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Re: [medievalsawdust] Interesting program?

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  • Brian D. Murphy
    Speaking of interesting shows, did anyone else catch the one on (I think it was 20/20) David Hockney s theory about how some of the great masters used optics
    Message 1 of 17 , Dec 17, 2002
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      Speaking of interesting shows, did anyone else catch the one on (I think it was 20/20) David Hockney's theory about how some of the great masters used optics to paint near photographic images in period?  The Flemish masters (for whom all good woodworkers have an affection for their attention to detail) were mentioned prominently.  Very interesting stuff.  I'm going to have to read his book, Secret Knowledge.
       
      As far as turning end-grain goes, I don't have much experience with it yet (I just bought a lathe recently and have so far just been making massive piles of shavings learning what the tools do).  From what I've read, though, it goes more smoothly if you use a hook tool or a hollowing tool.  If you're using a gouge, it looks like you should start a hollow in the center and then lever the gouge nose horizontally, cutting with the grain as much as you can, pushing to the outside to increase the hollow diameter.  Rotate the gouge to get a shear-scraping presentation.  Sounds good on paper, but I've not tried it yet.  I have a feeling you've been through that much already ;)  I'm sure having fun with my lathe.  You learn a great deal about the properties of various woods in a hurry when you start trying to turn them.  I've yet to produce anything useful, however (except for a walnut billy club for my four-year-old son that I made from a branch out of the backyard. Every kid should have one, right?).
       
      Bran
       
      Bran Du ap Dafydd
       
       
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Ted Kocot
      Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2002 12:22 PM
      Subject: Re: [medievalsawdust] Interesting program?

      >A "must see" for all Leonardo fans.

      I think I've seen this one.  The people arguing the for case seem a bit
      dogmatic.  Not that the man wasn't a genuius, but it seems like every
      fringe group (or not so fringe group) is certain he'd be on their side
      today.

      Avery

      BTW - Anyone got any pointers on end grain turning?  I broke down and
      played with doing a sort of vase kind of thing yesterday.  The outside
      roughed in pretty nicely, but let's just say the inside was not the smooth
      and easy turning I've come to expect from the spindle work I've done over
      the years.
    • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
      don t get that channel....:( ... ===== Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim Hart Aude Aliquid Dignum Dare Something Worthy
      Message 2 of 17 , Dec 17, 2002
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        don't get that channel....:(


        --- jrwinkler@... wrote:
        > Kinda' following along with the "period stains"
        > thing. the National Geographic Channel (Sunday at
        > 8:00) will air a program that is going to explore
        > the possibility that Leonardo da Vinci was
        > responsible for the Shroud of Turin. (. part of the
        > teaser spots on this is doing a side by side
        > comparison of Leonardo's face and the face on the
        > Shroud). A "must see" for all Leonardo fans.
        >
        > There might be some interesting "how to" info
        > presented in this one.
        >
        > Chas.


        =====
        Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
        Aude Aliquid Dignum
        ' Dare Something Worthy '

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      • jrwinkler@msn.com
        Something I ve always wondered about. are those mousetraps. or bird traps??? If you look at the whole Joseph picture there s one just outside the window.
        Message 3 of 17 , Dec 17, 2002
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          Something I've always wondered about… are those mousetraps… or bird traps???   If you look at the whole "Joseph" picture there's one just outside the window… seems like a strange place to put a birdtrap.
           
          Chas.
           
          It's kinda funny that you should just happen to
          mention mousetraps.

          Just saw one in a book at lunch today and thought

          I'll throw the full picture into the period
          examples file in the photo section. There are some
          nice tools in the full painting.

          =====
          Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
             Aude Aliquid Dignum
               ' Dare Something Worthy '

        • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
          ... I m thinking that that window is on street level and he is just showing his wares to those that walk buy. Look at the hinge on the wood that the second
          Message 4 of 17 , Dec 18, 2002
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            --- jrwinkler@... wrote:
            > Something I've always wondered about. are those
            > mousetraps. or bird traps??? If you look at the
            > whole "Joseph" picture there's one just outside the
            > window. seems like a strange place to put a
            > birdtrap.
            >
            > Chas.
            >
            I'm thinking that that window is on street
            level and he is just 'showing his wares' to
            those that walk buy. Look at the hinge on the
            wood that the second trap is sitting on, I think
            it's a display table.


