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RE: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

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  • D. Young
    Its very important to note that the hardware: nails, hinges, straps, and lock.....represent a tremendous amount of time that we dont often account
    Message 1 of 24 , Aug 24 7:23 AM
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      Its very important to note that the hardware: nails, hinges, straps, and lock.....represent a tremendous amount of time that we dont often account for.....particularly as some of these things are custom oriented to the size of the box.

      So...want accuracy....might have to pay for it.

      Rather like using wide oak lumber vs 2.5 inch oak flooring....

      food for thought.   Accuracy = time= more money= investment



      Fine Armour and Historical Reproductions

           Custom Commissions Welcome....!

      www.partsandtechnical.com
      (Well Formed Munitions Catalog Coming This Spring)
       



      To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
      From: lhjw66576@...
      Date: Sat, 24 Aug 2013 14:21:09 +0100
      Subject: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

       

      Gentles all,
       I've come late to this discussion, having just spent the last two weeks away from my PC,  - instead camping late-15th century-style at Raglan Castle in S. Wales.

      I'm a Master Carpenter & Joiner.
      I've occasionally made replica-medieval chests and coffers for Re-enactors as a pleasant and challenging change from my usual commercial housing-fit-out work.
      I've eventually been able to find Manufacturers who produce replica-mediveal strapwork, hinges, and handles for such chests. [I've even found a UK source for rosehead cut nails to use in fixing such ironwork].
      But so far I've been unable to find any manufacturing locksmith  who offers replica-appearance* chest and coffer box-locks and padlocks. [*By this I mean that the exposed exteriors - hasps, staples, and padlocks; - hasps and/or only faceplates,  -  of such locks should look vaguely medieval, but the "works" can be modern.]
       So if anyone can send me contact details for such a niche-market  Manufacturing Locksmith - or even their Retail Sales Agents, I'll be very grateful.
       Matthewe


    • Julian Wilson
      Thank you, Mr. Young. Most of my clients so far, for medievally-themed chests and coffers - have wanted to pass the 3-Foot Rule but haven t demanded absolute
      Message 2 of 24 , Aug 24 10:59 AM
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        Thank you, Mr. Young.
        Most of my clients so far, for medievally-themed chests and coffers - have wanted to pass the "3-Foot Rule" but haven't demanded absolute historical-replica accuracy.
        I have found quite a large selection of "blackwork" hinges, corner protections, and strapwork available off-the-shelf; - and if I had to do so, I could even make them myself though it's not a Craft I have much reason to exercise.
        But chest locks which will pass the 3-Foot Rule - even with modern mechanisms inside or behind a period case/faceplate - none of the Manufacurers from whom I could by a wide range of such period hinges /strapwork - also offer the extra lock-accessory in their online Catalogues. And no-one seems to offer any replica-"period" padlocks dating to before 1600AD. I've spent hours searching online without positive results - or I wouldn't be asking the question in this Forum.
        I'm grateful for your early response, naytheless.
        Matthewe



        From: D. Young <furnaceplans@...>
        To: "medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com" <medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Saturday, 24 August 2013, 15:23
        Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

         
        Its very important to note that the hardware: nails, hinges, straps, and lock.....represent a tremendous amount of time that we dont often account for.....particularly as some of these things are custom oriented to the size of the box.

        So...want accuracy....might have to pay for it.

        Rather like using wide oak lumber vs 2.5 inch oak flooring....

        food for thought.   Accuracy = time= more money= investment

      • bsrlee
        The closest thing I have seen on-line lately are the restorer s padlocks being sold by Van Dyke s in the US. http://www.vandykes.com/ They have some heart
        Message 3 of 24 , Aug 25 3:18 AM
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          The closest thing I have seen on-line lately are the "restorer's" padlocks being sold by Van Dyke's in the US.
          http://www.vandykes.com/

          They have some 'heart shaped' keyed padlocks which are arguably 1600's or so - similar to the triangular locks found in some of the Dutch wrecks on the Western Australian coast.

          http://www.vandykes.com/product.aspx?p=204934&green=95C2577F-3A8A-5C46-A843-2A18EA9873D5

          and 'screw' key padlocks
          http://www.vandykes.com/product.aspx?p=207390&green=95C2577F-3A8A-5C46-A843-2A18EA9873D5

          Also some fairly chunky padlock hasps as well as the 'usual' fake Spanish/Mexican sheet metal hasps.
          http://www.vandykes.com/product.aspx?p=203535&green=95C2577F-3A8A-5C46-A843-2A18EA9873D5
          http://www.vandykes.com/spear-point-black-iron-hasp/p/204981/

          I think Vandykes buy a lot of their hardware by the pallet as they have 'new' items all the time, but when they sell out of something interesting it just disppears, never to return.

