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Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Authenticity

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  • kit_houston@pkf.com.au
    IMO, messy modern. That was my thought. Kit www.knighthospitaller.com Ralph Lindberg Sent by: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com 13/10/2005
    Message 1 of 9 , Oct 12, 2005
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      IMO, messy modern.


      That was my thought.

      Kit
      www.knighthospitaller.com



      "Ralph Lindberg" <n7bsn@...>
      Sent by: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com

      13/10/2005 02:16 PM

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      [MedievalSawdust] Re: Authenticity





      --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, kit_houston@p... wrote:

    • Tom Rettie
      ... hand. ... shows and ... Excellent idea. There s no better way to get in touch with the sawdust of our ancestors than to work with their tools and
      Message 2 of 9 , Oct 13, 2005
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        --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, kit_houston@p... wrote:

        >While power tools are fast and easy i want to start doing things by
        hand.
        > I also want to start taking wood working / armouring / craft to
        shows and
        > events to do in front of the public / fill my spare time.

        Excellent idea. There's no better way to get in touch with the
        sawdust of our ancestors than to work with their tools and
        techniques. And woodworking makes a great demo activity.

        > The one major problem is with modern timber. I want to take my
        > authenticity as far as finished wood. ie. i don't have the time,
        skill or
        > know how to chop down trees (well i could do that bit) and make
        plank's.
        > So i will be starting with pre-cut timber.

        That's not really a problem. I'm not so much up on the 14th century,
        but by the 15th century carpenters are working in both green and
        seasoned stock. And not everyone is going from tree to finish piece;
        many craftsmen are purchasing from timber mongers. See Ranulf's
        article on the timber trade at:

        http://www.medievalwoodworking.com/articles/lumber_trade.htm

        He's also got a Compleate Anachronist on period tools that's worth
        looking at.

        I suggest finding a good lumber yard or two in your area. Not a Home
        Center; their stuff will be overpriced and overmilled. A real lumber
        yard can sell you rough cut stock in varying thicknesses (measured
        in "quarters" of an inch). If you buy 4-quarter stock, it will be a
        true 1-inch thick and give you plenty of room to practice planing
        and jointing a board. The result will look more like a period
        piece, tool marks and all, than something that's been run through a
        power planer. Lumber yards also frequently have a "shorts" bin with
        scraps for very cheap (or free), good for practicing on.

        > I'm doing the 14th century , is there a good manuscript or
        painting with
        > variety of wood tools form this century?. If not ill be using the
        > below........

        There are quite a number of period illustrations, though most of the
        ones I'm familiar with start in the 15th century. Look for pictures
        of Noah or Joseph, both biblical woodworkers who are frequently
        illustrated at work.

        > I have read through http://www.his.com/~tom/TOOLS.PDF and from
        that have a
        > basic idea of the tools used.
        > I'm going to a blacksmithing convention this weekend and want to
        ask some
        > of the guys there to quote on making the tools.
        > Is ther anything missing from he above that i should consider?

        Well, as the author of that article I'd say it's a fair starting
        point, with a few provisos. The guys in that picture are doing large-
        scale timber framing. If you're starting on small-scale carpentry,
        you may want a slightly different tool set.

        You probably won't need a lot of axes, but a good broad hatchet is
        handy. Don't run out and buy a froe unless you're going to need one
        (for some reason, everybody buys a froe). A good drawknife is also
        very useful.

        You'll definitely want some good quality chisels and gouges. You
        won't need a full set at first. I find I use by 3/8 and 1-inch
        mortising chisels a lot, and the 1/4 is handy.

        Saws can be a little problematic; while you can buy modern frame
        saws that look close to period, I haven't found any commercial
        models that come close to the "scimitar" profile of some period
        ones. Be sure to have both a good crosscut and rip saw; I see a lot
        of folks get frustrated because they're trying to rip with a
        crosscut (which quickly drives them to the tablesaw).

        Wood-bodied planes are still available both new and used. Do some
        reading on their use and maintenance before buying, esp. used. There
        are some that have been so abused they just aren't worth trying to
        fix (they get sold for decoration).

        While I can't document a shaving horse to the 14th century, it's
        also very useful to have.

        Many of the tools you'll need can be bought commercially, new or
        used. Keep an eye open for old tool shows and auctions (PATINA has a
        good one every spring in Maryland). In my opinion, it's better to
        have a few good quality tools than many tools that are cheap or worn
        out. I think hand-forged tools are great, but it's hard to find
        smiths that know how to make them.

