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Re: [Meditation Society of America] Re: The Lone Poster/Deep and Deeper

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  • sean tremblay
    just a question? How does a fella know if he is enlightened and not in a self deluded? ... From: schatzman Subject: [Meditation Society of
    Message 1 of 8 , Jun 21, 2009
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      just a question?
      How does a fella know if he is enlightened and not in a self deluded?

      --- On Sat, 6/20/09, schatzman <pearboy@...> wrote:

      From: schatzman <pearboy@...>
      Subject: [Meditation Society of America] Re: The Lone Poster/Deep and Deeper
      To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Saturday, June 20, 2009, 1:17 PM

      keep it comin', dude.
      tks.

      --- In meditationsocietyof america@yahoogro ups.com, "Jeff Belyea" <jeff@...> wrote:
      >
      > At the risk of appearing
      > a post hog, a couple of
      > points in response to
      > Sandeep and Dan -
      >
      > (No supporting cast of
      > quotes)
      >
      > About contrast as the
      > way to know:
      >
      > It's the way we learn
      > and process with the
      > linear, rational faculties,
      > but with enlightened
      > awakening,a "Knowing"
      > without contrast is
      > revealed. The step
      > into pure being is a
      > step into the bliss
      > of unconditional
      > acceptance of every
      > circumstance and event
      > as 'perfect'. This is
      > life lived by intuition,
      > inspiration and revelation.
      >
      >
      > About the localized
      > experience as illusory:
      >
      > Enlightenment and the
      > joy it brings is not
      > localized. The self is
      > not the experiencer of
      > enlightened awakening,
      > the self dissolves into
      > the One of absolute
      > perfection of Self-
      > Realization.
      >
      > Reference to this
      > Self-Realization of Oneness
      > necessarily uses the
      > dualistic vehicle of
      > language, and speaks
      > in the dualistic context of
      > relative reality, but those
      > who speak of enlightened
      > awakening authentically
      > speak in the language
      > of the heart.
      >
      > The language of the heart
      > is not comprehended by
      > those who have not learned
      > it, and they hear the
      > report as coming from
      > ego and self-reference -
      > in error.
      >
      > Meditation is the study
      > hall for learning the
      > language of the heart.
      >
      > One Love,
      >
      > Jeff
      >


    • sean tremblay
      that last post may have been incomplete every time I log in people need to chat!? ... From: schatzman Subject: [Meditation Society of
      Message 2 of 8 , Jun 21, 2009
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        that last post may have been incomplete every time I log in people need to chat!?

        --- On Sat, 6/20/09, schatzman <pearboy@...> wrote:

        From: schatzman <pearboy@...>
        Subject: [Meditation Society of America] Re: The Lone Poster/Deep and Deeper
        To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Saturday, June 20, 2009, 1:17 PM

        keep it comin', dude.
        tks.

        --- In meditationsocietyof america@yahoogro ups.com, "Jeff Belyea" <jeff@...> wrote:
        >
        > At the risk of appearing
        > a post hog, a couple of
        > points in response to
        > Sandeep and Dan -
        >
        > (No supporting cast of
        > quotes)
        >
        > About contrast as the
        > way to know:
        >
        > It's the way we learn
        > and process with the
        > linear, rational faculties,
        > but with enlightened
        > awakening,a "Knowing"
        > without contrast is
        > revealed. The step
        > into pure being is a
        > step into the bliss
        > of unconditional
        > acceptance of every
        > circumstance and event
        > as 'perfect'. This is
        > life lived by intuition,
        > inspiration and revelation.
        >
        >
        > About the localized
        > experience as illusory:
        >
        > Enlightenment and the
        > joy it brings is not
        > localized. The self is
        > not the experiencer of
        > enlightened awakening,
        > the self dissolves into
        > the One of absolute
        > perfection of Self-
        > Realization.
        >
        > Reference to this
        > Self-Realization of Oneness
        > necessarily uses the
        > dualistic vehicle of
        > language, and speaks
        > in the dualistic context of
        > relative reality, but those
        > who speak of enlightened
        > awakening authentically
        > speak in the language
        > of the heart.
        >
        > The language of the heart
        > is not comprehended by
        > those who have not learned
        > it, and they hear the
        > report as coming from
        > ego and self-reference -
        > in error.
        >
        > Meditation is the study
        > hall for learning the
        > language of the heart.
        >
        > One Love,
        >
        > Jeff
        >


      • Jeff Belyea
        Why would a fella even care? If enlightened, the question would never come to mind. Enlightened are enlightened about their delusions. --Dogen If
        Message 3 of 8 , Jun 21, 2009
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          Why would a fella even care?

          If enlightened, the question
          would never come to mind.

          "Enlightened are enlightened
          about their delusions." --Dogen

          If self-deluded, the question
          would never come to mind.

