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Re: [Meditation Society of America] Re: #1 Life practice -Bob

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  • Jason Fishman
    Very good Bob, I haven t dropped out of existance just this moment, but you d better hurry, you never know which moment you will realize fully that you don t
    Message 1 of 28 , Mar 1, 2003
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      Very good Bob, I haven't dropped out of existance just
      this moment, but you'd better hurry, you never know
      which moment you will realize fully that you don't
      exist!

      Look forward to the new addition, How does one get an
      inner traveler, BTW? I'm sure it was mentioned before,
      yet it has seemed to have slipped my existing memory!

      Peace and Love

      --- medit8ionsociety <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
      > > --- tosime <tosime@b...> wrote:
      > > > Hi Jason,
      > > >
      > > > This is quite a coincidence...
      >
      > Jason Fishman <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
      > >
      > > Someone once told me, one should practice to die
      > > everynight before going to sleep, this way one is
      > nice
      > > and ready to live the next day! One should make
      > that a
      > > practice, it does quite well and one will be all
      > ready
      > > for death of form when the contract expires.
      > >
      > Yeah, co-incidences. I just got done putting the art
      > in place for the
      > lead article in the next issue of The Inner
      > Traveler. The title of the
      > article and meditation technique is "Death and How
      > to Prepare For It".
      > Way cool that Jason mentions this exact thing in
      > this Now. Gurdjieff
      > indicated more than once that the goofiest thing
      > people did was to act
      > as if they were immortal and they had all the time
      > in the world to get
      > down to serious "Work". Meditating on Death isn't
      > alot of fun, that's
      > why it makes for excellent "Intentional Suffering".
      > And Tonyji asks
      > "Is there some spiritual significance to "nothing"?"
      > Well, that's a
      > significant point. Our ego's and body's, and
      > emotions as well as our
      > thoughts are as nothing, have come from nothing, and
      > will certainly be
      > nothing for billions of years. With this perspective
      > in place, and it
      > actually always is, One is free of everything that
      > happened to or is
      > happening to or will ever happen to the fantasy
      > creature we have
      > constructed that we call "Me". This Me has alot of
      > "somethings"
      > attached to it, and that's where our desire and thus
      > our karma and
      > suffering comes in. Without "Me", we have Nothing,
      > and thus nothing to
      > worry us. Unfortunatly we take that Me very
      > seriously, and aren't
      > serious at all about what we should be serious
      > about, and that is the
      > "Work" of annihilating this phantom person. So, as
      > Chief Dan George
      > said many times in the excellent film Little Big
      > Man, "Today is a good
      > day to die." And that is well worth meditating
      > about.
      > Peace and blessings,
      > Bob
      > BTW, wait til you see the fantastic art that will be
      > featured in the
      > article I mentioned. New artist for us, and
      > certainly world quality,
      > as are all of our artists and authors. So, don't
      > actually drop the
      > physical just yet! :-)
      >
      >


      __________________________________________________
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    • satkartar7 <mi_nok@yahoo.com>
      ... what are you saying? please name the activities what lead you to something [which is nothing of course] sounds like j* rhetoric, she brutally distorts and
      Message 2 of 28 , Mar 1, 2003
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        > Hi Jason,
        >
        > This is quite a coincidence. After your post, the
        > very next post I received
        > was...
        >
        > :-) Nothing is something, and Something is really
        > nothing at all. T'ai Hsu
        > the "Great Nothing."
        >
        > It came one minute after yours.
        >
        > Is there some spiritual significance to "nothing"?
        >
        > ...Tony
        >
        > Well Tony, One can say spiritual, one can say
        > emotional, one can say physical, all of which leads to
        > nothing.


        what are you saying? please name the
        activities what lead you to something
        [which is nothing of course]

        sounds like j* rhetoric, she
        brutally distorts and simplifies
        everything to make her point and
        gives the impression to the ranch
        members that they have a "special" *understanding* i hope this mutation
        in thinking can be reversed
        re-examined and to broaden ones
        view is still possible

        Jason, think on your own please

        God is in the detail. I thing
        it is admirable to learn the
        fundamentalist black & white formula
        and i enjoy the merry go around
        word-games spinning from something
        into nothing and than back again a
        game the ranch elite loves to play..


