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RE: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-dualism or non-dualism

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  • Greg Goode
    Nice dialoguing, Bruce! --Greg ________________________________ From: Bruce Morgen [mailto:editor@juno.com] Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 5:32 PM To:
    Message 1 of 16 , Apr 4 4:53 AM
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      Section 1

      Nice dialoguing, Bruce!

       

      --Greg

       


      From: Bruce Morgen [mailto:editor@...]
      Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 5:32 PM
      To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-dualism or non-dualism

       

      jasonjamesmorgan wrote:

      >Hello,
      >
      >Thanks for playing with me.
      >
      >
      >

    • Bruce Morgen
      Thank you, old friend -- and thanks also to that fine Canadian fellow who spells his surname so strangely! :-) Much love -- Bruce
      Message 2 of 16 , Apr 4 7:40 AM
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        Thank you, old friend -- and
        thanks also to that fine
        Canadian fellow who spells
        his surname so strangely! :-)

        Much love -- Bruce


        Greg Goode wrote:

        > Nice dialoguing, Bruce!
        >
        >
        >
        > --Greg
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
        >
        > *From:* Bruce Morgen [mailto:editor@...]
        > *Sent:* Sunday, April 03, 2005 5:32 PM
        > *To:* meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
        > *Subject:* Re: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-dualism
        > or non-dualism
        >
        >
        >
        > jasonjamesmorgan wrote:
        >
        >>Hello,
        >>
        >>Thanks for playing with me.
        >>
        >>
        >
      • Jeff Belyea
        Nice log rolling, Greg. ... or
        Message 3 of 16 , Apr 4 7:56 AM
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          Nice log rolling, Greg.

          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Greg Goode"
          <goode@d...> wrote:
          > Nice dialoguing, Bruce!
          >
          >
          >
          > --Greg
          >
          >
          >
          > ________________________________
          >
          > From: Bruce Morgen [mailto:editor@j...]
          > Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 5:32 PM
          > To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-dualism
          or
          > non-dualism
          >
          >
          >
          > jasonjamesmorgan wrote:
          >
          > >Hello,
          > >
          > >Thanks for playing with me.
          > >
          > >
          > >
        • Bruce Morgen
          The exchanging of favors or praise, as among artists, critics, or academics, Jeffji? I confess I once attempted to give Gregji an old snare drum, but he
          Message 4 of 16 , Apr 4 8:07 AM
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            "The exchanging of favors or
            praise, as among artists,
            critics, or academics," Jeffji?
            I confess I once attempted to
            give Gregji an old snare drum,
            but he turned me down, citing
            lack of room for it in his
            apartment.


            Jeff Belyea wrote:

            >Nice log rolling, Greg.
            >
            >--- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Greg Goode"
            ><goode@d...> wrote:
            >
            >
            >>Nice dialoguing, Bruce!
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>--Greg
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>________________________________
            >>
            >>From: Bruce Morgen [mailto:editor@j...]
            >>Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 5:32 PM
            >>To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
            >>Subject: Re: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-dualism
            >>
            >>
            >or
            >
            >
            >>non-dualism
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>jasonjamesmorgan wrote:
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>>Hello,
            >>>
            >>>Thanks for playing with me.
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
          • Jeff Belyea
            Snare drum: Advaitaspeak (TM)? ... dualism
            Message 5 of 16 , Apr 4 8:17 AM
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              Snare drum: Advaitaspeak (TM)?

              --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Morgen
              <editor@j...> wrote:
              >
              > "The exchanging of favors or
              > praise, as among artists,
              > critics, or academics," Jeffji?
              > I confess I once attempted to
              > give Gregji an old snare drum,
              > but he turned me down, citing
              > lack of room for it in his
              > apartment.
              >
              >
              > Jeff Belyea wrote:
              >
              > >Nice log rolling, Greg.
              > >
              > >--- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Greg Goode"
              > ><goode@d...> wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > >>Nice dialoguing, Bruce!
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>--Greg
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>________________________________
              > >>
              > >>From: Bruce Morgen [mailto:editor@j...]
              > >>Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 5:32 PM
              > >>To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
              > >>Subject: Re: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-
              dualism
              > >>
              > >>
              > >or
              > >
              > >
              > >>non-dualism
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>jasonjamesmorgan wrote:
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>>Hello,
              > >>>
              > >>>Thanks for playing with me.
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
            • Bruce Morgen
              Not at all -- I found out that he likes to hit things rhythmically on occasion, so I figured to give him something appropriate for that activity. Sometimes a
              Message 6 of 16 , Apr 4 8:49 AM
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                Not at all -- I found out
                that he likes to hit things
                rhythmically on occasion,
                so I figured to give him
                something appropriate for
                that activity. Sometimes a
                drum is just a drum and a
                compliment is just a
                compliment.



