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Re: [MedievalSawdust] could you would you

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  • Avraham
    Wolf, Ah - down *below* all the yahoo ad stuff. I ve never been on a list that wasn t set to strip attachments before, now I know. Thanks! Conal, Poplar
    Message 1 of 23 , May 4 6:51 PM
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      Wolf,
      Ah - down *below* all the yahoo ad stuff. I've never been on a list that
      wasn't set to strip attachments before, now I know. Thanks!

      Conal,
      Poplar isn't *that* weak, I think it would work fine. Of course, you
      wouldn't want some of the larger folks in them, but sizing them
      appropriately should help that. :)
      Avraham


      >Avraham;
      >
      >You "should" have gotten a picture attached - I didn't see it right
      >away, but scrolling down showed it. If you didn't get it, or if you're
      >reading off the web, let me know and I'll forward the picture to you.
      >
      >Conal;
      >
      >Poplar vs. oak probably "would" compromise the strength somewhat, so the
      >question would most likely be "could it compromise the strength
      >_enough_". I'd guess that the engineering of the chair would be
      >sufficient for "most" people. To be safe though, you could always try
      >it with five or more slats per side.
      >
      >Personally, I would - if only to learn that it's not a good idea. If
      >you're uncomfortable with the finished product, you could always specify
      >it as a "child's only" chair.
      >
      >Wolf
      >
      >Avraham wrote:
      > >
      > > Um, make what?
      > > Avraham
      > > new to the group, not so much to woodworking
      > >
      > > >I can't decide, but I know I have
      > > >a tendency to over build...
      > > >
      > > >Could this be built from 3/4 poplar
      > > >stock without compromising the strength?
      > > >
      > > >I've made one from red oak and these two
      > > >from white oak.... I just can't convince
      > > >myself one way or the other about trying
      > > >one in poplar...
      > > >
      > > >Opinions?
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
      > > >
      > > > Aude Aliquid Dignum
      > > > ' Dare Something Worthy '
    • Joseph Hayes
      I always thought poplar was one of the softer hardwoods, but you should be OK. If I remember my American furniture history, it doesn t take a stain well and
      Message 2 of 23 , May 4 7:35 PM
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        I always thought poplar was one of the softer hardwoods, but you should
        be OK. If I remember my American furniture history, it doesn't take a
        stain well and was often painted.

        My first fauldstuhl is made of 1x2 pine (sold as trim) and is sitting
        in my bathroom. I went 11 pieces deep so there's more "legs" to carry
        the weight.

        Ulrich


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      • Chuck Phillips
        Actually, you should be fine, strengthwise. Poplar is commonly used for framing in upholstered furniture, where it doesn t get seen. The problem you _will_
        Message 3 of 23 , May 4 7:37 PM
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          Actually, you should be fine, strengthwise.  Poplar is commonly used for framing in upholstered furniture, where it doesn't get seen.  The problem you _will_ encounter is that it just doesn't look as nice.  You may well run into areas that have a greenish tint, and the relative softness of the wood makes it difficult to get a smooth finish.  I always wind up with a bit of fuzziness on the first pass.
           
          Charles Joiner
          Caid
          -----Original Message-----
          From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
          Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 4:43 PM
          To: sawdust
          Subject: [MedievalSawdust] could you would you

          I can't decide, but I know I have
          a tendency to over build...

          Could this be built from 3/4 poplar
          stock without compromising the strength?

          I've made one from red oak and these two
          from white oak.... I just can't convince
          myself one way or the other about trying
          one in poplar...

          Opinions?





          Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

             Aude Aliquid Dignum
               ' Dare Something Worthy '


                     
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        • James Winkler
          I agree with Charles Joiner... the first one of these I made was from 1 x 2 pine strips... is VERY light. The legs flex a bit when somebody of my delicate
          Message 4 of 23 , May 4 9:11 PM
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            I agree with Charles Joiner...  the first one of these I made was from 1 x 2 pine strips...  is VERY light.  The legs flex a bit when somebody of my delicate size sits on it... but it was the first one I built... and m'Lady still uses it...  (3 legs each side... six seat boards...)
             
            Chas.
             
             
          • Trevor Payne
            Is western Red Cedar softer and weaker than Poplar? Aiden
            Message 5 of 23 , May 5 6:16 AM
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              Is western Red Cedar softer and weaker than Poplar?

              Aiden
            • Avraham
              Hey, Aiden, fancy seeing you here. Avraham
              Message 6 of 23 , May 5 6:34 AM
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                Hey, Aiden, fancy seeing you here.
                Avraham

                >Is western Red Cedar softer and weaker than Poplar?
                >
                >Aiden
                >
                >
                >
                >Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
              • Schuster, Robert L.
                Damn Calontiri! Halv ________________________________ From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Avraham Sent:
                Message 7 of 23 , May 5 6:39 AM
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                  Damn Calontiri!
                   