          ----------------------------

          "Give me enough wine or
          leave me alone." --Rumi

          God-intoxicated,

          Jeff


          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, sean tremblay <bethjams9@...> wrote:
          >
          > just a question?
          > How does a fella know if he is enlightened and not in a self deluded?
          >
          > --- On Sat, 6/20/09, schatzman <pearboy@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > From: schatzman <pearboy@...>
          > Subject: [Meditation Society of America] Re: The Lone Poster/Deep and Deeper
          > To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
          > Date: Saturday, June 20, 2009, 1:17 PM
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > keep it comin', dude.
          > tks.
          >
          > --- In meditationsocietyof america@yahoogro ups.com, "Jeff Belyea" <jeff@> wrote:
          > >
          > > At the risk of appearing
          > > a post hog, a couple of
          > > points in response to
          > > Sandeep and Dan -
          > >
          > > (No supporting cast of
          > > quotes)
          > >
          > > About contrast as the
          > > way to know:
          > >
          > > It's the way we learn
          > > and process with the
          > > linear, rational faculties,
          > > but with enlightened
          > > awakening,a "Knowing"
          > > without contrast is
          > > revealed. The step
          > > into pure being is a
          > > step into the bliss
          > > of unconditional
          > > acceptance of every
          > > circumstance and event
          > > as 'perfect'. This is
          > > life lived by intuition,
          > > inspiration and revelation.
          > >
          > >
          > > About the localized
          > > experience as illusory:
          > >
          > > Enlightenment and the
          > > joy it brings is not
          > > localized. The self is
          > > not the experiencer of
          > > enlightened awakening,
          > > the self dissolves into
          > > the One of absolute
          > > perfection of Self-
          > > Realization.
          > >
          > > Reference to this
          > > Self-Realization of Oneness
          > > necessarily uses the
          > > dualistic vehicle of
          > > language, and speaks
          > > in the dualistic context of
          > > relative reality, but those
          > > who speak of enlightened
          > > awakening authentically
          > > speak in the language
          > > of the heart.
          > >
          > > The language of the heart
          > > is not comprehended by
          > > those who have not learned
          > > it, and they hear the
          > > report as coming from
          > > ego and self-reference -
          > > in error.
          > >
          > > Meditation is the study
          > > hall for learning the
          > > language of the heart.
          > >
          > > One Love,
          > >
          > > Jeff
          > >
          >
        • dan330033
          Because there is no other involved to seek validation from. Nor is there any other that has ever been encountered. The words and ideas generated in response to
          Message 4 of 8 , Jun 21, 2009
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            Because there is no other involved to seek validation from.

            Nor is there any other that has ever been encountered.

            The words and ideas generated in response to contacting others, the images presented to and from others, the self that relates to others, have no relevance this timeless all-moment.

            - D -



            --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, sean tremblay <bethjams9@...> wrote:
            >
            > just a question?
            > How does a fella know if he is enlightened and not in a self deluded?
            >
            > --- On Sat, 6/20/09, schatzman <pearboy@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > From: schatzman <pearboy@...>
            > Subject: [Meditation Society of America] Re: The Lone Poster/Deep and Deeper
            > To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
            > Date: Saturday, June 20, 2009, 1:17 PM
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > keep it comin', dude.
            > tks.
            >
            > --- In meditationsocietyof america@yahoogro ups.com, "Jeff Belyea" <jeff@> wrote:
            > >
            > > At the risk of appearing
            > > a post hog, a couple of
            > > points in response to
            > > Sandeep and Dan -
            > >
            > > (No supporting cast of
            > > quotes)
            > >
            > > About contrast as the
            > > way to know:
            > >
            > > It's the way we learn
            > > and process with the
            > > linear, rational faculties,
            > > but with enlightened
            > > awakening,a "Knowing"
            > > without contrast is
            > > revealed. The step
            > > into pure being is a
            > > step into the bliss
            > > of unconditional
            > > acceptance of every
            > > circumstance and event
            > > as 'perfect'. This is
            > > life lived by intuition,
            > > inspiration and revelation.
            > >
            > >
            > > About the localized
            > > experience as illusory:
            > >
            > > Enlightenment and the
            > > joy it brings is not
            > > localized. The self is
            > > not the experiencer of
            > > enlightened awakening,
            > > the self dissolves into
            > > the One of absolute
            > > perfection of Self-
            > > Realization.
            > >
            > > Reference to this
            > > Self-Realization of Oneness
            > > necessarily uses the
            > > dualistic vehicle of
            > > language, and speaks
            > > in the dualistic context of
            > > relative reality, but those
            > > who speak of enlightened
            > > awakening authentically
            > > speak in the language
            > > of the heart.
            > >
            > > The language of the heart
            > > is not comprehended by
            > > those who have not learned
            > > it, and they hear the
            > > report as coming from
            > > ego and self-reference -
            > > in error.
            > >
            > > Meditation is the study
            > > hall for learning the
            > > language of the heart.
            > >
            > > One Love,
            > >
            > > Jeff
            > >
            >
          • medit8ionsociety
            ... If you can start the day without caffeine or pep pills, If you can be cheerful, ignoring aches and pains, If you can resist complaining and boring people
            Message 5 of 8 , Jun 22, 2009
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              sean tremblay <bethjams9@...> wrote:
              >
              > just a question?
              > How does a fella know if he is enlightened and not in a self deluded?
              >

