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Re: Nekkid Instigation

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  • devianandi
    ... devi: the question is, can jp rise at all and how long will it last...
    Message 1 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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      >
      > It will be interesting to see what comes from JP's club.
      > Will it be more veils, or more views? Will it further a greater
      > understanding within community, and of oneself? Will JP rise
      > to the role of moderator, and support honest and even 'safe'
      > exploration and sharing? This all remains to be seen...
      > until then, it seems premature to label it as 'sleazy',
      > or anything else... until then, and perhaps even then,
      > any label would be pure projection, more a reflection of
      > one's preferences, than the facts of the club.
      >
      > Nina

      devi: the question is, can jp rise at all and how long will it last...
    • babspiscot
      dear Devi I m sorry to read your comments now and before. You see, i am an older woman, mother, on a spiritual path. But nevertheless i am interested in my
      Message 2 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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        dear Devi
        I'm sorry to read your comments now and before. You see, i am an
        older woman, mother, on a spiritual path. But nevertheless i am
        interested in my sexuality - actually the spiritual path implies, for
        me at least, (re)discovering my sexuality and finding a more
        rewarding way to integrate it into my emotional and spiritual world.
        I find it extremely non-spiritual to consider that older women and/or
        mothers should deny that sexuality is part of their wholeness.
        Recognizing that i am also a sexual being is simply natural, it has
        nothing to do with lewdness or pornography or whatever. And believe
        me, i fully enjoy my path of sexual discovery, without feeling
        lesser, dirtier, it is just part of the natural me. It's that simple.
        And jp's group is wonderful, erotic and decent in the same time, even
        more, it is making me completely safe there.
        I hope i didn't offend anybody with my comments.
        Take care,
        Edith

