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Re: [Meditation Society of America] Crossing over?

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  • ravin bu
    It depends what we mean by new realms. Essentially meditation helps one to Discover One s own self. In this process of discovering, one can encounter some
    Message 1 of 17 , Feb 25 3:03 AM
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      It depends what we mean by new realms. Essentially
      meditation helps one to Discover One's own self.
      In this process of discovering, one can encounter some
      experiences which might seem new but are part of our
      own selves.

      Peace

      --- acra@... wrote:
      > I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this
      > but I am to
      > understand that meditation helps one cross over into
      > other relms. Can
      > anyone shed any light on that? Thanks in advance.
      >
      >


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    • bhalla sandeep
      Hi, i am sandeep here. now lets look at this buisness of crossing over to so called other realms. well, there are no othere realms. we are presently staying in
      Message 2 of 17 , Feb 25 5:38 AM
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        Hi, i am sandeep here. now lets look at this buisness of crossing over to so called other realms. well, there are no othere realms. we are presently staying in those othere realms. the orignal state is always there, the only difference being that we do not open up the inner eye to stay perfectly in the present. as long as we take the aspect of meditation to be a process or a procedure or a method of experiencing the so called other realms, let me assure you my dear sir, we will still be no better than what we are at the present. what is required is to relinquish this mental debate, the logic and the wish to go through the so called meditative experiences. the meditative experiences in itself no different than those relating to this mundane world and they lead to an another type of bondage, so lets get over with it and the goal is right there.

        ravin bu <ravinsanu@...> wrote:
        It depends what we mean by new realms. Essentially
        meditation helps one to Discover One's own self.
        In this process of discovering, one can encounter some
        experiences which might seem new but are part of our
        own selves.

        Peace

        --- acra@... wrote:
        > I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this
        > but I am to
        > understand that meditation helps one cross over into
        > other relms. Can
        > anyone shed any light on that? Thanks in advance.
        >
        >


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      • jodyrrr
        ... If you want to waste your time chasing castles in the sky, then there are various meditation practices that will help you find them. However, these forays
        Message 3 of 17 , Feb 26 9:21 AM
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          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, acra@h... wrote:
          > I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to
          > understand that meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can
          > anyone shed any light on that? Thanks in advance.

          If you want to waste your time chasing castles in the sky, then
          there are various meditation practices that will help you find them.

          However, these forays into other realms are simply forays into more
          delusion. You are trading the delusion of being an individual in
          this realm with that of being an individual in another. What's worse,
          the mind can make up whatever it wants in these realms and then
          generate these "realities" as so-called truth. This is in effect creating
          your own path of illusion and then pulling yourself along it into ever-
          increasing depths of delusion.

          The plain and simple fact, one that is quite commonly overlooked in
          the search for exotic experience, is that who you are and what you are
          looking for are always right here, closer than your own breath, in
          your own heart, completely outside of any realm whatsoever.

          You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
          to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
          yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
          bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.

          --jody.
        • Era
          ... or can be looked at as other realities of ourselves with an opened mind check out the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
          Message 4 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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            --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
            > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, acra@h... wrote:
            > > I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to
            > > understand that meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can
            > > anyone shed any light on that? Thanks in advance.
            >
            > If you want to waste your time chasing castles in the sky, then
            > there are various meditation practices that will help you find them.
            >
            > However, these forays into other realms are simply forays into more
            > delusion. You are trading the delusion of being an individual in
            > this realm with that of being an individual in another. What's worse,
            > the mind can make up whatever it wants in these realms and then
            > generate these "realities" as so-called truth. This is in effect creating
            > your own path of illusion and then pulling yourself along it into ever-
            > increasing depths of delusion.
            >
            > The plain and simple fact, one that is quite commonly overlooked in
            > the search for exotic experience, is that who you are and what you are
            > looking for are always right here, closer than your own breath, in
            > your own heart, completely outside of any realm whatsoever.
            >
            > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
            > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
            > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
            > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
            >
            > --jody.



            or can be looked at as other realities
            of ourselves with an opened mind

            check out

            the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site

            <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
          • Bruce Morgen
            ... I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to understand that meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can anyone shed any light
            Message 5 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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              Era wrote:
              --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                
              --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, acra@h... wrote:
                  
              I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to 
              understand that meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can 
              anyone shed any light on that? Thanks in advance.
                    
