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Re: Swami Sivananda on signs of spiritual evolution

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  • dan330033
    ... It s just a mind-game, this comparison of persons. Believing that one is contending with others is a related mind game. And the ending of mind games is not
    Message 1 of 40 , May 21 12:54 PM
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      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "tarah513" <faithearden@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      > Hello!
      >
      > I just have a couple of comments.
      >
      > First, you state how you struggled with the "attachment" in Afghanistan
      > and how difficult it was to let go. I suggest that perhaps you just let
      > one attachment (a type of thought, living style) for another (the
      > buddhist route). You call it detached from the old ego & growing a new
      > ego.
      >
      > Second, you, as well as others, DO put me down. You did so in your
      > comment that that you had to chuckle at some of my comments because it
      > reminded you of yourself when you first arrived. [Interpretation: go on
      > Faithe, we are here to help you, eventually, if you are spiritual enough
      > you will come to the higher level of consciousness way of
      > thinking/being, see Buddha's Way or Christianity, etc.]
      >
      > Bob did the same thing yesterday to me when he made the comment about
      > how others affected him (in a positive manner, whereas I affected him
      > negatively was strongly inferred). IF this unattachment were truly
      > achieved, would one really have the differentiation? I answered Bob in a
      > manner that later I did not like, as I allowed myself to be pulled into
      > the same mode.
      >
      > As long as it is perceived that there is a "right/comfortable" way vs.
      > the opposite, then unattachment is NOT present. Unattachment is a
      > figment of the imagination (as so many things are) as a means to an end
      > (gaining a higher level of spiritual evolvement) when in the whole
      > scheme of things is totally meaningless because... who can really
      > measure spiritual levels? No one can, and never has. There are millions
      > of books of how to do it, showing the endless journey(s) & paths that
      > people can partake to arrive settled on the spiritual station. I have
      > yet to meet a highly evolved "spiritual" person...still waiting (here I
      > chuckle).
      >
      > I am the most highly evolved spiritual person that I know...as it should
      > be. Perhaps each of you feel the same way about yourselves.
      >
      > Thank you.
      >
      > Faithe

      It's just a mind-game, this comparison of persons.

      Believing that one is contending with others is a related mind game.

      And the ending of mind games is not something one chooses, forces, or makes happen.

      Utterly nonvolitional.

      And thus very humbling -- the end of the mind-game of self contending with others.

      And most certainly, it is the ending of any "highly evolved spiritual person" that can be attached to.

      Just Being alone.

      - Dan -
    • dan330033
      ... D: Unless one is not attached. ... D: Yes, words develop, as does thought. ... D: It depends on what you mean by peace. If peace is taken as
      Message 40 of 40 , May 24 1:48 PM
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        --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "tarah513" <faithearden@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > Words (sound or written) indeed are vibrations, but are not "just
        > vibrations". They are one of the methods used to communicate that to
        > which one is attached.

        D: Unless one is not attached.

        > It is a tool that has been developed and used
        > (not always successfully, I might add).

        D: Yes, words develop, as does thought.

        > On peace, well, we certainly don't have it here, so I am guessing it is
        > no where - "as it is above, so it is below".

        D: It depends on what you mean by "peace." If "peace" is taken as undivided being aware, then peace is directly clear. If "peace" is taken as all people on the earth not harming each other, not manipulating, not stealing, not deceiving, not assaulting, etc. - then clearly one does not observe peace as what is occuring in the world.

        Being aware above as below, there is no division, and no outside or inside - call this by whatever name seems to fit the conversation of the moment, such as being, awareness, peace, love, or like the Taoists "the uncarved block."

        Doesn't matter very much what you call it -.

        At heart, there is no name for this - just the being of it.

