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The mystery of simultaneous immanence and transcendence

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  • Sandeep
    The mystery of simultaneous immanence and transcendence, is impossible for the mind to comprehend. An intuitive leap, may mysteriously occur with blinding
    Message 1 of 3 , Nov 5, 2003
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      The mystery of simultaneous immanence and transcendence, is impossible for the mind to comprehend.

      An intuitive leap, may mysteriously occur with blinding clarity, .......which is not the conceptualization of the term/word "clarity".

      This manifestation, this phenomenality,........... can come to exist only in duality.

      And yet that "that-which-you-are" and "this-what you-appear-to-be",......the non-manifest and manifestation, .......the Noumenon and the phenomenon, .........the Absolute and the relative,.......

      ....are not two different.

      Manifestation is not the "creation" of the non-Manifest, but a mirroring, an imaging, an objective expressing,..

      .... of it.

      There is no inherent duality between the subject and the object.

      The Absolute is all there IS.

      Hence the Absolute must necessarily transcend the relative, because the relative is only it's image.......

      ......AND...........

      ...it must also be immanent in the relative because the relative has no independent existence of it's own.

      The substance must necessarily at once transcend and be immanent in the shadow.

      Thus manifestation appears in Consciousness, and is cognized by Consciousness, only in Consciousness.

      And it is thus, that duality is purely notional.

      Consciousness acting through an individualized body-mind complex, ........which is itself Consciousness manifested as "so",(i.e. a sentient psycho-somatic conditioned responsive biological organism ,.........hence the transcendence and the simultaneous immanence,....

      ...........there is no cognizer as an independent entity on it's own, ....

      ....apart........... from the object cognized.

      They are not separate.

      Both the "cognizer" and the "cognized",............... together,............ constitute the fact of cognizing,.....

      .....the functional aspect of noumenon, as pure potentiality.

      Noumenon, as pure potentiality, as pure subjectivity, has no objective existence other than,...... as it's manifestation.

      The appearance thus is the perceived aspect and the interpretation of the perceived aspect, through the attribute of sentience, is the perceptive aspect of Consciousness in movement.

      There are two aspects of the creationing of manifestation.

      -The arising of the Universe.

      -The cognizing of it.

      The arousal of consciousness from the state of rest, the state of pure awareness,

      which is without consciousness of its own existence or presence ......

      ......and.........

      ...... the arising of the apparent universe therein,....

      .....is spontaneous and simultaneous.

      Cognizing takes place through the sentience (the attribute by which there is a prevailing sense of being alive and present) of sentient psycho-somatic objects, ......

      ......which themselves are imaged-objects,........... within that mirroring of the Absolute.

      In the imaged-object, ...............again as part of the mirroring, ...........is the prevailing belief that it is the subject, cognizing the entire array of objects, ......making up it's world, .........the world of loved ones, unloved ones, .......

      ......thus it's world of relatings, objectives, goals, successes, failures, understandings, concepts etc etc.

      As a consequence of the very architecture of the imaged-object,.........is the prevailing sense of such a thinking, ...such a believing..... in that imaged object.

      Whereas, what is happening is that,........... both the cognizing -imaged-object, (thinking it is the subject),....

      ........AND.....

      .... it's cognized objects, (which are once again imaged objects),............

      .......are all imaged objects .......within the mirroring of the Absolute.

       

      In essence, ...............you, ...............whatever you have assumed yourself to be, .....

      ....a spiritual seeker, an enlightened Guru, needing to save the seeker in front, needing to save the whole of humanity, ......

      ......a regular Joe/Jane, who believes spirituality is for third-rate losers who could not make it, in life,.......

      .....you do not live.

      You are lived.

      In the moment.

      Lived exactly as a "danced image".

      A "sage", a term used for a body-mind complex, in which apperception of this has occurred, .....

      .....if the body-mind complex continues to be "alive", will remain,......

      ... as much a "danced image", .............as say a regular Joe.

      With a simultaneous transcendence of the dancing,.. "as- the-sage", ...........in the form of a witnessing gestalt.

      The sage dreams .............and................. witnesses the dream,........ in simultaneous time.

