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Mind Chatter

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  • texasbg2000
    There have been some posts on the distractions of mind chatter. It is possible that it is a sign of the right direction. It would probably not be noticed if
    Message 1 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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      There have been some posts on the distractions of mind chatter. It
      is possible that it is a sign of the right direction. It would
      probably not be noticed if the meditation were not working.

      I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain of thoughts, one
      leading to another with no recognition that it is mind chatter.

      It could be that the meditator is not letting go of the technique and
      entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads to a distraction
      because of the attachment to the methodology of the meditation. The
      pull of the attachment to thouights concerning meditation overcomes
      the advance toward the meditative state.

      Letting go completely and ignoring the mind chatter as an obstacle
      and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a help.

      Love
      Bobby G.
    • G
      ... chatter. It ... one ... and ... meditation. The ... overcomes ... obstacle ... G: good points.... yes some get so caught up in wanting to still it
      Message 2 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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        --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
        "texasbg2000" <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
        > There have been some posts on the distractions of mind
        chatter. It
        > is possible that it is a sign of the right direction. It would
        > probably not be noticed if the meditation were not working.
        >
        > I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain of thoughts,
        one
        > leading to another with no recognition that it is mind chatter.
        >
        > It could be that the meditator is not letting go of the technique
        and
        > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads to a distraction
        > because of the attachment to the methodology of the
        meditation. The
        > pull of the attachment to thouights concerning meditation
        overcomes
        > the advance toward the meditative state.
        >
        > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind chatter as an
        obstacle
        > and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a help.
        >
        > Love
        > Bobby G.

        G: good points.... yes some get so caught up in wanting to still
        it that they only succeed in creating more.... this path must be
        one of totally relaxed awareness rather than trying to hard and it
        becoming an effort in watching .... become aware of what is
        here and Now present ... not the rambling thoughts which are
        either past or future in nature.... being totally present is a help
        ....

        shanti om
      • Jeff Belyea
        ... Hi Bobby G - Yes, I think you ve articulated the value of meditation very well. Love, Jeff
        Message 3 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "texasbg2000"
          <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
          > There have been some posts on the distractions of mind chatter. It
          > is possible that it is a sign of the right direction. It would
          > probably not be noticed if the meditation were not working.
          >
          > I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain of thoughts, one
          > leading to another with no recognition that it is mind chatter.
          >
          > It could be that the meditator is not letting go of the technique and
          > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads to a distraction
          > because of the attachment to the methodology of the meditation. The
          > pull of the attachment to thouights concerning meditation overcomes
          > the advance toward the meditative state.
          >
          > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind chatter as an obstacle
          > and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a help.
          >
          > Love
          > Bobby G.

          Hi Bobby G -

          Yes, I think you've
          articulated the value
          of meditation very well.

          Love,

          Jeff
        • Jason Fishman
          ... Interesting to note Bobby, is during total concentration, their is no awareness of idle words flowing through the mind. In doing a something is a
          Message 4 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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            --- texasbg2000 <Bigbobgraham@...> wrote:
            > There have been some posts on the distractions of
            > mind chatter. It
            > is possible that it is a sign of the right
            > direction. It would
            > probably not be noticed if the meditation were not
            > working.
            >
            > I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain of
            > thoughts, one
            > leading to another with no recognition that it is
            > mind chatter.
            >
            > It could be that the meditator is not letting go of
            > the technique and
            > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads to a
            > distraction
            > because of the attachment to the methodology of the
            > meditation. The
            > pull of the attachment to thouights concerning
            > meditation overcomes
            > the advance toward the meditative state.
            >
            > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind chatter
            > as an obstacle
            > and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a
            > help.
            >
            > Love
            > Bobby G.
            >

            Interesting to note Bobby, is during total
            concentration, their is no awareness of idle words
            flowing through the mind. In doing a something is a
            meditation (if one defines meditation as stilling the
            mind). We are really never not meditating (stilling)
            unless we are thinking of a fox :)

