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RE: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain

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  • kjworz@comcast.net
    Another tip: If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line of planing, as the angle provides even more slicing action vis scraping/crushing action. Old
    Message 1 of 13 , Nov 8, 2005
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      Another tip:

      If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line of planing, as the angle provides even more slicing action vis scraping/crushing action.

      Old time expensive shooting boards often had a shooting plane with a skewed angle built into the bed. If you have oodles of money and a lot of time to hunt one down you could go that route, but I doubt it is worth the effort for you. You can get good results with the everyday tools that all the tips that have been provided and a small bit of skill.

      Are skewed planes blades Period? Probably not. I have heard of no example extant. Is skewed planing technique Period? Probably. No evidence confirming either way.


      --
      -Chris Schwartz
      Silver Spring, MD


      To add on to this topic, here's a few things I learned this weekend:
      - Make sure your plane sole is well flattened.
      - Sharpen to blade until it splits photons.
      - Set the cap iron (Provided it has one) a hair's breadth from the edge of the blade.
      - Close down the mouth so that it is only slightly wider than the thickest shaving you want to take.

      Breakout on the far end of the stroke will not be a problem if you back up the work with a stop block. A shooting board will make this much easier.

      A well tuned plane can take a shaving from any wood in any direction. I saw this with my own eyes, and have little doubt that I can replicate the feat.

      Charles Joiner
      Caid
      -----Original Message-----
      From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Craig Robert Pierpont
      Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 11:21 AM
      To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain


      Laurence,
      Use a sharp low angled block plans set to take a very fine cut.
      The grain will split when the cut runs off the edge of the board so you will have to work from both ends of your board toward the center or cut a small chamfer on the corner toward which the plane is going before planing the end grain.
      It may be helpful to make narrow cuts working across the end of the board from one side to the other.
      Your first cuts will be hit and miss but once you are below the rough stuff, you should be able to take a cut that will leave the surface almost shiny.
      The way you handle the plane will be quite a bit different from normal edge planing. If you don't have somebody to show you, you'll just have to work at till you get it. You'll get it.

      Craig Robert
      Lord Craig Robert le Luthier de Pierrepont OVO CAR
      Apprentice to Dame Alysea of Ashley

      medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com wrote:
      Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:11:37 -0000
      From: "lawrence_djd" <teffendar@...>
      Subject: Cleaning up endgrain

      I've been working on a few projects in the past week, and run into the
      same problem on all of them. I spend more than half of my time on a
      given project trying to clean up endgrain. I'm trying to work only
      with tools I can document to the 15th century, which means that the
      only things I have found useful for this task are chisels and files.
      Does anyone have any suggestions as to ways I could make this task
      easier without using OOP methods?

      Laurence of Skraengham
      Baronial College of Tor Aerie
      Kingdom on Northshield
    • Chuck Phillips
      Chris; I didn t mean to imply that people should go out and hunt down one of the few remaining cast iron shooting boards. Part of the reason those things are
      Message 2 of 13 , Nov 8, 2005
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        Chris;
         
        I didn't mean to imply that people should go out and hunt down one of the few remaining cast iron shooting boards.  Part of the reason those things are so rare is that most people saw no reason to buy one in the first place.  All you really need is a couple of boards.  Make one about 4 inches wide, which is wide enough to support your work.  Make a second board about as much wider as the cheek of your plane.  For most of use, that come to about 7 inches.  Both of these are 2-3 feet long.  Fasten the two boards together, stacked on their wide faces.  Add a stop block to the top piece, and Bob's your uncle.
         
        It is entirely plausible that shooting boards fall into the category of "everyday tools".  The reason that few, if any, wooden ones have survived is that they don't look like "tools", and so most were likely pitched into the wood pile along with all those transitional planes.
         
        Charles Joiner
        Caid
        -----Original Message-----
        From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of kjworz@...
        Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 4:59 AM
        To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com; medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain


        Another tip:

        If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line of planing, as the angle provides even more slicing action vis scraping/crushing action.

        Old time expensive shooting boards often had a shooting plane with a skewed angle built into the bed.  If you have oodles of money and a lot of time to hunt one down you could go that route, but I doubt it is worth the effort for you.  You can get good results with the everyday tools that all the tips that have been provided and a small bit of skill.