        Are you talking about YOUR experience?


        >
        > One can apparently be following what is called a
        > spiritual path, meaning their spirit, their soul is
        > the key to unlocking some mystery. They can attempt to

        WRONG! spiritual exercize is like
        the sports it is to optimise ones body-mind-spirit organism [spirit
        like enthusiasm, will-power not your
        teachers holy ghost on the way to
        her Savior, NO NEED TO mystify all]

        > be fulfilled by fantasizing they are some mystical
        > force that is housed within a physical body to reach

        WRONG! again there are forces in the
        body like the force of an unavoidable
        bowel movement when one is full of
        shit and there is a force of a vacuum
        after all the air is emptied form
        the lungs, which force than will suck
        fresh air in

        and than there is the lifeforce energy
        of a living organism on the tracks
        of the nervous system and its plexuses
        which with training can be
        manipulated and used to refine the
        state of this living organism to an
        optimal point when it radiates
        intelligence etc

        > some enlightened phase.

        YES! which phase one gains
        *understanding*: of course i mean
        the RIGHT understanding aka
        enlightened consciousness

        This souls search always comes
        > up short handed, usually with a person looking hard


        WRONG! it comes up exactly as it does
        and as it IS


        > enough saying, what a waste, what a nothing.
        >

        oh! the proverbial nothing which is something of course,


        i say it is a time WELL spent


        > Now most of us already have come to terms with a
        > physical search. The more money one amasses, or things
        > a person obtains leads exactly the same place with,
        > what a waste of time, what a big nothing.
        >
        > The emotion search is somewhat more tricky.

        clean and simple again: each activity is
        boiled down to to the dirty word to:
        *SEARCH* which of course leads to
        nothing [something<->nothing] my head
        is spinning iam getting dizzy


        >Each
        > living being has a set of programs. To feel something
        > based on a set of conditions. To be angry when
        > threatened (for survival) to feel loved when cared for
        > (also for survival of a group) to feel sad of the
        > loss/change of someone or something (again for a
        > survival of the group). This again leads to nothing,


        by now with your disappointments that everything leads to nothing i'm moved
        to give you something.. i just don't
        know what ...


        > following your heart may give one emotional
        > understanding, yet when ones heart is yanked from
        > their insides (as the story goes) then that again leads
        > to the big emptiness of nothing.
        >
        > There is a 4 factor in this 3-d world, that is the
        > tool of the mind which encompasses all of the factors.
        > To be a witness to the non eternal truth of each
        > (which are really the make up of a "you"), to
        > rationalize, experience and conceptualize knowledge
        > that turns understanding, into wisdom. This is the
        > heart of the matter, yet even when stepped back in
        > witness stance, this leads to the same truth. Nothing
        > (no-existance) is everything.
        >
        > This is the eternal truth and a very tough pill to
        > swallow. To think that everything you have ever done
        > (in memory) is for not, for a big zero, that you don't
        > really exist (only in the now), well most cannot even
        > look at that pill let alone consume it into their very
        > being. There must be more! People tell themselves, we
        > want to survive, to be eternal, yet we already are
        > eternal. Everything that is our makup is eternal, yet
        > it's not ours, it is merely on loan till the contract
        > runs out, yet like it or not, at that point you face
        > the big nothing (no-understood-exsistance), which is
        > everything!
        >
        > Someone once told me, one should practice to die
        > everynight before going to sleep, this way one is nice
        > and ready to live the next day! One should make that a
        > practice, it does quite well and one will be all ready
        > for death of form when the contract expires.


