Re: Applied Meditation and into The Mystic
- Thanks, Sean. First of all, let me write that you are one of the most
beautiful and pristine BE-INGS I have ever known. (Note for readers:
I first met Sean when he was 8 months old, and spent time with him
until age 6, and for the past 30 years have had little contact). It
was evident from the first days I knew you.
Secondly, I apologize for misspelling Tremblay (Trembley), my lame
excuse is that it was late (for me) and we share a lot of B E L Y and
A letters in our names.
Yes, I perfectly agree that the childlike state IS the return to the
Garden of Eden, and I appreciate your comments that your earthy view
if from that perspective. As I wrote, the primary identity
(Transcendence) enfolds the secondary identify without sacrificing
the joy of both. So, you can enjoy the sensual delights and the
blissful non-attachment at the same time. This may boogle the literal
mind, but the transcendent realization harmonizes this naturally.
About the pain issue, that I have not followed closely...
Again, you are right. If pain and discomfort has manifested, it has
not been dealt with spiritually and is best addressed on the physical
level, through the wisdom of much of conventional medicine and trauma
treatment. (Bob Rose has both the knowledge of the traditional
medical approach and, of course, the meditative approach...and he may
expond on this).
Your recall of listening to the Joe Cocker album just about gave me
an out-of-body experience. Thanks for the delicious taste of
nostalgia. (BTW - Your mother was a great cook in those days.)
Love, as always,
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, sean tremblay
>recently in reference to pain and meditation Does not seem to
> Jeff, I think a few need to respond. What I have been reading
adiquitly adress Aideen's problem. The article sent refers to
the "Normal" and "Minor" aches and pains assciated with sitting in
Zazen for a determinate amount of time, or on a bus or an airport
bench for that matter. It does not adress pain indications of serious
problems and what Aideen was describing was an indication that
something may be Biologically wrong, Saint Hildigard, Mary Baker Eddy
the Buddha and many others have discussed the inner roots of disease
and injury, but the injury must be treated as well as the cause of it
in the physical as well as the metaphysical. The point is the
student needs to develope not an intuitive link to understanding the
mind and bodies relationship and to understand the signals that the
body sends us. "Transending" physical limitations are both
powerfull and positive things examples being marathon runners
> and endurance events. That is not the same thing as ignoring apotentialy serious inury for the sake of a vaque "Attachment" to
ideas of transendence. It would defeat the purpose of meditation for
the student to endure physical suffering especialy suffering that may
indicate a serious heath problem. Most of us know the difference
between serious pain and superficial discomfort but the fear of
failure at our practice or disciplin might cause us to ignore of
override the physical indications of injury. Biologicaly speaking
our minds and bodies are born, grow and then decay. At a certain
point on a cellular level we begin to die and we spend years doing
it. in the interim, we can transend that discomfort of dieing, we can
override the discomfort of dieing but we are still dieing. Pain
injury and illness are are a part of this. And if not fully adressed
they can become a self consuming thing in and of itself. AN example
would be my Aunt who died of cancer. It took her
> ten years to die, after many years of diet, meditation, chemo, andmore meditation she died, she felt pain and discomfort but she died
and was at peace the moment she did.
> I wanted to touch also on Jeffs point returning to a pure statelike childhood, I agree completly, that is what I refer to as the
garden of eden, because that is the condition of our essencial
human "BE-ING" when I was a kid I still remember running as fat as i
could through the main woods occasionaly stopping to pick wild
blackberry or an occasioal wild strawberry, I remember climbing trees
and dicovering a stream to be forded or a cool little grotto to hide
out in, there were horseshoe crabs in the bay inlets and blue heron,
the woods had porcupine and racoons. The world was wonderfull and as
a kid you directly experience it for what it is and not what you want
it to be, and you took people the same way. That original state free
from judgement when we were free to observe "Idependent Reality"
instead of the frustrated, diasapointed, hurt angry dependent reality
of the Adult world. So to return to that free state is a return to
being the kid whos spacing out watching
> light reflect off of dust particles while listening to Jeff's Joecocker albums on the head phones. In the next room Jeff scrapes
something of an alum cover, and in the KItchen my moms burning down
the house trying to make home made doughnuts.
> The dependent reality is the one of cause and effect. He said shesaid. That make me so made. She made me do this and all the other
Attachements to things and Stuff of this world as if they realy had
value. A car is a car a dollar is a dollar, render onto Ceasar and
all that stuff. The return to BE-ING is the basis of my sensual and
earthy philosphy. It is about the here and now the just being
enjoying the experience of Family and experiencing relationships and
my relationship with the world around me as it is. For me exploration
is also a big part of experiencing the world, the joy of discovery.
An example of attachments and suffering would be to save hundreds or
thousands of dollars for your dream vacation....lets say to
Thailand. you've done your research and planned every little detail
down to the minute. A beach bungalo so on and so forth.....When the
vacationer arrives he realizes it nothing like what he imagined.
Now he is about to experience the worst
> disaster of his life setting him back thousands of dollars andhard work for nothing! or... he is about to embark on the most life
altering adventure in his life!
> Just a few afternoon rambles
> I didnt hit spell check, because the kids want tuna sandwiches.
> Jeff Belyea <jeff@...> wrote:
> The practical application of meditation
> for stress and as part of goal achievement
> strategies - ranging from quiting smoking to
> supremely practical goal of transcendence
> is well known, and has been part of many
> meditation teachings (including my own)
> Your mind may have hit a pothole at
> reading the words practical and
> transcendence in the same sentence...
> but all goals have the very same
> core: happiness and peace of mind.
> These are success at its core, regardless
> of the "vehicles" (new house, car, career,
> relationship, fitness,...) viewed as
> necessary for success.
> Transcendence, therefore, is the
> supremely practical goal, because
> transcendence brings happiness and
> peace of mind beyond what any of the
> temporary thrill ofmaterial vehicles
> can bring.
> Transcendent is a return
> to the childlike, goal free, worry
> free, sheer joy that is our birthright -
> and which we forfeited and forgot through
> coercian by our early teachers,
> who forced social order on us, and
> robbed us of our true identity
> and our true home.
> Meditation can return us to our
> true home. However, the phrase true home
> is meaningless, in its "true" sense,
> unless the return has been experienced.
> If it hasn't, we settle for much less
> - a secondary existence and limited
> perspective that we naively mistate
> for our true existence.
> When the earthy, solid, practical
> philosophies of say, a Sean Trembley,
> and Zen teachings of chop wood, carry
> water before and after transcendence
> are presented, they are unassailably
> worthwhile: eat good food, raise happy
> kids, come in out of the rain...
> These are aspects of secondary consciousness
> and limited intrepretations, limited to the
> sensual and emotional apparatus that we have
> "inherited" as home on this earthly plane.
> And...these are adopted reflections
> that satisfy the "I" of the ego, the
> I that does not recognize (has forgotten)
> the freedom from goals and need for
> sensual delights (including food and
> dry clothes) in order to shine. (That
> is not to say that sensual delights
> and dry clothes are not to be enjoyed.
> It is just a matter of recognized
> their impermanence, and the impermanence
> of the joy they bring.
> Transcendence, on the other hand,
> is primary existence, a timeless
> and blissful level of consciousness
> that has nothing to do with the mortal
> life or sensory apparatus. The secondary
> existence is blended into the transcendent
> level of consciousness, but it is
> recognized as secondary, and allows
> for absolute freedom from self-consciousness
> in favor of blissful Self consciousness.
> Meditation can open the door to this
> new (renewed) understanding.
> Just a midnight ramble.
> Got a little couch potato?
> Check out fun summer activities for kids.