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Re: [Meditation Society of America] The eluding.....

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  • Jason Fishman
    Nice post, very scientific :) Heres an expansion... Since it seems one is seeing themselves as exsitent beings apart this all makes great sense. Dust to dust.
    Message 1 of 3 , Jun 28, 2003
      Nice post, very scientific :) Heres an expansion...

      Since it seems one is seeing themselves as exsitent
      beings apart this all makes great sense. Dust to dust.
      Without a begining or ending. Unfortuantly, things get
      a start and stop along the way through eternity, such
      as birth and death, inhale and exhale, etc. and of
      course there is a being that is born and dies, breaths
      in and out, as was as stars that expand until collapse
      etc.

      In a sense, nothing gets a start, therefore a finish
      is uneccesary. Much like building, one can add onto,
      by taking away from until the model itself becomes
      totality. This is the pepetuation of all existence,
      for the least as 3-dimensions are, as if. This is the
      expansion that contracts and not one single seperate
      anything can be away from. Nothing is added nor
      removed. All hoopla, as is :)

      The meaning behind all this perpetuation is expansion
      into union. Regardless if one can veiw from a single
      point, or infinite points. Whether one describes
      non-exsitence as is or beings that exsist as ego
      identities. What was will be again, what is was at one
      point, as is.

      The model of the ego is itself the model of totality
      adding to and taking from until the ego is itself
      totality, where no contradition remains anywhere. By
      growing a population of beings, there is removal of
      raw material in order to maintain. This expansion as
      it appears, equally so is a removal, until nothing is
      apart. Neutron to Neutron, as is.

      Great peace dearest Sandeep. Wonderfully thought out
      post.

