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Re: Crossing over?

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  • jodyrrr
    ... I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be able to psychotically imagine all
    Message 1 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
      > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
      > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, acra@h... wrote:
      > > > I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to
      > > > understand that meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can
      > > > anyone shed any light on that? Thanks in advance.
      > >
      > > If you want to waste your time chasing castles in the sky, then
      > > there are various meditation practices that will help you find them.
      > >
      > > However, these forays into other realms are simply forays into more
      > > delusion. You are trading the delusion of being an individual in
      > > this realm with that of being an individual in another. What's worse,
      > > the mind can make up whatever it wants in these realms and then
      > > generate these "realities" as so-called truth. This is in effect creating
      > > your own path of illusion and then pulling yourself along it into ever-
      > > increasing depths of delusion.
      > >
      > > The plain and simple fact, one that is quite commonly overlooked in
      > > the search for exotic experience, is that who you are and what you are
      > > looking for are always right here, closer than your own breath, in
      > > your own heart, completely outside of any realm whatsoever.
      > >
      > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
      > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
      > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
      > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
      > >
      > > --jody.
      >
      >
      >
      > or can be looked at as other realities
      > of ourselves with an opened mind
      >
      > check out
      >
      > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
      >
      > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>

      I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
      nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
      able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.

      The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
      kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
      To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
      coming from.

      So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
      as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
      after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
      they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
      is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
      tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
      existential fact.
    • Era
      ... . wrote:accra:I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to understand th= at meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can
      Message 2 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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        --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Morgen <editor@j..=
        .> wrote:
        >

        accra:

        I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to understand th=
        at meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can anyone shed any lig=
        ht on that? Thanks in advance.
        If you want to waste your time chasing castles in the sky, then
        there are various meditation practices that will help you find them. Howeve=
        r, these forays into other realms are simply forays into more delusion. You =
        are trading the delusion of being an individual in this realm with that of b=
        eing an individual in another. What's worse, the mind can make up whatever i=
        t wants in these realms and then generate these "realities" as so-called tru=
        th. This is in effect creating your own path of illusion and then pulling yo=
        urself along it into ever- increasing depths of delusion. The plain and simp=
        le fact, one that is quite commonly overlooked in the search for exotic expe=
        rience, is that who you are and what you are looking for are always right he=
        re, closer than your own breath, in your own heart, completely outside of an=
        y realm whatsoever. You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, ri=
        ght now to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find you=
        rself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same bullshit you =
        find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
        --jody.



        era: or can be looked at as other realities
        of ourselves with an opened mind

        check out

        the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site

        <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>


        bruce:

        Sure, but once one's hung
        out with one aspect of
        oneself, you've pretty much
        had a sufficient dose. 
        I've observed some pretty
        deep pitfalls along the
        third-eye-centric, "Light
        and Sound" paths involving
        a very high potential for
        perpetual bhaktihood and
        even delusional quasi-
        realization. 


        heh

        I must agree here Bruce

        but meditation is still important

        imho



        By nature,
        these practices rely very
        heavily on the honesty and
        authenticity of the
        guidance received, and such
        guidance isn't easy to find

        imo.
      • Era
        [...] ... I have no idea what you are talking about I am happy with the Naam meditation cool of jody
        Message 3 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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          [...]
          > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
          > > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
          > > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
          > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
          > > >
          > > > --jody.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > or can be looked at as other realities
          > > of ourselves with an opened mind
          > >
          > > check out
          > >
          > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
          > >
          > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
          >
          > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
          > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
          > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
          >
          > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
          > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
          > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
          > coming from.
          >
          > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
          > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
          > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
          > they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
          > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
          > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
          > existential fact.


          I have no idea what you are talking about

          I am happy with the Naam meditation

          cool of jody
        • jodyrrr
          ... That s good Karta. Whatever floats your boat. However, I d like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if
          Message 4 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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            --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
            > [...]
            > > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
            > > > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
            > > > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
            > > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
            > > > >
            > > > > --jody.
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > or can be looked at as other realities
            > > > of ourselves with an opened mind
            > > >
            > > > check out
            > > >
            > > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
            > > >
            > > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
            > >
            > > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
            > > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
            > > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
            > >
            > > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
            > > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
            > > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
            > > coming from.
            > >
            > > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
            > > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
            > > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
            > > they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
            > > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
            > > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
            > > existential fact.
            >
            >
            > I have no idea what you are talking about
            >
            > I am happy with the Naam meditation
            >
            > cool of jody

            That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.