          I have seen the odd small 'Viking' padlock turn up with merchants at SCA events which seem to be coming from Eastern Europe, and there is a fellow in New Zealand who is making very nice large & fancy Viking/Anglo-Saxon padlocks but they run $80-$100 IIRC.

          regards
          Brusi of Orkney


          On 25-Aug-13 3:59 AM, Julian Wilson wrote:
          Thank you, Mr. Young.
          Most of my clients so far, for medievally-themed chests and coffers - have wanted to pass the "3-Foot Rule" but haven't demanded absolute historical-replica accuracy.
          I have found quite a large selection of "blackwork" hinges, corner protections, and strapwork available off-the-shelf; - and if I had to do so, I could even make them myself though it's not a Craft I have much reason to exercise.
          But chest locks which will pass the 3-Foot Rule - even with modern mechanisms inside or behind a period case/faceplate - none of the Manufacurers from whom I could by a wide range of such period hinges /strapwork - also offer the extra lock-accessory in their online Catalogues. And no-one seems to offer any replica-"period" padlocks dating to before 1600AD. I've spent hours searching online without positive results - or I wouldn't be asking the question in this Forum.
          I'm grateful for your early response, naytheless.
          Matthewe

        • D. Young
          I hear ya Matthewe Hence the reason Im edging closer to making some. Fine Armour and Historical Reproductions Custom Commissions Welcome....!
          Message 4 of 24 , Aug 26 2:39 PM
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            I hear ya Matthewe

            Hence the reason Im edging closer to making some.





            Fine Armour and Historical Reproductions

                 Custom Commissions Welcome....!

            www.partsandtechnical.com
            (Well Formed Munitions Catalog Coming This Spring)
             



            To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
            From: lhjw66576@...
            Date: Sat, 24 Aug 2013 18:59:31 +0100
            Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

             

            Thank you, Mr. Young.
            Most of my clients so far, for medievally-themed chests and coffers - have wanted to pass the "3-Foot Rule" but haven't demanded absolute historical-replica accuracy.
            I have found quite a large selection of "blackwork" hinges, corner protections, and strapwork available off-the-shelf; - and if I had to do so, I could even make them myself though it's not a Craft I have much reason to exercise.
            But chest locks which will pass the 3-Foot Rule - even with modern mechanisms inside or behind a period case/faceplate - none of the Manufacurers from whom I could by a wide range of such period hinges /strapwork - also offer the extra lock-accessory in their online Catalogues. And no-one seems to offer any replica-"period" padlocks dating to before 1600AD. I've spent hours searching online without positive results - or I wouldn't be asking the question in this Forum.
            I'm grateful for your early response, naytheless.
            Matthewe



            From: D. Young <furnaceplans@...>
            To: "medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com" <medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Saturday, 24 August 2013, 15:23
            Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

             
            Its very important to note that the hardware: nails, hinges, straps, and lock.....represent a tremendous amount of time that we dont often account for.....particularly as some of these things are custom oriented to the size of the box.

            So...want accuracy....might have to pay for it.

            Rather like using wide oak lumber vs 2.5 inch oak flooring....

            food for thought.   Accuracy = time= more money= investment


          • Hall, Hayward
            The problem with either locks or any period mechanism or tool is that you really need to understand its workings in order to maintain it, and the time involved
            Message 5 of 24 , Aug 26 9:06 PM
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              The problem with either locks or any period mechanism or tool is that you really need to understand its workings in order to maintain it, and the time involved is generally cost prohibitive.  I’ll probably never sell a 13thc barrel lock because it takes an incredible about of tedious casting, filing and fitting of small parts if you want to do it right ($$$) and if something goes wrong or gets jammed in use either through user-error or mechanical failure (lets face it, I/we don’t make these for a living), then I have a disgruntled customer (although I’ve never had a problem with mine yet).  If someone produces stuff like this commercially, then they’re not generally going to look properly medieval, and its painful to see commercial hardware on a nice handmade period piece.  All that to say you’re better off learning to make ur own, or coming to a trade agreement.

               

              Gratuitous showing off:

              http://personal.evangel.edu/hallh/web/medievalstuff/barrellock.jpg

              http://personal.evangel.edu/hallh/web/medievalstuff/barrellock2.jpg

               

              I would teach a class on making these but the odds of someone(s) showing up with enough skills to complete it without 2 hours of 1-on-1 contact are fairly slim.  I’m happy if 1 in 10 actually know how to use a file (no offense to my wonderful students).  I wish sometimes I could do more than entry-level classes, which is another discussion altogether.

