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Re: Glue (is glue glue?)

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  • ewdysar
    I ve been using Titebond III for a few months now. I feel that it works better for me than Gorilla, cleans up easier (no black fingers) and doesn t expand
    Message 1 of 13 , Jun 6 3:22 PM
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      I've been using Titebond III for a few months now. I feel that it
      works better for me than Gorilla, cleans up easier (no black fingers)
      and doesn't expand like poly. Seems plenty strong, I've had no
      failures with TB III or Gorilla.

      Eirikr Mjoksiglandi

      --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, Siegfried
      <SiegfriedFaust@g...> wrote:
      > Actually, this last discussion brought up a good discussion point ...
      >
      > And what about the other glues as well?
      >
      > (BTW, Anyone used Titebond III yet? I've wanted to play with it
      some,
      > but when I look at the price, I figure I might as well use Gorilla
      > Glue for that price)
      >
      > Siegfried
      >
      > --
    • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
      haven t tried III yet. I like II, I use it on everything that gets used in the SCA, just in case it gets left out on the rain. ... Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim
      Message 2 of 13 , Jun 6 4:26 PM
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        haven't tried III yet.

        I like II, I use it on everything
        that gets used in the SCA, just in case
        it gets left out on the rain.



        --- ewdysar <ewdysar@...> wrote:

        > I've been using Titebond III for a few months now.
        > I feel that it
        > works better for me than Gorilla, cleans up easier
        > (no black fingers)
        > and doesn't expand like poly. Seems plenty strong,
        > I've had no
        > failures with TB III or Gorilla.
        >
        > Eirikr Mjoksiglandi
        >
        > --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, Siegfried
        > <SiegfriedFaust@g...> wrote:
        > > Actually, this last discussion brought up a good
        > discussion point ...
        > >
        > > And what about the other glues as well?
        > >
        > > (BTW, Anyone used Titebond III yet? I've wanted
        > to play with it
        > some,
        > > but when I look at the price, I figure I might as
        > well use Gorilla
        > > Glue for that price)
        > >
        > > Siegfried
        > >
        > > --
        >
        >
        >
        >


        Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

        Aude Aliquid Dignum
        ' Dare Something Worthy '

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      • Tim Bray
        I think Titebond is a little better than other PVA glues. Quicker grab, thicker body... Don t know if there is much of a strength difference, though. I ve
        Message 3 of 13 , Jun 6 4:39 PM
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          I think Titebond is a little better than other PVA glues.  Quicker grab, thicker body... Don't know if there is much of a strength difference, though.

          I've used two kinds of poly: Gorilla, and Franklin.  The Franklin is definitely inferior.  Wood Magazine recently did a strength test on glues - you should try searching for it - and the only one that failed before the wood was the Franklin polyurethane.

          Other people have told me that the best outdoor/waterproof glue is PL Premium polyurethane construction adhesive. 

          Titebond III works fine, but it's hard to find a reason to pay the extra for it over Titebond II.  (BTW, Logan is right - Titebond II is very water-resistant, even though it is not rated for continuous immersion.)

          Cheers,
          Colin


          Albion Works
          Furniture and Accessories
          For the Medievalist!
        • ulieum
          Well my experience as a contractor is that Titebond is weaker than Gorilla Glue. They both seem to expand about the same amount, but the Titebond (I believe it
          Message 4 of 13 , Jun 6 11:36 PM
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            Well my experience as a contractor is that Titebond is weaker than Gorilla Glue. They both
            seem to expand about the same amount, but the Titebond (I believe it was Titebond II)
            seemed to be more brittle and "chip" off of the wood easier during cleanup, this makes me
            a little suspicious of its "sticking power". I like the thickness of Gorilla Glue too, it doesn't
            run and drip as much.

            And yes being that I am from Oregon, the glue being waterproof IS a big deal (to me). I
            don't know about other states, but it is not uncommon for us to get so much rain at a
            event that it does run under your tents!! So I guess it depends on where you live and
            personal preference.

            I have used a polyurethane construction adhesive that comes in a tube like caulking comes
            in. That was the most amazingly sticky nasty stuff I have ever had to work with, but I tell
            you what, anything that gets put together with that stuff is NEVER coming apart again!! but
            it is too thick to make laminated boards out of.

