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  • freyjartist@aol.com
    It seems like a lot of us are constantly looking for evidence, out there, in the form of other people s opinions and thoughts, to validate and back up our own
    Message 1 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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      It seems like a lot of us are constantly
      looking for evidence, out there, in the form of other
      people's opinions and thoughts, to validate
      and back up our own thoughts.
      To constantly "make sense" out of everything.

      There is a scene in the film "The Big Chill"
      where the William Hurt character, (who also
      happens to be a drug dealer, but dont hold it
      against him), is sitting, apparently watching a gangster movie
      on TV.

      Someone comes in and asks him "what's going on,
      who did it?" And he says, "The guy with the hat".
      Pan to the TV screen and they are all wearing hats.

      The guy makes a face at Hurt and Hurt says with flair,
      "Don't you know, sometimes you just have to let
      art wash over you."

      just sharing,

      Freyja
      (who thinks she will go have some Clairmont Diner breakfast now)




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Jason <jfishman2@msn.com>
      ... In the immortal words of our beloved Judi round and round we go! There is no escape from conditioning, what IS, is.. what was, never was and what will be
      Message 2 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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        --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, freyjartist@a...
        wrote:
        >
        > It seems like a lot of us are constantly
        > looking for evidence, out there, in the form of other
        > people's opinions and thoughts, to validate
        > and back up our own thoughts.
        > To constantly "make sense" out of everything.
        >
        > There is a scene in the film "The Big Chill"
        > where the William Hurt character, (who also
        > happens to be a drug dealer, but dont hold it
        > against him), is sitting, apparently watching a gangster movie
        > on TV.
        >
        > Someone comes in and asks him "what's going on,
        > who did it?" And he says, "The guy with the hat".
        > Pan to the TV screen and they are all wearing hats.
        >
        > The guy makes a face at Hurt and Hurt says with flair,
        > "Don't you know, sometimes you just have to let
        > art wash over you."
        >
        > just sharing,
        >
        > Freyja
        > (who thinks she will go have some Clairmont Diner breakfast now)

        In the immortal words of our beloved Judi round and round we go!
        There is no escape from conditioning, what IS, is.. what was, never
        was and what will be is still the unknowable. You still are form, no
        escape and nothing to run from... quite the dilema of non dilemas...
        not two, not two ;)
      • dragonpuffs7777
        Yes, let s bathe in a little art and come out more colorful. I had a dream yesterday morning where a small group of closely bonded sparkly people had tried to
        Message 3 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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          Yes, let's bathe in a little art and come out more colorful.

          I had a dream yesterday morning where a small group of closely
          bonded sparkly people had tried to claim my nice clean empty house
          by bringing in a baby and a pile of their belongings. It was a
          rental house, but empty, and they wanted to be squatters.

          When i told them to keep on moving, they brought in more stuff
          until you could hardly walk. Still, I told them to pack it up and
          move on and so they did with no hard feelings. But, the feeling of
          the dream was about the need to keep the validation from the others
          in order to stay sparkly, and the further need to move in on what
          was mine so that I would lose my own house to them. In other words,
          they also needed my validation, and then more people's validation,
          and on and on, but they never had a house of their own. It was all
          borrowed, or stolen.



          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, freyjartist@a...
          wrote:
          >
          > It seems like a lot of us are constantly
          > looking for evidence, out there, in the form of other
          > people's opinions and thoughts, to validate
          > and back up our own thoughts.
          > To constantly "make sense" out of everything.
          >
          > There is a scene in the film "The Big Chill"
          > where the William Hurt character, (who also
          > happens to be a drug dealer, but dont hold it
          > against him), is sitting, apparently watching a gangster movie
          > on TV.
          >
          > Someone comes in and asks him "what's going on,
          > who did it?" And he says, "The guy with the hat".
          > Pan to the TV screen and they are all wearing hats.
          >
          > The guy makes a face at Hurt and Hurt says with flair,
          > "Don't you know, sometimes you just have to let
          > art wash over you."
          >
          > just sharing,
          >
          > Freyja
          > (who thinks she will go have some Clairmont Diner breakfast now)
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • G <crystalkundalini@hotmail.com>
          ... now) G: those that depend on others to validate their *opinions* are just that .... having opinions still caught in the mind and search..... beyond
          Message 4 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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            --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
            freyjartist@a... wrote:
            >
            > It seems like a lot of us are constantly
            > looking for evidence, out there, in the form of other
            > people's opinions and thoughts, to validate
            > and back up our own thoughts.
            > To constantly "make sense" out of everything.
            >
            > There is a scene in the film "The Big Chill"
            > where the William Hurt character, (who also
            > happens to be a drug dealer, but dont hold it
            > against him), is sitting, apparently watching a gangster movie
            > on TV.
            >
            > Someone comes in and asks him "what's going on,
            > who did it?" And he says, "The guy with the hat".
            > Pan to the TV screen and they are all wearing hats.
            >
            > The guy makes a face at Hurt and Hurt says with flair,
            > "Don't you know, sometimes you just have to let
            > art wash over you."
            >
            > just sharing,
            >
            > Freyja
            > (who thinks she will go have some Clairmont Diner breakfast
            now)