                  Halv
                   


                  From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Avraham
                  Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 8:34 AM
                  To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] could you would you

                  Hey, Aiden, fancy seeing you here.
                  Avraham

                  >Is
                  western Red Cedar softer and weaker than Poplar?
                  >
                  >Aiden
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >Yahoo! Groups
                  Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >



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                       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medievalsawdust/


                • Joseph Paul
                  Interesting that you want to try this in poplar. I have been thinking on the same subject but I have the luxury of planing my rough cut stock to size. With
                  Message 8 of 23 , May 5 7:00 AM
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                    Interesting that you want to try this in poplar. I have been thinking on the same subject but I have the luxury of planing my rough cut stock to size.  With that capability in mind what would be a good thickness of poplar to do a faldstool in?
                     
                    Oh by the way: Hi everybody! I am new here and only so-so skilled with wood but very interested in medieval furniture and techniques.
                     
                    Jamie Blackrose
                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                    Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 6:43 PM
                    To: sawdust
                    Subject: [MedievalSawdust] could you would you

                    I can't decide, but I know I have
                    a tendency to over build...

                    Could this be built from 3/4 poplar
                    stock without compromising the strength?

                    I've made one from red oak and these two
                    from white oak.... I just can't convince
                    myself one way or the other about trying
                    one in poplar...

                    Opinions?





                    Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                       Aude Aliquid Dignum
                         ' Dare Something Worthy '


                               
                    __________________________________
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                    Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
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                    <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
                         http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medievalsawdust/


                  • powell.sean@comcast.net
                    Hello all, This is my first post here and hopefully I won t offend the more medievally minded of you by being a geek on my first post. From Marks Standard
                    Message 9 of 23 , May 5 8:23 AM
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                      Hello all,
                      This is my first post here and hopefully I won't offend the more medievally minded of you by being a geek on my first post.
                       
                      From Marks Standard Handbook for Mechanical Engineers, Chapter 6, Table 6.7.2 Strengths and related properties of Wood...
                       
                      Wood ; Modulus of Rupture (lbs/in^2) ; Modulus of Elasticity (ksi)
                      Red Oak ; 14,300 ; 1,800
                      Poplar, yellow ; 10,100 ; 1,580
                      Pine, Eastern White ; 8,600 ; 1,240
                      Ceder, Western Red ; 7,500 ; 1,110
                       
                      Therefore: if there are no extra legs or changes to structure and the boards are all equivilent in size we can expect the Poplar fauld stool to support 70% of the load caried by the red oak before similar failure and have 115% of the flex. Obviously the legs will flex farther, changing the moment arms, affecting the loading and throwing the math all to hell. Western red cedar would be about 55% of load.
                       
                      To thicken the poplar for equivilent strength it is necessary to determine loading type, which is mostly bending and subject to the formula Stress = M*c/I where c = half the board thickness and I = width*height^3/12. A finished thickness of 7/8" is almost sufficient and a finished thickness of 1" is plenty.
                       
                      Thanks for giving me an excuse to be an engineer. :)
                       
                      Sean
                       
                      -------------- Original message --------------
                      Interesting that you want to try this in poplar. I have been thinking on the same subject but I have the luxury of planing my rough cut stock to size.  With that capability in mind what would be a good thickness of poplar to do a faldstool in?
                       
                      Oh by the way: Hi everybody! I am new here and only so-so skilled with wood but very interested in medieval furniture and techniques.
                       
                      Jamie Blackrose
                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                      Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 6:43 PM
                      To: sawdust
                      Subject: [MedievalSawdust] could you would you

                      I can't decide, but I know I have
                      a tendency to over build...

                      Could this be built from 3/4 poplar
                      stock without compromising the strength?

                      I've made one from red oak and these two
                      from white oak.... I just can't convince
                      myself one way or the other about trying
                      one in poplar...

                      Opinions?





                      Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                         Aude Aliquid Dignum
                           ' Dare Something Worthy '


                                 
                      __________________________________
                      Do you Yahoo!?
                      Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
                      http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/


                      <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
                           http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medievalsawdust/




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                    • James Winkler
                      HEY Jamie... welcome aboard - Chas. Interesting that you want to try this in poplar. I have been thinking on the same subject but I have the luxury of planing
                      Message 10 of 23 , May 5 10:56 AM
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                        HEY Jamie...  welcome aboard -
                        Chas.
                         