        - Dan -

        > Faithe
        >
        >
        > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "dan330033"
        > <dan330033@> wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "tarah513"
        > faithearden@ wrote:
        > > >
        > > > > > Hi Dan.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > A little bit of snipping...
        > > > > >
        > > > > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "dan330033"
        > > > > > <dan330033@> wrote:
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > D: Words are fun. Nothing to be attached to.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > I disagree. Words ARE fun, but don't agree with the rest.
        > > > >
        > > > > D: You are disagreeing with your own idea of what the
        > > > > words mean, which you are inventing.
        > > > >
        > > > > And if your disagreement with yourself stops -
        > > > > no "other" can be found to disagree with.
        > > >
        > > > What I am saying is that words spoken are the attachment.
        > >
        > > D: Words spoken are just vibrations produced in the air by the human
        > larynx.
        > >
        > > As "others"
        > > > question the attachment, there is where the acceptance,
        > defensiveness or
        > > > argumentative stance is taken. The agreement that I stated is that
        > words
        > > > ARE fun in that they allow attachments to be voiced. We all love our
        > > > attachments, whether toys, ideas, religions or grandiose spiritual
        > > > endeavors.
        > >
        > > D: Words are just one of many, many ways that vibrating reverbations
        > move though the universe.
        > >
        > > > >
        > > > > > > Being isn't an affective state.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > If it is not, than how can one determine whether one is "being"
        > or
        > > > > > not?????
        > > > >
        > > > > D: One doesn't determine anything. One is still. Being.
        > > >
        > > > Sure...great words Dan. Your words. Your attachment. See, it is fun!
        > >
        > > D: Even beyond fun - it is love.
        > >
        > > > What is not fun is that I question your attachment. Granted it is
        > YOUR
        > > > belief and after you read this it will still be YOUR belief. Perhaps
        > we
        > > > are using the term "one" to denote different things. Now how fun is
        > > > that! We not only use the same words, but those words mean totally
        > > > different things to each of us.
        > >
        > > D: Meanings arise in the moment. Like all perceiving, meanings are in
        > flux. No meaning to attach to. No no-meaning to attach to. Just being.
        > >
        > > > > > > > Personally, I read this, shook my head and mumbled to
        > > > > > myself..."thought
        > > > > > > > running amok".
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > D: Running amok, in Southeast Asia where the concept
        > > > > > > started, had to do with uncontrollable rage and killing
        > people.
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > Thought just appears, disappears, though - with nothing
        > > > > > > to kill or be killed involved.
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > Isn't that your experience?
        > > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > I did think that at one time, experience showed otherwise.
        > > > >
        > > > > D: That's just memory, that notion about something that was shown
        > > > > - this is not a memory, this being that
        > > > > shines through immediacy of experience.
        > > >
        > > > Bringing new ideas to kill off old ideas is indeed killing, and can
        > do
        > > > more damage than just the removal of a few hundred thousand bodies.
        > >
        > > D: Well, if ideas of killing ideas suit you, ideate about killing
        > ideas. If that ceases to be fun, such thinking ceases. Now, nothing to
        > kill or be killed. Just thoughtless peace. An idea arises, dissolves.
        > Nothing was killed. Peace is.
        > >
        > > It
        > > > all depends on the ideas. There are good and evil ideas. Ideas have
        > the
        > > > capacity to totally control and totally wipeout millions. I have
        > noted
        > > > this directly in my life experiences.
        > >
        > > D: When ideas about control no longer attract or repulse, no
        > controlling entities need to be imagined. The fear of no one being in
        > control dissolves into peace.
        > >
        > > > > > Take care Dan.
        > > > >
        > > > > D: I care. But I don't take care.
        > > > >
        > > > > Be well, Faithe.
        > > > >
        > > > > - Dan
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Take care Dan.
        > > >
        > > > I could say (cleverly, I might add) I am well, but I am not being
        > well.
        > >
        > > D: I am being. Well, well, well.
        > >
        > > > Words...fun, fun, fun.
        > >
        > > D: Till Daddy takes my T-Bird away.
        > >
        > > Not to worry though - I'm in free-fall anyway.
        > >
        > > > Love you Dan!
        > >
        > > Love you Faithe!
        > >
        > > - D -
        > >
        >
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