            Thanks Bobby,
            Peace and Love


            __________________________________________________
            Do you Yahoo!?
            Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
            http://platinum.yahoo.com
          • Jeff Belyea
            ... This is not for discussion, Jason. We have ended that phase. But I just put points up on the board for you. Nice pick up from Ray Sender. You may be more
            Message 5 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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              --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Jason Fishman
              <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
              >
              > --- texasbg2000 <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
              > > There have been some posts on the distractions of
              > > mind chatter. It
              > > is possible that it is a sign of the right
              > > direction. It would
              > > probably not be noticed if the meditation were not
              > > working.
              > >
              > > I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain of
              > > thoughts, one
              > > leading to another with no recognition that it is
              > > mind chatter.
              > >
              > > It could be that the meditator is not letting go of
              > > the technique and
              > > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads to a
              > > distraction
              > > because of the attachment to the methodology of the
              > > meditation. The
              > > pull of the attachment to thouights concerning
              > > meditation overcomes
              > > the advance toward the meditative state.
              > >
              > > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind chatter
              > > as an obstacle
              > > and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a
              > > help.
              > >
              > > Love
              > > Bobby G.
              > >
              >
              > Interesting to note Bobby, is during total
              > concentration, their is no awareness of idle words
              > flowing through the mind. In doing a something is a
              > meditation (if one defines meditation as stilling the
              > mind). We are really never not meditating (stilling)
              > unless we are thinking of a fox :)
              >
              > Thanks Bobby,
              > Peace and Love
              >
              >

              This is not for discussion, Jason. We have ended
              that phase. But I just put points up on the board
              for you. Nice pick up from Ray Sender. You may be
              more clever than you allow some to see.

              All the love,

              Jeff
            • Jason Fishman
              ... Certainly, this is always open for discussion as any topic is open for discussion. Where have you ended? Where did you begin? Is this discussion something
              Message 6 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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                --- Jeff Belyea <jeff@...> wrote:
                > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
                > Jason Fishman
                > <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
                > >
                > > --- texasbg2000 <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
                > > > There have been some posts on the distractions
                > of
                > > > mind chatter. It
                > > > is possible that it is a sign of the right
                > > > direction. It would
                > > > probably not be noticed if the meditation were
                > not
                > > > working.
                > > >
                > > > I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain
                > of
                > > > thoughts, one
                > > > leading to another with no recognition that it
                > is
                > > > mind chatter.
                > > >
                > > > It could be that the meditator is not letting go
                > of
                > > > the technique and
                > > > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads
                > to a
                > > > distraction
                > > > because of the attachment to the methodology of
                > the
                > > > meditation. The
                > > > pull of the attachment to thouights concerning
                > > > meditation overcomes
                > > > the advance toward the meditative state.
                > > >
                > > > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind
                > chatter
                > > > as an obstacle
                > > > and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a
                > > > help.
                > > >
                > > > Love
                > > > Bobby G.
                > > >
                > >
                > > Interesting to note Bobby, is during total
                > > concentration, their is no awareness of idle words
                > > flowing through the mind. In doing a something is
                > a
                > > meditation (if one defines meditation as stilling
                > the
                > > mind). We are really never not meditating
                > (stilling)
                > > unless we are thinking of a fox :)
                > >
                > > Thanks Bobby,
                > > Peace and Love
                > >
                > >
                >
                > This is not for discussion, Jason. We have ended
                > that phase. But I just put points up on the board
                > for you. Nice pick up from Ray Sender. You may be
                > more clever than you allow some to see.
                >
                > All the love,
                >
                > Jeff

                Certainly, this is always open for discussion as any
                topic is open for discussion. Where have you ended?
                Where did you begin? Is this discussion something you
                no longer deem worthy? I deem you no longer worthy of
                discussing. Will this change you from not discussing?

                Cleverness is a fox not in a box. A fox not in a box
                loves points!

                Peace and Love, Jeff


                __________________________________________________
                Do you Yahoo!?
                Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
                http://platinum.yahoo.com
              • texasbg2000
                ... One additional thought. the word thought is given to one phrase or a group of phrases. The first thought in a grouping is called a thought, and the
                Message 7 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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                  --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Jason Fishman
                  <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
                  >
                  > --- texasbg2000 <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
                  > > There have been some posts on the distractions of
                  > > mind chatter. It
                  > > is possible that it is a sign of the right
                  > > direction. It would
                  > > probably not be noticed if the meditation were not
                  > > working.
                  > >
                  > > I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain of
                  > > thoughts, one
                  > > leading to another with no recognition that it is
                  > > mind chatter.
                  > >
                  > > It could be that the meditator is not letting go of
                  > > the technique and
                  > > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads to a
                  > > distraction
                  > > because of the attachment to the methodology of the
                  > > meditation. The
                  > > pull of the attachment to thouights concerning
                  > > meditation overcomes
                  > > the advance toward the meditative state.
                  > >
                  > > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind chatter
                  > > as an obstacle
                  > > and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a
                  > > help.
                  > >
                  > > Love
                  > > Bobby G.
                  > >
                  >
                  > Interesting to note Bobby, is during total
                  > concentration, their is no awareness of idle words
                  > flowing through the mind. In doing a something is a
                  > meditation (if one defines meditation as stilling the
                  > mind). We are really never not meditating (stilling)
                  > unless we are thinking of a fox :)
                  >
                  > Thanks Bobby,
                  > Peace and Love
                  >