            =====
            Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
            Aude Aliquid Dignum
            ' Dare Something Worthy '

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          • jrwinkler@msn.com
            Did some readin in a book from the Met. regarding the Campin painting. Even Joseph s early profession as a guild carpenter is infused with higher meaning.
            Message 5 of 17 , Dec 18, 2002
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              Did some readin' in a book from the Met… regarding the Campin painting…
               
              "Even Joseph's early profession as a guild carpenter is infused with higher meaning.  In his hop window he displays for  sale a mousetrap, a reference to his role as the bait to fool Satan on the momentous occasion of the Incarnation for, as Saint Augustine tells us, the marriage of Joseph and Mary was staged to deceive the devil just as mice are fooled by bait in a mousetrap."
               
              Score two for the apprentice!!!  One for the mousetrap and one for the shop display!!!
               
              Chas.
               
              ===============
               
              Conal wrote:
               
              I'm thinking that that window is on street
              level and he is just 'showing his wares' to
              those that walk buy. Look at the hinge on the
              wood that the second trap is sitting on, I think
              it's a display table.


            • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
              I enjoyed making the mousetrap. Anyone have any more pictures of simple medieval gadjets? I d like to try something similar... (Size, speed of
              Message 6 of 17 , Dec 19, 2002
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                I enjoyed making the mousetrap.

                Anyone have any more pictures of
                simple medieval gadjets?

                I'd like to try something similar...
                (Size, speed of construction....)

                The kind of thing that we nomally
                overlook while going for bigger, more
                'useful' items.



                =====
                Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
                Aude Aliquid Dignum
                ' Dare Something Worthy '

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              • Avery
                A while back I bought a big three horsepower Delta shaper used. About a month ago I got some wiring done in my basement including a new 220v circuit for said
                Message 7 of 17 , Dec 22, 2002
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                  A while back I bought a big three horsepower Delta shaper used. About a
                  month ago I got some wiring done in my basement including a new 220v circuit
                  for said shaper. Friday I got a lock miter cutter. Saturday I put it all
                  together and tried using it. For those unfamiliar with what I'm describing,
                  think of it as a 3 hp router table with a 4 inch in diameter bit - the fact
                  that it can only be run at 220v should give you a hint of how big a tool
                  we're talking.

                  Saturday night I let out a yelp and spent a lot of time holding a paper
                  towel over the tip of my right index finger. It was not serious enough to
                  require an emergency room visit and once my fingernail grows out to where
                  all the cut/torn/shattered parts are clipped away there will be no permanent
                  marks.

                  This is solely due to the grace of God. I could just as easily be looking
                  at the cut/torn/shattered remains of my second knuckle.

                  Safety rules I was following - I was wearing safety glasses and hearing
                  protection.

                  Safety rules I was not following - Pretty much all the others.

                  What I was thinking - .

                  If I had put two seconds of thought into how I was holding the piece, where
                  it was going, where the blade was going and where my hand was, I wouldn't
                  have a bandage on my finger or a sheepish look on my face right now. I'd
                  like to think that I was the sacrificial lamb for the upcoming year and my
                  warning will prevent the rest of you from doing anything foolish,
                  particularly with new toys that have sharp cutty things as part of their
                  works, but there is a lot of new year ahead and it only takes a second or
                  two. Trust me on this.

                  No apologies to those of you who get this more than once. Read it again.
                  It'll be good for you. Hell, print it out and post it in your workshop!

                  Avery
                • Brian D. Murphy
                  Timely advice, Avery. Yesterday I picked up a brand new table saw for Christmas. I will heed your warning. I ve had some personal experience in the, What
                  Message 8 of 17 , Dec 23, 2002
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                    Timely advice, Avery.  Yesterday I picked up a brand new table saw for Christmas.  I will heed your warning.  I've had some personal experience in the, "What was I thinking?" category, however.  I understand perfectly that it only takes a fraction of a second of bad judgment to yield some potential maiming or fatal results.  I'm glad your close call was only that.
                     
                    My father always said, "Good judgment comes from experience.  Experience comes from bad judgment."  I would add that this is true as long as your bad judgment doesn't kill you in the process.
                     
                    -Bran
                    (who was once rushed to the emergency room to have fragments of a ricocheted rifle bullet extracted from the side of his face)
                     
                     
                    I'd like to think that I was the sacrificial lamb for the upcoming year and my
                    warning will prevent the rest of you from doing anything foolish,
                    particularly with new toys that have sharp cutty things as part of their
                    works, but there is a lot of new year ahead and it only takes a second or
                    two.  Trust me on this.