              If you want to waste your time chasing castles in the sky, then
              there are various meditation practices that will help you find them.
              
              However, these forays into other realms are simply forays into more
              delusion.  You are trading the delusion of being an individual in 
              this realm with that of being an individual in another.  What's worse, 
              the mind can make up whatever it wants in these realms and then
              generate these "realities" as so-called truth.  This is in effect creating 
              your own path of illusion and then pulling yourself along it into ever-
              increasing depths of delusion.
              
              The plain and simple fact, one that is quite commonly overlooked in
              the search for exotic experience, is that who you are and what you are
              looking for are always right here, closer than your own breath, in 
              your own heart, completely outside of any realm whatsoever.
              
              You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
              to find yourself.  In fact, that is the only place you *can* find 
              yourself.  All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
              bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
              
              --jody.
                  
              
              
              or can be looked at as other realities
               of ourselves with an opened mind
              
              check out
              
              the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
              
              <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                

              Sure, but once one's hung
              out with one aspect of
              oneself, you've pretty much
              had a sufficient dose. 
              I've observed some pretty
              deep pitfalls along the
              third-eye-centric, "Light
              and Sound" paths involving
              a very high potential for
              perpetual bhaktihood and
              even delusional quasi-
              realization.  By nature,
              these practices rely very
              heavily on the honesty and
              authenticity of the
              guidance received, and such
              guidance isn't easy to find
              imo.
            • jodyrrr
              ... I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be able to psychotically imagine all
              Message 6 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, acra@h... wrote:
                > > > I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to
                > > > understand that meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can
                > > > anyone shed any light on that? Thanks in advance.
                > >
                > > If you want to waste your time chasing castles in the sky, then
                > > there are various meditation practices that will help you find them.
                > >
                > > However, these forays into other realms are simply forays into more
                > > delusion. You are trading the delusion of being an individual in
                > > this realm with that of being an individual in another. What's worse,
                > > the mind can make up whatever it wants in these realms and then
                > > generate these "realities" as so-called truth. This is in effect creating
                > > your own path of illusion and then pulling yourself along it into ever-
                > > increasing depths of delusion.
                > >
                > > The plain and simple fact, one that is quite commonly overlooked in
                > > the search for exotic experience, is that who you are and what you are
                > > looking for are always right here, closer than your own breath, in
                > > your own heart, completely outside of any realm whatsoever.
                > >
                > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                > >
                > > --jody.
                >
                >
                >
                > or can be looked at as other realities
                > of ourselves with an opened mind
                >
                > check out
                >
                > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                >
                > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>

                I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.

                The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                coming from.

                So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
                is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                existential fact.
              • Era
                ... . wrote:accra:I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to understand th= at meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can
                Message 7 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                  --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Morgen <editor@j..=
                  .> wrote:
                  >

                  accra:

                  I am not sure if everyone/anyone believes in this but I am to understand th=
                  at meditation helps one cross over into other relms. Can anyone shed any lig=
                  ht on that? Thanks in advance.
                  If you want to waste your time chasing castles in the sky, then
                  there are various meditation practices that will help you find them. Howeve=
                  r, these forays into other realms are simply forays into more delusion. You =
                  are trading the delusion of being an individual in this realm with that of b=
                  eing an individual in another. What's worse, the mind can make up whatever i=
                  t wants in these realms and then generate these "realities" as so-called tru=
                  th. This is in effect creating your own path of illusion and then pulling yo=
                  urself along it into ever- increasing depths of delusion. The plain and simp=
                  le fact, one that is quite commonly overlooked in the search for exotic expe=
                  rience, is that who you are and what you are looking for are always right he=
                  re, closer than your own breath, in your own heart, completely outside of an=
                  y realm whatsoever. You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, ri=
                  ght now to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find you=
                  rself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same bullshit you =
                  find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                  --jody.