              If you can start the day without caffeine or pep pills,
              If you can be cheerful, ignoring aches and pains,
              If you can resist complaining and boring people with your troubles,
              If you can eat the same food everyday and be grateful for it,
              If you can understand when loved ones are too busy to give you time,
              If you can overlook when people take things out
              on you when, through no fault of yours, something goes wrong,
              If you can take criticism and blame without resentment,
              If you can face the world without lies and deceit,
              If you can conquer tension without medical help,
              If you can relax without liquor,
              If you can sleep without the aid of drugs,

              If you can do all these things, ..........

              Then you're Enlightened ...
              or more likely, you are the family dog...
            • Sandeep
              /*Hi Jeff, Greetings */ ... /*You have gathered the words Jeff but have no clue. The term revelation is another fancy word for an experience. Knowing in
              Message 6 of 8 , Jun 22, 2009
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                Hi Jeff,

                Greetings

                Jeff Belyea wrote:

                At the risk of appearing
                a post hog, a couple of
                points in response to
                Sandeep and Dan -

                (No supporting cast of
                quotes)

                About contrast as the
                way to know:

                It's the way we learn
                and process with the
                linear, rational faculties,
                but with enlightened
                awakening,a "Knowing"
                without contrast is
                revealed.


















                You have gathered the words Jeff but have no clue.

                The term "revelation" is another fancy word for an experience.

                Knowing in which no contrasts prevails......is not an experience.

                Why not?

                An experience is a durational event and exists only in contrast...... the time when the experience has not yet started
                in contrast to the time when it has ended.

                It makes no difference whether the duration of the experience is 60 secs or a 1000 years.

                And  whether the
                sense of qualification surrounding the experience  is that of "profoundity" or "profanity".
                 





                The step
                into pure being is a
                step into the bliss
                of unconditional
                acceptance of every
                circumstance and event
                as 'perfect'.








                Well, it would appear that you have yet to step, eh Jeff?

                Whatever Dan was stating, whatever be the pointing of this prattling.....is hardly acceptable and ......far from  perfect.

                For Jeff.

                :-)


                This is
                life lived by intuition,
                inspiration and revelation.




                Baloney.

                STOP.

                Rather than rushing to a key board to punch out a defense Jeff.....observe the arising reaction at the grade given to your fine exposition.

                And that will indicate how much of life is being lived in intuition, inspiration and revelation.




                About the localized
                experience as illusory:

                Enlightenment and the
                joy it brings is not
                localized. The self is
                not the experiencer of
                enlightened awakening,









                OK.

                No self.

                And yet you seem to have noted all sorts of descriptions for this non-experienced experience.




                the self dissolves into
                the One of absolute
                perfection of Self-
                Realization.





                Dear Jeff......for a dissolving to occur......an apriori existence is a must.





                Reference to this
                Self-Realization of Oneness
                necessarily uses the
                dualistic vehicle of
                language, and speaks
                in the dualistic context of
                relative reality,








                Which is why the very referencing ......forget what the content of the referencing may be....

                ......is akin one of the characters in your last night sleep dream......

                 referencing...... no doubt profoundly and even using the language of the heart for the referencing ..

                .... the shape of your nose.


                 
                Hiding behind the excuse that language is dualistic is an age old fig leaf, dear Jeff.

                Language which is sequenced sounds or sequenced pixels on a PC screen is never dualistic.

                There is fact nothing in phenomenality that is dualistic.




                but those
                who speak of enlightened
                awakening authentically
                speak in the language
                of the heart.






                Those who speak ....."OF".... enlightened awakening speak in the language of accumulations and gatherings.

                Accumulated bromides and gathered phrases.

                Knowing without contrasts............... does not have the space........ to allow the existence of an "of".



                1


                The language of the heart
                is not comprehended by
                those who have not learned
                it,






                The language of the heart can never be learnt.

                When all learning gets casted aside.......the heart beating in resonance with the universal pulse is audible.

                Audible............ but not to an ear.

                And from that resonance springs forth creativity.





                and they hear the
                report as coming from
                ego and self-reference -
                in error.

                Meditation is the study
                hall for learning the
                language of the heart.








                As soon as thought creeps up as "Meditation is...X,Y,Z"....

                .....meditation is obscured.


                An emptying.

                And the emptying of the very emptying.


                DooooBeee Doooo .......Dooo Beeeee Doooooo





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