                    No apologies to those of you who get this more than once.  Read it again.
                    It'll be good for you.  Hell, print it out and post it in your workshop!

                    Avery
                  • jrwinkler@msn.com
                    ... Well. so far I ve done more damage to myself with hand tools (ya know its WAY past the time to sharpen your chisels after you ve extracted it from your
                    Message 9 of 17 , Dec 23, 2002
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                      Avery wrote:

                      >> Safety rules I was not following - Pretty much all the
                      others.
                      >> What I was thinking - .
                      Well… so far I've done more damage to myself with hand tools (ya' know its WAY past the time to sharpen your chisels after you've extracted it from your body…) and hot metals that with power tools… although I've had a near miss or two with my bandsaw (… oh, and then there was that incident with the chainsaw… but somehow I don't think that really counts… I wasn't actually in my shop at the time…)  We all need reminders now and again and this was sure a "wake up and smell the coffee" one for me…
                       
                      Featherboards are your friend.  Avery and I had a conversation about his "oops" not long after the incident (if I recall correctly the paper towel wrap hadn't quite come off yet and the router bit hadn't been cleaned to reduce the corrosive effects of blood)…  So are pusher sticks, etc.   Avery can also tell ya' a great story about table saw kickbacks.  (No blood involved in this one if I recall correctly.) 
                       
                      We also have another good friend who had the startling experience of watching one half of a board he was ripping on his table saw get kicked back across the shop and actually go THROUGH the garage door…   ummm… I should mention that the garage door was closed at the time…   
                       
                      Glad to hear that ya' still have all yer' fingers and toes, dude…  and thanks for posting the tip… 
                       
                      Chas.
                    • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                      Oh yes... I watched a guy that I worked with nip the tip of a finger with a table saw. ( couldn t say anything fast enough ) I know a guy with 9 1/2 fingers
                      Message 10 of 17 , Dec 24, 2002
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                        Oh yes...

                        I watched a guy that I worked with
                        'nip the tip' of a finger with a table
                        saw. ( couldn't say anything fast enough )

                        I know a guy with 9 1/2 fingers as
                        a result of a hungry table saw.

                        I sliced into the end of my thumb
                        with a bandsaw.( 5 stiches )

                        And I chopped an 1/8 slice off the
                        tip of my thumb in the kitchen ( after
                        a FULL weekend in the shop no less )

                        The small flat spot on the end of my
                        thumb serves as a wonderful reminder....


                        Be careful with any sharp implement of
                        destruction....


                        =====
                        Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
                        Aude Aliquid Dignum
                        ' Dare Something Worthy '

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                      • Dan Baker
                        -- YIS, Lord Rhys, Capten gen y Arian Lloer Privateer to the Midrealm Arafu at dawnsio mewn adlaw ...
                        Message 11 of 17 , Dec 24, 2002
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                          --
                          YIS,

                          Lord Rhys, Capten gen y Arian Lloer
                          Privateer to the Midrealm

                          Arafu at dawnsio mewn adlaw
                          ...Take time to dance in the rain...




                          >From: jrwinkler@...
                          >Reply-To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                          >To: <medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com>
                          >Subject: Re: [medievalsawdust] What was I thinking?
                          >Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 00:57:43 -0600
                          >
                          >Avery wrote:
                          >
                          > >> Safety rules I was not following - Pretty much all the others.
                          > >> What I was thinking - .
                          >
                          >Well. so far I've done more damage to myself with hand tools (ya' know its
                          >WAY past the time to sharpen your chisels after you've extracted it from
                          >your body.) and hot metals that with power tools. although I've had a near
                          >miss or two with my bandsaw (. oh, and then there was that incident with
                          >the chainsaw. but somehow I don't think that really counts. I wasn't
                          >actually in my shop at the time.) We all need reminders now and again and
                          >this was sure a "wake up and smell the coffee" one for me.
                          >
                          >Featherboards are your friend. Avery and I had a conversation about his
                          >"oops" not long after the incident (if I recall correctly the paper towel
                          >wrap hadn't quite come off yet and the router bit hadn't been cleaned to
                          >reduce the corrosive effects of blood). So are pusher sticks, etc. Avery
                          >can also tell ya' a great story about table saw kickbacks. (No blood
                          >involved in this one if I recall correctly.)
                          >
                          >We also have another good friend who had the startling experience of
                          >watching one half of a board he was ripping on his table saw get kicked
                          >back across the shop and actually go THROUGH the garage door. ummm. I
                          >should mention that the garage door was closed at the time.
                          >
                          >Glad to hear that ya' still have all yer' fingers and toes, dude. and
                          >thanks for posting the tip.
                          >
                          >Chas.


