >
      > > In this way I am all the time
      > > self-consciously "becoming more
      > > or becoming less", as I measure,
      > > and try to control "my progress".
      > >
      > > So the sense of an egotistical
      > > self can become more solidified
      > > each time I try to improve myself
      > > with some daily agenda, and the
      > > more I enforce it, the more I loose
      > > the freedom of spontaneity.
      > >
      > > The mind does not know the way
      > > to the "Unknown", and that is
      > > why it is so essential to FEEL
      > > the spontaneity of the "Heart",
      > > and to let it dominate - to let
      > > it have duration, so that it can
      > > overcome all the ignorance and
      > > pettiness of the mind.
      > > ... Only then can there be "Freedom".
      > >
      > > Then Heart knows "The Way", but the
      > > mind does not. The mind can only
      > > accumulate negative or positive
      > > vanity - in its sense of achievement
      > > or failure, and in the sense of an
      > > entity becoming more or less,
      > > ... Because the mind does not have
      > > the power of "Being".
      > >
      > > Love,
      > > Tony
    • texasbg2000
      ... Hi Dan: Always good to hear from you. If you decide to run for prez I will vote for you. Love Bobby G.
      Message 53 of 53 , Jul 15, 2003
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        > You're welcome, and glad for the chuckle, Bobby.
        > And yes, we must always keep in mind the
        > unrembemberable.
        > Love,
        > Dan

        Hi Dan:

        Always good to hear from you. If you decide to run for prez I will
        vote for you.

        Bobby G.
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