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Re: Awareness Meditation

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  • Stephen Johnston
    Hi, I m relatively new to meditation myself, but from what others have told me, this could be your ego rebelling against meditation, as the ultimate goal of
    Message 1 of 6 , Jul 25, 2006
      Hi,
       
      I'm relatively new to meditation myself, but from what others have told me, this could be your ego rebelling against meditation, as the ultimate goal of meditation is to lose a sense of "self". I feel the same peaceful qualities you describe, but I don't have the feeling that I want to stop. However, I smetimes have a general feeling of dread underneath my now much calmer personality. Again, the ego thing I'm told.
       
      It could also be some free-ranging issues you have that may be trying to surface once you start calming the chatter.
       
      I hope somebody with more experience in this area is able to help further.  I think this type of thing really underlines the need for an experienced "master".
       
      Anybody know a reputable one in the Amsterdam area?
       
      Stephen 
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: 25 July 2006 12:52
      Subject: [newmail] [Meditation Society of America] Awareness Meditation

      Hi Everybody
       
      I've already sent the below message to medit8@..., but I thought it's always good to ask everyone's opinion on this. So here it goes: 
       
      I've just recently started meditation. And no I don't do any concentration meditation, in other words I don't concentrate on any object or image but rather I do awareness meditation. You know just observing your thoughts, the physical sensations, breath  etc.. just simply being aware (easy said than done!) And I'am now able to sit for like more than just 20 minutes. But when I start pushing myself to sit for more than 20 minutes that is like 35 minutes or so, I suddenly start feeling (i don't know how to explain this) very peaceful and serene (i don't think even these words could explain it properly), i've never felt tha t before, I've never felt that sort of tranquility before ( I guess this is something that you would feel only when your meditating), it's just a really beautiful feeling, my head just starts to feel really light. But as I start feeling tranquil, at the same time, simaltaneously I start feeling very, very restless and I feel fear arising in me. I don't understand why I start to suddenly feel very scared and restless. At that particular moment all I want to do is to just open my eyes and get out of meditation. At that particular moment I feel like there is some sort of a restless battle waging on inside me. A part of me is just screaming and begging to stop the meditation, and get out of it immediately. And another part of me is telling me to just be patient and persistent, to not stop, to not open my eyes, and keep going, and to just be aware of the fear arising in me. I'am unable to go beyond 35 minutes. I can sit for more than 35 minutes, but only with a 5 minutes break in between. otherwise sitting in one stretch for more than 35 minutes is just scary. I don't know why I start feeling so scared and restless, or rather should i say what am I so scared of??? I'am really curious. Have any of you ever felt this when you first started meditation?????
       
      Thanking You,
      Yeshwanthi


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    • Sandeep
      *Hi Yeshwanthi (and Stephen), First of all 35 mins is not a milestone which has to be crossed. As soon as as there is a sense of a milestone which has to be
      Message 2 of 6 , Jul 25, 2006
        Hi Yeshwanthi (and Stephen),



        First of all 35 mins is not a milestone which has to be crossed.

        As soon as as there is a sense of a milestone which has to be crossed......

        .....and thus the associated sense of satisfaction of having achieved it, or the sense of despair with not having achieved it...

        ...it's the usual game.

        Round and round the mulberry bush..........around  now a new mulberry bush.
         

        So on some occasions........2 mins is all that happens.

        And is appropriate

        And on another occasion the elapsing of maybe 2 days...........is appropriate.

        And on a different occasion........it just does not happen and the non-happening is appropriate.



        On the specific turmoil..........between the two options of wanting to stop and wanting to breach 35 mins, or 40 mins or 60 mins or whatever is the sense of a new target....

        ....rather than "what am I so scared of"..............be in the quest.............just who is it..... that is scared?

        For whom is this sense of a turmoil?

        For whom is this arising sense of fear, dread?


        Essentially.........sense of turmoil.........and it's acute form the sense of fear or dread......irrespective of it's content, hue, form or intensity....

        ....is an arising thought, .....with maybe an associated sensation in the body........ is it not?



        To whom has this thought occurred?

        Who has taken delivery of  this thought?

        Who is "Yeshwanthi".............for whom that entire hoopla exists........ and is of significance?