        --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, devianandi
        <no_reply@y...> wrote:
        > --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Poole"
        > <gene_poole@q...> wrote:
        > > > devianandi <no_reply@y...> wrote:
        > > > > JP > <jppoffandi@y...> wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > > > Dear Friends
        > > > >
        > > > > A deep bow of gratitude and thanks to beloved
        > > > > Jerry Katz of NDS (http://www.nonduality.com),
        > > > > pioneering visionary of all things Nondual on the
        > > > > Net.
        > > > >
        > > > > His example of celebrating and encouraging
        > > > > diverse voices, his work of loving service and
        > > > > devotion have inspired many people to create
        > > > > internet communities and lists dedicated to the
        > > > > varieties of nondual spirituality.
        > > > >
        > > > > You are cordially invited and warmly welcome to
        > > > > subscribe to a new list on Yahoo Groups:
        > > > >
        > > > > Erotic Nonduality
        > > > >
        > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eroticnonduality
        > > > >
        > > > > A sex-positive list celebrating and exploring the
        > > > > relationship between sexuality, the erotic and
        > > > > nonduality.
        > > > >
        > > > > Don't be bashful.
        > > > >
        > > > > Come as you are.
        > > > >
        > > > > Love,
        > > > >
        > > > > JP
        > > > >
        > >
        > > > devi: jp, are you that ignorant about sex that you have to talk
        > about
        > > > it with other people?
        > >
        > > What an outlandish and irresponsible statement to
        > > make, Devi.
        > >
        > > I could ask you: "Are you so ignorant about
        > > people, that you have to ask other people
        > > about them?", and the answer would obviously
        > > be "yes".
        > >
        > > Get a clue, Devi.
        > >
        > > The nice thing about lava-lamps, is that
        > > they just sit there quietly, bubbling their
        > > blobs... their arisings seen, silently...
        > >
        > >
        > > ==GP==
        >
        > devi: yes i give a good silent darshan, bless you gene, but thats
        > besides the point...from my point of view, inviting a group of semi-
        > strangers, with the majority of them older females, mothers,on a
        > spiritual path into a club to talk about sex is, is well, the best
        > word i can think of without offending is ignorant...and we're not
        > supposed to make personal attackes, so you never really got to hear
        > all my outlandish and irresposible ideas.lucky for me.i was sooooo
        > surprised to see jerry katz embrace the club, my evalution of his
        > *character* just went down the *proverbial drain*
      • Gene Poole
        ... There you go again, Devi. On what basis do you make such condemnations? Are you the standard by which we should all live? Something you do not know,
        Message 3 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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          > devianandi <no_reply@y...> wrote:
          > > "Gene Poole" > <gene_poole@q...> wrote:
          > > > devianandi <no_reply@y...> wrote:
          > > > > JP > <jppoffandi@y...> wrote:
          > >
          > >
          > > > > Dear Friends
          > > > >
          > > > > A deep bow of gratitude and thanks to beloved
          > > > > Jerry Katz of NDS (http://www.nonduality.com),
          > > > > pioneering visionary of all things Nondual on the
          > > > > Net.
          > > > >
          > > > > His example of celebrating and encouraging
          > > > > diverse voices, his work of loving service and
          > > > > devotion have inspired many people to create
          > > > > internet communities and lists dedicated to the
          > > > > varieties of nondual spirituality.
          > > > >
          > > > > You are cordially invited and warmly welcome to
          > > > > subscribe to a new list on Yahoo Groups:
          > > > >
          > > > > Erotic Nonduality
          > > > >
          > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eroticnonduality
          > > > >
          > > > > A sex-positive list celebrating and exploring the
          > > > > relationship between sexuality, the erotic and
          > > > > nonduality.
          > > > >
          > > > > Don't be bashful.
          > > > >
          > > > > Come as you are.
          > > > >
          > > > > Love,
          > > > >
          > > > > JP
          > > > >
          > >
          > > > devi: jp, are you that ignorant about sex that you have to talk
          > about
          > > > it with other people?
          > >
          > > What an outlandish and irresponsible statement to
          > > make, Devi.
          > >
          > > I could ask you: "Are you so ignorant about
          > > people, that you have to ask other people
          > > about them?", and the answer would obviously
          > > be "yes".
          > >
          > > Get a clue, Devi.
          > >
          > > The nice thing about lava-lamps, is that
          > > they just sit there quietly, bubbling their
          > > blobs... their arisings seen, silently...
          > >
          > >
          > > ==GP==
          >
          > devi: yes i give a good silent darshan, bless you gene, but thats
          > besides the point...from my point of view, inviting a group of semi-
          > strangers, with the majority of them older females, mothers,on a
          > spiritual path into a club to talk about sex is, is well, the best
          > word i can think of without offending is ignorant...and we're not
          > supposed to make personal attackes, so you never really got to hear
          > all my outlandish and irresposible ideas.lucky for me.i was sooooo
          > surprised to see jerry katz embrace the club, my evalution of his
          > *character* just went down the *proverbial drain*

          There you 'go' again, Devi.

          On what basis do you make such condemnations?

          Are you the 'standard' by which we should all live?

          Something you do not know, but which I will now
          tell you: There are no standards.

          There Is No Law

          All of that is purely human invention; and you
          continually reveal yourself to be slave to the
          invention of humans.... no different than 'addiction'
          to anything else...

          Do you really think yourself better, than the one
          who made you, and gave you sexuality, and
          (heaven forbid!) genitals?

          It is all about choice, Devi... not 'law'.