        A tool box is a good first project, and it gives you something to
        tote your stuff around in. Some simple stake-leg benches are also
        handy as sawhorses.

        I also strongly recommend Roy Underhill's "Woodwright" series of
        books (and TV show) as an accessible introduction to using hand
        tools. He won't give you measured drawings, but he's good at getting
        into that pre-industrial mindset.

        Hope that helps some. Feel free to drop me a line with questions.

        Regards,

        Tom R. (Fin)
      • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
        ... just pretend you are a jointer or a cabinetmaker and you therefore purchase your lumber from a sawyer. Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim Hart Aude Aliquid Dignum
        Message 3 of 9 , Oct 13, 2005
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          > > Is this worth it ? or will it just look like messy
          > modern timber?
          > >
          >


          just pretend you are a jointer or a cabinetmaker
          and you therefore purchase your lumber from a sawyer.





          Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

          Aude Aliquid Dignum
          ' Dare Something Worthy '




          __________________________________
          Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
          http://mail.yahoo.com
        • Jon Terris
          ... I ve been looking for ages to find a period saw, I m talking to a blacksmith over here (UK) about having one made, his suggestion was to get an old saw and
          Message 4 of 9 , Oct 14, 2005
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            --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Rettie" <tom@h...> wrote:
            > Saws can be a little problematic; while you can buy modern frame
            > saws that look close to period, I haven't found any commercial
            > models that come close to the "scimitar" profile of some period
            > ones.

            I've been looking for ages to find a period saw, I'm talking to a
            blacksmith over here (UK) about having one made, his suggestion was to
            get an old saw and then he'll get it cut down into the correct shape
            by a colleague. A couple of my timber framing friends have done the
            same thing and they look great, they do take a bit of getting used to
            though!
          • James W. Pratt, Jr.
            Got any pictures of the scimitar profile saws? James Cunningham asking the obvious...well to you guys...not to me
            Message 5 of 9 , Oct 14, 2005
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              Got any pictures of the "scimitar" profile saws?

              James Cunningham
              asking the obvious...well to you guys...not to me
            • Tom Rettie
              ... They show up several places, such as in the Bedford Book of Hours picture of Noah: http://www.wga.hu/art/zgothic/miniatur/1401-450/01f_1401.jpg There s
              Message 6 of 9 , Oct 14, 2005
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                --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "James W. Pratt, Jr."
                <cunning@f...> wrote:

                > Got any pictures of the "scimitar" profile saws?

                They show up several places, such as in the Bedford Book of Hours
                picture of Noah:

                http://www.wga.hu/art/zgothic/miniatur/1401-450/01f_1401.jpg

                There's also the "big bread knife" profile such as here:

                http://gallery.euroweb.hu/art/m/master/flemalle/merode/3mero_r.jpg

                There's a nice one of a frame saw/bow saw here:

                http://www.uncletaz.com/classgallery/raphael/buildark.html

                and here:

                http://homepage.univie.ac.at/rudolf.koch/mendel/011.jpg
                http://homepage.univie.ac.at/rudolf.koch/mendel/020.jpg
                http://homepage.univie.ac.at/rudolf.koch/mendel/087.jpg
              • James W. Pratt, Jr.
                Good stuff!! Thanks! James Cunningham ... From: Tom Rettie To: Sent: Friday, October 14, 2005 2:00 PM
                Message 7 of 9 , Oct 14, 2005
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                  Good stuff!! Thanks!

                  James Cunningham
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "Tom Rettie" <tom@...>
                  To: <medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Friday, October 14, 2005 2:00 PM
                  Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Authenticity


                  > --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "James W. Pratt, Jr."
                  > <cunning@f...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > Got any pictures of the "scimitar" profile saws?
                  >
                  > They show up several places, such as in the Bedford Book of Hours
                  > picture of Noah:
                  >
                  > http://www.wga.hu/art/zgothic/miniatur/1401-450/01f_1401.jpg
                  >
                  > There's also the "big bread knife" profile such as here:
                  >
                  > http://gallery.euroweb.hu/art/m/master/flemalle/merode/3mero_r.jpg
                  >
                  > There's a nice one of a frame saw/bow saw here:
                  >
                  > http://www.uncletaz.com/classgallery/raphael/buildark.html
                  >
                  > and here:
                  >
                  > http://homepage.univie.ac.at/rudolf.koch/mendel/011.jpg
                  > http://homepage.univie.ac.at/rudolf.koch/mendel/020.jpg
                  > http://homepage.univie.ac.at/rudolf.koch/mendel/087.jpg
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
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