                  era: or can be looked at as other realities
                  of ourselves with an opened mind

                  check out

                  the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site

                  <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>


                  bruce:

                  Sure, but once one's hung
                  out with one aspect of
                  oneself, you've pretty much
                  had a sufficient dose. 
                  I've observed some pretty
                  deep pitfalls along the
                  third-eye-centric, "Light
                  and Sound" paths involving
                  a very high potential for
                  perpetual bhaktihood and
                  even delusional quasi-
                  realization. 


                  heh

                  I must agree here Bruce

                  but meditation is still important

                  imho



                  By nature,
                  these practices rely very
                  heavily on the honesty and
                  authenticity of the
                  guidance received, and such
                  guidance isn't easy to find

                  imo.
                • Era
                  [...] ... I have no idea what you are talking about I am happy with the Naam meditation cool of jody
                  Message 8 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                    [...]
                    > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                    > > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                    > > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                    > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                    > > >
                    > > > --jody.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > or can be looked at as other realities
                    > > of ourselves with an opened mind
                    > >
                    > > check out
                    > >
                    > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                    > >
                    > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                    >
                    > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                    > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                    > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
                    >
                    > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                    > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                    > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                    > coming from.
                    >
                    > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                    > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                    > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                    > they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
                    > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                    > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                    > existential fact.


                    I have no idea what you are talking about

                    I am happy with the Naam meditation

                    cool of jody
                  • jodyrrr
                    ... That s good Karta. Whatever floats your boat. However, I d like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if
                    Message 9 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                      > [...]
                      > > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                      > > > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                      > > > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                      > > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > --jody.
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > or can be looked at as other realities
                      > > > of ourselves with an opened mind
                      > > >
                      > > > check out
                      > > >
                      > > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                      > > >
                      > > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                      > >
                      > > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                      > > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                      > > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
                      > >
                      > > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                      > > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                      > > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                      > > coming from.
                      > >
                      > > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                      > > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                      > > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                      > > they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
                      > > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                      > > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                      > > existential fact.
                      >
                      >
                      > I have no idea what you are talking about
                      >
                      > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                      >
                      > cool of jody

                      That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.

                      However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                      see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                      of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                      delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                      (and therefore more illusory) form.
                    • Bruce Morgen
                      ... [...] You don t need to go anywhere else except right here, right now to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find yourself. All you ll
                      Message 10 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                        jodyrrr wrote:
                        --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                          
                        [...]
                            
                        You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                        to find yourself.  In fact, that is the only place you *can* find 
                        yourself.  All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                        bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                        
                        --jody.
                                  
                        
                        or can be looked at as other realities
                         of ourselves with an opened mind
                        
                        check out
                        
                        the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                        
                        <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                                
                        I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical 
                        nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                        able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit. 
                        
                        The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                        kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                        To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                        coming from.
                        
                        So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                        as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                        after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                        they visit heaven on a regular basis.  What they are "visiting"
                        is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                        tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                        existential fact.
                              
                        I have no idea what you are talking about
                        
                        I am happy with the Naam meditation
                        
                          cool of jody
                            
                        That's good Karta.  Whatever floats your boat.
                        
                        However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                        see, hear, or feel is only more Maya.  So, if you have some kind
                        of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                        delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                        (and therefore more illusory) form.
                          
                        Moreover, the ultimate gist
                        of meditation is not that
                        you necessarily be "happy"
                        with the practice itself,
                        but rather the direct
                        discovery of true nature,
                        regardless of what that
                        entails emotionally.

                        Time to trot out a tried
                        true Krishnamurti quote:

                        "Meditation is not the
                        repetition of the word, nor
                        the experiencing of a vision,
                        nor the cultivating of
                        silence.  The bead and the
                        word do quieten the
                        chattering mind, but this is
                        a form of self-hypnosis.  You
                        might as well take a pill."
                      • Era
                        ... not so jody, at least with me not so I am getting cleaned of delusions in MY meditations take my word for it
                        Message 11 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                          > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                          > > [...]
                          > > > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                          > > > > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                          > > > > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                          > > > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > --jody.
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > or can be looked at as other realities
                          > > > > of ourselves with an opened mind
                          > > > >
                          > > > > check out
                          > > > >
                          > > > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                          > > > >
                          > > > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                          > > >
                          > > > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                          > > > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                          > > > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
                          > > >
                          > > > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                          > > > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                          > > > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                          > > > coming from.
                          > > >
                          > > > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                          > > > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                          > > > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                          > > > they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
                          > > > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                          > > > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                          > > > existential fact.
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > I have no idea what you are talking about
                          > >
                          > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                          > >
                          > > cool of jody
                          >
                          > That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.
                          >
                          > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                          > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                          > of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                          > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                          > (and therefore more illusory) form.