          ==Gene Poole==
        • devianandi
          ... for ... world. ... and/or ... simple. ... even ... devi: i have no idea what to say to you....except, i expressed myself and you expressed yourself,,you
          Message 4 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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            > dear Devi
            > I'm sorry to read your comments now and before. You see, i am an
            > older woman, mother, on a spiritual path. But nevertheless i am
            > interested in my sexuality - actually the spiritual path implies,
            for
            > me at least, (re)discovering my sexuality and finding a more
            > rewarding way to integrate it into my emotional and spiritual
            world.
            > I find it extremely non-spiritual to consider that older women
            and/or
            > mothers should deny that sexuality is part of their wholeness.
            > Recognizing that i am also a sexual being is simply natural, it has
            > nothing to do with lewdness or pornography or whatever. And believe
            > me, i fully enjoy my path of sexual discovery, without feeling
            > lesser, dirtier, it is just part of the natural me. It's that
            simple.
            > And jp's group is wonderful, erotic and decent in the same time,
            even
            > more, it is making me completely safe there.
            > I hope i didn't offend anybody with my comments.
            > Take care,
            > Edith
            >
            devi: i have no idea what to say to you....except, i expressed myself
            and you expressed yourself,,you got offended at what i said and i got
            creepy feeling that jp invited strange woman me included into a
            sexually oriented group grope..enjoy yourself...smiles
          • Jason Fishman
            Yes, choosing not to respond would be a good indicator that your not interested :) Calling someone ignorant for posting an invitation openly, doesn t show the
            Message 5 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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              Yes, choosing not to respond would be a good indicator that your not interested :) Calling someone ignorant for posting an invitation openly, doesn't show the inviter as ignorant, but it may make the one denouncing them, as such, a pretty good case for ignorance.
               
              Peace and Love

              Gene Poole <gene_poole@...> wrote:
              > devianandi <no_reply@y...> wrote:
              > > "Gene Poole"  > <gene_poole@q...> wrote:
              > > > devianandi <no_reply@y...> wrote:
              > > > > JP  > <jppoffandi@y...> wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > > > > Dear Friends
              > > > >
              > > > > A deep bow of gratitude and thanks to beloved
              > > > > Jerry Katz of NDS (http://www.nonduality.com),
              > > > > pioneering visionary of all things Nondual on the
              > > > > Net.
              > > > >
              > > > > His example of celebrating and encouraging
              > > > > diverse voices, his work of loving service and
              > > > > devotion have inspired many people to create
              > > > > internet communities and lists dedicated to the
              > > > > varieties of nondual spirituality.
              > > > >
              > > > > You are cordially invited and warmly welcome to
              > > > > subscribe to a new list on Yahoo Groups:
              > > > >
              > > > > Erotic Nonduality
              > > > >
              > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eroticnonduality
              > > > >
              > > > > A sex-positive list celebrating and exploring the
              > > > > relationship between sexuality, the erotic and
              > > > > nonduality.
              > > > >
              > > > > Don't be bashful.
              > > > >
              > > > > Come as you are.
              > > > >
              > > > > Love,
              > > > >
              > > > > JP
              > > > >
              > >
              > > > devi: jp, are you that ignorant about sex that you have to talk
              > about
              > > > it with other people?
              > >
              > > What an outlandish and irresponsible statement to
              > > make, Devi.
              > >
              > > I could ask you: "Are you so ignorant about
              > > people, that you have to ask other people
              > > about them?", and the answer would obviously
              > > be "yes".
              > >
              > > Get a clue, Devi.
              > >
              > > The nice thing about lava-lamps, is that
              > > they just sit  there quietly, bubbling their
              > > blobs... their arisings seen, silently...
              > >
              > >
              > > ==GP==
              >
              > devi: yes i give a good silent darshan, bless you gene,  but thats
              > besides the point...from my point of view, inviting a group of semi-
              > strangers, with the majority of them older females, mothers,on a
              > spiritual path into a club to talk about sex is, is well, the best
              > word i can think of without offending is ignorant...and we're not
              > supposed to make personal attackes, so you never really got to hear
              > all my outlandish and irresposible ideas.lucky for me.i was sooooo
              > surprised to see jerry katz embrace the club, my evalution of his
              > *character* just went down the *proverbial drain*

              There you 'go' again, Devi.

              On what basis do you make such condemnations?

              Are you the 'standard' by which we should all live?

              Something you do not know, but which I will now
              tell you: There are no standards.

              There  Is  No  Law

              All of that is purely human invention; and you
              continually reveal yourself to be slave to the
              invention of humans.... no different than 'addiction'
              to anything else...

              Do you really think yourself better, than the one
              who made you, and gave you sexuality, and
              (heaven forbid!) genitals?

              It is all about choice, Devi... not 'law'.