                        Interesting that you want to try this in poplar. I have been thinking on the same subject but I have the luxury of planing my rough cut stock to size.  With that capability in mind what would be a good thickness of poplar to do a faldstool in?
                         
                        Oh by the way: Hi everybody! I am new here and only so-so skilled with wood but very interested in medieval furniture and techniques.
                         
                        Jamie Blackrose
                      • Siegfried
                        ... What about Tulip popular, which I understand to be the standard popular that us in the mid-Atlantic get. Siegfried --
                        Message 11 of 23 , May 5 11:25 AM
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                          > Wood ; Modulus of Rupture (lbs/in^2) ; Modulus of Elasticity (ksi)
                          > Red Oak ; 14,300 ; 1,800
                          > Poplar, yellow ; 10,100 ; 1,580
                          > Pine, Eastern White ; 8,600 ; 1,240
                          > Ceder, Western Red ; 7,500 ; 1,110

                          What about Tulip popular, which I understand to be the standard
                          popular that us in the mid-Atlantic get.

                          Siegfried

                          --
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                        • Ralph Lindberg
                          ... I m afraid it s my fault, I told him about this Ralg AnTir _
                          Message 12 of 23 , May 5 11:32 AM
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                            --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Schuster, Robert L."
                            <SchusterRL@u...> wrote:
                            > Damn Calontiri!
                            >
                            > Halv
                            >
                            I'm afraid it's my fault, I told him about this

                            Ralg
                            AnTir
                            _
                          • Avraham
                            Halvgrim just can t get away from me. :) Avraham
                            Message 13 of 23 , May 5 11:34 AM
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                              Halvgrim just can't get away from me. :)
                              Avraham

                              >--- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Schuster, Robert L."
                              ><SchusterRL@u...> wrote:
                              > > Damn Calontiri!
                              > >
                              > > Halv
                              > >
                              > I'm afraid it's my fault, I told him about this
                              >
                              >Ralg
                              >AnTir
                            • Trevor Payne
                              LOL, thought that was you, but I wasn t sure ;) Aiden ... From: Avraham Sent: May 5, 2005 8:34 AM To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                              Message 14 of 23 , May 5 11:51 AM
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                                LOL, thought that was you, but I wasn't sure ;)

                                Aiden

                                -----Original Message-----
                                From: Avraham <avraham@...>
                                Sent: May 5, 2005 8:34 AM
                                To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] could you would you

                                <html><body>


                                <tt>
                                Hey, Aiden, fancy seeing you here.<BR>
                                Avraham<BR>
                                <BR>
                                >Is western Red Cedar softer and weaker than Poplar?<BR>
                                ><BR>
                                >Aiden<BR>
                                ><BR>
                                ><BR>
                                ><BR>
                                >Yahoo! Groups Links<BR>
                                ><BR>
                                ><BR>
                                ><BR>
                                ><BR>
                                <BR>
                                </tt>

                                <br><br>
                                <tt>
                                <br><br>



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                              • Steve Mercer
                                ... For those people who read this group in digest mode, all attachments are stripped off. -- Steve Mercer mercer@winternet.com
                                Message 15 of 23 , May 5 12:41 PM
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                                  >You "should" have gotten a picture attached - I didn't see it right
                                  >away, but scrolling down showed it. If you didn't get it, or if you're
                                  >reading off the web, let me know and I'll forward the picture to you.

                                  For those people who read this group in digest mode, all attachments
                                  are stripped off.


                                  --
                                  Steve Mercer
                                  mercer@...
                                • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                                  ... see attachment... Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim Hart Aude Aliquid Dignum Dare Something Worthy __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo!
                                  Message 16 of 23 , May 5 2:38 PM
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                                    --- Avraham <avraham@...> wrote:
                                    > Um, make what?
                                    > Avraham
                                    > new to the group, not so much to woodworking
                                    >


                                    see attachment...

                                    Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                                    Aude Aliquid Dignum
                                    ' Dare Something Worthy '



                                    __________________________________
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                                    Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
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                                  • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                                    ... I was looking for something to do with the scrap/off-fall shorts that I had collected and had just finshed the two in white oak. So the foldstol was near
                                    Message 17 of 23 , May 5 2:49 PM
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                                      --- Joseph Paul <josephnjody@...> wrote:
                                      > Interesting that you want to try this in poplar. I
                                      > have been thinking on the
                                      > same subject but I have the luxury of planing my
                                      > rough cut stock to size.
                                      > With that capability in mind what would be a good
                                      > thickness of poplar to do
                                      > a faldstool in?