        Are skewed planes blades Period?  Probably not.  I have heard of no example extant.  Is skewed planing technique Period?  Probably.  No evidence confirming either way.


        --
        -Chris Schwartz
        Silver Spring, MD


        To add on to this topic, here's a few things I learned this weekend:
        - Make sure your plane sole is well flattened.
        - Sharpen to blade until it splits photons.
        - Set the cap iron (Provided it has one) a hair's breadth from the edge of the blade.
        - Close down the mouth so that it is only slightly wider than the thickest shaving you want to take.

        Breakout on the far end of the stroke will not be a problem if you back up the work with a stop block.  A shooting board will make this much easier.

        A well tuned plane can take a shaving from any wood in any direction.  I saw this with my own eyes, and have little doubt that I can replicate the feat. 

        Charles Joiner
        Caid
        -----Original Message-----
        From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Craig Robert Pierpont
        Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 11:21 AM
        To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain


        Laurence,
            Use a sharp low angled block plans set to take a very fine cut.
            The grain will split when the cut runs off the edge of the board so you will have to work from both ends of your board toward the center or cut a small chamfer on the corner toward which the plane is going before planing the end grain.
            It may be helpful to make narrow cuts working across the end of the board from one side to the other.
            Your first cuts will be hit and miss but once you are below the rough stuff, you should be able to take a cut that will leave the surface almost shiny.
            The way you handle the plane will be quite a bit different from normal edge planing. If you don't have somebody to show you, you'll just have to work at till you get it. You'll get it.

        Craig Robert
        Lord Craig Robert le Luthier de Pierrepont OVO CAR
        Apprentice to Dame Alysea of Ashley

        medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com wrote:
        Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:11:37 -0000
           From: "lawrence_djd" <teffendar@...>
        Subject: Cleaning up endgrain

        I've been working on a few projects in the past week, and run into the
        same problem on all of them.  I spend more than half of my time on a
        given project trying to clean up endgrain.  I'm trying to work only
        with tools I can document to the 15th century, which means that the
        only things I have found useful for this task are chisels and files.
        Does anyone have any suggestions as to ways I could make this task
        easier without using OOP methods?

        Laurence of Skraengham
        Baronial College of Tor Aerie
        Kingdom on Northshield

      • michael_recchione
        A shooting board is a necessary piece of equipment if you don t want to use sandpaper. Here s a link to plans for a ramped shooting board and also some plans
        Message 3 of 13 , Nov 8, 2005
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          A shooting board is a necessary piece of equipment if you don't want
          to use sandpaper. Here's a link to plans for a ramped shooting board
          and also some plans for other types of shooting boards. Making a
          simple, non-ramped one is about an hours work or less.

