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Re: Incarnation and Reincarnation

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  • mlcanow
    This is so true. Mind is so used to try to explain everything, that when the concepts or ideas about reincarnation come about, it tends to get trapped in new
    Message 1 of 6 , Nov 23, 2005
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      This is so true. Mind is so used to try to explain everything, that when the
      concepts or ideas about reincarnation come about, it tends to get trapped in
      new knowings that I would dare to call irrelevant. Why should we be
      concerned about past or future lifes, when we are not even aware of this
      present one?

      Love,

      Maria Luisa


      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, medit8ionsociety <no_
      reply@y...> wrote:
      >
      > Incarnation and Reincarnation
      >
      > There is no need at all to talk of what we
      > are not aware of, and this is very well
      > demonstrated by any attempt to talk about
      > reincarnation. This is relative to the
      > reality that for 99.999% of the time we
      > are not aware of the incarnation we are in now.
      > Most always we are simply reacting to either
      > our sensory input, our emotions, or our mind
      > chatter. Our lives can be seen to be like a
      > sleepwalker in a dream. Only when we awaken to
      > the ongoing present can we speak of this
      > incarnation with any validity, let alone any
      > past or future ones. Reincarnation is not a
      > problem - incarnation is. And what this and all
      > our incarnations have in common is the potential
      > to awaken. Much like a seed that is dormant,
      > needing a sheltering and nurturing environment
      > to grow, so is our Real Self waiting to have its
      > coverings removed and be revealed for the infinite,
      > eternal, blissful flower in full bloom that is its
      > destiny. Meditation is an ancient and very
      > effective cultivation tool. And you may find
      > guidance in meditation by reading the scriptures of
      > whatever tradition you are drawn to, by trying
      > various methods to be present within and without
      > that you are led to, or even by doing nothing but
      > keeping your hand open and waiting for the key to
      > fall into it that will open the door to the Kingdom
      > of God within, or...whatever. But I think you will
      > find that actually meditating is the best way to
      > learn about meditation, and will be the most
      > effective way to proceed with your Coronation in
      > this incarnation. And then you can live now and
      > happily ever after.
      >
      > Peace and blessings,
      > Bob
      >
      > PS: This was in response to recent and frequent emails
      > we receive asking about what position we take about
      > reincarnation, and the seeming inadequacy of our
      > usual answer of "sitting down":-)
      >
    • Bruce Morgen
      True wisdom, very well said. Muchas gracias, mi amiga -- and thanks to also Bobji for prompting you to write it! Future lives, past lives, and the shifting
      Message 2 of 6 , Nov 23, 2005
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        True wisdom, very well said.
        Muchas gracias, mi amiga --
        and thanks to also Bobji for
        prompting you to write it!

        Future lives, past lives, and
        the shifting fortunes of the
        NFC East -- all transient
        occurences, mere ripples on a
        vastness beyond description,
        let alone explanation, the
        appearance of manifestation
        in an exquisite infinitude of
        formlessness. It is all, as
        J. Krishnamurti called it, "a
        great meditation." Perfect.

        mlcanow wrote:

        >This is so true. Mind is so used to try to explain everything, that when the
        >concepts or ideas about reincarnation come about, it tends to get trapped in new knowings that I would dare to call irrelevant. Why should we be
        >concerned about past or future lifes, when we are not even aware of this
        >present one?
        >
        >Love,
        >
        >Maria Luisa
        >
        >
        >--- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, medit8ionsociety <no_
        >reply@y...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >>Incarnation and Reincarnation
        >>
        >>There is no need at all to talk of what we
        >>are not aware of, and this is very well
        >>demonstrated by any attempt to talk about
        >>reincarnation. This is relative to the
        >>reality that for 99.999% of the time we
        >>are not aware of the incarnation we are in now.
        >>Most always we are simply reacting to either
        >>our sensory input, our emotions, or our mind
        >>chatter. Our lives can be seen to be like a
        >>sleepwalker in a dream. Only when we awaken to
        >>the ongoing present can we speak of this
        >>incarnation with any validity, let alone any
        >>past or future ones. Reincarnation is not a
        >>problem - incarnation is. And what this and all
        >>our incarnations have in common is the potential
        >>to awaken. Much like a seed that is dormant,
        >>needing a sheltering and nurturing environment
        >>to grow, so is our Real Self waiting to have its
        >>coverings removed and be revealed for the infinite,
        >>eternal, blissful flower in full bloom that is its
        >>destiny. Meditation is an ancient and very
        >>effective cultivation tool. And you may find
        >>guidance in meditation by reading the scriptures of
        >>whatever tradition you are drawn to, by trying
        >>various methods to be present within and without
        >>that you are led to, or even by doing nothing but
        >>keeping your hand open and waiting for the key to
        >>fall into it that will open the door to the Kingdom
        >>of God within, or...whatever. But I think you will
        >>find that actually meditating is the best way to
        >>learn about meditation, and will be the most
        >>effective way to proceed with your Coronation in
        >>this incarnation. And then you can live now and
        >>happily ever after.
        >>
        >>Peace and blessings,
        >>Bob
        >>
        >>PS: This was in response to recent and frequent emails
        >>we receive asking about what position we take about
        >>reincarnation, and the seeming inadequacy of our
        >>usual answer of "sitting down":-)
        >>
        >>
      • prakki surya
        dear friends Divine Message of His Holiness Shri Datta Swami You are getting everything according to your present deeds and also the past deeds. The Lord has
        Message 3 of 6 , Nov 23, 2005
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          dear friends
           
          Divine Message of His Holiness Shri Datta Swami
           
          You are getting everything according to your present deeds and also the past deeds. The Lord has arranged the cycles of your births. In each cycle happiness and misery are alternatively arranged leaving the sequence of good and bad deeds. Even if you have done two sins subsequently the fruits of the two sins are not given to you subsequently.  The result of a good deed is penetrated in between these two sins. Like this the Lord has arranged all your life cycles at present and in the future.  If you are pestering Him, He will bring the result of good deed from the future cycle to the present cycle as a pre-matured fixed deposit with reduced value. By such interference your future life cycles will be filled with misery. Then you will scold the Lord crying “Oh! Lord you have given me misery from birth to death”. You don’t remember your foolish interference in the past birth.
           