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                        • Dan Baker
                          Ooops, sorry about that last one, wrong button. I had a lick or two with tools myself. A moments disraction around tools can make for a world of hurt. I took
                          Message 12 of 17 , Dec 24, 2002
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                            Ooops, sorry about that last one, wrong button.

                            I had a lick or two with tools myself. A moments disraction around tools
                            can make for a world of hurt. I took off the tip of a finger with a jointer
                            more then 20 years ago.

                            There was a news article here about a year ago about the subject of care
                            with tools of any kind. It seems some poor soul decided to cut a branch off
                            of a tree with his brand new chainsaw. He put up the ladder and proceded to
                            cut. His main problem was the ladder was supported by the branch he was
                            cutting. As the branch went, so did the ladder sending him down into the
                            bushes below. The the chainsaw hit him in the leg, still running, the
                            branch fell across his chest, and to add insult to injury, there was a large
                            wasp next in the bushes he landed in. Pinned by the branch, he was rescued
                            by a neighbor who heard the screams. The man survived, thankfully with only
                            a few scars.

                            I think about that poor fellow at times when I am considering how to setup a
                            project. Think things through, consider what could, might, or will happen
                            when you start using your tools.

                            --
                            YIS,

                            Lord Rhys, Capten gen y Arian Lloer
                            Privateer to the Midrealm

                            Arafu at dawnsio mewn adlaw
                            ...Take time to dance in the rain...




                            > >> Safety rules I was not following - Pretty much all the others.
                            > >> What I was thinking - .
                            >
                            >Well. so far I've done more damage to myself with hand tools (ya' know its
                            >WAY past the time to sharpen your chisels after you've extracted it from
                            >your body.) and hot metals that with power tools. although I've had a near
                            >miss or two with my bandsaw (. oh, and then there was that incident with
                            >the chainsaw. but somehow I don't think that really counts. I wasn't
                            >actually in my shop at the time.) We all need reminders now and again and
                            >this was sure a "wake up and smell the coffee" one for me.
                            >
                            >Featherboards are your friend. Avery and I had a conversation about his
                            >"oops" not long after the incident (if I recall correctly the paper towel
                            >wrap hadn't quite come off yet and the router bit hadn't been cleaned to
                            >reduce the corrosive effects of blood). So are pusher sticks, etc. Avery
                            >can also tell ya' a great story about table saw kickbacks. (No blood
                            >involved in this one if I recall correctly.)
                            >
                            >We also have another good friend who had the startling experience of
                            >watching one half of a board he was ripping on his table saw get kicked
                            >back across the shop and actually go THROUGH the garage door. ummm. I
                            >should mention that the garage door was closed at the time.
                            >
                            >Glad to hear that ya' still have all yer' fingers and toes, dude. and
                            >thanks for posting the tip.
                            >
                            >Chas.


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                          • Lew Newby <gideon@neei.com>
                            Sigh... Chas, that is what Tormec is for. :) Tormec is your friend. I just happen to plane off the side of my left index finger with a very sharp hand plain. I
                            Message 13 of 17 , Dec 24, 2002
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                              Sigh... Chas, that is what Tormec is for. :) Tormec is your friend. I
                              just happen to plane off the side of my left index finger with a very
                              sharp hand plain. I didn't even feel it until I saw the blood on the
                              board.

                              Featherboards, proper jigs, clear workspaces, and GOOD light.

                              I still carry the scar from a model airplane propeller accident when I
                              was 9 and I added a beatiful scar from a pressure washer about 1.5
                              years ago. Tools in the shop aren't the only thing that will get ya.