        As can be seen.........this questing................need not remain confined to a period of 35 mins............but can be the underlying current......over a 24 hours period..........where for each of the changing moods, feelings, decisions , acts, behaviours, impacting results of these acts.......

        .....dotting the whole of the waking period as well as the sleep period.....

        ....the questing remains...

        ..to whom has this particular thought occurred to?

        Who has taken delivery of  this thought?




        And there is the uncovering of meditativeness...(to use a conceptual term)..........as opposed to technique-based/object-related durational meditation..........

        ...meditativeness which is not confined to duration, not subjected to location or circumstances and  not related to objects.........

        including the sense of an object..which is.....the "me-meditator"........the sense of "me-Yeshwanthi".







        .



         



        Stephen Johnston wrote:

        Hi,
         
        I'm relatively new to meditation myself, but from what others have told me, this could be your ego rebelling against meditation, as the ultimate goal of meditation is to lose a sense of "self". I feel the same peaceful qualities you describe, but I don't have the feeling that I want to stop. However, I smetimes have a general feeling of dread underneath my now much calmer personality. Again, the ego thing I'm told.
         
        It could also be some free-ranging issues you have that may be trying to surface once you start calming the chatter.
         
        I hope somebody with more experience in this area is able to help further.  I think this type of thing really underlines the need for an experienced "master".
         
        Anybody know a reputable one in the Amsterdam area?
         
        Stephen 
         
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: 25 July 2006 12:52
        Subject: [newmail] [Meditation Society of America] Awareness Meditation

        Hi Everybody
         
        I've already sent the below message to medit8@..., but I thought it's always good to ask everyone's opinion on this. So here it goes: 
         
        I've just recently started meditation. And no I don't do any concentration meditation, in other words I don't concentrate on any object or image but rather I do awareness meditation. You know just observing your thoughts, the physical sensations, breath  etc.. just simply being aware (easy said than done!) And I'am now able to sit for like more than just 20 minutes. But when I start pushing myself to sit for more than 20 minutes that is like 35 minutes or so, I suddenly start feeling (i don't know how to explain this) very peaceful and serene (i don't think even these words could explain it properly), i've never felt tha t before, I've never felt that sort of tranquility before ( I guess this is something that you would feel only when your meditating), it's just a really beautiful feeling, my head just starts to feel really light. But as I start feeling tranquil, at the same time, simaltaneously I start feeling very, very restless and I feel fear arising in me. I don't understand why I start to suddenly feel very scared and restless. At that particular moment all I want to do is to just open my eyes and get out of meditation. At that particular moment I feel like there is some sort of a restless battle waging on inside me. A part of me is just screaming and begging to stop the meditation, and get out of it immediately. And another part of me is telling me to just be patient and persistent, to not stop, to not open my eyes, and keep going, and to just be aware of the fear arising in me. I'am unable to go beyond 35 minutes. I can sit for more than 35 minutes, but only with a 5 minutes break in between. otherwise sitting in one stretch for more than 35 minutes is just scary. I don't know why I start feeling so scared and restless, or rather should i say what am I so scared of??? I'am really curious. Have any of you ever felt this when you first started meditation?????
         
        Thanking You,
        Yeshwanthi


        Jul-06
          
      • Benjamin Buehne
        Hello Yeshwanthi, Now I am by no means a master but I am an experienced meditator and work in the mental health field. I am not certain but it sounds like you
        Message 3 of 6 , Jul 25, 2006
          Hello Yeshwanthi,

          Now I am by no means a master but I am an
          experienced meditator and work in the mental health
          field. I am not certain but it sounds like you are
          inducing Mania with form of meditation.

          Let me clarify why I think this. Mania would be
          the opposite of depression. Here is the symptoms...
          http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=4271
          . Rather than finding a way to shut off your mind you
          are overheating it. Think of your computer... it can
          only process so much and then will struggle if you run
          too many programs at once. Well the mind is used to
          processing only so much... and overloading has the
          effects of Mania.

          It is not uncommon for those experiencing Mania
          to have severe panic attacks. It is also not uncommon
          to have severe mood swings. While the initial effect
          may be euphoric, Mania weakens your judgement and is
          an extreme rather than a center.