            One easy way for laminated boards with poly glue is if you have a thickness planer. Lam
            your boards, clamp, let dry. Then run them through the planer to remove any glue that
            squeezed out, this makes a very nice looking lam edge, that does look nice with a clear
            coat of polyurethane sealer over the top!

            Good luck, Ulieum Haig, residing in the borderlands between the West and AnTir


            --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, Tim Bray <tbray@m...> wrote:
            > I think Titebond is a little better than other PVA glues. Quicker grab,
            > thicker body... Don't know if there is much of a strength difference, though.
            >
            > I've used two kinds of poly: Gorilla, and Franklin. The Franklin is
            > definitely inferior. Wood Magazine recently did a strength test on glues -
            > you should try searching for it - and the only one that failed before the
            > wood was the Franklin polyurethane.
            >
            > Other people have told me that the best outdoor/waterproof glue is PL
            > Premium polyurethane construction adhesive.
            >
            > Titebond III works fine, but it's hard to find a reason to pay the extra
            > for it over Titebond II. (BTW, Logan is right - Titebond II is very
            > water-resistant, even though it is not rated for continuous immersion.)
            >
            > Cheers,
            > Colin
            >
            >
            > Albion Works
            > Furniture and Accessories
            > For the Medievalist!
            > http://www.albionworks.net
            > http://www.albionworks.com
          • Logan
            titebond is a hide glue while gorilla glue is a polyurethane glue. of course it is weaker. they are two very different things. titebond II is fine for any
            Message 5 of 13 , Jun 6 11:46 PM
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              titebond is a "hide" glue while gorilla glue is a polyurethane glue.  of course it is weaker.  they are two very different things.  titebond II is fine for any type of camping situation since nobody would be able to camp in an environment that would weaken it.
               
              as a demolitions contractor i can tell you that it matters not what adhesive you use when i take a 40,000lb excavator to it.  8^P
               
              best regards
              logan
               

              www.ebonwoulfe.com

              Some people are like Slinkies: not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs.


               

               


              From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ulieum
              Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 2:36 AM
              To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Glue (is glue glue?)

              Well my experience as a contractor is that Titebond is weaker than Gorilla Glue. They both
              seem to expand about the same amount, but the Titebond (I believe it was Titebond II)
              seemed to be more brittle and "chip" off of the wood easier during cleanup, this makes me
              a little suspicious of its "sticking power". I like the thickness of Gorilla Glue too, it doesn't
              run and drip as much.

              And yes being that I am from Oregon, the glue being waterproof IS a big deal (to me). I
              don't know about other states, but it is not uncommon for us to get so much rain at a
              event that it does run under your tents!! So I guess it depends on where you live and
              personal preference.

              I have used a polyurethane construction adhesive that comes in a tube like caulking comes
              in. That was the most amazingly sticky nasty stuff I have ever had to work with, but I tell
              you what, anything that gets put together with that stuff is NEVER coming apart again!! but
              it is too thick to make laminated boards out of.

              One easy way for laminated boards with poly glue is if you have a thickness planer. Lam
              your boards, clamp, let dry. Then run them through the planer to remove any glue that
              squeezed out, this makes a very nice looking lam edge, that does look nice with a clear
              coat of polyurethane sealer over the top!

              Good luck, Ulieum Haig, residing in the borderlands between the West and AnTir


              --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, Tim Bray <tbray@m...> wrote:
              > I
              think Titebond is a little better than other PVA glues.  Quicker grab,
              > thicker body... Don't know if there is much of a strength difference,
              though.
              >
              > I've used two kinds of poly: Gorilla, and
              Franklin.  The Franklin is
              > definitely inferior.  Wood
              Magazine recently did a strength test on glues -
              > you should try
              searching for it - and the only one that failed before the
              > wood was the
              Franklin polyurethane.
              >
              > Other people have told me that the best
              outdoor/waterproof glue is PL
              > Premium polyurethane construction
              adhesive.
              >
              > Titebond III works fine, but it's hard to find a
              reason to pay the extra
              > for it over Titebond II.  (BTW, Logan is
              right - Titebond II is very
              > water-resistant, even though it is not
              rated for continuous immersion.)
              >
              > Cheers,
              > Colin
              >
              >
              > Albion Works
              > Furniture and Accessories
              > For the
              Medievalist!
              >
              href="http://www.albionworks.net">http://www.albionworks.net
              >
              href="http://www.albionworks.com">http://www.albionworks.com