                Jeff Belyea wrote:

                >Snare drum: Advaitaspeak (TM)?
                >
                >--- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Morgen
                ><editor@j...> wrote:
                >
                >
                >>"The exchanging of favors or
                >>praise, as among artists,
                >>critics, or academics," Jeffji?
                >>I confess I once attempted to
                >>give Gregji an old snare drum,
                >>but he turned me down, citing
                >>lack of room for it in his
                >>apartment.
                >>
                >>
                >>Jeff Belyea wrote:
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>>Nice log rolling, Greg.
                >>>
                >>>--- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Greg Goode"
                >>><goode@d...> wrote:
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>>Nice dialoguing, Bruce!
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>--Greg
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>________________________________
                >>>>
                >>>>From: Bruce Morgen [mailto:editor@j...]
                >>>>Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 5:32 PM
                >>>>To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
                >>>>Subject: Re: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >dualism
                >
                >
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>or
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>>non-dualism
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>jasonjamesmorgan wrote:
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>>Hello,
                >>>>>
                >>>>>Thanks for playing with me.
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
              • Jeff Belyea
                And sometimes a pun is just a pun.
                Message 7 of 16 , Apr 4 1:55 PM
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                  And sometimes a pun
                  is just a pun.

                  --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Morgen
                  <editor@j...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Not at all -- I found out
                  > that he likes to hit things
                  > rhythmically on occasion,
                  > so I figured to give him
                  > something appropriate for
                  > that activity. Sometimes a
                  > drum is just a drum and a
                  > compliment is just a
                  > compliment.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Jeff Belyea wrote:
                  >
                  > >Snare drum: Advaitaspeak (TM)?
                  > >
                  > >--- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Morgen
                  > ><editor@j...> wrote:
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >>"The exchanging of favors or
                  > >>praise, as among artists,
                  > >>critics, or academics," Jeffji?
                  > >>I confess I once attempted to
                  > >>give Gregji an old snare drum,
                  > >>but he turned me down, citing
                  > >>lack of room for it in his
                  > >>apartment.
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>Jeff Belyea wrote:
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>>Nice log rolling, Greg.
                  > >>>
                  > >>>--- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Greg Goode"
                  > >>><goode@d...> wrote:
                  > >>>
                  > >>>
                  > >>>
                  > >>>
                  > >>>>Nice dialoguing, Bruce!
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>--Greg
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>________________________________
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>From: Bruce Morgen [mailto:editor@j...]
                  > >>>>Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 5:32 PM
                  > >>>>To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
                  > >>>>Subject: Re: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >dualism
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>or
                  > >>>
                  > >>>
                  > >>>
                  > >>>
                  > >>>>non-dualism
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>jasonjamesmorgan wrote:
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>>Hello,
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>>>Thanks for playing with me.
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>>>
                • Sandeep
                  Yoo-hoo JJM, A somewhat dated post... Some two cents... ... From: jasonjamesmorgan To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005
                  Message 8 of 16 , Apr 7 10:34 AM
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                    Yoo-hoo JJM,
                     
                    A somewhat dated post...
                     
                    Some two cents...
                     
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 12:28 AM
                    Subject: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-dualism or non-dualism


                    Hello,

                    1.  If you were to get a splinter in your foot, do you remove it?  Or
                    do you realize there is no foot, no splinter, no pain.
                     
                    There is none.
                     
                    And yet a splinter may be removed.
                     
                    Or remains embedded.
                     
                     
                     
                     

                    Ramana sat to close to the fire once and severely burnt his legs.
                     
                    Ramana did not.
                    Yes the psycho-somatic organism which maybe labeled "Ramana", Buddha", "George W Bush/Osama Ben laden".......
                     
                    ......so long such an organism is "alive"..........if it sits on a hot stove, .......the organism will rapidly ascend.
                     
                     



                    2.  I am told you non-dual types believe in nothing.
                     
                     
                    Not even that nothing.
                     
                    And there is no non-dual types.
                     
                    Or to put it in another manner........there is not a whit difference between a non-dual type and a dual-type.
                     
                     
                     
                     
                     Do you believe in yourself?
                     
                     
                    What is this "yourself"?
                     
                     
                     
                     
                      If you only accept your awareness, do you accept mine? 
                     
                     
                    There is no "your" or "my" awareness.
                     
                     

                    If you accept mine, you must accept God.  That in which we live, move
                    and have our being. Qualified non-dualism.
                     
                    Aceept whatever rocks.
                     
                    Reject whatever rocks
                     
                    Both sneezings of the dreamt up character of the last night sleep dream.
                     
                     



                    3.  Do you accept qualified non-dualism?  Or do you only practice non-
                    dualsim?
                     
                     
                    What is qualified non-dualism?
                    What is the practice non-dualism?
                     
                     
                     
                      If so, do you have sex, enjoy food, etc.?
                     
                    Very much.
                     