                  One additional thought. the word 'thought' is given to one phrase or
                  a group of phrases. The first thought in a grouping is called a
                  thought, and the entire grouping is called a thought. If I say I had
                  a thought and then proceed to talk for an hour I have used many
                  thoughts to describe my thought.

                  The description of the larger thought is what is eliminated in
                  meditation. It is seen as arising but there is no attachment to it so
                  it fades. The flow of the meditative state is not broken.

                  My point here that the technique of meditation may be the last
                  attachment one has to learn to give up. Not get caught up in a chain
                  of thoughts about meditation itself.

                  Love
                  Bobby G.
                • dan330033
                  ... or ... had ... so ... chain ... Makes sense, Bobby G. Meditation is letting go, including the dropping away of letting go. If I m aware that I m letting
                  Message 8 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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                    --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "texasbg2000"
                    <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
                    > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Jason Fishman
                    > <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > --- texasbg2000 <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
                    > > > There have been some posts on the distractions of
                    > > > mind chatter. It
                    > > > is possible that it is a sign of the right
                    > > > direction. It would
                    > > > probably not be noticed if the meditation were not
                    > > > working.
                    > > >
                    > > > I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain of
                    > > > thoughts, one
                    > > > leading to another with no recognition that it is
                    > > > mind chatter.
                    > > >
                    > > > It could be that the meditator is not letting go of
                    > > > the technique and
                    > > > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads to a
                    > > > distraction
                    > > > because of the attachment to the methodology of the
                    > > > meditation. The
                    > > > pull of the attachment to thouights concerning
                    > > > meditation overcomes
                    > > > the advance toward the meditative state.
                    > > >
                    > > > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind chatter
                    > > > as an obstacle
                    > > > and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a
                    > > > help.
                    > > >
                    > > > Love
                    > > > Bobby G.
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > Interesting to note Bobby, is during total
                    > > concentration, their is no awareness of idle words
                    > > flowing through the mind. In doing a something is a
                    > > meditation (if one defines meditation as stilling the
                    > > mind). We are really never not meditating (stilling)
                    > > unless we are thinking of a fox :)
                    > >
                    > > Thanks Bobby,
                    > > Peace and Love
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    > One additional thought. the word 'thought' is given to one phrase
                    or
                    > a group of phrases. The first thought in a grouping is called a
                    > thought, and the entire grouping is called a thought. If I say I
                    had
                    > a thought and then proceed to talk for an hour I have used many
                    > thoughts to describe my thought.
                    >
                    > The description of the larger thought is what is eliminated in
                    > meditation. It is seen as arising but there is no attachment to it
                    so
                    > it fades. The flow of the meditative state is not broken.
                    >
                    > My point here that the technique of meditation may be the last
                    > attachment one has to learn to give up. Not get caught up in a
                    chain
                    > of thoughts about meditation itself.
                    >
                    > Love
                    > Bobby G.

                    Makes sense, Bobby G.

                    Meditation is letting go, including
                    the dropping away of "letting go."

                    If I'm aware that I'm letting go,
                    then I'm holding whatever is
                    required to assure myself
                    that I'm letting go.

                    If I know that I'm meditating well,
                    then I'm holding whatever needs
                    to be kept to know what meditation
                    is like when it's good, and what
                    it is like when it's not good,
                    and what it is like when it isn't
                    happening.

                    Meditation as "breaking through"
                    which is "opening" without
                    criteria as to how or what or whom,
                    means that criteria about meditation are
                    no better than any other criteria
                    at this "point of dropping away" ...