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                   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medievalsawdust/


            • Ralph Lindberg
              ... II is ... camp in ... Well... Titebond does make a liquid hide glue (Natural protein emulsion). Works about as well as a hide glue should work. However
              Message 6 of 13 , Jun 7 6:49 AM
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                --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Logan" <logan@e...> wrote:
                > titebond is a "hide" glue while gorilla glue is a polyurethane glue. of
                > course it is weaker. they are two very different things. titebond
                II is
                > fine for any type of camping situation since nobody would be able to
                camp in
                > an environment that would weaken it.
                >
                Well... Titebond does make a liquid hide glue (Natural protein
                emulsion). Works about as well as a hide glue should work. However
                their main glues, aren't hide. Type 1 is an aliphatic resin glue, Type
                2 is a Cross-linking polyvinyl acetate glue and Type 3 is an "Advanced
                Proprietary Polymer" glue.
                Titebond also makes a Polyurethane glue, I've used it and like it
                (I've yet to use Gorilla)
                For a look at Titebond's glues see
                http://www.titebond.com/IntroPageTB.ASP?UserType=1&ProdSel=ProductCategoryTB.asp?prodcat=1

                Ralg
                AnTir
              • Ralph Lindberg
                ... big deal (to me). I ... so much rain at a ... where you live and ... Actually, a lot of places get more rain then we do, it just doesn t rain for as many
                Message 7 of 13 , Jun 7 6:52 AM
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                  --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "ulieum" <lcsodiver@g...> wrote:
                  ...
                  >
                  > And yes being that I am from Oregon, the glue being waterproof IS a
                  big deal (to me). I
                  > don't know about other states, but it is not uncommon for us to get
                  so much rain at a
                  > event that it does run under your tents!! So I guess it depends on
                  where you live and
                  > personal preference.
                  >

                  Actually, a lot of places get more rain then we do, it just doesn't
                  rain for as many days in most of them.

                  Ralg
                  AnTir (but a bit north and west of you)
                • ulieum
                  Ah yes sorry, the other poly glue I used was Probond not Titebond, (head gets fuzzy late at night) *chuckles* and yes not much matters when you have a 40,000
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jun 7 7:34 AM
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                    Ah yes sorry, the other poly glue I used was Probond not Titebond, (head gets fuzzy late at
                    night) *chuckles* and yes not much matters when you have a 40,000 lb piece of
                    equipment!! (sounds like a fun "toy"!!)

                    Ulieum Haig (KC7GTQ)

                    --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph Lindberg" <n7bsn@a...> wrote:
                    > --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "ulieum" <lcsodiver@g...> wrote:
                    > ...
                    > >
                    > > And yes being that I am from Oregon, the glue being waterproof IS a
                    > big deal (to me). I
                    > > don't know about other states, but it is not uncommon for us to get
                    > so much rain at a
                    > > event that it does run under your tents!! So I guess it depends on
                    > where you live and
                    > > personal preference.
                    > >
                    >
                    > Actually, a lot of places get more rain then we do, it just doesn't
                    > rain for as many days in most of them.
                    >
                    > Ralg
                    > AnTir (but a bit north and west of you)
                  • Tim Bray
                    ... Titebond is simply Franklin s trade name for a whole line of adhesives of several different types. Their polyurethane glue is called Titebond; their
                    Message 9 of 13 , Jun 7 8:11 AM
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                      Better try to clear up some misconceptions:

                      titebond is a "hide" glue

                      "Titebond" is simply Franklin's trade name for a whole line of adhesives of several different types.  Their polyurethane glue is called Titebond; their original PVA glue is called Titebond; their improved yellow PVA glue is called Titebond II; their new Titebond III is something else, I'm not even sure what.  Oh, and they do have a premixed liquid hide glue, also called Franklin Titebond.   (Apparently their marketing guys all graduated from the University of Wallamalloo and are all named Bruce, as well.)

                      Titebonds I, II, and III are all great glues.  The liquid hide glue has a decent reputation but is rather specialized (and not at all water-resistant, btw).  Their polyurethane is not very good.