                    And you forgot a good Cohiba.
                     
                    Sex is mere humping,.......... while a good cigar..........now that's something.
                     
                     
                     
                     
                      The difference
                    between tasting sugar and being sugar.
                     
                     
                    Being somewhat wet-behind the ears, can you please explain what is that difference?
                     
                     
                     
                     
                      Do you act non-dual(ie
                    Ramana)
                     
                     
                    That dude in the diaper was acting?
                     
                     
                     
                     or are you a hipocrit and really practice qualified non-
                    dualism(ie papaji).
                     
                    So non-hypocrisy lies in practicing non-qualified non-dualism?
                     
                    Can any "ism" escape a qualification?
                     
                    Non-qualification..............is not a qualification?
                     
                     
                      Act non-dual as well as talk non-dual.
                     
                    How do you act non-dual?
                     
                  • jasonjamesmorgan
                    Hello, The Holy Mother prepares food according to the childs temperments. Let us see if I can cook some good old fashion, home cooked non-dual Bhakti, non-dual
                    Message 9 of 16 , Apr 7 10:13 PM
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                      Hello,

                      The Holy Mother prepares food according to the childs temperments.

                      Let us see if I can cook some good old fashion, home cooked non-dual
                      Bhakti, non-dual Gnani style. I get the feeling it would be less
                      spicy.

                      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Sandeep"
                      <sandeep1960@y...> wrote:
                      > Yoo-hoo JJM,
                      >
                      > A somewhat dated post...
                      >
                      > Some two cents...
                      >
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: jasonjamesmorgan
                      > To: meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com
                      > Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 12:28 AM
                      > Subject: [Meditation Society of America] Qualified non-dualism or
                      non-dualism
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Hello,
                      >
                      > 1. If you were to get a splinter in your foot, do you remove
                      it? Or
                      > do you realize there is no foot, no splinter, no pain.
                      >
                      > There is none.
                      >
                      > And yet a splinter may be removed.
                      >
                      > Or remains embedded.

                      JJM. A mental splinter, like a thought can be removed with non-
                      identification.

                      A phiscial splinter, like a splinter :), can be removed with tweezers.

                      The difference between sahaja savikalpa samadhi and sahaja nirvikalpa
                      samadhi is that one dude would have moved back from the fire, to the
                      other there was no fire, and no legs.

                      I guess the defence mechanism of refutation might come from believing
                      that you have the same power as the president.

                      A king demand a yogi tell him a special mantra. The yogi refused.
                      When asked he sayed it would not work for him. The king tripped out
                      and demanded to know why. Just then the yogi tripped out and ordered
                      a guard nearby to sieze the king. The guard did not even blink. The
                      king then got angrier and odered the guard to sieze the yogi. The
                      yogi became histarical with laughter when the gaurd grabbed him. The
                      yogi said he had just demonstrated why it would not work.

                      What if there is such things as avatars? Miracles........

                      So this distinction is valid in my books.
                      Ramana was the Man.

                      If you want to know my description of the distinction between
                      Savikalpa Samadhi and Nirvikalpa Samadhi, I am sure it is still
                      floating around on web. Type my full name in exact search in
                      google. Feel free to send me refutations. I enjoy learning more
                      than teaching.

                      >
                      > Ramana sat to close to the fire once and severely burnt his legs.
                      >
                      > Ramana did not.
                      > Yes the psycho-somatic organism which maybe labeled "Ramana",
                      Buddha", "George W Bush/Osama Ben laden".......
                      >
                      > ......so long such an organism is "alive"..........if it sits on
                      a hot stove, .......the organism will rapidly ascend.
                      >

                      JJM. So sit on a hot stove. The natural abidance in the effulgence
                      of Self, is preceded by the un-natural abidance in the effulgence of
                      Self.

                      He however was already boiled, a fresh pot.

                      Sahaja Nirvikalpa Samadhi is different than Sahaja Savikalpa
                      Samadhi. Those words of mine alluded to it.

                      See different groups post at bottom( I just typed it and dont feel
                      like retyping it)

                      >
                      > 2. I am told you non-dual types believe in nothing.
                      >
                      >
                      > Not even that nothing.
                      >
                      > And there is no non-dual types.
                      >
                      > Or to put it in another manner........there is not a whit
                      difference between a non-dual type and a dual-type.
                      >

                      JJM. See post at bottom.




                      > Do you believe in yourself?
                      >
                      >
                      > What is this "yourself"?
                      >

                      JJM. Who read and then answered this post? That is "your"Self as I
                      did not read and answer my post.



                      > If you only accept your awareness, do you accept mine?
                      >
                      >
                      > There is no "your" or "my" awareness.
                      >

                      JJM. Truth is apparent. So is honesty. Honesty is accepting neither
                      duality or oneness as you say. So, honestly, Jason is mine, Sandeep
                      is yours. I will hang on to Jason for the time being. If your
                      looking to give away Sandeep, I'll pass.