        I like to swim and it leads to nothing
        i like to meditate searchlessly, yoga
        makes me feel good, [FEEL GOO!!!? i
        can hear the poliCe cursing UPON
        HEARING THE OTHER DIRTY WORD] altho
        i practice yoga without wanting to
        feel good this is just as the way it is

        i like to spend some of my time on
        earth with meditation i noticed it
        sharpened my intellect: it centers
        and calms me and gives me something
        else to do than to think about
        nothing = something around and around


        ---love, Karta
      • satkartar7 <mi_nok@yahoo.com>
        there are plenty of activities to chose from, and if you say you are a bundle of activities, than the best is to talk about your own: what you know don t ever
        Message 3 of 28 , Mar 1, 2003
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          there are plenty of activities to chose
          from, and if you say you are a bundle
          of activities, than the best is to
          talk about your own: what you know

          don't ever think that your choice of
          activities are superior to others

          and do not assume why others do
          anything even if it is called 'sadna"
          just because you were exposed to a
          very limited view about what spirituality is

          ----K

          > Hi Jason,
          >
          > This is quite a coincidence. After your post, the
          > very next post I received
          > was...
          >
          > :-) Nothing is something, and Something is really
          > nothing at all. T'ai Hsu
          > the "Great Nothing."
          >
          > It came one minute after yours.
          >
          > Is there some spiritual significance to "nothing"?
          >
          > ...Tony
          >
          > > Jason: Well Tony, One can say spiritual, one can say
          > >emotional, one can say physical, all of which leads to
          > >nothing.
          >
          >
          > Karta: what are you saying? please name the
          > activities what lead you to something
          > [which is nothing of course]
          >
          > sounds like j* rhetoric, she
          > brutally distorts and simplifies
          > everything to make her point and
          > gives the impression to the ranch
          > members that they have a "special" *understanding* i hope this mutation
          > in thinking can be reversed
          > re-examined and to broaden ones
          > view is still possible
          >
          > Jason, think on your own please
          >
          > God is in the detail. I thing
          > it is admirable to learn the
          > fundamentalist black & white formula
          > and i enjoy the merry go around
          > word-games spinning from something
          > into nothing and than back again a
          > game the ranch elite loves to play..
          >
          >
          > Are you talking about YOUR experience?
          >
          >
          > >
          > > One can apparently be following what is called a
          > > spiritual path, meaning their spirit, their soul is
          > > the key to unlocking some mystery. They can attempt to
          >
          > WRONG! spiritual exercize is like
          > the sports it is to optimise ones body-mind-spirit organism [spirit
          > like enthusiasm, will-power not your
          > teachers holy ghost on the way to
          > her Savior, NO NEED TO mystify all]
          >
          > > be fulfilled by fantasizing they are some mystical
          > > force that is housed within a physical body to reach
          >
          > WRONG! again there are forces in the
          > body like the force of an unavoidable
          > bowel movement when one is full of
          > shit and there is a force of a vacuum
          > after all the air is emptied form
          > the lungs, which force than will suck
          > fresh air in
          >
          > and than there is the lifeforce energy
          > of a living organism on the tracks
          > of the nervous system and its plexuses
          > which with training can be
          > manipulated and used to refine the
          > state of this living organism to an
          > optimal point when it radiates
          > intelligence etc
          >
          > > some enlightened phase.
          >
          > YES! which phase one gains
          > *understanding*: of course i mean
          > the RIGHT understanding aka
          > enlightened consciousness
          >
          > This souls search always comes
          > > up short handed, usually with a person looking hard
          >
          >
          > WRONG! it comes up exactly as it does
          > and as it IS
          >
          >
          > > enough saying, what a waste, what a nothing.
          > >
          >
          > oh! the proverbial nothing which is something of course,
          >
          >
          > i say it is a time WELL spent
          >
          >
          > > Now most of us already have come to terms with a
          > > physical search. The more money one amasses, or things
          > > a person obtains leads exactly the same place with,
          > > what a waste of time, what a big nothing.
          > >
          > > The emotion search is somewhat more tricky.
          >
          > clean and simple again: each activity is
          > boiled down to to the dirty word to:
          > *SEARCH* which of course leads to
          > nothing [something<->nothing] my head
          > is spinning iam getting dizzy
          >
          >
          > >Each
          > > living being has a set of programs. To feel something
          > > based on a set of conditions. To be angry when
          > > threatened (for survival) to feel loved when cared for
          > > (also for survival of a group) to feel sad of the
          > > loss/change of someone or something (again for a
          > > survival of the group). This again leads to nothing,
          >
          >
          > by now with your disappointments that everything leads to nothing i'm moved
          > to give you something.. i just don't
          > know what ...
          >
          >
          > > following your heart may give one emotional
          > > understanding, yet when ones heart is yanked from
          > > their insides (as the story goes) then that again leads
          > > to the big emptiness of nothing.
          > >
          > > There is a 4 factor in this 3-d world, that is the
          > > tool of the mind which encompasses all of the factors.
          > > To be a witness to the non eternal truth of each
          > > (which are really the make up of a "you"), to
          > > rationalize, experience and conceptualize knowledge
          > > that turns understanding, into wisdom. This is the
          > > heart of the matter, yet even when stepped back in
          > > witness stance, this leads to the same truth. Nothing
          > > (no-existance) is everything.
          > >
          > > This is the eternal truth and a very tough pill to
          > > swallow. To think that everything you have ever done
          > > (in memory) is for not, for a big zero, that you don't
          > > really exist (only in the now), well most cannot even
          > > look at that pill let alone consume it into their very
          > > being. There must be more! People tell themselves, we
          > > want to survive, to be eternal, yet we already are
          > > eternal. Everything that is our makup is eternal, yet
          > > it's not ours, it is merely on loan till the contract
          > > runs out, yet like it or not, at that point you face
          > > the big nothing (no-understood-exsistance), which is
          > > everything!
          > >
          > > Someone once told me, one should practice to die
          > > everynight before going to sleep, this way one is nice
          > > and ready to live the next day! One should make that a
          > > practice, it does quite well and one will be all ready
          > > for death of form when the contract expires.
          >
          >
          > I like to swim and it leads to nothing
          > i like to meditate searchlessly, yoga
          > makes me feel good, [FEEL GOO!!!? i
          > can hear the poliCe cursing UPON
          > HEARING THE OTHER DIRTY WORD] altho
          > i practice yoga without wanting to
          > feel good this is just as the way it is
          >
          > i like to spend some of my time on
          > earth with meditation i noticed it
          > sharpened my intellect: it centers
          > and calms me and gives me something
          > else to do than to think about
          > nothing = something around and around
          >
          >
          > ---love, Karta
        • medit8ionsociety
          Jason Fishman wrote: snip ... Dear Jason, The Inner Traveler is available by subscription, free with a membership in the Meditation Society
          Message 4 of 28 , Mar 1, 2003
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            Jason Fishman <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:

            snip
            > Look forward to the new addition, How does one get an
            > inner traveler, BTW? I'm sure it was mentioned before,
            > yet it has seemed to have slipped my existing memory!
            >
            > Peace and Love
            >
            Dear Jason,
            The Inner Traveler is available by subscription, free with a
            membership in the Meditation Society of America, or by writing
            something or sharing artwork for it. Also, I sometimes post the URL
            for issues here on this group. We also now have available a CD of the
            first 10 issues. Info can be found on our web site, Meditation Station
            http://www.meditationsociety.com
            Here's the URL of our sample issue:
            http://www.meditationsociety.com/it71808/index.html
            You will need the Adobe Reader tm 5.0 to read it. If you
            don't have it, the Adobe Reader can be downloaded at:
            http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep.html
            Thanks for asking and I hope you enjoy and benefit from it if you do
            check it out.
            Peace and blessings,
            Bob
          • Jason Fishman
            ... Any activity, this is what everything includes. For example you and I are having this conversation, you disagree with what is said, where does that get you
            Message 5 of 28 , Mar 1, 2003
            • 0 Attachment
              > what are you saying? please name the
              > activities what lead you to something
              > [which is nothing of course]

              Any activity, this is what everything includes. For
              example you and I are having this conversation, you
              disagree with what is said, where does that get you in
              your mind? Another example, you have all this great
              knowledge then one day your mind goes blank (such as
              amnesia or altzimers disease does over time) what do
              YOU have left? Does that mean all those things you
              experienced and knowledge you gained never happened?
              How would you know? You can't do them over. Think
              about that, if you will.