            G: those that depend on others to validate their *opinions* are
            just that .... having opinions still caught in the mind and
            search..... beyond that is Knowing that rests and stills no
            longer needing a validation... for the opinions have blown out
            and no longer carry any weight or validity.....

            what remains is that great Whole that is empty in nature and
            needs no form or mind to fill its parameters as it is complete
            within itself..... where no self remains....

            shanti om ...g..

            save me a place at the Diner.... hahahahaha
          • G <crystalkundalini@hotmail.com>
            ... closely ... house ... of the dream was about the need to keep the validation from the others in order to stay sparkly, and the further need to move in on
            Message 5 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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              --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
              dragonpuffs7777 <no_reply@y...> wrote:
              > Yes, let's bathe in a little art and come out more colorful.
              >
              > I had a dream yesterday morning where a small group of
              closely
              > bonded sparkly people had tried to claim my nice clean empty
              house
              > by bringing in a baby and a pile of their belongings. It was a
              > rental house, but empty, and they wanted to be squatters.
              >
              > When i told them to keep on moving, they brought in more stuff
              > until you could hardly walk. Still, I told them to pack it up and
              > move on and so they did with no hard feelings. But, the feeling
              of the dream was about the need to keep the validation from the
              others in order to stay sparkly, and the further need to move in on
              what was mine so that I would lose my own house to them. In
              other words, they also needed my validation, and then more
              people's validation, and on and on, but they never had a house
              of their own. It was all borrowed, or stolen.


              G: uh how about once the house is swept clean of concepts....
              don't invite any more in no matter how sparkling and colorful that
              they might be..... once again the validation thing is another
              concept you are clinging to perhaps....

              Realization doesn''t need validation when the house has been
              swept clean..... .

              what a priceless timing.... the house is the ego mind which is
              the illusion of self...... sweep it clean ... then don't clutter it up
              again... you don't live there it is a rental....

              who is attempting to move in on your space?...

              yep you can collect so many concepts and ideas that you can no
              longer move.... no freedom.... concepts don't cling anywhere it
              is you that let's them go.... or you that allows them to collect and
              stay ..... they move in almost unawares but it is you that must
              confront them and let them go....

              . no one can move into your mind and world unless you allow
              them in..... once again this only substantiates the former post ....

              Here are your words look at this more closely..... it is telling...::::

              P: "the feeling of the dream was about the need to keep the
              validation from the others in order to stay sparkly, and the further
              need to move in on what was mine so that I would lose my own
              house to them. In other words, they also needed my validation,
              and then more people's validation, and on and on, but they
              never had a house of their own. It was all borrowed, or stolen. "

              G: is others knowledge really borrowed or stolen unless you
              validate it? will their knowledge really displace you from your
              mind/self? if you withhold does it really keep your (house
              ego/mind) sparkly ....?

              talk about a need to defend and be on the alert.....

              enjoy your dream..... in know i did .... it really sheds light on
              your recent actions and posts ...... this dream really has some
              wisdom in it for you if you can step back and see it in clarity.....


              shanti om ...g...
            • dragonpuffs7777
              That would be your interpretation if it were your own dream. My interpretation is the true meaning as it comes from me to me. IT s about how I am percieving
              Message 6 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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                That would be your interpretation if it were your own dream. My
                interpretation is the true meaning as it comes from me to me.

                IT's about how I am percieving many of the members of this group
                (not all,) and in this group specifically rather than in the 3-d
                world or in other groups, and that's why I put it here. You and they
                look like fundamentalist nothingists. It is a dream about what part
                of me I'd choose to steer clear of. But, of course, I didn't steer
                clear, and that means I want to confront people like you because
                something in me started to gell and be automatic, which is the way
                you are to me, so I can get you out of my system and move on.

