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Re: Any relevance here? Dan

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  • G
    ... judirhodes
    Message 1 of 72 , Apr 1, 2003
      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff
      Belyea" <jeff@s...> wrote:
      > Dan -
      > I'm assuming that you were not opposed
      > to having this posted and I therefore
      > consider if appropriate to respond to
      > your comments, on this site...
      > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
      "judirhodes" <
      > judirhodes@z...> wrote:
      > > No, does this have any relevance - a repost from the ranch
      list -
      > > from Dan -
      > >
      > >
      > > Not to mention the happy meditators who
      > > have to make sure you understand how realized and in
      > > they are, how deep from the silence they are
      > > speaking, how really truly real is their realization --
      > > Just so you know that it's just like Ramana said,
      > > and how amazing it is to realize that it's
      > > just like he said -- and if you don't get that,
      > > you are going to get the subtle love darts
      > > intended to bring you down some notches -- every time.
      > What you see as ego-centered peacocking,
      > happy meditators see as offering of a lively hope,
      > and our purpose is to serve as witnesses to the
      > beautiful truth that the past and present awakened,
      > enlightened and realized teachers offer, as
      > encouragement to those "on the road".
      > The "love darts" are provoked by the
      > attributions that you, Judi and Jason post about
      > many of us happy meditators: accusations of fraud,
      > delusion, deceit and the litany of negativity
      > that comes from little or no direct contact with
      > those at whom you fire your own darts.
      > It seems to me that you have no understanding of what
      > motivates a happy meditator. The return darts are
      > intended to counter false accusations and attributions
      > that seem to me to be attempts to undermine the
      > veracity and purpose of the happy meditators' offering,
      > and which potentially discourage those who seek
      > to find ways past the stress and discouragement
      > in their lives. Happy meditators offer reports
      > of rewards they found on the road they traveled.
      > And that is what we defend.
      > >
      > > Confronting people about self-satisfaction and
      > > smug bullshit is a losing proposition -- they
      > > will keep on with what keeps them feeling good
      > > about themselves, and stick it to ya in return --
      > > every time.
      > What you see as self-satisfaction and smug bullshit,
      > happy meditators see as gratitude and an eagerness
      > to share the bounty of the treasure they have found
      > with all who ask about it.
      > >
      > > It's remarkable how the same ploy gets played again
      > > and again and again ...
      > >
      > > That's all selves are is these ploys, so that's the last thing
      > > anyone is going to look into.
      > >
      > > The spiritual ploys somehow seem the worst of all, as
      > > bad as all the other ploys can be. There is something
      > > particularly nasty, vicious, and self-serving about
      > > the spiritualized self-ploys. I think it's because
      > > all the knives have to be covered up with lots
      > > of gooey love and wisdom.
      > What you see as nasty, vicious and self-serving, happy
      > meditators see as selfness, loving, kind and caring service
      > to other people. Love and wisdom are not derisive or
      threatening terms
      > to happy meditators.
      > >
      > > A favorite seems to be:
      > > It's fine with me to lose my self as long as I can
      > > tell everyone how deep from silence I'm speaking, or
      > > the amazing love bliss I now have, and we get
      > > to smugly congratulate and reinforce one another --
      > > and so on.
      > What you see as self-aggrandizement, happy meditators
      > see as witnessing to the reality of a way of escape from
      > stress and confusion, which they speak to from experiential
      > knowledge. What you see as smug congratulations, happy
      > meditators see as positive and faith-building affirmations.
      > The view is toward those seeking a way out. To tell them
      > they are already out leaves the vast majority in despair
      > when what they hear from the advaita view is "this is all
      > there is, live with it." Happy meditators offer real world
      > efforts that precede grace.
      > > But to look into that "act" and see that it's just
      > > another version of self -- that would be to suffer
      > > a real loss ...
      > >
      > > And that's the last thing any of these self-proclaimed
      > > realizers living in contentment and bliss want ...
      > >
      > > The claim of a loss that made me a special realizer
      > > living deep in silent bliss love
      > > is so much easier to deal with,
      > > and then I get to keep the suffering and call
      > > it blissful silence ... what could be better?
      > What you see as us happy meditators feeling like we
      > are "special realizers", is us happy meditators
      > jumping for joy for us anything-but-special people
      > having received a beautiful gift that ends the
      > suffering - mountains of suffering made into mole
      > hills, dust in the wind.
      > Suffering succotash! Is that all you eat? Don't you
      > ever have a gooey dessert and get past all your
      > suffering?
      > All the love,
      > Jeff