          http://www.amgron.clara.net/planingpoints/rampedboard/rampindex.htm

          - Mike

          --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck Phillips" <chuck@c...>
          wrote:
          >
          > Chris;
          >
          > I didn't mean to imply that people should go out and hunt down one
          of the
          > few remaining cast iron shooting boards. Part of the reason those
          things
          > are so rare is that most people saw no reason to buy one in the
          first place.
          > All you really need is a couple of boards. Make one about 4 inches
          wide,
          > which is wide enough to support your work. Make a second board about as
          > much wider as the cheek of your plane. For most of use, that come
          to about
          > 7 inches. Both of these are 2-3 feet long. Fasten the two boards
          together,
          > stacked on their wide faces. Add a stop block to the top piece, and
          Bob's
          > your uncle.
          >
          > It is entirely plausible that shooting boards fall into the category of
          > "everyday tools". The reason that few, if any, wooden ones have
          survived is
          > that they don't look like "tools", and so most were likely pitched
          into the
          > wood pile along with all those transitional planes.
          >
          > Charles Joiner
          > Caid
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
          > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of kjworz@c...
          > Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 4:59 AM
          > To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com; medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain
          >
          >
          >
          > Another tip:
          >
          > If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line of planing, as the
          > angle provides even more slicing action vis scraping/crushing action.
          >
          > Old time expensive shooting boards often had a shooting plane with a
          > skewed angle built into the bed. If you have oodles of money and a
          lot of
          > time to hunt one down you could go that route, but I doubt it is
          worth the
          > effort for you. You can get good results with the everyday tools
          that all
          > the tips that have been provided and a small bit of skill.
          >
          > Are skewed planes blades Period? Probably not. I have heard of no
          > example extant. Is skewed planing technique Period? Probably. No
          evidence
          > confirming either way.
          >
          >
          > --
          > -Chris Schwartz
          > Silver Spring, MD
          >
          >
          > To add on to this topic, here's a few things I learned this weekend:
          > - Make sure your plane sole is well flattened.
          > - Sharpen to blade until it splits photons.
          > - Set the cap iron (Provided it has one) a hair's breadth from the
          edge of
          > the blade.
          > - Close down the mouth so that it is only slightly wider than the
          thickest
          > shaving you want to take.
          >
          > Breakout on the far end of the stroke will not be a problem if you
          back up
          > the work with a stop block. A shooting board will make this much
          easier.
          >
          > A well tuned plane can take a shaving from any wood in any
          direction. I
          > saw this with my own eyes, and have little doubt that I can
          replicate the
          > feat.
          >
          > Charles Joiner
          > Caid
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
          > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Craig Robert
          Pierpont
          > Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 11:21 AM
          > To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain
          >
          >
          > Laurence,
          > Use a sharp low angled block plans set to take a very fine cut.
          > The grain will split when the cut runs off the edge of the
          board so
          > you will have to work from both ends of your board toward the center
          or cut
          > a small chamfer on the corner toward which the plane is going before
          planing
          > the end grain.
          > It may be helpful to make narrow cuts working across the end
          of the
          > board from one side to the other.
          > Your first cuts will be hit and miss but once you are below
          the rough
          > stuff, you should be able to take a cut that will leave the surface
          almost
          > shiny.
          > The way you handle the plane will be quite a bit different
          from normal
          > edge planing. If you don't have somebody to show you, you'll just
          have to
          > work at till you get it. You'll get it.
          >
          > Craig Robert
          > Lord Craig Robert le Luthier de Pierrepont OVO CAR
          > Apprentice to Dame Alysea of Ashley
          >
          > medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com wrote:
          > Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:11:37 -0000
          > From: "lawrence_djd" <teffendar@h...>
          > Subject: Cleaning up endgrain
          >
          > I've been working on a few projects in the past week, and run into the
          > same problem on all of them. I spend more than half of my time on a
          > given project trying to clean up endgrain. I'm trying to work only
          > with tools I can document to the 15th century, which means that the
          > only things I have found useful for this task are chisels and files.
          > Does anyone have any suggestions as to ways I could make this task
          > easier without using OOP methods?
          >
          > Laurence of Skraengham
          > Baronial College of Tor Aerie
          > Kingdom on Northshield
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
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          >
          > a.. Visit your group "medievalsawdust" on the web.
          >
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          >
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          > Service.
          >
          >
          >
          ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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          >
        • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
          What about a finishing scraper with a fresh burr? I m asking, not advising...... ... Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim Hart Aude Aliquid Dignum Dare Something Worthy
          Message 4 of 13 , Nov 8, 2005
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            What about a finishing scraper with a fresh burr?

            I'm asking, not advising......



            --- kjworz@... wrote:

            >
            > Another tip:
            >
            > If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line
            > of planing, as the angle provides even more slicing
            > action vis scraping/crushing action.
            >
            > Old time expensive shooting boards often had a
            > shooting plane with a skewed angle built into the
            > bed. If you have oodles of money and a lot of time
            > to hunt one down you could go that route, but I
            > doubt it is worth the effort for you. You can get
            > good results with the everyday tools that all the
            > tips that have been provided and a small bit of
            > skill.
            >
            > Are skewed planes blades Period? Probably not. I
            > have heard of no example extant. Is skewed planing
            > technique Period? Probably. No evidence confirming
            > either way.
            >
            >
            > --
            > -Chris Schwartz
            > Silver Spring, MD
            >
            >
            > To add on to this topic, here's a few things I
            > learned this weekend:
            > - Make sure your plane sole is well flattened.
            > - Sharpen to blade until it splits photons.
            > - Set the cap iron (Provided it has one) a hair's
            > breadth from the edge of the blade.
            > - Close down the mouth so that it is only slightly
            > wider than the thickest shaving you want to take.
            >
            > Breakout on the far end of the stroke will not be a
            > problem if you back up the work with a stop block.
            > A shooting board will make this much easier.
            >
            > A well tuned plane can take a shaving from any wood
            > in any direction. I saw this with my own eyes, and
            > have little doubt that I can replicate the feat.
            >
            > Charles Joiner
            > Caid
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
            > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
            > Craig Robert Pierpont
            > Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 11:21 AM
            > To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain
            >
            >
            > Laurence,
            > Use a sharp low angled block plans set to take a
            > very fine cut.
            > The grain will split when the cut runs off the
            > edge of the board so you will have to work from both
            > ends of your board toward the center or cut a small
            > chamfer on the corner toward which the plane is
            > going before planing the end grain.
            > It may be helpful to make narrow cuts working
            > across the end of the board from one side to the
            > other.
            > Your first cuts will be hit and miss but once
            > you are below the rough stuff, you should be able to
            > take a cut that will leave the surface almost shiny.
            > The way you handle the plane will be quite a bit
            > different from normal edge planing. If you don't
            > have somebody to show you, you'll just have to work
            > at till you get it. You'll get it.
            >
            > Craig Robert
            > Lord Craig Robert le Luthier de Pierrepont OVO CAR
            > Apprentice to Dame Alysea of Ashley
            >
            > medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com wrote:
            > Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:11:37 -0000
            > From: "lawrence_djd" <teffendar@...>
            > Subject: Cleaning up endgrain
            >
            > I've been working on a few projects in the past
            > week, and run into the
            > same problem on all of them. I spend more than half
            > of my time on a
            > given project trying to clean up endgrain. I'm
            > trying to work only
            > with tools I can document to the 15th century, which
            > means that the
            > only things I have found useful for this task are
            > chisels and files.
            > Does anyone have any suggestions as to ways I could
            > make this task
            > easier without using OOP methods?
            >
            > Laurence of Skraengham
            > Baronial College of Tor Aerie
            > Kingdom on Northshield
            >
            >


            Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

            Aude Aliquid Dignum
            ' Dare Something Worthy '



            __________________________________
            Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.
            http://farechase.yahoo.com
          • Dragano Abbruciati
            OH, I like that. It also places the blade at an angle for an easier shave. Thanks for sharing. Dragano michael_recchione wrote:
            Message 5 of 13 , Nov 9, 2005
            • 0 Attachment
              OH, I like that.  It also places the blade at an angle for an easier shave.  Thanks for sharing.
               
              Dragano

              michael_recchione <michael_recchione@...> wrote:
              A shooting board is a necessary piece of equipment if you don't want
              to use sandpaper.  Here's a link to plans for a ramped shooting board
              and also some plans for other types of shooting boards.  Making a
              simple, non-ramped one is about an hours work or less.