              ==Gene Poole==



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            • devianandi
              ... devi: there she goes... ... devi: personal preference ... devi: your taking my words much to seriously, and gene, i would never in a million years tell you
              Message 6 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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                >
                > There you 'go' again, Devi.

                devi: there she goes...
                >
                > On what basis do you make such condemnations?

                devi: personal preference
                >
                > Are you the 'standard' by which we should all live?

                devi: your taking my words much to seriously, and gene, i would never
                in a million years tell you that you should use me as a standard...
                >
                > Something you do not know, but which I will now
                > tell you: There are no standards.

                devi: i think your right, but i don't believe you walk the talk, if
                you did, we wouldn't be having this conversation
                >
                > There Is No Law

                devi: right back atcha
                >
                > All of that is purely human invention;

                devi: what is not human invention


                and you
                > continually reveal yourself to be slave to the
                > invention of humans.... no different than 'addiction'
                > to anything else...

                devi: if i were to ever give you an indepth look into the life of
                what has been me i imagine that you might have a different view...
                >
                > Do you really think yourself better, than the one
                > who made you, and gave you sexuality, and
                > (heaven forbid!) genitals?

                devi: gene, is that *enlightenement*? ..to think that there is a
                someone else who made me?
                >
                > It is all about choice, Devi... not 'law'.
                >
                >
                > ==Gene Poole==

                devi: like i quoted in another group today,,,from baba hari dass...we
                are like goats tied to a fence with a long rope...


                so, you want to have a contest...see who can talk about genitals the
                best and the longest?
              • devianandi
                You see, i am an ... for ... world. ... and/or ... simple. ... even ... devi: dear edith, there is a tv program called sex in the city on hbo...its about 4
                Message 7 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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                  You see, i am an
                  > older woman, mother, on a spiritual path. But nevertheless i am
                  > interested in my sexuality - actually the spiritual path implies,
                  for
                  > me at least, (re)discovering my sexuality and finding a more
                  > rewarding way to integrate it into my emotional and spiritual
                  world.
                  > I find it extremely non-spiritual to consider that older women
                  and/or
                  > mothers should deny that sexuality is part of their wholeness.
                  > Recognizing that i am also a sexual being is simply natural, it has
                  > nothing to do with lewdness or pornography or whatever. And believe
                  > me, i fully enjoy my path of sexual discovery, without feeling
                  > lesser, dirtier, it is just part of the natural me. It's that
                  simple.
                  > And jp's group is wonderful, erotic and decent in the same time,
                  even
                  > more, it is making me completely safe there.
                  > I hope i didn't offend anybody with my comments.
                  > Take care,
                  > Edith

                  devi: dear edith, there is a tv program called "sex in the city" on
                  hbo...its about 4 very sexually active women, best friends, ...now,
                  in case you don't know the program, there is a woman who fucks every
                  good looking man she meets, and even sometimes the not-so goodlooking
                  men..thats about all she does on the program...anyway, i keep hearing
                  her saying to me to say to you " get a vibrator, honey"...i had to
                  come back to tell you

                  smiles

                  i hope i didn't offentd anyone, and remember what our resident geene
                  poole says,,there are no laws...
                  >
                • Gene Poole
                  ... Do you prefer to condemn? That... is a big problem . ... If they are not to be taken seriously, why emit them? Is not your call, to condemn JP s sex talk
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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                    >devianandi <no_reply@y...> wrote:

                    >>(in reply to Gene, who said:)
                    > >
                    > > There you 'go' again, Devi.
                    >
                    > devi: there she goes...

                    > > On what basis do you make such condemnations?
                    >
                    > devi: personal preference

                    Do you prefer to condemn?

                    That... is a big 'problem'.

                    > > Are you the 'standard' by which we should all live?
                    >
                    > devi: your taking my words much to seriously,

                    If they are not to be taken seriously,
                    why emit them?

                    Is not your call, to condemn JP's sex talk group,
                    to be taken seriously? Or do you issue such
                    judgments casually?

                    > and gene, i would never
                    > in a million years tell you that you should use me as a standard...