      Peace and Love


      --- Sandeep Chatterjee <sandeepc@...>
      wrote:
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Let's assume your name is Ravi and let us see
      > whether an apperception of what is the case is
      > possible.
      >
      > For that a good place to start is at the beginning,
      > isn't it?
      >
      > It's a different matter that there is no beginning,
      > but let's take for the moment, the beginning of Ravi
      > to be,.. when a sperm raced to engage in a hip-hop
      > with a coy ovum, .....succeeded .......and hey
      > presto a unique DNA-gene template was formed.
      >
      > That unique DNA-gene template, was a the end-result
      > of the genetic contributions coming from both the
      > sperm and the ovum and since the sperm and ovum
      > themselves are the culmination of another hip-hop,
      > at another point of time and that of another further
      > back in time,......
      >
      > ..........I trust you can see that the body-mind
      > complex, the psycho-somatic 3 D object, reading this
      > post on his PC screen,.......
      >
      > ........is a culmination of eternity itself,
      > .........expressed as "so".
      >
      >
      > Now this gene-template which was formed, just like a
      > particular "wave" appears to be formed out of the
      > Ocean (appears, not real),...........
      >
      > ...this gene-template, through a mysterious
      > intelligence of it's own, of such mind-boggling
      > proportions, (can you imagine the unimaginable
      > complexity that is involved in making your nose to
      > that precise shape it is, or the color of your eyes,
      > or in the manufacture of that lovely shaped kidneys
      > inside you, or to run the neurological system which
      > allows you to read this post and maybe make some
      > sense) ........
      >
      > ............through that mysterious Grace, the
      > gene-template reaches fruitation and screaming,
      > yelling it's spewed out.
      >
      > The Big-Bang, in it's miniature form.
      >
      > The gene-template, continues to grow
      > psycho-somatically.
      >
      > And during this nurturance stage, the gene-template
      > continues to be impacted by conditioning-inputs from
      > the external environ, which shape it, alter it,
      > amend it, evolve it.
      >
      > What are these impacting inputs?
      >
      > Parental dictates from their own conditioning,
      > ........prevailing environ in the home, ...
      >
      > ......experiences both in home and outside, both the
      > "good" ones and the "horrible" ones, .....
      >
      > .....education or lack of one, .....
      >
      > ....social/religious/spiritual/communal/nation ethos
      > which was prevailing in the immediate environ in
      > which the nurturing was taking place, ......
      >
      > ....influences by media, friends, accepted icons of
      > authority/trust,..........etc etc etc.
      >
      > Each and every one impacts that gene-template, even
      > now continues to, to form what is the prevailing,
      > intrinsic innate conditioning-in-the-moment.
      >
      > Now this conditioning-in-the-moment is not something
      > which is etched in stone, sometime in some Dark
      > Ages.
      >
      > The arriving input, alters the existing conditioning
      > AND the fashioned response once again alters the
      > conditioning, in the very process itself.
      >
      > (You would have definitely had moments, when moved
      > by the situation, something got done through Ravi,
      > which he would have never dreamed to be ever doing
      > in the past)
      >
      > It's like a dynamic loop.
      >
      > A Yin-Yang dance.
      >
      > That is why the term conditioning-in-the-moment, and
      > not conditioning which connotes something static
      > etchings in Dark Ages stone.
      >
      >
      >
      > Which is what "runs" the psycho-somatic object.
      >
      > By "runs it", I don't mean the biological functions
      > which carry on quite irrespective of "you", but
      > really the way Ravi views the world, how he creates
      > a mental image of the input that arrives from the
      > world (i.e. an E mail, or a sexual assault),
      > .........and how a response arises TO that
      > self-created image of that input.
      >
      > Remember Ravi's response is never to the external
      > input per se, but to Ravi's created image of that
      > input, both the creating and the responding,
      > "fashioned" by the conditioning-in-the-moment.
      >
      > BOTH.
      >
      > Now, we have been using this convention of a "Ravi",
      > creating an image, responding etc etc, as if there
      > is an independent self, apart from the body-mind
      > complex.
      >
      > There is nothing like "Ravi" in the psycho-somatic
      > apparatus know by society as "Ravi".
      >
      > Just a notion, which feels so real, so real, that it
      > has "real" problems, "real" issues, ........it
      > suffers, grieves, gets angry, screams at the
      > injustice of "his" Life.
      >
      > It is completely hilarious, but till the hilarity
      > has bubbled up, ..........it's like a continuous
      > sinking in deep shit.
      >
      > So how does this notion appear to come about?
      >
      > What you see around are conditioned responsive
      > psycho-somatic objects, whether they are labeled "an
      > interesting rock-piece", ..........."the Petunia
      > Rose", ..........or an " orange assed orangutan"
      > .......or a "human".
      >
      > Psycho-somatic objects with varying attributes.
      >
      > The real attribute which vary among all the species
      > is the attribute of sentience, which is the ability
      > to cognize an "other" separate to yourself and
      > create a mental image of that "other",..... to be
      > then responded to.
      >
      > In the objects labeled "humans" sentience is at the
      > relative maximum.
      >
      > With that relatively maximum sentience, the human
      > object, has further embedded flavours, which is the
      > intellect, i.e. the ability to discriminate between
      > all the cognized "others".
      >
      > The discrimination of sentience itself which is also
      > present to a limited extent in an animal, which can
      > discriminate between a "friendly/safe" other and an
      > "other" which poses danger/threat.
      >
      > In the cognition of the other, and in the
      > discrimination inter-alia all these "others", is
      > born the sense of the cognizer-self.
      >
      > The subject which observes it's objects of
      > cognition.
      >
      > Thus is the sense of the individual self, which is
      > nothing but an identification with a particular
      > biological body-mind object as a separated object
      > from all other objects.......
      >
      > AND
      >
      > .......the identification to the name which that
      > particular biological body-mind object carries.
      >
      > (You Ravi do not feed your sister's body-mind
      > apparatus, when you note hunger pangs in "your"
      > apparatus, do you?.........When her boyfriend calls
      > for her by her name, you dont' respond, do you?)
      >
      >
      > This self, or this identification does not come at
      > birth, but some time in the first 3 years.
      >
      > Notice an infant, falling down, will cry "It hurts",
      > not "I am hurt".
      >
      > The sense of the self, has not yet appeared.
      >
      > Now in this sense of the separated individual self,
      > arrives another flavour, the sense of personal
      > doership.
      >
      === message truncated ===


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