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Re: [MedievalSawdust] Adjusting blade tracking on older Craftsman bandsaw.

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  • conradh@efn.org
    Go ahead and glue them on. Used to do that all the time for friction sawing metal on the bandsaw. In friction sawing, you speed the saw up instead of slowing
    Message 1 of 14 , Jun 12, 2010
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      Go ahead and glue them on. Used to do that all the time for friction
      sawing metal on the bandsaw. In friction sawing, you speed the saw up
      instead of slowing it like you'd think for metal--we'd turn the jackshaft
      around to get triple speed instead of one-third. You had to glue the
      tires down so they wouldn't throw.

      FYI, friction sawing cuts steel plate about as fast as a torch, feet per
      minute. The blade heats the metal so much at the point of contact it
      turns orange-hot, and can be torn away at a vast rate because it's as soft
      as wood. The blade doesn't lose teeth because they only have momentary
      contact followed by high-speed air cooling.

      Only downsides are that not every saw has a jackshaft (though I suppose
      you could trade off pulleys), and that it's kind of scary. Consider
      wearing a leather apron and a full face shield. It also leaves quite a
      burr on the underside of the work, though cleanup is no worse than after a
      torch cut.

      Ulfhedinn


      On Sat, June 12, 2010 12:04 pm, Sean Powell wrote:
      > Hello,
      > I'm going to ask here before I do something that I may regret later.
      > I have inherited an old craftsman tabletop bandsaw, strictly
      > speaking a weekend warrior job that my father hasn't used in years because
      > he had trouble with the blade tracking over the wheels. I have partially
      > disassembled, cleaned, reassembled and trued up the system to the best of
      > my ability. I think I have found the root of the problem. For some reason
      > the rubber on the lower idler wheel wants to eject sideways and come off
      > the pulley (luckily the blade now stays tracking where it should). The
      > rubber thenrubs on the interior housing and the blade directly contacts
      > the aluminum wheel. I think that the rubber is old enough that it no
      > longer wants to grip the idler wheel properly. The idler wheel has the
      > crown so theoretically I could run directly against the aluminum but that
      > would gradually tear up the wheel and potentially dull the blade. The best
      > choice would be to replace the rubber but I don't think they make parts
      > for a saw this old anymore. I am considering using spray contact adhesive
      > to reattach the rubber to the wheel. Worst case is I need to use a putty
      > knife to clean it off. Well that or pitch the saw as un-salvageable...
      > Anyone have any advice about securing the rubber to the idler wheel?
      >
      >
      > Thanks,
      > Sean
      >
      >
    • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
      I ve seen blades get hot enough to melt the tire.... ( with an idiot operating the saw.... lol ) what happens with this? Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim Hart Aude
      Message 2 of 14 , Jun 12, 2010
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        I've seen blades get hot enough to melt the tire....
        ( with an idiot operating the saw.... lol  )

        what happens with this?
         
        Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

        Aude Aliquid Dignum
        ' Dare Something Worthy '



        From: "conradh@..." <conradh@...>
        To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Sat, June 12, 2010 4:57:24 PM
        Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Adjusting blade tracking on older Craftsman bandsaw.

         

        Go ahead and glue them on. Used to do that all the time for friction
        sawing metal on the bandsaw. In friction sawing, you speed the saw up
        instead of slowing it like you'd think for metal--we'd turn the jackshaft
        around to get triple speed instead of one-third. You had to glue the
        tires down so they wouldn't throw.

        FYI, friction sawing cuts steel plate about as fast as a torch, feet per
        minute. The blade heats the metal so much at the point of contact it
        turns orange-hot, and can be torn away at a vast rate because it's as soft
        as wood. The blade doesn't lose teeth because they only have momentary
        contact followed by high-speed air cooling.

        Only downsides are that not every saw has a jackshaft (though I suppose
        you could trade off pulleys), and that it's kind of scary. Consider
        wearing a leather apron and a full face shield. It also leaves quite a
        burr on the underside of the work, though cleanup is no worse than after a
        torch cut.

        Ulfhedinn

        On Sat, June 12, 2010 12:04 pm, Sean Powell wrote:
        > Hello,
        > I'm going to ask here before I do something that I may regret later.
        > I have inherited an old craftsman tabletop bandsaw, strictly
        > speaking a weekend warrior job that my father hasn't used in years because
        > he had trouble with the blade tracking over the wheels. I have partially
        > disassembled, cleaned, reassembled and trued up the system to the best of
        > my ability. I think I have found the root of the problem. For some reason
        > the rubber on the lower idler wheel wants to eject sideways and come off
        > the pulley (luckily the blade now stays tracking where it should). The
        > rubber thenrubs on the interior housing and the blade directly contacts
        > the aluminum wheel. I think that the rubber is old enough that it no
        > longer wants to grip the idler wheel properly. The idler wheel has the
        > crown so theoretically I could run directly against the aluminum but that
        > would gradually tear up the wheel and potentially dull the blade. The best
        > choice would be to replace the rubber but I don't think they make parts
        > for a saw this old anymore. I am considering using spray contact adhesive
        > to reattach the rubber to the wheel. Worst case is I need to use a putty
        > knife to clean it off. Well that or pitch the saw as un-salvageable...
        > Anyone have any advice about securing the rubber to the idler wheel?
        >
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Sean
        >
        >


      • Sean Powell
        AH HA!!! My father is as OCD about saving manuals as I am and I knew he gave me the manual with the saw. I spent half the day cleaning the shop looking for
        Message 3 of 14 , Jun 12, 2010
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          AH HA!!!