                          not so jody,

                          at least with me not so

                          I am getting cleaned of delusions
                          in MY meditations

                          take my word for it
                        • star fall
                          Delurking to ask a question. What do you mean by Maya ? Thanks, star jodyrrr wrote: I have no idea what you are talking about ... That s
                          Message 12 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                            Delurking to ask a question.  What do you mean by "Maya"?
                             
                            Thanks, star

                            jodyrrr <jodyrrr@...> wrote:
                             I have no idea what you are talking about
                            >
                            > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                            >
                            >   cool of jody

                            That's good Karta.  Whatever floats your boat.

                            However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                            see, hear, or feel is only more Maya.  So, if you have some kind
                            of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                            delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                            (and therefore more illusory) form.



                            Do you Yahoo!?
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                          • jodyrrr
                            ... I will take your word for it, Karta. But I ve got to tell you, I know two individuals who are completely convinced that they fly to heaven and hang out
                            Message 13 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                              --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                              > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                              > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                              > > > [...]
                              > > > > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                              > > > > > > to find yourself. In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                              > > > > > > yourself. All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                              > > > > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > --jody.
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > or can be looked at as other realities
                              > > > > > of ourselves with an opened mind
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > check out
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                              > > > >
                              > > > > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                              > > > > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                              > > > > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                              > > > > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                              > > > > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                              > > > > coming from.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                              > > > > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                              > > > > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                              > > > > they visit heaven on a regular basis. What they are "visiting"
                              > > > > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                              > > > > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                              > > > > existential fact.
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > I have no idea what you are talking about
                              > > >
                              > > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                              > > >
                              > > > cool of jody
                              > >
                              > > That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.
                              > >
                              > > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                              > > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                              > > of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                              > > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                              > > (and therefore more illusory) form.
                              >
                              >
                              > not so jody,
                              >
                              > at least with me not so
                              >
                              > I am getting cleaned of delusions
                              > in MY meditations
                              >
                              > take my word for it

                              I will take your word for it, Karta.

                              But I've got to tell you, I know two individuals who are completely
                              convinced that they fly to heaven and hang out there. One is
                              a proponent of Sant Mat, the other of Eckankar.

                              That's what I call delusion.
                            • jodyrrr
                              ... Maya is the projecting power of the manifesting principle, Shakti, according to shakta tantra. Maya is the covering over this , or Nirguna Brahman,
                              Message 14 of 17 , Mar 4, 2004
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                                --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, star fall <starsspinning@y...>
                                wrote:
                                > Delurking to ask a question. What do you mean by "Maya"?
                                >
                                > Thanks, star

                                Maya is the projecting power of the manifesting principle, Shakti,
                                according to shakta tantra. Maya is the "covering" over 'this', or
                                Nirguna Brahman, which we all are as the Atman.

                                Maya is the world of name and form, which is essentially illusory,
                                like a dream to that which dwells in the secret chamber of the heart.
                                She is the deluding power in humanity, the presence of everything
                                that conditions a mind to believe it's an individual.

                                She is the veil that keeps us from knowing ourselves as we are at
                                all times, the Self. She's the one that will eventually move aside
                                and allow you to know yourself as you really are.