               

               

              Guillaume

               


              To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              From: lhjw66576@...
              Date: Sat, 24 Aug 2013 18:59:31 +0100
              Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

               

               

              Thank you, Mr. Young.
              Most of my clients so far, for medievally-themed chests and coffers - have wanted to pass the "3-Foot Rule" but haven't demanded absolute historical-replica accuracy.
              I have found quite a large selection of "blackwork" hinges, corner protections, and strapwork available off-the-shelf; - and if I had to do so, I could even make them myself though it's not a Craft I have much reason to exercise.
              But chest locks which will pass the 3-Foot Rule - even with modern mechanisms inside or behind a period case/faceplate - none of the Manufacurers from whom I could by a wide range of such period hinges /strapwork - also offer the extra lock-accessory in their online Catalogues. And no-one seems to offer any replica-"period" padlocks dating to before 1600AD. I've spent hours searching online without positive results - or I wouldn't be asking the question in this Forum.
              I'm grateful for your early response, naytheless.
              Matthewe

               

               


              From: D. Young <furnaceplans@...>
              To: "medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com" <medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Saturday, 24 August 2013, 15:23
              Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

               

               

              Its very important to note that the hardware: nails, hinges, straps, and lock.....represent a tremendous amount of time that we dont often account for.....particularly as some of these things are custom oriented to the size of the box.

              So...want accuracy....might have to pay for it.

              Rather like using wide oak lumber vs 2.5 inch oak flooring....

              food for thought.   Accuracy = time= more money= investment

               

               




            • Thylacine
              very nice. ... very nice. On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 at 12:06 AM, Hall, Hayward wrote: á The problem with either locks or any period mechanism
              Message 6 of 24 , Aug 27 1:42 AM
              • 0 Attachment
                very nice.


                On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 at 12:06 AM, Hall, Hayward <hallh@...> wrote:
                 

                The problem with either locks or any period mechanism or tool is that you really need to understand its workings in order to maintain it, and the time involved is generally cost prohibitive.  I’ll probably never sell a 13thc barrel lock because it takes an incredible about of tedious casting, filing and fitting of small parts if you want to do it right ($$$) and if something goes wrong or gets jammed in use either through user-error or mechanical failure (lets face it, I/we don’t make these for a living), then I have a disgruntled customer (although I’ve never had a problem with mine yet).  If someone produces stuff like this commercially, then they’re not generally going to look properly medieval, and its painful to see commercial hardware on a nice handmade period piece.  All that to say you’re better off learning to make ur own, or coming to a trade agreement.

                 

                Gratuitous showing off:

                http://personal.evangel.edu/hallh/web/medievalstuff/barrellock.jpg

                http://personal.evangel.edu/hallh/web/medievalstuff/barrellock2.jpg

                 

                I would teach a class on making these but the odds of someone(s) showing up with enough skills to complete it without 2 hours of 1-on-1 contact are fairly slim.  I’m happy if 1 in 10 actually know how to use a file (no offense to my wonderful students).  I wish sometimes I could do more than entry-level classes, which is another discussion altogether.

                 

                 

                Guillaume

                 


                To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                From: lhjw66576@...
                Date: Sat, 24 Aug 2013 18:59:31 +0100
                Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

                 

                 

                Thank you, Mr. Young.
                Most of my clients so far, for medievally-themed chests and coffers - have wanted to pass the "3-Foot Rule" but haven't demanded absolute historical-replica accuracy.
                I have found quite a large selection of "blackwork" hinges, corner protections, and strapwork available off-the-shelf; - and if I had to do so, I could even make them myself though it's not a Craft I have much reason to exercise.
                But chest locks which will pass the 3-Foot Rule - even with modern mechanisms inside or behind a period case/faceplate - none of the Manufacurers from whom I could by a wide range of such period hinges /strapwork - also offer the extra lock-accessory in their online Catalogues. And no-one seems to offer any replica-"period" padlocks dating to before 1600AD. I've spent hours searching online without positive results - or I wouldn't be asking the question in this Forum.
                I'm grateful for your early response, naytheless.
                Matthewe

                 

                 


                From: D. Young <furnaceplans@...>
                To: "medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com" <medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Saturday, 24 August 2013, 15:23
                Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] replica antique box locks

                 

                 

                Its very important to note that the hardware: nails, hinges, straps, and lock.....represent a tremendous amount of time that we dont often account for.....particularly as some of these things are custom oriented to the size of the box.

                So...want accuracy....might have to pay for it.

                Rather like using wide oak lumber vs 2.5 inch oak flooring....

                food for thought.   Accuracy = time= more money= investment

                 

                 





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