      Aka, wakes up in the morning, brushes his teeth, reads the newspaper, eats, goes about working which enables expenses to be paid, responds to questions posed, .......

      ....when no questions, no seekers, ........watches TV, roots for his favourite football team, admires the vigour and energy and beauty displayed in a MTV program, .....

      ......relates to whatever needs relating, (shouting at the plumber for screwing up the drainage system),..

       .......discusses the finer subtle points between a Cohiba cigar and ordinary cheeroot, Pamela Anderson and Meryl Streep,.....

      ...sips some fine Remy Martin and goes to sleep when tired.

      Exults when another seeker-object "gets" a subtle point,.......grieves at the memory of a loved sister. 

      All the time, ...............a watching of an imaged object, (which society, audience, popular media as labeled as a sage),...... being danced,......in precisely the manner,.... such that there is a doing of all these activities, ............there is an arising of all these feelings,....... in the moment,....

      ....moment to moment to moment.

       

      The simultaneous immanence and transcendence.

       

       

    • Jason Fishman
      Felt this post prior to post and reading.... Sandeep wrote: The mystery of simultaneous immanence and transcendence, is impossible
      Message 2 of 3 , Nov 5, 2003
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        Felt this post prior to post and reading....

        Sandeep <sandeepc@...> wrote:

        The mystery of simultaneous immanence and transcendence, is impossible for the mind to comprehend.

        No comprehention takes place in a brain.

        An intuitive leap, may mysteriously occur with blinding clarity, .......which is not the conceptualization of the term/word "clarity".

        Logical terms have no mental clarity, mental clarity doesn't exist. Intuitive leaps are brought forth from reality into being.

        This manifestation, this phenomenality,........... can come to exist only in duality.

        Duality isn't complete, nor is non-dual, total, whole, simple terms representing parts of totality. Contradiction is seen through. Finite can add to infinite, co-operatively. What is a number but a representation of finite?

        And yet that "that-which-you-are" and "this-what you-appear-to-be",......the non-manifest and manifestation, .......the Noumenon and the phenomenon, .........the Absolute and the relative,.......

        ....are not two different.

        They are different, non-manifest and manifest, two extremes of what can be partial to either. Black and white, light and dark, extremes of spectra in between, only connect through extremes in between, indirectly. One functions just as well without the other. Push isn't in need of a good pull. The human brain can make distinction, but simple logic of what is without the other, seperate or as one, is the black and white, confusion in what's in-between.

        The rest of which your wrote is on this basis, what cannot be without the other, is really only what is difficult to see through without comparison. What is born will most certainly die, indirectly through time, time has no known anti-time. Space no anti-space, dimesions, no anti-dimensions, being, no anti-being. All manifestations are, no non-manifestation are not understood or make an appearence. Object, non-object, simple enough.... Thought, no thought simple enough... Local, absense...simple enough.

        Manifestation is not the "creation" of the non-Manifest, but a mirroring, an imaging, an objective expressing,..

        .... of it.

        There is no inherent duality between the subject and the object.

        The Absolute is all there IS.

        Hence the Absolute must necessarily transcend the relative, because the relative is only it's image.......

        ......AND...........

        ...it must also be immanent in the relative because the relative has no independent existence of it's own.

        The substance must necessarily at once transcend and be immanent in the shadow.

        Thus manifestation appears in Consciousness, and is cognized by Consciousness, only in Consciousness.

        And it is thus, that duality is purely notional.

        Consciousness acting through an individualized body-mind complex, ........which is itself Consciousness manifested as "so",(i.e. a sentient psycho-somatic conditioned responsive biological organism ,.........hence the transcendence and the simultaneous immanence,....

        ...........there is no cognizer as an independent entity on it's own, ....

        ....apart........... from the object cognized.

        They are not separate.

        Both the "cognizer" and the "cognized",............... together,............ constitute the fact of cognizing,.....

        .....the functional aspect of noumenon, as pure potentiality.

        Noumenon, as pure potentiality, as pure subjectivity, has no objective existence other than,...... as it's manifestation.

        The appearance thus is the perceived aspect and the interpretation of the perceived aspect, through the attribute of sentience, is the perceptive aspect of Consciousness in movement.