                      >
                      > If you accept mine, you must accept God. That in which we live,
                      move
                      > and have our being. Qualified non-dualism.
                      >
                      > Aceept whatever rocks.
                      >
                      > Reject whatever rocks
                      >
                      > Both sneezings of the dreamt up character of the last night sleep
                      dream.

                      JJM. The waking body is just as fleeting as the dream body. Where
                      is your body in deep sleep, or nirvikalpa samdhi. Could we chat in
                      the later "states". We are now. What does that tell ya?

                      >
                      >
                      > 3. Do you accept qualified non-dualism? Or do you only practice
                      non-
                      > dualsim?
                      >
                      >
                      > What is qualified non-dualism?
                      > What is the practice non-dualism?

                      JJM. Look it up.


                      >
                      >
                      > If so, do you have sex, enjoy food, etc.?
                      >
                      > Very much.
                      >
                      > And you forgot a good Cohiba.
                      >
                      > Sex is mere humping,.......... while a good cigar..........now
                      that's something.

                      Jason also enjoys the odd joint, the odd cigarrete, mexican and
                      italian food, and the Holy Mother. Does the none dual state allow of
                      parts?

                      If a tree falls in the forest does it make a sound? Only if there is
                      an ear drum around. Other wise it is just vibration.

                      The difference between tasting sugar, and being sugar.


                      > The difference
                      > between tasting sugar and being sugar.
                      >
                      >
                      > Being somewhat wet-behind the ears, can you please explain what
                      is that difference?

                      JJM. See above.


                      >
                      >
                      > Do you act non-dual(ie
                      > Ramana)
                      >
                      >
                      > That dude in the diaper was acting?
                      >

                      Yes, the part of Ramana. He did not talk for many years, in the
                      early years. I guess he was only doing guest appearnences at the
                      time. And as for his action after, he compared it to a sleep
                      walker. He said Jesus the Christ was not aware of his action. Have
                      you ever driven home and not remebered getting, like sleep walking,
                      it is just a metaphor to explain sahaja nirvikalpa samadhi. The pure
                      expression of God.

                      Living scripture.


                      >
                      > or are you a hipocrit and really practice qualified non-
                      > dualism(ie papaji).
                      >
                      > So non-hypocrisy lies in practicing non-qualified non-dualism?
                      >
                      > Can any "ism" escape a qualification?
                      >
                      > Non-qualification..............is not a qualification?
                      >
                      >
                      > Act non-dual as well as talk non-dual.
                      >
                      > How do you act non-dual?

                      Sahaja Nirvikalpa Samadhi.

                      The sadhana of gnani gets you to act right. No parts, no desire.
                      Kill desire. Etc. No male or female, means no sex. Shitty deal for
                      some. An ape is attracted to an ape. Different races are attracted
                      to their own somewhat. Daughter end up with husbands like their
                      dads. Attraction is a mental creation, enforced by past influences.

                      If you were non-dual, would you like blondes or brunnettes better?
                      Bunk question in the non-dual standpoint.


                      Anyways, If I had posted the below before you posted your response,
                      which one would you have responded to, and what would have been the
                      thought and context.


                      Posted on the "direct approach" group.

                      "Hello,

                      Natural abidance in the effulgence of Self, is preceded by un-natural
                      abidance in the effulgence of Self.

                      This whole group, Ramana, Sankara, Patanjali, Ramakrishna, etc. etc.,
                      vedanta, religion, the very chance to experience realization, would
                      not be without the cause.

                      So to deny the former, is to deny the present.

                      Without duality, there would be no whole. Get it.

                      Thank the dudes that remain un-awakened, as they give the chance for
                      us to be the polar.

                      Nirvikalpa samdhi admits of no parts, no body(hence death in most
                      cases). So it is seen that the natural state would not allow our
                      little chats. And where would be the fun in that.

                      This is sahaja savikalpa samadhi we are injoying, or you would not be
                      reading this.

                      Sahaja savikalpa (dual) samadhi or the natural abidance in the
                      effulgence of Self, is the kingdom of heaven, the kingdom of heaven
                      is inside you. Enjoy it.

                      But remember without hell, there is no heaven.

                      Om Tat Sat.

                      Ramakrishna was travelling in a cariage to some devotees house, they
                      passed a bar, with revelors and drunk merry makers. He saw the
                      revelry of the Holy Mother and went into samadhi. He shouted,
                      congratulations and happiness for them, as he leaned out of the
                      carrige and lost outward consciousness. One new devotee became
                      concerned about the masters body. His concernes were quenched by an
                      experienced devotee of the Master.

                      Namaste
                      Om Namah Shivaya
                      Jason James Morgan"



                      You dont have to accept God, to accept this.
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