          In my experience Meditation is about finding a
          center and balance. You are looking for a way for
          your mind to be neither high nor low... but to simply
          be. Concentrating one 1 thing is a gateway... it puts
          your mind in a constant state. Eventually, this 1
          thing may slip away and then you have nothingness. I
          don't think this can happen with the meditation method
          you describe, although I could be wrong.

          In addition though, I have found that fear may
          arise before going to this next level. Before I had
          done that, I awoke several times as if being shocked
          back to conciousness. It's a fearful experience at
          first because it's unfamiliar. You could be
          experiencing this... but I then wonder if your method
          would allow you to transition further as your thoughts
          may be racing. YOu must decide if you feel that this
          is the case and if you choose to alter or continue
          this form of meditation.

          Just trying to add my 2 cents... hope this helps.

          Sincerely,
          Ben

          --- yeshwanthi vasudevan <badgirl_nofear@...>
          wrote:

          > Hi Everybody
          >
          > I've already sent the below message to
          > medit8@..., but I thought it's
          > always good to ask everyone's opinion on this. So
          > here it goes:
          >
          > I've just recently started meditation. And no I
          > don't do any concentration meditation, in other
          > words I don't concentrate on any object or image but
          > rather I do awareness meditation. You know just
          > observing your thoughts, the physical sensations,
          > breath etc.. just simply being aware (easy said
          > than done!) And I'am now able to sit for like more
          > than just 20 minutes. But when I start pushing
          > myself to sit for more than 20 minutes that is like
          > 35 minutes or so, I suddenly start feeling (i don't
          > know how to explain this) very peaceful and serene
          > (i don't think even these words could explain it
          > properly), i've never felt that before, I've never
          > felt that sort of tranquility before ( I guess this
          > is something that you would feel only when your
          > meditating), it's just a really beautiful feeling,
          > my head just starts to feel really light. But as I
          > start feeling tranquil, at the same time,
          > simaltaneously I start feeling very, very restless
          > and I feel fear arising in me. I don't
          > understand why I start to suddenly feel very scared
          > and restless. At that particular moment all I want
          > to do is to just open my eyes and get out of
          > meditation. At that particular moment I feel like
          > there is some sort of a restless battle waging on
          > inside me. A part of me is just screaming and
          > begging to stop the meditation, and get out of it
          > immediately. And another part of me is telling me to
          > just be patient and persistent, to not stop, to not
          > open my eyes, and keep going, and to just be aware
          > of the fear arising in me. I'am unable to go beyond
          > 35 minutes. I can sit for more than 35 minutes, but
          > only with a 5 minutes break in between. otherwise
          > sitting in one stretch for more than 35 minutes is
          > just scary. I don't know why I start feeling so
          > scared and restless, or rather should i say what am
          > I so scared of??? I'am really curious. Have any of
          > you ever felt this when you first started
          > meditation?????
          >
          > Thanking You,
          > Yeshwanthi
          >
          >
          > ---------------------------------
          > Find out what India is talking about on Yahoo!
          > Answers India.


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        • Michael
          I am also a novice where meditation is concerned (only meditating since January)and by far am no master, however, I had experiences similar to what you
          Message 4 of 6 , Jul 25, 2006
            I am also a novice where meditation is concerned (only meditating
            since January)and by far am no master, however, I had experiences
            similar to what you describe although not as intense. I eventually
            found my fear was the fear of releasing control. As you go deeper
            into meditation, deeper into your true, inner self, closer to our
            Universal Source, it becomes necessary to "let go" of your
            egocentric, earthly part of your being and proceed to the next
            spiritual level. That "letting go" can be a scary experience. I got
            past it by practicing a little technique. While meditating, when the
            sense of fear began, I focused on the words "There is nothing to
            fear." I also matched the words to my breathing. As I inhaled I
            thought, "There is nothing..." and then on the exhale,
            thought, "...to fear." I eventually got over the threshold. I hope
            this helps.