                    Strange... because as a reader of this list,
                    you already did tell me just that... and I am
                    here to tell you, that I not only disagree with
                    your judgment/condemnation, but that I also
                    warn you of a potentially fatal flaw in your
                    handling of yourself... how you gate your own
                    energies, in reaction to what you observe, or
                    think that you observe...

                    > > Something you do not know, but which I will now
                    > > tell you: There are no standards.
                    >
                    > devi: i think your right, but i don't believe you walk the talk, if
                    > you did, we wouldn't be having this conversation

                    'We' are having this conversation, because I care to
                    do so... how about you?

                    > > There Is No Law
                    >
                    > devi: right back atcha

                    I detect lack of understanding of what I said...

                    > > All of that is purely human invention;
                    >
                    > devi: what is not human invention

                    What invented humans, is not a human
                    invention...

                    > and you
                    > > continually reveal yourself to be slave to the
                    > > invention of humans.... no different than 'addiction'
                    > > to anything else...
                    >
                    > devi: if i were to ever give you an indepth look into the life of
                    > what has been me i imagine that you might have a different view...

                    Still, a slave to circumstances... such as the
                    emission of condemnations... and on a regular,
                    predictable basis, as well...

                    > > Do you really think yourself better, than the one
                    > > who made you, and gave you sexuality, and
                    > > (heaven forbid!) genitals?
                    >
                    > devi: gene, is that *enlightenement*? ..to think that there is a
                    > someone else who made me?

                    Not 'someone' in the sense you seem to imply, Devi

                    > > It is all about choice, Devi... not 'law'.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > ==Gene Poole==
                    >
                    > devi: like i quoted in another group today,,,from baba hari dass...we
                    > are like goats tied to a fence with a long rope...

                    Can you exist, without the constraint of the rope?

                    > so, you want to have a contest...see who can talk about genitals the
                    > best and the longest?

                    That is not the topic here. Elsewhere, it is the topic...

                    Meditation on the 'blank screen' of empty awareness itself,
                    will resolve for you, the issues we are discussing...


                    ==Gene Poole==
                  • Swami-G
                    Edith ... myself and you expressed yourself,,you got offended at what i said and i got creepy feeling that jp invited strange woman me included into a
                    Message 9 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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                      Edith
                      > >
                      > devi: i have no idea what to say to you....except, i expressed
                      myself and you expressed yourself,,you got offended at what i
                      said and i got creepy feeling that jp invited strange woman me
                      included into a sexually oriented group grope..enjoy
                      yourself...smiles

                      SG: that is an imagination and coloring .....

                      there was only an invitation to a new group..... yes there is a
                      sexual overtone ....

                      but nothing was said about a come and get a group grope .......
                      that is reading between the lines and only stems from a run
                      away imagination.......

                      let's try and see it without a coloring ..... there was an invitation
                      posted to a group .... we don't have to chase after it nor fight it
                      ..... let it remain for those who wish to follow that avenue.......
                    • devianandi
                      ... devi: oh, like knowing what you were doing over in the other group was imagination and coloring? ... a ... devi: i think your being naive ... invitation
                      Message 10 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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                        > > devi: i have no idea what to say to you....except, i expressed
                        > myself and you expressed yourself,,you got offended at what i
                        > said and i got creepy feeling that jp invited strange woman me
                        > included into a sexually oriented group grope..enjoy
                        > yourself...smiles
                        >
                        > SG: that is an imagination and coloring .....

                        devi: oh, like knowing what you were doing over in the other group
                        was imagination and coloring?
                        >
                        > there was only an invitation to a new group..... yes there is
                        a
                        > sexual overtone ....
                        >
                        > but nothing was said about a come and get a group grope .......
                        > that is reading between the lines and only stems from a run
                        > away imagination.......

                        devi: i think your being naive
                        >
                        > let's try and see it without a coloring ..... there was an
                        invitation
                        > posted to a group .... we don't have to chase after it nor fight
                        it
                        > ..... let it remain for those who wish to follow that avenue.......