                --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "G
                <crystalkundalini@h...>" <crystalkundalini@h...> wrote:
                > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
                > dragonpuffs7777 <no_reply@y...> wrote:
                > > Yes, let's bathe in a little art and come out more colorful.
                > >
                > > I had a dream yesterday morning where a small group of
                > closely
                > > bonded sparkly people had tried to claim my nice clean empty
                > house
                > > by bringing in a baby and a pile of their belongings. It was a
                > > rental house, but empty, and they wanted to be squatters.
                > >
                > > When i told them to keep on moving, they brought in more stuff
                > > until you could hardly walk. Still, I told them to pack it up
                and
                > > move on and so they did with no hard feelings. But, the feeling
                > of the dream was about the need to keep the validation from the
                > others in order to stay sparkly, and the further need to move in
                on
                > what was mine so that I would lose my own house to them. In
                > other words, they also needed my validation, and then more
                > people's validation, and on and on, but they never had a house
                > of their own. It was all borrowed, or stolen.
                >
                >
                > G: uh how about once the house is swept clean of concepts....
                > don't invite any more in no matter how sparkling and colorful that
                > they might be..... once again the validation thing is another
                > concept you are clinging to perhaps....
                >
                > Realization doesn''t need validation when the house has been
                > swept clean..... .
                >
                > what a priceless timing.... the house is the ego mind which is
                > the illusion of self...... sweep it clean ... then don't
                clutter it up
                > again... you don't live there it is a rental....
                >
                > who is attempting to move in on your space?...
                >
                > yep you can collect so many concepts and ideas that you can no
                > longer move.... no freedom.... concepts don't cling anywhere it
                > is you that let's them go.... or you that allows them to collect
                and
                > stay ..... they move in almost unawares but it is you that must
                > confront them and let them go....
                >
                > . no one can move into your mind and world unless you allow
                > them in..... once again this only substantiates the former
                post ....
                >
                > Here are your words look at this more closely..... it is
                telling...::::
                >
                > P: "the feeling of the dream was about the need to keep the
                > validation from the others in order to stay sparkly, and the
                further
                > need to move in on what was mine so that I would lose my own
                > house to them. In other words, they also needed my validation,
                > and then more people's validation, and on and on, but they
                > never had a house of their own. It was all borrowed, or stolen. "
                >
                > G: is others knowledge really borrowed or stolen unless you
                > validate it? will their knowledge really displace you from your
                > mind/self? if you withhold does it really keep your (house
                > ego/mind) sparkly ....?
                >
                > talk about a need to defend and be on the alert.....
                >
                > enjoy your dream..... in know i did .... it really sheds light
                on
                > your recent actions and posts ...... this dream really has some
                > wisdom in it for you if you can step back and see it in
                clarity.....
                >
                >
                > shanti om ...g...
              • G <crystalkundalini@hotmail.com>
                ... IT s about how I am percieving many of the members of this group (not all,) and in this group specifically rather than in the 3-d ... they look like
                Message 7 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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                  --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
                  dragonpuffs7777 <no_reply@y...> wrote:
                  > That would be your interpretation if it were your own dream. My
                  > interpretation is the true meaning as it comes from me to me.
                  IT's about how I am percieving many of the members of this
                  group (not all,) and in this group specifically rather than in the 3-d
                  > world or in other groups, and that's why I put it here. You and
                  they look like fundamentalist nothingists. It is a dream about
                  what part of me I'd choose to steer clear of. But, of course, I
                  didn't steer clear, and that means I want to confront people like
                  you because something in me started to gell and be automatic,
                  which is the way you are to me, so I can get you out of my
                  system and move on.


                  G: did you ever stop to think you may not be real objective about
                  it? of course you are going to interpret it in your best light...

                  ah.... i have never been "in" your system... the only one in there
                  is you.... if i'm in there and if it is your perception of people in
                  this group then my dear that is even a sadder commentary on it
                  than before.... everyone is trying to rip you off... and seeking
                  your approval ? sneaking into your place and squatting there....
                  oh my dear.... and your so cramped that you can't move....

                  you might do better to stick with my interpretation it really paints
                  you in a much better light than what you are saying right now.....

                  what you end up doing is simply confronting yourself, if there is
                  a need to *confront* anything.... so which is it - is it about
                  confronting the people here or steering away from your own
                  perceptions? you are sounding more and more confused .....
                  boy am i glad that

                  shanti om ..g...
                • dragonpuffs7777
                  Message 8 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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                    <you might do better to stick with my interpretation it really
                    paints
                    > you in a much better light than what you are saying right now--- >

                    Oh no, where is Tom Hanks when you need him? Now ganga is telling me
                    to stop listening to my own intuition, my own small still voice, and
                    to listen to her big loud stupid one, instead! G, you have, in fact,
                    confirmed that my inner voice can be trusted very well, thank you.