          My father is as OCD about saving manuals as I am and I knew he gave me the manual with the saw. I spent half the day cleaning the shop looking for where I could have misplaced it since it wasn't with my supply of manuals... then I found it shoved in a box with the blades! :) happy dance.

          Sears 10-inch band saw model 113.244400 Serial or code date 3153.m0062.

          I'm going to try gluing the rubber in place tonight. I'll give a report if it works tomorrow. Worst case I peel it off and there is no loss.

          Side note: if someone knows of a place for replacement parts for a Craftsman Model 315.175040 router I would appreciate it. The collar came loose during a cut and the internal piece split and spread open like a flower. :( Definetly needs a replacement part. The question is if the part is more expensive then just replacing the whole router.

          Thanks, Sean

          On 6/12/2010 3:17 PM, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart wrote:
          Do you have the manual?

          Model number?

          Does Sears still make parts for it?

          How old is it?
           
          Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

          Aude Aliquid Dignum
          ' Dare Something Worthy '



          From: Sean Powell <powell.sean@...>
          To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Sat, June 12, 2010 3:04:35 PM
          Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Adjusting blade tracking on older Craftsman bandsaw.

           

          Hello,
          I'm going to ask here before I do something that I may regret later.
          I have inherited an old craftsman tabletop bandsaw, strictly
          speaking a weekend warrior job that my father hasn't used in years
          because he had trouble with the blade tracking over the wheels. I have
          partially disassembled, cleaned, reassembled and trued up the system to
          the best of my ability. I think I have found the root of the problem.
          For some reason the rubber on the lower idler wheel wants to eject
          sideways and come off the pulley (luckily the blade now stays tracking
          where it should). The rubber thenrubs on the interior housing and the
          blade directly contacts the aluminum wheel.
          I think that the rubber is old enough that it no longer wants to
          grip the idler wheel properly. The idler wheel has the crown so
          theoretically I could run directly against the aluminum but that would
          gradually tear up the wheel and potentially dull the blade.
          The best choice would be to replace the rubber but I don't think
          they make parts for a saw this old anymore.
          I am considering using spray contact adhesive to reattach the
          rubber to the wheel. Worst case is I need to use a putty knife to clean
          it off. Well that or pitch the saw as un-salvageable...
          Anyone have any advice about securing the rubber to the idler wheel?

          Thanks,
          Sean


        • conradh@efn.org
          ... The tires held up OK, never smelled burning rubber. Of course, this was a big saw, not a bench model. The lower wheel was practically touching the floor,
          Message 4 of 14 , Jun 13, 2010
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            On Sat, June 12, 2010 2:58 pm, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart wrote:
            > I've seen blades get hot enough to melt the tire....
            > ( with an idiot operating the saw.... lol )
            >
            >
            > what happens with this? Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

            The tires held up OK, never smelled burning rubber. Of course, this was a
            big saw, not a bench model. The lower wheel was practically touching the
            floor, so the extra cooling time may have helped. Also, that old saying
            about the heat being in the chip may apply. The guy whose shop it was
            talked like the key to not burning up the blade was high speed, so that no
            one bit of blade had time to pick up heat from the work. He was talking
            in terms of not ruining the teeth, but maybe the same effect was
            protecting the tires too?
            >
            >
            Ulfhedinn
          • Erik Hansen
            I built a list for a running tournaments at Pennsic, which due to a focus on historical victory conditions tended to be more physical than most SCA bouts. One
            Message 5 of 14 , Jun 14, 2010
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              I built a list for a running tournaments at Pennsic, which due to a focus on historical victory conditions tended to be more physical than most SCA bouts.  One of the ways to lose a bout historically is to be driven from the list.

              I decided rather then trying to make a list that would resist combatants running into it, I made it so it could "give way".  I also needed to enclose a large area, but not use much too much wood due to limited transport and storage area.

              My compromise was to use a solution that was "not apparantly modern" to the untrained eye, when installed, using 4x4 posts and a long legnth of manilla rope

              I took  4 foot lengths of 4x4' and drilled an 12 inch hole in the bottom.  I then inserted a 3 foot section of rebar in to the bottom, so I had 2 feet of rebar sticking out the bottom.  