              http://www.amgron.clara.net/planingpoints/rampedboard/rampindex.htm

              - Mike

              --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck Phillips" <chuck@c...>
              wrote:
              >
              > Chris;
              >
              > I didn't mean to imply that people should go out and hunt down one
              of the
              > few remaining cast iron shooting boards.  Part of the reason those
              things
              > are so rare is that most people saw no reason to buy one in the
              first place.
              > All you really need is a couple of boards.  Make one about 4 inches
              wide,
              > which is wide enough to support your work.  Make a second board about as
              > much wider as the cheek of your plane.  For most of use, that come
              to about
              > 7 inches.  Both of these are 2-3 feet long.  Fasten the two boards
              together,
              > stacked on their wide faces.  Add a stop block to the top piece, and
              Bob's
              > your uncle.
              >
              > It is entirely plausible that shooting boards fall into the category of
              > "everyday tools".  The reason that few, if any, wooden ones have
              survived is
              > that they don't look like "tools", and so most were likely pitched
              into the
              > wood pile along with all those transitional planes.
              >
              > Charles Joiner
              > Caid
              >   -----Original Message-----
              >   From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of kjworz@c...
              >   Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 4:59 AM
              >   To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com; medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              >   Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain
              >
              >
              >
              >   Another tip:
              >
              >   If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line of planing, as the
              > angle provides even more slicing action vis scraping/crushing action.
              >
              >   Old time expensive shooting boards often had a shooting plane with a
              > skewed angle built into the bed.  If you have oodles of money and a
              lot of
              > time to hunt one down you could go that route, but I doubt it is
              worth the
              > effort for you.  You can get good results with the everyday tools
              that all
              > the tips that have been provided and a small bit of skill.
              >
              >   Are skewed planes blades Period?  Probably not.  I have heard of no
              > example extant.  Is skewed planing technique Period?  Probably.  No
              evidence
              > confirming either way.
              >
              >
              >   --
              >   -Chris Schwartz
              >   Silver Spring, MD
              >
              >
              >   To add on to this topic, here's a few things I learned this weekend:
              >   - Make sure your plane sole is well flattened.
              >   - Sharpen to blade until it splits photons.
              >   - Set the cap iron (Provided it has one) a hair's breadth from the
              edge of
              > the blade.
              >   - Close down the mouth so that it is only slightly wider than the
              thickest
              > shaving you want to take.
              >
              >   Breakout on the far end of the stroke will not be a problem if you
              back up
              > the work with a stop block.  A shooting board will make this much
              easier.
              >
              >   A well tuned plane can take a shaving from any wood in any
              direction.  I
              > saw this with my own eyes, and have little doubt that I can
              replicate the
              > feat.
              >
              >   Charles Joiner
              >   Caid
              >   -----Original Message-----
              >   From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Craig Robert
              Pierpont
              >   Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 11:21 AM
              >   To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              >   Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain
              >
              >
              >   Laurence,
              >       Use a sharp low angled block plans set to take a very fine cut.
              >       The grain will split when the cut runs off the edge of the
              board so
              > you will have to work from both ends of your board toward the center
              or cut
              > a small chamfer on the corner toward which the plane is going before
              planing
              > the end grain.
              >       It may be helpful to make narrow cuts working across the end
              of the
              > board from one side to the other.
              >       Your first cuts will be hit and miss but once you are below
              the rough
              > stuff, you should be able to take a cut that will leave the surface
              almost
              > shiny.
              >       The way you handle the plane will be quite a bit different
              from normal
              > edge planing. If you don't have somebody to show you, you'll just
              have to
              > work at till you get it. You'll get it.
              >
              >   Craig Robert
              >   Lord Craig Robert le Luthier de Pierrepont OVO CAR
              >   Apprentice to Dame Alysea of Ashley
              >
              >   medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com wrote:
              >   Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:11:37 -0000
              >      From: "lawrence_djd" <teffendar@h...>
              >   Subject: Cleaning up endgrain
              >
              >   I've been working on a few projects in the past week, and run into the
              >   same problem on all of them.  I spend more than half of my time on a
              >   given project trying to clean up endgrain.  I'm trying to work only
              >   with tools I can document to the 15th century, which means that the
              >   only things I have found useful for this task are chisels and files.
              >   Does anyone have any suggestions as to ways I could make this task
              >   easier without using OOP methods?
              >
              >   Laurence of Skraengham
              >   Baronial College of Tor Aerie
              >   Kingdom on Northshield
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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              >   YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
              >
              >     a..  Visit your group "medievalsawdust" on the web.
              >
              >     b..  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              >      medievalsawdust-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              >     c..  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
              > Service.
              >
              >
              >
              ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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              >







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            • Chuck Phillips
              There are two issues with using a scraper. First, the edge is completely unconstrained, so that unless you have godlike skill you will not get the work truly
              Message 6 of 13 , Nov 9, 2005
              • 0 Attachment
                There are two issues with using a scraper.  First, the edge is completely unconstrained, so that unless you have godlike skill you will not get the work truly flat.  Secondly, a scraper doesn't leave as clean a surface as a plane.  Better than sanding, but still not as nice as a plane.
                -----Original Message-----
                From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 2:06 PM
                To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain

                What about a finishing scraper with a fresh burr?

                I'm asking, not advising......



                --- kjworz@... wrote:

                >
                > Another tip:
                >
                > If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line
                > of planing, as the angle provides even more slicing
                > action vis scraping/crushing action.
                >
                > Old time expensive shooting boards often had a
                > shooting plane with a skewed angle built into the
                > bed.  If you have oodles of money and a lot of time
                > to hunt one down you could go that route, but I
                > doubt it is worth the effort for you.  You can get
                > good results with the everyday tools that all the
                > tips that have been provided and a small bit of
                > skill.
                >
                > Are skewed planes blades Period?  Probably not.  I
                > have heard of no example extant.  Is skewed planing
                > technique Period?  Probably.  No evidence confirming
                > either way.
                >
                >
                > --
                > -Chris Schwartz
                > Silver Spring, MD
                >
                >
                > To add on to this topic, here's a few things I
                > learned this weekend:
                > - Make sure your plane sole is well flattened.
                > - Sharpen to blade until it splits photons.
                > - Set the cap iron (Provided it has one) a hair's
                > breadth from the edge of the blade.
                > - Close down the mouth so that it is only slightly
                > wider than the thickest shaving you want to take.

