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12295Re: No Thoughts Are Brilliant

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  • endofthedream@yahoo.com
    Dec 17, 2003
      --- In meditationsocietyofamerica@yahoogroups.com, medit8ionsociety
      <no_reply@y...> wrote:

      Dear Bob ~

      > Sitting in meditation and witnessing your body, emotions, thoughts,
      > or whatever, eventually realization of a moment between the thoughts
      > occurs.

      *****In that moment, you are not. ;-)

      > When in the thoughts, you are either drawn toward or going
      > away from the objects of your thoughts. All the chasing after or
      > running away from these things leads to an infinity of discomforting
      > mind chatter.

      *****If you mean "in" thoughts as in "sucked into believing them,"
      then yes, what you state is true. However, if you are equating "when
      in the thoughts" with "being in the presence of thoughts," this is
      not necessarily so. In my experience, (and I speak ONLY for Andy, no
      one else), there is *no* problem with thoughts or their objects. Nor
      is there chasing or running away from them. They are seen, arising,
      receding ... just there, like the weather. Sure, some mornings, I
      get up, look at the stormy sky, a bitter cold wintery day, and find a
      disinclination to going outside in such inclement weather. But that
      is just another thought, another story. Appropriate clothing is
      selected and the journey outside is taken. (Or I crawl back under
      the covers and call in sick! Hahaha!!!) Sure, there is a sting! of
      discomfort when the wife offers a sharp word to me. However, in the
      watching, any stories, tales, or spinning out from what happened
      (some words were articulated, that is all) just does not happen. The
      horizontal involvement in 'the play' gets cut off, even in the midst
      of the thoughts ('She's such a bitch' or whatever).

      > The space between your thoughts is where brilliance is
      > found. Brilliance as in light, and brilliance as in wisdom. The
      > brilliance between thoughts is the experience of the infinite peace
      > transcendent of thought.

      *****Yes, it is peace, of a sort. But not one that is very useful,
      in my opinion. Most of our 'conscious' life is navigated in the
      presence of thoughts. Until they are experienced to be empty, until
      one can 'ride' them with no upset, the work is not done. Thoughts
      are not ~ and have never been ~ the "problem." It is the investment
      in them that causes upset, disrupts the equanimity. Even the
      thought "I am to die tomorrow," need not cause upset. It is, after
      all, just a thought. It is not the dying (which is either to come or
      not to come, at a later moment).

      It is all well and good to experience peace, serentiy, even
      brilliance!, while engaged in formal sitting. It certainly has value
      (a lot! for some folks). But the persistent value of meditation is
      that it may allow this Seeing to be carried off of the cushion, into
      the workplace, the family, the world. And that entails being
      serenely WITH the thoughts that bombard us throughout our day, not
      escaping from them in the silence between them.

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