              > sounds like j* rhetoric, she
              > brutally distorts and simplifies
              > everything to make her point and
              > gives the impression to the ranch
              > members that they have a "special" *understanding* i
              > hope this mutation
              > in thinking can be reversed
              > re-examined and to broaden ones
              > view is still possible
              >
              > Jason, think on your own please

              Karta, this is on my own, yet it's nothing special,
              derived from thinking on my own and through the
              teaching of everything. This is everything, how much
              broader view can one have?

              > God is in the detail. I thing
              > it is admirable to learn the
              > fundamentalist black & white formula
              > and i enjoy the merry go around
              > word-games spinning from something
              > into nothing and than back again a
              > game the ranch elite loves to play..

              Of course god is in the detail. God IS everything,
              everywhere every moment, you are not seperate from
              god. There is no fundamentalism, yet everything is
              fun-da-mental, light and dark, black and white. I'm
              sorry you have had a bad experience with the ranch,
              but they are not elite, nor have I been on the ranch
              list. ALL are you, not seperate from you. Word spining
              is conversations, tossing concepts to and fro which
              amounts to nothing more then the moment which is based
              on everything and nothing equally feeding on each
              other.

              > Are you talking about YOUR experience?

              All experiences are exsistant. As said before one
              cannot go to no-exsistance and come back to tell of
              ones experience there.

              > >
              > > One can apparently be following what is called a
              > > spiritual path, meaning their spirit, their soul
              > is
              > > the key to unlocking some mystery. They can
              > attempt to
              >
              > WRONG! spiritual exercize is like
              > the sports it is to optimise ones body-mind-spirit
              > organism [spirit
              > like enthusiasm, will-power not your
              > teachers holy ghost on the way to
              > her Savior, NO NEED TO mystify all]

              Certainly, you said the same thing I said, how can
              either of us be correct?

              > > be fulfilled by fantasizing they are some mystical
              > > force that is housed within a physical body to
              > reach
              >
              > WRONG! again there are forces in the
              > body like the force of an unavoidable
              > bowel movement when one is full of
              > shit and there is a force of a vacuum
              > after all the air is emptied form
              > the lungs, which force than will suck
              > fresh air in
              >
              > and than there is the lifeforce energy
              > of a living organism on the tracks
              > of the nervous system and its plexuses
              > which with training can be
              > manipulated and used to refine the
              > state of this living organism to an
              > optimal point when it radiates
              > intelligence etc


              Of course, These are all parts of you which is
              everything. This does not desribe HOW phenomena happen
              in exsistance. This is something to KNOW. If all of
              the earth was wiped out where only the soil and water
              remained, did your knowledge go anywhere? Do you feel
              you take something with you when death comes? How can
              you? Everything you have is stored in memory, is in
              mind, do you take mind with you? Once your gone, you
              will take nothing more then what you came in with,
              which is nothing more then everything.

              > > some enlightened phase.
              >
              > YES! which phase one gains
              > *understanding*: of course i mean
              > the RIGHT understanding aka
              > enlightened consciousness


              Yes, phase one, phase two, phase ten million, all the
              same thing, amounts to everything, which is already
              what you have.

              > This souls search always comes
              > > up short handed, usually with a person looking
              > hard
              >
              >
              > WRONG! it comes up exactly as it does
              > and as it IS

              When you complete these phases, what do you expect to
              gain? Will you be special then? Seperate from all
              others and everything?