            However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
            see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
            of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
            delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
            (and therefore more illusory) form.
          • Bruce Morgen
            ... [...] You don t need to go anywhere else except right here, right now to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find yourself. All you ll
            Message 5 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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              jodyrrr wrote:
              --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                
              [...]
                  
              You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
              to find yourself.  In fact, that is the only place you *can* find 
              yourself.  All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
              bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
              
              --jody.
                        
              
              or can be looked at as other realities
               of ourselves with an opened mind
              
              check out
              
              the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
              
              <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                      
              I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical 
              nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
              able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit. 
              
              The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
              kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
              To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
              coming from.
              
              So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
              as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
              after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
              they visit heaven on a regular basis.  What they are "visiting"
              is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
              tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
              existential fact.
                    
              I have no idea what you are talking about
              
              I am happy with the Naam meditation
              
                cool of jody
                  
              That's good Karta.  Whatever floats your boat.
              
              However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
              see, hear, or feel is only more Maya.  So, if you have some kind
              of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
              delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
              (and therefore more illusory) form.
                
              Moreover, the ultimate gist
              of meditation is not that
              you necessarily be "happy"
              with the practice itself,
              but rather the direct
              discovery of true nature,
              regardless of what that
              entails emotionally.

              Time to trot out a tried
              true Krishnamurti quote:

              "Meditation is not the
              repetition of the word, nor
              the experiencing of a vision,
              nor the cultivating of
              silence.  The bead and the
              word do quieten the
              chattering mind, but this is
              a form of self-hypnosis.  You
              might as well take a pill."
            • Era
              ... not so jody, at least with me not so I am getting cleaned of delusions in MY meditations take my word for it
              Message 6 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                > > [...]
                > > > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                > > > > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                > > > > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                > > > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > --jody.
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > or can be looked at as other realities
                > > > > of ourselves with an opened mind
                > > > >
                > > > > check out
                > > > >
                > > > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                > > > >
                > > > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                > > >
                > > > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                > > > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                > > > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
                > > >
                > > > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                > > > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                > > > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                > > > coming from.
                > > >
                > > > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                > > > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                > > > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                > > > they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
                > > > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                > > > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                > > > existential fact.
                > >
                > >
                > > I have no idea what you are talking about
                > >
                > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                > >
                > > cool of jody
                >
                > That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.
                >
                > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                > of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                > (and therefore more illusory) form.


                not so jody,

                at least with me not so

                I am getting cleaned of delusions
                in MY meditations

                take my word for it
              • star fall
                Delurking to ask a question. What do you mean by Maya ? Thanks, star jodyrrr wrote: I have no idea what you are talking about ... That s
                Message 7 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                  Delurking to ask a question.  What do you mean by "Maya"?
                   
                  Thanks, star

                  jodyrrr <jodyrrr@...> wrote:
                   I have no idea what you are talking about
                  >
                  > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                  >
                  >   cool of jody

                  That's good Karta.  Whatever floats your boat.

                  However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                  see, hear, or feel is only more Maya.  So, if you have some kind
                  of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                  delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                  (and therefore more illusory) form.



                  Do you Yahoo!?
                  Yahoo! Search - Find what you�re looking for faster.

                • jodyrrr
                  ... I will take your word for it, Karta. But I ve got to tell you, I know two individuals who are completely convinced that they fly to heaven and hang out
                  Message 8 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                    --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                    > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                    > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                    > > > [...]
                    > > > > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                    > > > > > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                    > > > > > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                    > > > > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > --jody.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > or can be looked at as other realities
                    > > > > > of ourselves with an opened mind
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > check out
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                    > > > >
                    > > > > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                    > > > > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                    > > > > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                    > > > > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                    > > > > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                    > > > > coming from.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                    > > > > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                    > > > > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                    > > > > they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
                    > > > > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                    > > > > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                    > > > > existential fact.
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > I have no idea what you are talking about
                    > > >
                    > > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                    > > >
                    > > > cool of jody
                    > >
                    > > That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.
                    > >
                    > > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                    > > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                    > > of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                    > > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                    > > (and therefore more illusory) form.
                    >
                    >
                    > not so jody,
                    >
                    > at least with me not so
                    >
                    > I am getting cleaned of delusions
                    > in MY meditations
                    >
                    > take my word for it

                    I will take your word for it, Karta.