                        devi: like i said, if you enjoy that sort of thing go for it, it
                        still grosses me out and i would never stay in it...how much you
                        wanna bet that porn will be introduced at some point...? say 10
                        dollars
                      • devianandi
                        ... devi: it seems to me that you are condeming me. ... devi: oh really and I am ... devi: thats fine but that I also ... devi: interesting ... if ... devi: we
                        Message 11 of 20 , Nov 5, 2003
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                          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, "Gene Poole"
                          <gene_poole@q...> wrote:
                          > >devianandi <no_reply@y...> wrote:
                          >
                          > >>(in reply to Gene, who said:)
                          > > >
                          > > > There you 'go' again, Devi.
                          > >
                          > > devi: there she goes...
                          >
                          > > > On what basis do you make such condemnations?
                          > >
                          > > devi: personal preference
                          >
                          > Do you prefer to condemn?
                          >
                          > That... is a big 'problem'.

                          devi: it seems to me that you are condeming me.
                          >
                          > > >
                          > Strange... because as a reader of this list,
                          > you already did tell me just that...
                          devi: oh really

                          and I am
                          > here to tell you, that I not only disagree with
                          > your judgment/condemnation,

                          devi: thats fine


                          but that I also
                          > warn you of a potentially fatal flaw in your
                          > handling of yourself... how you gate your own
                          > energies, in reaction to what you observe, or
                          > think that you observe...

                          devi: interesting
                          >
                          > > > Something you do not know, but which I will now
                          > > > tell you: There are no standards.
                          > >
                          > > devi: i think your right, but i don't believe you walk the talk,
                          if
                          > > you did, we wouldn't be having this conversation
                          >
                          > 'We' are having this conversation, because I care to
                          > do so... how about you?

                          devi: we are having this conversation becasue you don't walk your
                          talk and i'm just pointing that out to you
                          >
                          > > > There Is No Law
                          > >
                          > > devi: right back atcha
                          >
                          > I detect lack of understanding of what I said...

                          devi: thats ok, *There is No Law* is not anything so profound that i
                          need to explore what you mean by it..anymore than what i already
                          think you mean
                          >
                          > > > All of that is purely human invention;
                          > >
                          > > devi: what is not human invention
                          >
                          > What invented humans, is not a human
                          > invention...

                          devi: humans were never invented, the idea was is and always will be
                          inherent in what is
                          >
                          > > and you
                          > > > continually reveal yourself to be slave to the
                          > > > invention of humans.... no different than 'addiction'
                          > > > to anything else...
                          > >
                          > > devi: if i were to ever give you an indepth look into the life of
                          > > what has been me i imagine that you might have a different view...
                          >
                          > Still, a slave to circumstances... such as the
                          > emission of condemnations... and on a regular,
                          > predictable basis, as well...

                          devi: your like the blind man who touches the elephant and thinks he
                          knows the whole elephant..
                          >
                          > > > Do you really think yourself better, than the one
                          > > > who made you, and gave you sexuality, and
                          > > > (heaven forbid!) genitals?
                          > >
                          > > devi: gene, is that *enlightenement*? ..to think that there is a
                          > > someone else who made me?
                          >
                          > Not 'someone' in the sense you seem to imply, Devi

                          devi: ok gene, your on the stage now...tell us in what sense did you
                          imply a *someone*
                          >
                          > > > It is all about choice, Devi... not 'law'.
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > ==Gene Poole==
                          > >
                          > > devi: like i quoted in another group today,,,from baba hari
                          dass...we
                          > > are like goats tied to a fence with a long rope...
                          >
                          > Can you exist, without the constraint of the rope?
                          devi: i have at times..it doesn't seem to suit my purposes now
                          >
                          > > so, you want to have a contest...see who can talk about genitals
                          the
                          > > best and the longest?
                          >
                          > That is not the topic here. Elsewhere, it is the topic...

                          devi:

                          > Meditation on the 'blank screen' of empty awareness itself,
                          > will resolve for you, the issues we are discussing...
                          >
                          >
                          > ==Gene Poole==

                          devi: i have no resolutions waiting to happen, thats your trip...you
                          meditate on that blank screen of empty awareness, is that orange
                          chair available for you? what does Neo stand for?
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