          The other way is that the Lord in human form should transfer your sin on Him and should suffer for your sake. This path is possible only when you don’t aspire for this path and worship the Lord in human form by sacrificing all your bonds of the world. This is possible only for a true devotee who never wishes that the Lord should suffer for his or her sake. Such true devotee will be worshipping the Lord without aspiring anything in return.
           
          One has to understand the theory of Karma and the devotion towards Lord. The Lord suffers for the sins of His true devotees only who are really serving the Lord in practice by doing Karma Sanyasa (Sacrifice of work) and Karma Phala Tyaga (Sacrifice of the fruit of work) in His mission without aspiring anything in return. In such service even an Iota of desire should not be present even in any biological cell of the human being. This is called  ‘NISHKAMA KARMA YOGA’ as emphasized in GITA.
           
          Hindus are not serious about spiritual line unlike Christians and Muslims. Most of the Hindus are worried about their families and wealth only and they try to use even the Lord as an instrument for their happiness. The root reason is that the Hindu gurus twisted the Hindu scriptures and created a wrong concept that the soul gets several human births. With this concept, people try to postpone the spiritual line to the old age and are immersed in the juice of family bonds. This juice has entered every cell of the human being by the time they become old. Therefore the old people cannot avoid even a trace of the attachments with the family. We must remember that Shankara could cut the bond with his mother in the childhood. Hanuman could not cut the bond with his mother in his old age and fought with the Lord for the sake of his mother. These old people are postponing the spiritual line to the next human birth. A Hindu is postponing the spiritual effort till the last minute based on this wrong concept. In Christianity and Islam, the concept is that there is no human re-birth. According to these two religions, after this human birth, the final enquiry will be done and the soul will either reach the Lord or will be thrown into hell permanently. This concept creates lot of seriousness in a Christian and a Muslim from the beginning. If you say that there is no re-examination for the failures in the annual test, the student will be serious from the date of joining of the college. If you say that there are a number of re-tests for the failures, the student will postpone the study to March and in March, he will postpone to the next re-examination. If the Hindu scriptures are researched, the real concept comes out because the same Lord told the same theory in all the religions in different languages. After all, the principle of conversion of mass into energy (E=m*c2) of Einstein must be the same in all the countries in their languages. Thus, the real interpretation of Hindu scriptures also shows that there is no human re-birth for any soul. The teacher is harsh towards the student who is not in the correct line and that should not be misunderstood. Datta is Universal Guru and He has no distinction between any two religions and any two human beings in this world. Please remember that Datta is the creator of this entire world. The criticism is soar like medicine and gives you good spiritual health by destroying the ignorance-illness. The pleasing words are like the sweets, which bring illness to you.
           
          His servant
          at the lotus feet of shri datta swami


          Bruce Morgen <editor@...> wrote:
          True wisdom, very well said.
          Muchas gracias, mi amiga --
          and thanks to also Bobji for
          prompting you to write it!

          Future lives, past lives, and
          the shifting fortunes of the
          NFC East -- all transient
          occurences, mere ripples on a
          vastness beyond description,
          let alone explanation, the
          appearance of manifestation
          in an exquisite infinitude of
          formlessness.  It is all, as
          J. Krishnamurti called it, "a
          great meditation."  Perfect.

          mlcanow wrote:

          >This is so true. Mind is so used to try to explain everything, that when the
          >concepts or ideas about reincarnation come about, it tends to get trapped in new knowings that I would dare to call irrelevant. Why should we be
          >concerned about past or future lifes, when we are not even aware of this
          >present one?
          >
          >Love,
          >
          >Maria Luisa


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        • Era
          ... I second this. Time is an earthbound thingy but the now is eternal love, Era
          Message 4 of 6 , Nov 24, 2005
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            Bruce:

            > True wisdom, very well said.
            > Muchas gracias, mi amiga --
            > and thanks to also Bobji for
            > prompting you to write it!
            >

            I second this.

            Time is an earthbound thingy but the now is eternal

            love, Era



            > Future lives, past lives, and
            > the shifting fortunes of the
            > NFC East -- all transient
            > occurences, mere ripples on a
            > vastness beyond description,
            > let alone explanation, the
            > appearance of manifestation
            > in an exquisite infinitude of
            > formlessness. It is all, as
            > J. Krishnamurti called it, "a
            > great meditation." Perfect.
            >
            > mlcanow wrote:
            >
            > >This is so true. Mind is so used to try to explain everything, that when the
            > >concepts or ideas about reincarnation come about, it tends to get trapped in new knowings that I would dare to call irrelevant. Why should we be
            > >concerned about past or future lifes, when we are not even aware of this
            > >present one?
            > >
            > >Love,
            > >
            > >Maria Luisa
          • jodyrrr
            ... wrote: [snip] ... Dream on, or get psychiatric help.
            Message 5 of 6 , Dec 5, 2005
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              --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, prakki surya
              <dattapr2000@y...> wrote:

              [snip]

              > Please remember that Datta is the creator of this entire world.

              Dream on, or get psychiatric help.
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