              > > enough saying, what a waste, what a nothing.
              > >
              >
              > oh! the proverbial nothing which is something of
              > course,
              >
              >
              > i say it is a time WELL spent

              Of course, what else will one do with the moments that
              pass? It's all experiences that leads to knowledge,
              that eventually give one wisdom, if those moments
              arise that one is willing to ponder experience,
              nothing more then what you already have.

              >
              > > Now most of us already have come to terms with a
              > > physical search. The more money one amasses, or
              > things
              > > a person obtains leads exactly the same place
              > with,
              > > what a waste of time, what a big nothing.
              > >
              > > The emotion search is somewhat more tricky.
              >
              > clean and simple again: each activity is
              > boiled down to to the dirty word to:
              > *SEARCH* which of course leads to
              > nothing [something<->nothing] my head
              > is spinning iam getting dizzy

              HEHE, getting dizzy is fun! One can decide they are no
              longer searching, but there is always knowledge to
              gain, experiences to experience, all of which are the
              same activity of existance.


              > >Each
              > > living being has a set of programs. To feel
              > something
              > > based on a set of conditions. To be angry when
              > > threatened (for survival) to feel loved when cared
              > for
              > > (also for survival of a group) to feel sad of the
              > > loss/change of someone or something (again for a
              > > survival of the group). This again leads to
              > nothing,
              >
              >
              > by now with your disappointments that everything
              > leads to nothing i'm moved
              > to give you something.. i just don't
              > know what ...

              I have no disappointments, only freedom and clarity.
              You can give me anything you'd like, yet I can only
              retain the knowledge of your understanding for a
              moment. Anything I do is what it is, then it's gone
              before it's over, no different then you, it only
              exists in memory.

              > > following your heart may give one emotional
              > > understanding, yet when ones heart is yanked from
              > > their insides (as the story goes) then that again
              > leads
              > > to the big emptiness of nothing.
              > >
              > > There is a 4 factor in this 3-d world, that is the
              > > tool of the mind which encompasses all of the
              > factors.
              > > To be a witness to the non eternal truth of each
              > > (which are really the make up of a "you"), to
              > > rationalize, experience and conceptualize
              > knowledge
              > > that turns understanding, into wisdom. This is the
              > > heart of the matter, yet even when stepped back in
              > > witness stance, this leads to the same truth.
              > Nothing
              > > (no-existance) is everything.
              > >
              > > This is the eternal truth and a very tough pill to
              > > swallow. To think that everything you have ever
              > done
              > > (in memory) is for not, for a big zero, that you
              > don't
              > > really exist (only in the now), well most cannot
              > even
              > > look at that pill let alone consume it into their
              > very
              > > being. There must be more! People tell themselves,
              > we
              > > want to survive, to be eternal, yet we already are
              > > eternal. Everything that is our makup is eternal,
              > yet
              > > it's not ours, it is merely on loan till the
              > contract
              > > runs out, yet like it or not, at that point you
              > face
              > > the big nothing (no-understood-exsistance), which
              > is
              > > everything!
              > >
              > > Someone once told me, one should practice to die
              > > everynight before going to sleep, this way one is
              > nice
              > > and ready to live the next day! One should make
              > that a
              > > practice, it does quite well and one will be all
              > ready
              > > for death of form when the contract expires.
              >
              >
              > I like to swim and it leads to nothing
              > i like to meditate searchlessly, yoga
              > makes me feel good, [FEEL GOO!!!? i
              > can hear the poliCe cursing UPON
              > HEARING THE OTHER DIRTY WORD] altho

              Yup, all experiences exist in the mind, all will be
              gone in the blink of an eye. Whats left? Nothing :)