                    -- Dan
                  • texasbg2000
                    ... phrase ... it ... I think that is correct. With the meditative state, what is called dhyana or meditative absorption, the technique is effortless. One
                    Message 9 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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                      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "dan330033"
                      <dan330033@y...> wrote:
                      > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "texasbg2000"
                      > <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
                      > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Jason Fishman
                      > > <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > --- texasbg2000 <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
                      > > > > There have been some posts on the distractions of
                      > > > > mind chatter. It
                      > > > > is possible that it is a sign of the right
                      > > > > direction. It would
                      > > > > probably not be noticed if the meditation were not
                      > > > > working.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > I am distracted when I get caught up in a chain of
                      > > > > thoughts, one
                      > > > > leading to another with no recognition that it is
                      > > > > mind chatter.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > It could be that the meditator is not letting go of
                      > > > > the technique and
                      > > > > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter leads to a
                      > > > > distraction
                      > > > > because of the attachment to the methodology of the
                      > > > > meditation. The
                      > > > > pull of the attachment to thouights concerning
                      > > > > meditation overcomes
                      > > > > the advance toward the meditative state.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind chatter
                      > > > > as an obstacle
                      > > > > and recognizing it only as a signpost might be a
                      > > > > help.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Love
                      > > > > Bobby G.
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > Interesting to note Bobby, is during total
                      > > > concentration, their is no awareness of idle words
                      > > > flowing through the mind. In doing a something is a
                      > > > meditation (if one defines meditation as stilling the
                      > > > mind). We are really never not meditating (stilling)
                      > > > unless we are thinking of a fox :)
                      > > >
                      > > > Thanks Bobby,
                      > > > Peace and Love
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > One additional thought. the word 'thought' is given to one
                      phrase
                      > or
                      > > a group of phrases. The first thought in a grouping is called a
                      > > thought, and the entire grouping is called a thought. If I say I
                      > had
                      > > a thought and then proceed to talk for an hour I have used many
                      > > thoughts to describe my thought.
                      > >
                      > > The description of the larger thought is what is eliminated in
                      > > meditation. It is seen as arising but there is no attachment to
                      it
                      > so
                      > > it fades. The flow of the meditative state is not broken.
                      > >
                      > > My point here that the technique of meditation may be the last
                      > > attachment one has to learn to give up. Not get caught up in a
                      > chain
                      > > of thoughts about meditation itself.
                      > >
                      > > Love
                      > > Bobby G.

                      Hi Dan:

                      >
                      > Makes sense, Bobby G.
                      >
                      > Meditation is letting go, including
                      > the dropping away of "letting go."
                      >
                      > If I'm aware that I'm letting go,
                      > then I'm holding whatever is
                      > required to assure myself
                      > that I'm letting go.
                      >
                      > If I know that I'm meditating well,
                      > then I'm holding whatever needs
                      > to be kept to know what meditation
                      > is like when it's good, and what
                      > it is like when it's not good,
                      > and what it is like when it isn't
                      > happening.
                      >
                      > Meditation as "breaking through"
                      > which is "opening" without
                      > criteria as to how or what or whom,
                      > means that criteria about meditation are
                      > no better than any other criteria
                      > at this "point of dropping away" ...

                      I think that is correct. With the meditative state, what is called
                      dhyana or meditative absorption, the technique is effortless. One
                      recites without volition or breathes rhythmically automatically.

                      I feared this for many years so I have compassion for anyone facing
                      the unknown of letting go.

                      I found out that knowing is loving. They feel the same to me.

                      Bobby G.