                    But I've got to tell you, I know two individuals who are completely
                    convinced that they fly to heaven and hang out there. One is
                    a proponent of Sant Mat, the other of Eckankar.

                    That's what I call delusion.
                  • jodyrrr
                    ... Maya is the projecting power of the manifesting principle, Shakti, according to shakta tantra. Maya is the covering over this , or Nirguna Brahman,
                    Message 9 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, star fall <starsspinning@y...>
                      wrote:
                      > Delurking to ask a question. What do you mean by "Maya"?
                      >
                      > Thanks, star

                      Maya is the projecting power of the manifesting principle, Shakti,
                      according to shakta tantra. Maya is the "covering" over 'this', or
                      Nirguna Brahman, which we all are as the Atman.

                      Maya is the world of name and form, which is essentially illusory,
                      like a dream to that which dwells in the secret chamber of the heart.
                      She is the deluding power in humanity, the presence of everything
                      that conditions a mind to believe it's an individual.

                      She is the veil that keeps us from knowing ourselves as we are at
                      all times, the Self. She's the one that will eventually move aside
                      and allow you to know yourself as you really are.

                      > jodyrrr <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                      > I have no idea what you are talking about
                      > >
                      > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                      > >
                      > > cool of jody
                      >
                      > That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.
                      >
                      > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                      > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                      > of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                      > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                      > (and therefore more illusory) form.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ---------------------------------
                      > Do you Yahoo!?
                      > Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster.
                    • Jason Fishman
                      ... I will take your word for it, Karta. But I ve got to tell you, I know two individuals who are completely convinced that they fly to heaven and hang out
                      Message 10 of 17 , Mar 5, 2004
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                        jodyrrr <jodyrrr@...> wrote:

                        --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                        > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                        > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                        > > > [...]
                        > > > > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                        > > > > > > to find yourself.  In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                        > > > > > > yourself.  All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                        > > > > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > --jody.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > or can be looked at as other realities
                        > > > > >  of ourselves with an opened mind
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > check out
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                        > > > >
                        > > > > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                        > > > > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                        > > > > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                        > > > > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                        > > > > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                        > > > > coming from.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                        > > > > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                        > > > > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                        > > > > they visit heaven on a regular basis.  What they are "visiting"
                        > > > > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                        > > > > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                        > > > > existential fact.
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > I have no idea what you are talking about
                        > > >
                        > > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                        > > >
                        > > >   cool of jody
                        > >
                        > > That's good Karta.  Whatever floats your boat.
                        > >
                        > > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                        > > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya.  So, if you have some kind
                        > > of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                        > > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                        > > (and therefore more illusory) form.
                        >
                        >
                        > not so jody,
                        >
                        > at least with me not so
                        >
                        > I am getting cleaned of delusions
                        > in MY meditations
                        >
                        > take my word for it

                        I will take your word for it, Karta. 

                        But I've got to tell you, I know two individuals who are completely
                        convinced that they fly to heaven and hang out there.  One is
                        a proponent of Sant Mat, the other of Eckankar.

                        That's what I call delusion.

                        ---------

                        One can't even tell whats gonna happen in the next moment for certain let alone flying off to heaven or any other possibility that can be dreamt up. Maybe there really is a you to experience a heaven or some other reality. The delusion is one of the least waverable things?, well, thats for sure, I think...:-)

                        Peace and Love


                        Do you Yahoo!?
                        Yahoo! Search - Find what you�re looking for faster.
                      • Era
                        ... I do not indulge in my meditations
                        Message 11 of 17 , Mar 6, 2004
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                          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, star fall <starsspinning@y...> wrote:
                          > Delurking to ask a question. What do you mean by "Maya"?
                          >
                          > Thanks, star
                          >
                          > jodyrrr <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                          > I have no idea what you are talking about
                          > >
                          > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                          > >
                          > > cool of jody
                          >
                          > That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.
                          >
                          > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                          > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                          > of glorious meditation experience,


                          I do not indulge in my meditations



                          > that's just more of the
                          > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                          > (and therefore more illusory) form.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
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