                                > jodyrrr <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                                > I have no idea what you are talking about
                                > >
                                > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                                > >
                                > > cool of jody
                                >
                                > That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.
                                >
                                > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                                > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                                > of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                                > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                                > (and therefore more illusory) form.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > ---------------------------------
                                > Do you Yahoo!?
                                > Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster.
                              • Jason Fishman
                                ... I will take your word for it, Karta. But I ve got to tell you, I know two individuals who are completely convinced that they fly to heaven and hang out
                                Message 15 of 17 , Mar 5, 2004
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                                  jodyrrr <jodyrrr@...> wrote:

                                  --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                                  > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "jodyrrr" <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                                  > > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Era" <satkarta7@j...> wrote:
                                  > > > [...]
                                  > > > > > > You don't need to go anywhere else except right here, right now
                                  > > > > > > to find yourself.  In fact, that is the only place you *can* find
                                  > > > > > > yourself.  All you'll find in the other realms is more of the same
                                  > > > > > > bullshit you find in this one, only less solid and more illusory.
                                  > > > > > >
                                  > > > > > > --jody.
                                  > > > > >
                                  > > > > >
                                  > > > > >
                                  > > > > > or can be looked at as other realities
                                  > > > > >  of ourselves with an opened mind
                                  > > > > >
                                  > > > > > check out
                                  > > > > >
                                  > > > > > the Surat Shabd Yoga Meditation site
                                  > > > > >
                                  > > > > > <http://santmat-meditation.net/yoga/meditation.html>
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > I find the sound and light paths to be full of theosophical
                                  > > > > nonsense, and all that you end up with is a tendency to be
                                  > > > > able to psychotically imagine all sorts of delusional bullshit.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > The simple truth of your own being stands outside of any
                                  > > > > kind of sense experience, whether of this world or the next.
                                  > > > > To the jnani, it is all Maya, no matter where it's supposedly
                                  > > > > coming from.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > So, I reject Sant Mat and the other sound and light paths
                                  > > > > as theosophical nonsense, promoted by those who are only
                                  > > > > after name and fame in the form of being able to say that
                                  > > > > they visit heaven on a regular basis.  What they are "visiting"
                                  > > > > is a state of mind projected as delusion by a conditioned
                                  > > > > tendency to accept the mind's imaginings as some kind of
                                  > > > > existential fact.
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > I have no idea what you are talking about
                                  > > >
                                  > > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                                  > > >
                                  > > >   cool of jody
                                  > >
                                  > > That's good Karta.  Whatever floats your boat.
                                  > >
                                  > > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                                  > > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya.  So, if you have some kind
                                  > > of glorious meditation experience, that's just more of the
                                  > > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                                  > > (and therefore more illusory) form.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > not so jody,
                                  >
                                  > at least with me not so
                                  >
                                  > I am getting cleaned of delusions
                                  > in MY meditations
                                  >
                                  > take my word for it

                                  I will take your word for it, Karta. 

                                  But I've got to tell you, I know two individuals who are completely
                                  convinced that they fly to heaven and hang out there.  One is
                                  a proponent of Sant Mat, the other of Eckankar.

                                  That's what I call delusion.

                                  ---------

                                  One can't even tell whats gonna happen in the next moment for certain let alone flying off to heaven or any other possibility that can be dreamt up. Maybe there really is a you to experience a heaven or some other reality. The delusion is one of the least waverable things?, well, thats for sure, I think...:-)

                                  Peace and Love


                                  Do you Yahoo!?
                                  Yahoo! Search - Find what you�re looking for faster.
                                • Era
                                  ... I do not indulge in my meditations
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Mar 6, 2004
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                                    --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, star fall <starsspinning@y...> wrote:
                                    > Delurking to ask a question. What do you mean by "Maya"?
                                    >
                                    > Thanks, star
                                    >
                                    > jodyrrr <jodyrrr@y...> wrote:
                                    > I have no idea what you are talking about
                                    > >
                                    > > I am happy with the Naam meditation
                                    > >
                                    > > cool of jody
                                    >
                                    > That's good Karta. Whatever floats your boat.
                                    >
                                    > However, I'd like to point out that *ANYTHING* that you can
                                    > see, hear, or feel is only more Maya. So, if you have some kind
                                    > of glorious meditation experience,


                                    I do not indulge in my meditations



                                    > that's just more of the
                                    > delusion of the world coming at you, only in a more subtle
                                    > (and therefore more illusory) form.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
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