      G: one more additional comment to Jeff's clarity..... you see we
      do not think that we are higher - more special - elite... we Know
      that what we are is most ordinary ... we have gone past all the
      games.... and where we are everyone can be.... behind all of
      the shadows and clouds of ignorance (which parade through
      mental dramas and judgement) , remains the light of Pure
      Being which is everyones birthright.....

      now don't take parts of this former paragraph and twist it to
      once again attempt to say "see there you go saying your special
      and different again.."
      no it is not that .... the fact that some continue to see it in that
      light simply shows where their attention and hang-ups are .....
      we Share what we have out of Gratitude and Love ..... Knowing
      there is a way out of the madness - suffering - and mental
      gymnastics of attempting to secure a place in the world.....

      this is why when others attack in spiteful ways we don't simply
      run away.... i used to run ... i used to hide.... i used to seek all
      the needy support or rail against the establishment...
      guess what ? that is all over.... neither do i buckle under the
      school yard bullies that simply now put on a different cloak ....
      bullies are bullies , cons are cons , intellectuals are
      intellectuals , heartfelt is heartfelt , giving without seeking
      anything in return is called compassion and love....

      why must everyone have some hidden agenda ? is it not rather
      the one that is pointing in that direction and judging it so may be
      simply is seeing what is within their own lives.... ?

      perhaps some give simply as a spontaneous part of living ....
      no agendas - no hidden motives - no needs or wants to be
      propped up ..... maybe the ordinary is so extraordinary that
      simply giving through the joy of living is misconstrued as
      something other than what it is ..... a celebration of Wholeness
      that is Love ... and Love by nature extends itself not seeking
      anything than others well being and happiness....

      shanti om
    • devianandi
      ... i ... those ... and ... sourse...and ... solid ... stone ... further ... and ... yes, thank you very much for your compliments,it s niice when a window of
      Message 72 of 72 , Apr 2, 2003
        --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "freyjartist"
        <freyjartist@a...> wrote:
        > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Poole"
        > <gene_poole@q...> wrote:
        > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, devianandi
        > <no_reply@y...> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > what's wrong with being devious?
        > > >
        > > > it's just another activity of god, which is the only one here --

        > > > remember?
        > > >
        > > > no, i forgot but thanks for reminding me that in the beginning
        > > > alone existed i was perfect and tranquil and then something
        > stirred
        > > > and i divided into two, then those two divided into two and
        > > > into two and into two and into two untill there were millions
        > > > trillions of particles of my sparkly light god energies
        > everywhere
        > > > moving further and further away from my center, the
        > down
        > > > down down went all those particles of God energies until a
        > > > point was reached and that particle of God energy became a
        > and
        > > > the material universes were formed and since there was no
        > > > down to go those particles of god started to go back up up up
        > > > after millions and trillions of divirse forms of existence your
        > > > almost home, to your sourse, which is me
        > >
        > > Cool!
        > >
        > >
        > > ==GP==
        > Yes! Way cool!

        > F
        yes, thank you very much for your compliments,it's niice when a
        window of opportunity opens up and i get to goof around, you know
        evrytime i say something negative or hurtful it causes me pain..

        baba hari dass tells me to love God and love myself and i will see
        love everywhere...when i do this love god and love myself it really
        happens, i see love everywhere,,,but when i forget god and forget
        myself and look at negativity it's like that stone that catches all
        the mossss rolling down the hill,,,
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