                              Farin


                              --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, jrwinkler@m... wrote:
                              > Avery wrote:
                              >
                              > >> Safety rules I was not following - Pretty much all the others.
                              > >> What I was thinking - .
                              >
                              > Well. so far I've done more damage to myself with hand tools (ya'
                              know its WAY past the time to sharpen your chisels after you've
                              extracted it from your body.) and hot metals that with power tools.
                              although I've had a near miss or two with my bandsaw (. oh, and then
                              there was that incident with the chainsaw. but somehow I don't think
                              that really counts. I wasn't actually in my shop at the time.) We all
                              need reminders now and again and this was sure a "wake up and smell
                              the coffee" one for me.
                              >
                              > Featherboards are your friend. Avery and I had a conversation about
                              his "oops" not long after the incident (if I recall correctly the
                              paper towel wrap hadn't quite come off yet and the router bit hadn't
                              been cleaned to reduce the corrosive effects of blood). So are pusher
                              sticks, etc. Avery can also tell ya' a great story about table saw
                              kickbacks. (No blood involved in this one if I recall correctly.)
                              >
                              > We also have another good friend who had the startling experience of
                              watching one half of a board he was ripping on his table saw get
                              kicked back across the shop and actually go THROUGH the garage door.
                              ummm. I should mention that the garage door was closed at the time.
                              >
                              > Glad to hear that ya' still have all yer' fingers and toes, dude.
                              and thanks for posting the tip.
                              >
                              > Chas.
                            • James W. Pratt, Jr.
                              You guys have to learn to stop it befor it happens!!! Once working in an Air Force wood hobby shop I stopped a friend who was just getting ready to use the
                              Message 14 of 17 , Dec 24, 2002
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                                You guys have to learn to stop it befor it happens!!! Once working in an
                                Air Force wood hobby shop I stopped a friend who was just getting ready to
                                use the big shop shapper(2-3Horse cut your finger off then pull the rest of
                                your arm in type) to route the edge of a drop leaf table. I told him to
                                stop and consider: one he was tired from working on the peice all
                                afternoon, two he was near the end of the project, and three it was near
                                closing time and I could see him rushing just a little harder to get it
                                done. I told him to slow down and think of the accident he was set up to
                                have. That is all it took.

                                It is very hard to prove you prevented an accident but here and now I claim
                                to have done just that. It takes only pause to grab a push stick, use a
                                finger board, or just stop and think to prevent accidents.

                                James Cunningham

                                > Oh yes...
                                >
                                > I watched a guy that I worked with
                                > 'nip the tip' of a finger with a table
                                > saw. ( couldn't say anything fast enough )
                                >
                                > I know a guy with 9 1/2 fingers as
                                > a result of a hungry table saw.
                                >
                                > I sliced into the end of my thumb
                                > with a bandsaw.( 5 stiches )
                                >
                                > And I chopped an 1/8 slice off the
                                > tip of my thumb in the kitchen ( after
                                > a FULL weekend in the shop no less )
                                >
                                > The small flat spot on the end of my
                                > thumb serves as a wonderful reminder....
                                >
                                >
                                > Be careful with any sharp implement of
                                > destruction....
                                >
                                >
                                > =====
                                > Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
                                > Aude Aliquid Dignum
                                > ' Dare Something Worthy '
                                >
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                              • jrwinkler@msn.com
                                ... This is probably one of the best pieces of advise for keeping yourself together in the shop. and for keeping your project together as well. A number of
                                Message 15 of 17 , Dec 24, 2002
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                                  James wrote:
                                   
                                  >> I told him to stop and consider:  one he was tired from working on the peice all
                                  >>
                                  afternoon, two he was near the end of the project, and three it was near
                                  >> closing time and I could see him rushing just a little harder
                                  to get it
                                  >> done. 
                                   
                                  This is probably one of the best pieces of advise for "keeping yourself together" in the shop… and for keeping your project together as well.  A number of years ago we were building the "Peacock chairs"…   lots of weekends went into that job…  As we neared the end of the project I was working on the last machining part of the project…  putting a cove cut on each side of the arm pieces (basically a decorative cut) just before they were to be glued on to the rest of the chair…   18 chairs…  36 arms…  2 cuts per arm…  72 cuts…  
                                   
                                  Wouldn't ya' know it…  on the VERY LAST CUT… on the VERY LAST PIECE… the work got away from me on the router table… my nice straight cove cut looked like a giant termite went berserk on the piece…    DRAT!!!   As the materials estimate for the project was done with a SMALL amount of overage included we did have ONE other piece to work on (but I had to redo all the rest of the machining operations on the piece to make it useful… which was a pain…) I took a MUCH needed break before tackling that one stupid arm piece…  Winking smiley emoticon    Fatigue and frustration are a bad combination when you're working with machines that have no feelings or sympathy for you or your project.
                                   
                                  By the way…  Merry Christmas ya'll…  and… hey…  watch out for paper cuts tomorrow… 
                                   
                                  Chas.
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