                      Cheers,
                      Colin


                      Albion Works
                      Furniture and Accessories
                      For the Medievalist!
                    • Logan
                      took a crack house down not long ago. first hit after the abatement was to grab his old caddy and throw it into the house. big fun. bad move was when a new
                      Message 10 of 13 , Jun 7 8:53 AM
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                        took a crack house down not long ago.  first hit after the abatement was to grab his old caddy and throw it into the house.  big fun.  bad move was when a new operator drove onto the second crack house (we took out three of them for the city) to level the other half of it and never bothered to check the house first.  it had a basement.  first floor was not meant to support 40k lbs.
                         
                        8^)
                        logan
                         

                        www.ebonwoulfe.com

                        Some people are like Slinkies: not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs.


                         

                         


                        From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ulieum
                        Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 10:34 AM
                        To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Glue (is glue glue?)

                        Ah yes sorry, the other poly glue I used was Probond not Titebond, (head gets fuzzy late at
                        night) *chuckles* and yes not much matters when you have a 40,000 lb piece of
                        equipment!! (sounds like a fun "toy"!!)

                        Ulieum Haig (KC7GTQ)

                        --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph Lindberg" <n7bsn@a...> wrote:
                        > --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "ulieum"
                        <lcsodiver@g...> wrote:
                        > ...
                        > >
                        > > And yes
                        being that I am from Oregon, the glue being waterproof IS a
                        > big deal (to
                        me). I
                        > > don't know about other states, but it is not uncommon for
                        us to get
                        > so much rain at a
                        > > event that it does run under
                        your tents!! So I guess it depends on
                        > where you live and
                        > >
                        personal preference.
                        > >
                        >
                        >   Actually, a lot
                        of places get more rain then we do, it just doesn't
                        > rain for as many
                        days in most of them.
                        >
                        > Ralg
                        > AnTir (but a bit north and
                        west of you)





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                             http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medievalsawdust/


                      • Logan
                        i knew it wasnt a true hide glue but wasnt sure what it was, so i used the quotes. thanks for clearing it up. regards logan www.ebonwoulfe.com Some people are
                        Message 11 of 13 , Jun 7 8:57 AM
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                          i knew it wasnt a true hide glue but wasnt sure what it was, so i used the quotes.  thanks for clearing it up.
                           
                          regards
                          logan
                           

                          www.ebonwoulfe.com

                          Some people are like Slinkies: not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs.


                           

                           


                          From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim Bray
                          Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 11:11 AM
                          To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Glue (is glue glue?)

                          Better try to clear up some misconceptions:

                          titebond is a "hide" glue

                          "Titebond" is simply Franklin's trade name for a whole line of adhesives of several different types.  Their polyurethane glue is called Titebond; their original PVA glue is called Titebond; their improved yellow PVA glue is called Titebond II; their new Titebond III is something else, I'm not even sure what.  Oh, and they do have a premixed liquid hide glue, also called Franklin Titebond.   (Apparently their marketing guys all graduated from the University of Wallamalloo and are all named Bruce, as well.)

                          Titebonds I, II, and III are all great glues.  The liquid hide glue has a decent reputation but is rather specialized (and not at all water-resistant, btw).  Their polyurethane is not very good.

                          Cheers,
                          Colin


                          Albion Works
                          Furniture and Accessories
                          For the Medievalist!


                          <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
                               http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medievalsawdust/


                        • John LaTorre
                          ... Depends on whom you ask. The salesman at my local Woodcraft who is also a luthier tells me that he feels that there is no difference between the Titebond
                          Message 12 of 13 , Jun 8 10:58 AM
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                            Ralg wrote:

                            > Well... Titebond does make a liquid hide glue (Natural protein
                            > emulsion). Works about as well as a hide glue should work.

                            Depends on whom you ask. The salesman at my local Woodcraft who is also a
                            luthier tells me that he feels that there is no difference between the
                            Titebond hide glue and the traditional stuff, but other luthiers feel that
                            the pre-mixed stuff is inferior. Of course, luthiers ask three things of the
                            glues they use for assembling bodies:

                            1. That it dry rock hard, so as to facilitate the transmission of vibrations
                            from one part of the instrument to the other

                            2. That it be very solid, so it won't come apart under normal use.

                            3. That with proper application of heat and/or moisture (particularly heat)
                            the joint will come apart so that components can be replaced or repaired.

                            Those aren't necessarily the same things we expect glues to do in our own
                            applications.

                            FWIW, most of the Luthiers I've communicated with feel that the ready-made
                            hide glues are deficient mainly in category (1) above.

                            Baron Johann von Drachenfels (John LaTorre)
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