                > Breakout on the far end of the stroke will not be a
                > problem if you back up the work with a stop block.
                > A shooting board will make this much easier.

                > A well tuned plane can take a shaving from any wood
                > in any direction.  I saw this with my own eyes, and
                > have little doubt that I can replicate the feat. 

                > Charles Joiner
                > Caid
                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
                > Craig Robert Pierpont
                > Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 11:21 AM
                > To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain
                >
                >
                > Laurence,
                >     Use a sharp low angled block plans set to take a
                > very fine cut.
                >     The grain will split when the cut runs off the
                > edge of the board so you will have to work from both
                > ends of your board toward the center or cut a small
                > chamfer on the corner toward which the plane is
                > going before planing the end grain.
                >     It may be helpful to make narrow cuts working
                > across the end of the board from one side to the
                > other.
                >     Your first cuts will be hit and miss but once
                > you are below the rough stuff, you should be able to
                > take a cut that will leave the surface almost shiny.
                >     The way you handle the plane will be quite a bit
                > different from normal edge planing. If you don't
                > have somebody to show you, you'll just have to work
                > at till you get it. You'll get it.
                >
                > Craig Robert
                > Lord Craig Robert le Luthier de Pierrepont OVO CAR
                > Apprentice to Dame Alysea of Ashley
                >
                > medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com wrote:
                >  Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:11:37 -0000
                >    From: "lawrence_djd" <teffendar@...>
                > Subject: Cleaning up endgrain
                >
                > I've been working on a few projects in the past
                > week, and run into the
                > same problem on all of them.  I spend more than half
                > of my time on a
                > given project trying to clean up endgrain.  I'm
                > trying to work only
                > with tools I can document to the 15th century, which
                > means that the
                > only things I have found useful for this task are
                > chisels and files.
                > Does anyone have any suggestions as to ways I could
                > make this task
                > easier without using OOP methods?
                >
                > Laurence of Skraengham
                > Baronial College of Tor Aerie
                > Kingdom on Northshield
                >
                >


                Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                   Aude Aliquid Dignum
                     ' Dare Something Worthy '


                           
                __________________________________
                Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.
                http://farechase.yahoo.com
              • James W. Pratt, Jr.
                The other side er..edge is that a scaper will cut knots and curly grain better than a plane. There is such a thing as a scraper plane and a Stanley #70 I
                Message 7 of 13 , Nov 9, 2005
                • 0 Attachment
                  The other side er..edge is that  a scaper will cut knots and curly grain better than a plane.  There is such a thing as a scraper plane and a Stanley #70 I think.. scraper thing that looks a lot like a spoke shave only with a big flat face.
                   
                  James Cunningham

                  There are two issues with using a scraper.  First, the edge is completely unconstrained, so that unless you have godlike skill you will not get the work truly flat.  Secondly, a scraper doesn't leave as clean a surface as a plane.  Better than sanding, but still not as nice as a plane.
                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                  Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 2:06 PM
                  To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain

                  What about a finishing scraper with a fresh burr?

                  I'm asking, not advising......



                  --- kjworz@... wrote:

                  >
                  > Another tip:
                  >
                  > If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line
                  > of planing, as the angle provides even more slicing
                  > action vis scraping/crushing action.
                  >
                  > Old time expensive shooting boards often had a
                  > shooting plane with a skewed angle built into the
                  > bed.  If you have oodles of money and a lot of time
                  > to hunt one down you could go that route, but I
                  > doubt it is worth the effort for you.  You can get
                  > good results with the everyday tools that all the
                  > tips that have been provided and a small bit of
                  > skill.
                  >
                  > Are skewed planes blades Period?  Probably not.  I
                  > have heard of no example extant.  Is skewed planing
                  > technique Period?  Probably.  No evidence confirming
                  > either way.
                  >
                  >
                  > --
                  > -Chris Schwartz
                  > Silver Spring, MD
                  >
                  >
                  > To add on to this topic, here's a few things I
                  > learned this weekend:
                  > - Make sure your plane sole is well flattened.
                  > - Sharpen to blade until it splits photons.
                  > - Set the cap iron (Provided it has one) a hair's
                  > breadth from the edge of the blade.
                  > - Close down the mouth so that it is only slightly
                  > wider than the thickest shaving you want to take.