              Peace and love to you Karta

              __________________________________________________
              Do you Yahoo!?
              Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more
              http://taxes.yahoo.com/
            • Jason Fishman
              ... Certainly Bob and thank you. I work in graphic arts. If you require something for your future publications, drop me a note and I ll see what can be done!
              Message 6 of 28 , Mar 1, 2003
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                --- medit8ionsociety <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                > Jason Fishman <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
                >
                > snip
                > > Look forward to the new addition, How does one get
                > an
                > > inner traveler, BTW? I'm sure it was mentioned
                > before,
                > > yet it has seemed to have slipped my existing
                > memory!
                > >
                > > Peace and Love
                > >
                > Dear Jason,
                > The Inner Traveler is available by subscription,
                > free with a
                > membership in the Meditation Society of America, or
                > by writing
                > something or sharing artwork for it. Also, I
                > sometimes post the URL
                > for issues here on this group. We also now have
                > available a CD of the
                > first 10 issues. Info can be found on our web site,
                > Meditation Station
                > http://www.meditationsociety.com
                > Here's the URL of our sample issue:
                > http://www.meditationsociety.com/it71808/index.html
                > You will need the Adobe Reader tm 5.0 to read it. If
                > you
                > don't have it, the Adobe Reader can be downloaded
                > at:
                > http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep.html
                > Thanks for asking and I hope you enjoy and benefit
                > from it if you do
                > check it out.
                > Peace and blessings,
                > Bob

                Certainly Bob and thank you. I work in graphic arts.
                If you require something for your future publications,
                drop me a note and I'll see what can be done!

                Peace and Love

                __________________________________________________
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              • Jason Fishman
                ... This is what one knows, how could one tell you what you know? In your idea of assumptions... what assumptions are being made? No activities are any more or
                Message 7 of 28 , Mar 1, 2003
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                  --- "satkartar7 <mi_nok@...>" <mi_nok@...>
                  wrote:
                  > there are plenty of activities to chose
                  > from, and if you say you are a bundle
                  > of activities, than the best is to
                  > talk about your own: what you know
                  >
                  > don't ever think that your choice of
                  > activities are superior to others
                  >
                  > and do not assume why others do
                  > anything even if it is called 'sadna"
                  > just because you were exposed to a
                  > very limited view about what spirituality is
                  >
                  > ----K

                  This is what one knows, how could one tell you what
                  you know? In your idea of assumptions... what
                  assumptions are being made? No activities are any more
                  or less of anything any other does, how could it be,
                  it all is the same thing underneath?
                  No limits to everything, yet only nothing remains.

                  Peace and Love


                  __________________________________________________
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                • Gene Poole <gene_poole@qwest.net>
                  ... If you look at zero you see nothing, but if you look through it you see the world
                  Message 8 of 28 , Mar 1, 2003
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                    "tosime" <tosime@b...> wrote:
                    > Hi Jason,
                    >
                    > This is quite a coincidence. After your post, the very next post I received
                    > was...
                    >
                    > :-) Nothing is something, and Something is really nothing at all. T'ai Hsu
                    > the "Great Nothing."
                    >
                    > It came one minute after yours.
                    >
                    > Is there some spiritual significance to "nothing"?
                    >
                    > ...Tony


                    If you look at zero you see nothing, but if you look through it you
                    see the world