                    I read in this place before I joined and saw in you somewhere I
                    never wanted to end up at but somewhere I was finding myself
                    hovering around in some dark attraction. Well, they say a teacher
                    teaches best what she most needs to learn and you teach by bad
                    example very well. Your broom is in the closet. Let me show you to
                    the door.




                    In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "G
                    <crystalkundalini@h...>" <crystalkundalini@h...> wrote:
                    > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
                    > dragonpuffs7777 <no_reply@y...> wrote:
                    > > That would be your interpretation if it were your own dream. My
                    > > interpretation is the true meaning as it comes from me to me.
                    > IT's about how I am percieving many of the members of this
                    > group (not all,) and in this group specifically rather than in the
                    3-d
                    > > world or in other groups, and that's why I put it here. You and
                    > they look like fundamentalist nothingists. It is a dream about
                    > what part of me I'd choose to steer clear of. But, of course, I
                    > didn't steer clear, and that means I want to confront people like
                    > you because something in me started to gell and be automatic,
                    > which is the way you are to me, so I can get you out of my
                    > system and move on.
                    >
                    >
                    > G: did you ever stop to think you may not be real objective about
                    > it? of course you are going to interpret it in your best
                    light...
                    >
                    > ah.... i have never been "in" your system... the only one in
                    there
                    > is you.... if i'm in there and if it is your perception of
                    people in
                    > this group then my dear that is even a sadder commentary on it
                    > than before.... everyone is trying to rip you off... and
                    seeking
                    > your approval ? sneaking into your place and squatting there....
                    > oh my dear.... and your so cramped that you can't move....
                    >
                    > you might do better to stick with my interpretation it really
                    paints
                    > you in a much better light than what you are saying right now.....
                    >
                    > what you end up doing is simply confronting yourself, if there is
                    > a need to *confront* anything.... so which is it - is it about
                    > confronting the people here or steering away from your own
                    > perceptions? you are sounding more and more confused .....
                    > boy am i glad that
                    >
                    > shanti om ..g...
                  • G <crystalkundalini@hotmail.com>
                    ... now--- ... P: Oh no, where is Tom Hanks when you need him? Now ganga is telling me to stop listening to my own intuition, my own small still voice,
                    Message 9 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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                      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com,
                      dragonpuffs7777 <no_reply@y...> wrote:
                      > <you might do better to stick with my interpretation it really
                      > paints you in a much better light than what you are saying right
                      now--- >
                      >
                      P: > Oh no, where is Tom Hanks when you need him? Now
                      ganga is telling me to stop listening to my own intuition, my own
                      small still voice, and to listen to her big loud stupid one, instead!
                      G, you have, in fact, confirmed that my inner voice can be trusted
                      very well, thank you.
                      >
                      > I read in this place before I joined and saw in you somewhere I
                      > never wanted to end up at but somewhere I was finding myself
                      > hovering around in some dark attraction. Well, they say a
                      teacher teaches best what she most needs to learn and you
                      teach by bad example very well. Your broom is in the closet. Let
                      me show you to the door.


                      G: hahahaha now temper -temper... tom hanks is probably at
                      home enjoying his life.....

                      the only dark attraction is your mind and its obsession .....

                      if it is playing on your mind so, then it is you that needs to walk
                      away .... for i assure you that you disturb me not in the least.....
                      when all is empty in nature there is nothing to cling to ... nothing
                      that stays or disturbs the peace.... you're like a knife through
                      water..... momentary - fleeting.

                      sorry to disapoint you but i don't have a broom .... plenty of
                      closets though.....

                      now who is *wired* ? i believe it may be you.... the trap was of
                      your own making.... in thinking to run me in a circle and to teach
                      me a lesson you only succeeded in getting your shorts tied in a
                      knot .....

                      you came with an objective here are your words :

                      P: I read in this place before I joined and saw in you somewhere
                      I never wanted to end up at but somewhere I was finding myself
                      hovering around in some dark attraction.

                      G: you made up your mind before entering into any
                      conversation..... and have seen only what you were prepared to
                      see..... i was never an adversary nor am i now..... the only
                      adversary in this is simply your own projections..... i have
                      nothing against you at all..... never have... still don't.....

                      you made up your mind from the start that i was some adversary
                      to conquer ..... hahahahhah it didn't work that way..... for there
                      is nothing here to be conquered.....

                      you're saying that i have a big loud stupid voice is quite funny for
                      really i hear nothing at all..... there are simply typed words on a
                      screen..... see how the projections are in place?

                      enjoy your intuition.... but perhaps you may think about starting
                      from a clear point rather than a set notion next time.... then
                      perhaps you will only see words on a screen that have no impact
                      rather than projecting a big loud stupid voice in your mind.....

                      here there are only marks on a screen - no more and no less....
                      it has no more impact other than what it is..... ..


                      shanti om ..g...
                    • Jason <jfishman2@msn.com>
                      So much for an early bedtime, but a stand in is to fun to pass up! Before this plays out in more debate, remember I hold no position in either favor here,
                      Message 10 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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                        So much for an early bedtime, but a stand in is to fun to pass up!
                        Before this plays out in more debate, remember I hold no position in
                        either favor here, there or everywhere (sorry, got that song stuck
                        in my head)...