            --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, yeshwanthi
            vasudevan <badgirl_nofear@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi Everybody
            >
            > I've already sent the below message to medit8@..., but I thought
            it's always good to ask everyone's opinion on this. So here it goes:
            >
            > I've just recently started meditation. And no I don't do any
            concentration meditation, in other words I don't concentrate on any
            object or image but rather I do awareness meditation. You know just
            observing your thoughts, the physical sensations, breath etc.. just
            simply being aware (easy said than done!) And I'am now able to sit
            for like more than just 20 minutes. But when I start pushing myself
            to sit for more than 20 minutes that is like 35 minutes or so, I
            suddenly start feeling (i don't know how to explain this) very
            peaceful and serene (i don't think even these words could explain it
            properly), i've never felt that before, I've never felt that sort of
            tranquility before ( I guess this is something that you would feel
            only when your meditating), it's just a really beautiful feeling, my
            head just starts to feel really light. But as I start feeling
            tranquil, at the same time, simaltaneously I start feeling very, very
            restless and I feel fear arising in me. I don't
            > understand why I start to suddenly feel very scared and restless.
            At that particular moment all I want to do is to just open my eyes
            and get out of meditation. At that particular moment I feel like
            there is some sort of a restless battle waging on inside me. A part
            of me is just screaming and begging to stop the meditation, and get
            out of it immediately. And another part of me is telling me to just
            be patient and persistent, to not stop, to not open my eyes, and keep
            going, and to just be aware of the fear arising in me. I'am unable to
            go beyond 35 minutes. I can sit for more than 35 minutes, but only
            with a 5 minutes break in between. otherwise sitting in one stretch
            for more than 35 minutes is just scary. I don't know why I start
            feeling so scared and restless, or rather should i say what am I so
            scared of??? I'am really curious. Have any of you ever felt this when
            you first started meditation?????
            >
            > Thanking You,
            > Yeshwanthi
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > Find out what India is talking about on Yahoo! Answers India.
            >
          • Rushikant Mehta
            Yeshwanthiji : Why not to accept the reality ? Continue your meditation of just being aware of whatever is the reality of the moment. And react not by desiring
            Message 5 of 6 , Jul 30, 2006
              Yeshwanthiji :
               
              Why not to accept the reality ? Continue your meditation of just being aware of whatever is the reality of the moment. And react not by desiring anything otherwise than what the Nature manifests, on the body or in the mind.
               
              If you do not wish the pent up fear to surface, how can you get rid of it ? Same with all supressed emotions & negativities. Let them come up & pass. It's real catharsis.
               
              And why insist on longer than 35 minutes ? Persist in the efforts, the meditation, the awareness; continually, if not continuously.
               
              Still if you want to do it more systematically in protective environment, under guidence, visit www.dhamma.org.
               
              May your determination to develop in self-awareness lead you to the Ultimate
              Enlightenment.
               
              -rushikant.
              yeshwanthi vasudevan <badgirl_nofear@...> wrote:
              Hi Everybody
               
              I've already sent the below message to medit8@..., but I thought it's always good to ask everyone's opinion on this. So here it goes: 
               
              I've just recently started meditation. And no I don't do any concentration meditation, in other words I don't concentrate on any object or image but rather I do awareness meditation. You know just observing your thoughts, the physical sensations, breath  etc.. just simply being aware (easy said than done!) And I'am now able to sit for like more than just 20 minutes. But when I start pushing myself to sit for more than 20 minutes that is like 35 minutes or so, I suddenly start feeling (i don't know how to explain this) very peaceful and serene (i don't think even these words could explain it properly), i've never felt that before, I've never felt that sort of tranquility before ( I guess this is something that you would feel only when your meditating), it's just a really beautiful feeling, my head just starts to feel really light. But as I start feeling tranquil, at the same time, simaltaneously I start feeling very, very restless and I feel fear arising in me. I don't understand why I start to suddenly feel very scared and restless. At that particular moment all I want to do is to just open my eyes and get out of meditation. At that particular moment I feel like there is some sort of a restless battle waging on inside me. A part of me is just screaming and begging to stop the meditation, and get out of it immediately. And another part of me is telling me to just be patient and persistent, to not stop, to not open my eyes, and keep going, and to just be aware of the fear arising in me. I'am unable to go beyond 35 minutes. I can sit for more than 35 minutes, but only with a 5 minutes break in between. otherwise sitting in one stretch for more than 35 minutes is just scary. I don't know why I start feeling so scared and restless, or rather should i say what am I so scared of??? I'am really curious. Have any of you ever felt this when you first started meditation?????
               
              Thanking You,
              Yeshwanthi

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