                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: Jason <munkiman4u@y...> [mailto:munkiman4u@y...]
                    > Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2003 1:38 AM
                    > To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: Re: [Meditation Society of America] Top 10 spiritual practices
                    > -Tony
                    >
                    >
                    > No need to thank me :) there is nothing, but everything.
                    >
                    >
                    > Peace and Love
                    >
                    > > Hi Jason,
                    > >
                    > > Thanks for EVERYTHING...
                    > >
                    > > ...Tony
                    > >
                    > > Yes, a summary...
                    > > Everything you have listed equals nothing to do more
                    > > or less of.
                    > >
                    > > You can do meditation, yet you already are doing
                    > > meditation. You can write and read yahoo groups, yet
                    > > you already are writing and reading yahoo groups. You
                    > > can be introspective, yet you already are
                    > > introspecting. You can live in the now, yet you
                    > > already are living in the now. You can observe nature,
                    > > yet everything already is natural. You can teach,
                    > > study, learn, Yet you already teach, study, and learn.
                    > > Ahh my favorite, observing children, you already are
                    > > observing children. My least favorite, attending
                    > > church, again, you already attend church.
                    > >
                    > > This all comes down to a big nothing, a zero. No
                    > > matter what you do, in your mind, this doing is
                    > > something you are already doing. There is no doing,
                    > > yet all is doing. Any words one can express, any doing
                    > > one does can be flipped to an opposite, I'm not doing
                    > > this or I'm not saying that. Two opposings cancel
                    > > there for a zero, nothing. Its a circle of opposing
                    > > factors which is the summary of all things, a zero, a
                    > > huge never ending, never begining circle. You don't
                    > > exist, yet you exists in the mind :)
                    > >
                    > > Peace and Love
                    > >
                    > > __________________________________________________
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                    > > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more
                    > > http://taxes.yahoo.com/
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                    > > meditationsocietyofamerica-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                    > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    >
                    >
                    > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                    > meditationsocietyofamerica-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  • satkartar7 <mi_nok@yahoo.com>
                    Jason Fishman wrote: Another example, you have all this great ... WHY? why would i think about such things ... One can dare to be real ...
                    Message 9 of 28 , Mar 2, 2003
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                      Jason Fishman <munkiman4u@y...> wrote:
                      Another example, you have all this great
                      > knowledge then one day your mind goes blank (such as
                      > amnesia or altzimers disease does over time) what do
                      > YOU have left? Does that mean all those things you
                      > experienced and knowledge you gained never happened?
                      > How would you know? You can't do them over. Think
                      > about that, if you will.
                      >


                      WHY? why would i think about such things


                      > This is everything, how much
                      > broader view can one have?


                      One can dare to be real


                      >
                      > Of course, These are all parts of you which is
                      > everything. This does not desribe HOW phenomena happen
                      > in exsistance. This is something to KNOW. If all of
                      > the earth was wiped out where only the soil and water
                      > remained, did your knowledge go anywhere? Do you feel
                      > you take something with you when death comes? How can
                      > you? Everything you have is stored in memory, is in
                      > mind, do you take mind with you? Once your gone, you
                      > will take nothing more then what you came in with,
                      > which is nothing more then everything.
                      >

                      >
                      > Yes, phase one, phase two, phase ten million, all the
                      > same thing, amounts to everything, which is already
                      > what you have.
                      >

                      You Jason are a philosopher <smiles>


                      > One can decide they are no
                      > longer searching, but there is always knowledge to
                      > gain, experiences to experience, all of which are the
                      > same activity of existance.


                      oh! this obsession with the *search*


                      > This is the
                      > heart of the matter, yet even when stepped back in
                      > witness stance, this leads to the same truth.
                      > Nothing
                      > (no-existance) is everything.
                      >
                      > Yup, all experiences exist in the mind, all will be
                      > gone in the blink of an eye. Whats left? Nothing :)


                      ok Jason, i will keep in mind your
                      advice, that to 'search' is the
                      wrong activity and the notion of
                      the 'nothing' the later Gene's way
                      looking at the zero...

                      i am not a philosopher, ALL I
                      WANTED TO SAY is that: At times
                      when i dare to exist between nowhere
                      and somewhere between no ID and
                      a transient one to use what makes
                      me tick is getting into the *zone*
                      what is easy with sadna yoga and
                      meditation as i belive, that through
                      yoga practice consciousness can be
                      raised. And with higher
                      consciousness there IS [must be and
                      there is NOOOOO way around this]
                      a refinement of character an upgrade
                      in the ethics of action and yes!
                      an upgrade in *understanding* these
                      are biproducts of sadna

                      Jason, i am glad; that what makes
                      you tick is not trolling the
                      *spiritual* as in: SPIRITUAL lists
                      with knocking meditation and yoga,
                      or what ever is listed as the aim
                      of the club is: and trying to
                      recruit normal people to some funny
                      farm boot-camp to be insulted

                      because i am fead up with that


                      ----love,
                      Karta
                      >
                      > Peace and love to you Karta
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