              I also drilled one hole through the 4X4, 6 inches from the top for the rope to run through.

              If the ground was soft, I could set up the list field by merely pushing the posts with the rebar right in the ground.  A few blows with a sledge hammer could push away rocks.  If the ground was hard, I could start the hole using a piece of loose rebar.   I could easilly vary the size of the field by running more rope between the list posts.

              If someone runs into a post, the rebar is is soft enough the posts fold right over.

              If someone runs into a rope, the whole structure has enough give that the marshal has plenty of time to stop the combat, before some trips.

              Improvements:
              4X4 are overkill.  3x3's with the corners knocked off would look better and save space and weight.

              Make the holes in the posts for the rebar just large enough to grip the rebar, but still loose enough to pull out by hand.  This ended up happening with a few of the posts, and it means I can pound in the rebar first and set the posts on top, or vary the rebar length, which is really useful for different ground hardness.

              Better design for a smaller field

              Add pegs to the sides of the posts which are slightly canted upwards.  Add rails which set on the pegs and face to the outside of the list, and therefore if someone runs into the rail, it falls off to the outside.



              On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 10:42 AM, igel <igelkottinus@...> wrote:
               

              I made some of these and they work very well for perimeter fence. However when fighting over them, they tend to fall apart but aren't too bad because you just pound them back together again. I made pins out of 1/4" steel rod bent in an L shape and go through the upright and rail and seem to hold things together better.

              I also made a bunch of these:

              http://home.armourarchive.org/members/igelkott/rook/DSC01895.JPG

              http://home.armourarchive.org/members/igelkott/rook/DSC01896.JPG

              and string rope between them. Not period but they look nice and transport flat.

              Chris



              --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Baron Otto" <RobertEDay@...> wrote:
              >
              > I made a barrier many years ago, and then our barony made a list fence using
              > the same design several years ago.
              >
              > We used the following as the starting point:
              >
              > http://www.greydragon.org/library/tourneyfence.html
              >
              > The main difference was that instead of passing the ends of the cross pieces
              > through holes in the uprights, we attached the ends with removable pin
              > hinges. It is solid, and you don't have to cut the through mortise the each
              > upright. The down side is the additional cost of the hinges and the
              > additional time during set up and tear down.
              >
              >
              >
              > Otto
              >
              >
              >
              > From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              > [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Matthew_Mole
              > Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2010 3:50 AM
              > To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Portable Wooden List Fields and Barriers
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Good afternoon all
              >
              > Does anyone here have a good design for wooden barriers to surround a list
              > field. There have been a number of them appearing around the SCA recently
              > and they look so much better than bunting.
              >
              > I'm looking for something that is solid, stable but easily disassembled for
              > transport.
              >
              > Ideas for a barrier for combatants to fight over would be useful as well.
              >
              > Regards
              > Don Emrys
              > Baron Ildhafn
              >


            • Tim Bray
              The Company of St George built one about 15 years ago - it was prominently displayed at the 3YC Pas. Which I still have not found any photos of! That was the
              Message 6 of 14 , Jun 15, 2010
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                The Company of St George built one about 15 years ago - it was prominently displayed at the 3YC Pas.  Which I still have not found any photos of!  That was the best-looking Pas setup we ever had, and I would love to see some pics to verify my memory.

                IIRC, we built that fence with 4x4 posts, mortised to receive 2x4 rails.  The ends of the rails were half-lapped (vertically, i.e. each end was 3-1/2 x 3-1/2 x 3/4).  No pegs needed except maybe at the corners.  Make the mortises a little loose so the joints don't tighten up if it rains, and paint everything liberally, including the lap joints and the insides of the mortises. 

                I can't actually remember which method we used to hold the posts upright: Thornbird made some "portable holes" for the Barrier, and we may have had some of those for the fence as well, or maybe we socketed the posts over rebar.

                Cheers,
                Tim
                (Colin)


                On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 12:50 AM, Matthew_Mole <matthew_mole@...> wrote:
                Good afternoon all

                Does anyone here have a good design for wooden barriers to surround a list field. There have been a number of them appearing around the SCA recently and they look so much better than bunting.

                I'm looking for something that is solid, stable but easily disassembled for transport.

                Ideas for a barrier for combatants to fight over would be useful as well.

                Regards
                Don Emrys
                Baron Ildhafn



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              • Ralph
                ... I know I took photo s of that, I just haven t found them Ralg AnTir (staff at 30 year)
                Message 7 of 14 , Jun 20, 2010
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                  --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, Tim Bray <albionwood@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > The Company of St George built one about 15 years ago - it was prominently
                  > displayed at the 3YC Pas. Which I still have not found any photos of! That
                  > was the best-looking Pas setup we ever had, and I would love to see some
                  > pics to verify my memory.
                  >
                  I know I took photo's of that, I just haven't found them

                  Ralg
                  AnTir
                  (staff at 30 year)
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