        There are two aspects of the creationing of manifestation.

        -The arising of the Universe.

        -The cognizing of it.

        The arousal of consciousness from the state of rest, the state of pure awareness,

        which is without consciousness of its own existence or presence ......

        ......and.........

        ...... the arising of the apparent universe therein,....

        .....is spontaneous and simultaneous.

        Cognizing takes place through the sentience (the attribute by which there is a prevailing sense of being alive and present) of sentient psycho-somatic objects, ......

        ......which themselves are imaged-objects,........... within that mirroring of the Absolute.

        In the imaged-object, ...............again as part of the mirroring, ...........is the prevailing belief that it is the subject, cognizing the entire array of objects, ......making up it's world, .........the world of loved ones, unloved ones, .......

        ......thus it's world of relatings, objectives, goals, successes, failures, understandings, concepts etc etc.

        As a consequence of the very architecture of the imaged-object,.........is the prevailing sense of such a thinking, ...such a believing..... in that imaged object.

        Whereas, what is happening is that,........... both the cognizing -imaged-object, (thinking it is the subject),....

        ........AND.....

        .... it's cognized objects, (which are once again imaged objects),............

        .......are all imaged objects .......within the mirroring of the Absolute.

         

        In essence, ...............you, ...............whatever you have assumed yourself to be, .....

        ....a spiritual seeker, an enlightened Guru, needing to save the seeker in front, needing to save the whole of humanity, ......

        ......a regular Joe/Jane, who believes spirituality is for third-rate losers who could not make it, in life,.......

        .....you do not live.

        You are lived.

        In the moment.

        Lived exactly as a "danced image".

        A "sage", a term used for a body-mind complex, in which apperception of this has occurred, .....

        .....if the body-mind complex continues to be "alive", will remain,......

        ... as much a "danced image", .............as say a regular Joe.

        With a simultaneous transcendence of the dancing,.. "as- the-sage", ...........in the form of a witnessing gestalt.

        The sage dreams .............and................. witnesses the dream,........ in simultaneous time.

        Aka, wakes up in the morning, brushes his teeth, reads the newspaper, eats, goes about working which enables expenses to be paid, responds to questions posed, .......

        ....when no questions, no seekers, ........watches TV, roots for his favourite football team, admires the vigour and energy and beauty displayed in a MTV program, .....

        ......relates to whatever needs relating, (shouting at the plumber for screwing up the drainage system),..

         .......discusses the finer subtle points between a Cohiba cigar and ordinary cheeroot, Pamela Anderson and Meryl Streep,.....

        ...sips some fine Remy Martin and goes to sleep when tired.

        Exults when another seeker-object "gets" a subtle point,.......grieves at the memory of a loved sister. 

        All the time, ...............a watching of an imaged object, (which society, audience, popular media as labeled as a sage),...... being danced,......in precisely the manner,.... such that there is a doing of all these activities, ............there is an arising of all these feelings,....... in the moment,....

        ....moment to moment to moment.

         

        The simultaneous immanence and transcendence.

         

         



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      • texasbg2000
        ... apperception of this has occurred, ..... ... remain,...... ... sage , ...........in the form of a witnessing gestalt. ... dream,........ in simultaneous
        Message 3 of 3 , Nov 5, 2003
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          --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, Sandeep
          <sandeepc@b...> wrote:
          > A "sage", a term used for a body-mind complex, in which
          apperception of this has occurred, .....
          >
          > .....if the body-mind complex continues to be "alive", will
          remain,......
          >
          > ... as much a "danced image", .............as say a regular Joe.
          >
          > With a simultaneous transcendence of the dancing,.. "as- the-
          sage", ...........in the form of a witnessing gestalt.
          >
          > The sage dreams .............and................. witnesses the
          dream,........ in simultaneous time.
          >
          > Aka, wakes up in the morning, brushes his teeth, reads the
          newspaper, eats, goes about working which enables expenses to be
          paid, responds to questions posed, .......


          The sage appears the same as the regular Joe. Witnessing the dream
          though is a form of control. Any observation of an event alters the
          event. Some, myself included, believe this alteration works towards
          more awakening.

          Love
          Bobby G.
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