                        What you both are doing is jocking for a position, neither of which
                        is any less or anymore valid then you make it...

                        G: it is very understood your position as such, removal of the I is
                        very important when being in balance, but regardless of the removal
                        of the I (which you are not doing) doesn't have any bearing on it's
                        existance. You (whether you've decided there is a you as one "not
                        two, not two" or not) are merely playing the game by calling it
                        something else. I no longer exist's, all is one, you are wrong and I
                        am right, see the unbalance of this. You continue this debate
                        because you say it is simply a passing by I hold nothing to it, it
                        does not control me nor make me feel any such way, yet continuing
                        the debate says otherwise....shanti om and grin and bear it all you
                        will. Your proving a point, a position is being maintained here.
                        You, whether your will will allow or not has no justification.
                        Again, You're simply continuing the game of cat and mouse and
                        calling it something else. Quite so, to mine and others amusement.

                        P: You are also playing the game, there is no difference but a scale
                        of another color. you point out truths that exist, whether someone
                        else agrees on them or not and you both continue to say look to
                        yourself, there is something wrong here. Quite so on all accounts,
                        there is no balance in this power play. Your talking to a wall that
                        stuck in a reality of her own making, just as you are. Trying to
                        force anothers truths onto someone else is just what is says it is,
                        a control power play, no more no less.

                        On a closing note, saying "thats what were both saying" which in
                        essence thats all your both saying anyway, is the same thing as
                        holding a position. Both have valid perspectives, see them as such
                        and move on, or don't and continue the debate. there may be a few
                        still lingering in the entertainment of it all :)
                      • dragonpuffs7777
                        Yes, I think I just said that in so many words, but yours sounds good. ... in ... which ... is ... removal ... it s ... I ... you ... scale ... that ... is,
                        Message 11 of 11 , Jan 31, 2003
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                          Yes, I think I just said that in so many words, but yours sounds
                          good.



                          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Jason
                          <jfishman2@m...>" <jfishman2@m...> wrote:
                          > So much for an early bedtime, but a stand in is to fun to pass up!
                          > Before this plays out in more debate, remember I hold no position
                          in
                          > either favor here, there or everywhere (sorry, got that song stuck
                          > in my head)...
                          >
                          > What you both are doing is jocking for a position, neither of
                          which
                          > is any less or anymore valid then you make it...
                          >
                          > G: it is very understood your position as such, removal of the I
                          is
                          > very important when being in balance, but regardless of the
                          removal
                          > of the I (which you are not doing) doesn't have any bearing on
                          it's
                          > existance. You (whether you've decided there is a you as one "not
                          > two, not two" or not) are merely playing the game by calling it
                          > something else. I no longer exist's, all is one, you are wrong and
                          I
                          > am right, see the unbalance of this. You continue this debate
                          > because you say it is simply a passing by I hold nothing to it, it
                          > does not control me nor make me feel any such way, yet continuing
                          > the debate says otherwise....shanti om and grin and bear it all
                          you
                          > will. Your proving a point, a position is being maintained here.
                          > You, whether your will will allow or not has no justification.
                          > Again, You're simply continuing the game of cat and mouse and
                          > calling it something else. Quite so, to mine and others amusement.
                          >
                          > P: You are also playing the game, there is no difference but a
                          scale
                          > of another color. you point out truths that exist, whether someone
                          > else agrees on them or not and you both continue to say look to
                          > yourself, there is something wrong here. Quite so on all accounts,
                          > there is no balance in this power play. Your talking to a wall
                          that
                          > stuck in a reality of her own making, just as you are. Trying to
                          > force anothers truths onto someone else is just what is says it
                          is,
                          > a control power play, no more no less.
                          >
                          > On a closing note, saying "thats what were both saying" which in
                          > essence thats all your both saying anyway, is the same thing as
                          > holding a position. Both have valid perspectives, see them as such
                          > and move on, or don't and continue the debate. there may be a few
                          > still lingering in the entertainment of it all :)
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