                                      I was looking for something to do with the
                                      scrap/off-fall shorts that I had collected
                                      and had just finshed the two in white oak.
                                      So the foldstol was near the top of my list
                                      of things I'm thinking aboput right now. I've
                                      got a few randon lenghts and widths that could
                                      easlily be cut down to the 1 1/2" stock I used
                                      for the whitew oak stools....


                                      Unless someone has another idea....

                                      So here's another question for the group.

                                      What do you do with 'scraps' that are
                                      too big to throw away, but not big enough
                                      for most projects?

                                      ( one can only wear so many pairs of
                                      pattens.... )


                                      Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                                      Aude Aliquid Dignum
                                      ' Dare Something Worthy '



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                                    • Chuck Phillips
                                      But it is a rather small world, after all. Particularly so when you have a subset like this. Charles Joiner Who can still remember most of Song of the Shield
                                      Message 18 of 23 , May 5 5:14 PM
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                                        But it is a rather small world, after all.  Particularly so when you have a subset like this.
                                         
                                        Charles Joiner
                                        Who can still remember most of "Song of the Shield Wall"...
                                        -----Original Message-----
                                        From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Avraham
                                        Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 11:35 AM
                                        To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: could you would you

                                        Halvgrim just can't get away from me. :)
                                        Avraham

                                        >--- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Schuster, Robert L."
                                        ><SchusterRL@u...> wrote:
                                        > > Damn Calontiri!
                                        > >
                                        > > Halv
                                        > >
                                        >   I'm afraid it's my fault, I told him about this
                                        >
                                        >Ralg
                                        >AnTir



                                        <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
                                             http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medievalsawdust/


                                      • ewdysar
                                        Actually Yahoo does strip the attachments. I only read these messages on the Yahoo group site and there s no picture or brief description of what you re
                                        Message 19 of 23 , May 6 12:05 PM
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                                          Actually Yahoo does strip the attachments. I only read these
                                          messages on the Yahoo group site and there's no picture or brief
                                          description of what you're talking about.

                                          Now for this particular question, I probably don't care. If anyone
                                          joined the group today or later and read the post on the board, they
                                          would not ever have any idea of what is being discussed.

                                          My guess is that you're trying to build an ark, the Noah's type, not
                                          the covenant type. I think that poplar would be OK because it only
                                          needs to hold up for a couple of months, but you're going to need
                                          alot of lumber... ;)

                                          Eric

                                          --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, Avraham <avraham@e...> wrote:
                                          > Wolf,
                                          > Ah - down *below* all the yahoo ad stuff. I've never been on a
                                          list that
                                          > wasn't set to strip attachments before, now I know. Thanks!
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > >Avraham;
                                          > >
                                          > >You "should" have gotten a picture attached - I didn't see it right
                                          > >away, but scrolling down showed it. If you didn't get it, or if
                                          you're
                                          > >reading off the web...
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Um, make what?
                                          > > > Avraham
                                          > > > new to the group, not so much to woodworking
                                          > > >
                                          > > > >I can't decide, but I know I have
                                          > > > >a tendency to over build...
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >Could this be built from 3/4 poplar
                                          > > > >stock without compromising the strength?
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >I've made one from red oak and these two
                                          > > > >from white oak.... I just can't convince
                                          > > > >myself one way or the other about trying
                                          > > > >one in poplar...
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >Opinions?
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > Aude Aliquid Dignum
                                          > > > > ' Dare Something Worthy '
                                        • Lord Alessandro dEste
                                          ... Someone has another idea And That someone is me. LOL Everyweek here in sternfeld we have a meeting called Stuff and nonsence .Held at Master JP Devereaux
                                          Message 20 of 23 , May 10 9:55 AM
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                                            --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                                            <baronconal@y...> wrote:
                                            > Unless someone has another idea....
                                            > So here's another question for the group.
                                            > What do you do with 'scraps' that are
                                            > too big to throw away, but not big enough
                                            > for most projects?
                                            >
                                            > ( one can only wear so many pairs of
                                            > pattens.... )
                                            > Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                                            Someone has another idea
                                            And That someone is me. LOL
                                            Everyweek here in sternfeld we have a meeting called"Stuff and
                                            nonsence".Held at Master JP Devereaux and Mistress Baroness Priscilla
                                            the Hun's home. We try to help others in the barony with what ever
                                            projects they are working on. What I and Master Devereaux do with are
                                            scraps is to bring them out and see if anyone needs them. But You now
                                            have given me a idea . Thank you Baron Conal. One can only wear so
                                            many pairs of pattens.But a barony can wear many. A group project that
                                            we are working on this would be a great addition too.
                                            IYS
                                            Lord Alessandro dEste
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