                  > Breakout on the far end of the stroke will not be a
                  > problem if you back up the work with a stop block.
                  > A shooting board will make this much easier.

                  > A well tuned plane can take a shaving from any wood
                  > in any direction.  I saw this with my own eyes, and
                  > have little doubt that I can replicate the feat. 

                  > Charles Joiner
                  > Caid
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                  > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
                  > Craig Robert Pierpont
                  > Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 11:21 AM
                  > To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain
                  >
                  >
                  > Laurence,
                  >     Use a sharp low angled block plans set to take a
                  > very fine cut.
                  >     The grain will split when the cut runs off the
                  > edge of the board so you will have to work from both
                  > ends of your board toward the center or cut a small
                  > chamfer on the corner toward which the plane is
                  > going before planing the end grain.
                  >     It may be helpful to make narrow cuts working
                  > across the end of the board from one side to the
                  > other.
                  >     Your first cuts will be hit and miss but once
                  > you are below the rough stuff, you should be able to
                  > take a cut that will leave the surface almost shiny.
                  >     The way you handle the plane will be quite a bit
                  > different from normal edge planing. If you don't
                  > have somebody to show you, you'll just have to work
                  > at till you get it. You'll get it.
                  >
                  > Craig Robert
                  > Lord Craig Robert le Luthier de Pierrepont OVO CAR
                  > Apprentice to Dame Alysea of Ashley
                  >
                  > medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com wrote:
                  >  Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:11:37 -0000
                  >    From: "lawrence_djd" <teffendar@...>
                  > Subject: Cleaning up endgrain
                  >
                  > I've been working on a few projects in the past
                  > week, and run into the
                  > same problem on all of them.  I spend more than half
                  > of my time on a
                  > given project trying to clean up endgrain.  I'm
                  > trying to work only
                  > with tools I can document to the 15th century, which
                  > means that the
                  > only things I have found useful for this task are
                  > chisels and files.
                  > Does anyone have any suggestions as to ways I could
                  > make this task
                  > easier without using OOP methods?
                  >
                  > Laurence of Skraengham
                  > Baronial College of Tor Aerie
                  > Kingdom on Northshield
                  >
                  >


                  Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                     Aude Aliquid Dignum
                       ' Dare Something Worthy '


                             
                  __________________________________
                  Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.
                  http://farechase.yahoo.com
                • Chuck Phillips
                  I think the tool you re describing is the Stanley #12. The #70 is more like a scraper on a stick. Charles Joiner Caid ... From:
                  Message 8 of 13 , Nov 9, 2005
                  • 0 Attachment
                    I think the tool you're describing is the Stanley #12.  The #70 is more like a scraper on a stick.
                     
                    Charles Joiner
                    Caid
                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of James W. Pratt, Jr.
                    Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 5:52 PM
                    To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain

                    The other side er..edge is that  a scaper will cut knots and curly grain better than a plane.  There is such a thing as a scraper plane and a Stanley #70 I think.. scraper thing that looks a lot like a spoke shave only with a big flat face.
                     
                    James Cunningham

                    There are two issues with using a scraper.  First, the edge is completely unconstrained, so that unless you have godlike skill you will not get the work truly flat.  Secondly, a scraper doesn't leave as clean a surface as a plane.  Better than sanding, but still not as nice as a plane.
                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                    Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 2:06 PM
                    To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain

                    What about a finishing scraper with a fresh burr?

                    I'm asking, not advising......



                    --- kjworz@... wrote:

                    >
                    > Another tip:
                    >
                    > If you can, skew the blade at an angle to the line
                    > of planing, as the angle provides even more slicing
                    > action vis scraping/crushing action.
                    >
                    > Old time expensive shooting boards often had a
                    > shooting plane with a skewed angle built into the
                    > bed.  If you have oodles of money and a lot of time
                    > to hunt one down you could go that route, but I
                    > doubt it is worth the effort for you.  You can get
                    > good results with the everyday tools that all the
                    > tips that have been provided and a small bit of
                    > skill.
                    >
                    > Are skewed planes blades Period?  Probably not.  I
                    > have heard of no example extant.  Is skewed planing
                    > technique Period?  Probably.  No evidence confirming
                    > either way.
                    >
                    >
                    > --
                    > -Chris Schwartz
                    > Silver Spring, MD
                    >
                    >
                    > To add on to this topic, here's a few things I
                    > learned this weekend:
                    > - Make sure your plane sole is well flattened.
                    > - Sharpen to blade until it splits photons.
                    > - Set the cap iron (Provided it has one) a hair's
                    > breadth from the edge of the blade.
                    > - Close down the mouth so that it is only slightly
                    > wider than the thickest shaving you want to take.