                      >
                      > -- Dan
                    • devianandi
                      people who are close to getting realized today are very lucky because there are so many men and woman out there who are making claims that they ve had that
                      Message 10 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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                        people who are close to getting realized
                        today are very lucky because there are
                        so many men and woman out there who are
                        making claims that they've had that
                        highest accomplishment,
                        and they are still living and proving
                        how wonderful that realization is..
                        when i started on my path,
                        there were very very few making those kinds of claims,
                        especially in america and the west,
                        it was the *Indians* that had that market cornered.
                        i really thought that i had to die,
                        i mean literally die, to get enlightenend,
                        that was my biggest fear..
                        i was really surprised to find that that was a falacy..
                      • Jason Fishman
                        ... Knowing you can love without a return on investment and now the seed of peace and understanding takes root. May it flourish. Peace and Love
                        Message 11 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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                          --- texasbg2000 <Bigbobgraham@...> wrote:
                          > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
                          > "dan330033"
                          > <dan330033@y...> wrote:
                          > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
                          > "texasbg2000"
                          > > <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
                          > > > --- In
                          > meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Jason
                          > Fishman
                          > > > <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > > --- texasbg2000 <Bigbobgraham@a...> wrote:
                          > > > > > There have been some posts on the
                          > distractions of
                          > > > > > mind chatter. It
                          > > > > > is possible that it is a sign of the right
                          > > > > > direction. It would
                          > > > > > probably not be noticed if the meditation
                          > were not
                          > > > > > working.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > I am distracted when I get caught up in a
                          > chain of
                          > > > > > thoughts, one
                          > > > > > leading to another with no recognition that
                          > it is
                          > > > > > mind chatter.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > It could be that the meditator is not
                          > letting go of
                          > > > > > the technique and
                          > > > > > entering the flow. That is, mind chatter
                          > leads to a
                          > > > > > distraction
                          > > > > > because of the attachment to the methodology
                          > of the
                          > > > > > meditation. The
                          > > > > > pull of the attachment to thouights
                          > concerning
                          > > > > > meditation overcomes
                          > > > > > the advance toward the meditative state.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Letting go completely and ignoring the mind
                          > chatter
                          > > > > > as an obstacle
                          > > > > > and recognizing it only as a signpost might
                          > be a
                          > > > > > help.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Love
                          > > > > > Bobby G.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Interesting to note Bobby, is during total
                          > > > > concentration, their is no awareness of idle
                          > words
                          > > > > flowing through the mind. In doing a something
                          > is a
                          > > > > meditation (if one defines meditation as
                          > stilling the
                          > > > > mind). We are really never not meditating
                          > (stilling)
                          > > > > unless we are thinking of a fox :)
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Thanks Bobby,
                          > > > > Peace and Love
                          > > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > One additional thought. the word 'thought' is
                          > given to one
                          > phrase
                          > > or
                          > > > a group of phrases. The first thought in a
                          > grouping is called a
                          > > > thought, and the entire grouping is called a
                          > thought. If I say I
                          > > had
                          > > > a thought and then proceed to talk for an hour I
                          > have used many
                          > > > thoughts to describe my thought.
                          > > >
                          > > > The description of the larger thought is what is
                          > eliminated in
                          > > > meditation. It is seen as arising but there is
                          > no attachment to
                          > it
                          > > so
                          > > > it fades. The flow of the meditative state is
                          > not broken.
                          > > >
                          > > > My point here that the technique of meditation
                          > may be the last
                          > > > attachment one has to learn to give up. Not get
                          > caught up in a
                          > > chain
                          > > > of thoughts about meditation itself.
                          > > >
                          > > > Love
                          > > > Bobby G.
                          >
                          > Hi Dan:
                          >
                          > >
                          > > Makes sense, Bobby G.
                          > >
                          > > Meditation is letting go, including
                          > > the dropping away of "letting go."
                          > >
                          > > If I'm aware that I'm letting go,
                          > > then I'm holding whatever is
                          > > required to assure myself
                          > > that I'm letting go.
                          > >
                          > > If I know that I'm meditating well,
                          > > then I'm holding whatever needs
                          > > to be kept to know what meditation
                          > > is like when it's good, and what
                          > > it is like when it's not good,
                          > > and what it is like when it isn't
                          > > happening.
                          > >
                          > > Meditation as "breaking through"
                          > > which is "opening" without
                          > > criteria as to how or what or whom,
                          > > means that criteria about meditation are
                          > > no better than any other criteria
                          > > at this "point of dropping away" ...
                          >
                          > I think that is correct. With the meditative state,
                          > what is called
                          > dhyana or meditative absorption, the technique is
                          > effortless. One
                          > recites without volition or breathes rhythmically
                          > automatically.
                          >
                          > I feared this for many years so I have compassion
                          > for anyone facing
                          > the unknown of letting go.
                          >
                          > I found out that knowing is loving. They feel the
                          > same to me.
                          >
                          > Bobby G.

                          Knowing you can love without a return on investment
                          and now the seed of peace and understanding takes
                          root. May it flourish.

                          Peace and Love

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                        • texasbg2000
                          ... Amen brother Jason. Love Bobby G.
                          Message 12 of 12 , Mar 29, 2003
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                            > Knowing you can love without a return on investment
                            > and now the seed of peace and understanding takes
                            > root. May it flourish.
                            >
                            > Peace and Love
                            >

                            Amen brother Jason.

                            Love
                            Bobby G.
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