                    > Breakout on the far end of the stroke will not be a
                    > problem if you back up the work with a stop block.
                    > A shooting board will make this much easier.

                    > A well tuned plane can take a shaving from any wood
                    > in any direction.  I saw this with my own eyes, and
                    > have little doubt that I can replicate the feat. 

                    > Charles Joiner
                    > Caid
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                    > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
                    > Craig Robert Pierpont
                    > Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 11:21 AM
                    > To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Cleaning up endgrain
                    >
                    >
                    > Laurence,
                    >     Use a sharp low angled block plans set to take a
                    > very fine cut.
                    >     The grain will split when the cut runs off the
                    > edge of the board so you will have to work from both
                    > ends of your board toward the center or cut a small
                    > chamfer on the corner toward which the plane is
                    > going before planing the end grain.
                    >     It may be helpful to make narrow cuts working
                    > across the end of the board from one side to the
                    > other.
                    >     Your first cuts will be hit and miss but once
                    > you are below the rough stuff, you should be able to
                    > take a cut that will leave the surface almost shiny.
                    >     The way you handle the plane will be quite a bit
                    > different from normal edge planing. If you don't
                    > have somebody to show you, you'll just have to work
                    > at till you get it. You'll get it.
                    >
                    > Craig Robert
                    > Lord Craig Robert le Luthier de Pierrepont OVO CAR
                    > Apprentice to Dame Alysea of Ashley
                    >
                    > medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com wrote:
                    >  Date: Sun, 06 Nov 2005 18:11:37 -0000
                    >    From: "lawrence_djd" <teffendar@...>
                    > Subject: Cleaning up endgrain
                    >
                    > I've been working on a few projects in the past
                    > week, and run into the
                    > same problem on all of them.  I spend more than half
                    > of my time on a
                    > given project trying to clean up endgrain.  I'm
                    > trying to work only
                    > with tools I can document to the 15th century, which
                    > means that the
                    > only things I have found useful for this task are
                    > chisels and files.
                    > Does anyone have any suggestions as to ways I could
                    > make this task
                    > easier without using OOP methods?
                    >
                    > Laurence of Skraengham
                    > Baronial College of Tor Aerie
                    > Kingdom on Northshield
                    >
                    >


                    Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                       Aude Aliquid Dignum
                         ' Dare Something Worthy '


                               
                    __________________________________
                    Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.
                    http://farechase.yahoo.com
                  • michael_recchione
                    Scrapers don t work particularly well on endgrain, and have issues with softer woods in general. In more recent times, bevel-up low angle planes have been
                    Message 9 of 13 , Nov 10, 2005
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Scrapers don't work particularly well on endgrain, and have issues with
                      softer woods in general. In more recent times, bevel-up low angle
                      planes have been touted as the thing to use on end-grain, and they
                      certainly work well (e.g. a Stanley 65 or 61 1/2 or any of a number of
                      the new offerings from Lee Valley). But they're almost equally
                      certainly not period in the sense that bedding and supporting an iron
                      at a very low angle is very difficult to do with a wooden plane body
                      and the resulting plane is extremely fragile. The good news is, as
                      someone else pointed out, any plane with a sharp iron and set for a
                      fine cut handles end-grain just fine. Again, as was pointed out,
                      skewing the plane as you approach the wood lowers the effective cutting
                      angle and was almost certainly a period technique (it would be hard to
                      imagine that it wasn't - it just amounts to holding the plane at a
                      different angle with your hands as you push it).

                      So, if you're determined to do this in a period way, use a wooden
                      bodied smoother set for a fine cut (size of mouth opening is irrelevant
                      for endgrain), and skew it relative to the work. To prevent break out,
                      either use a backing block, a chamfer or work towards the middle from
                      either side.

                      - Mike
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