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OOP: rebuilding cordless tool batteries?

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  • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
    Anyone have it done? Happy with the results? Happy with the cost vs. buying new batteries? Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim Hart Aude Aliquid Dignum Dare Something
    Message 1 of 17 , Sep 10, 2009
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      Anyone have it done?

      Happy with the results?

      Happy with the cost vs. buying new batteries?
       
      Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

      Aude Aliquid Dignum
      ' Dare Something Worthy '


    • nelsonhaynes@aol.com
      I ve been contemplating this issue for a while. My Makita dills batteries are dead. Rebuilding the batteries cost more than the original package. New Makita
      Message 2 of 17 , Sep 10, 2009
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        I've been contemplating this issue for a while. My Makita dills batteries are dead. Rebuilding the batteries cost more than the original package. New Makita tools are not the quality of the old ones. Rigid drills come with a lifetime warranty on the drill motor and the batteries. A new Rigid drill package with 2 batteries cost slightly more than two rebuilt batteries. Then again, my hand brace never runs out of power.
         
        Master Nigel
      • W. Roberts
        Ditto my McCulloch - charge the batteries per instructions, and maybe 20 minutes after I slap them back in I m praying for just enough Ooomp to finish this
        Message 3 of 17 , Sep 10, 2009
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          Ditto my McCulloch - charge the batteries per instructions, and maybe 20 minutes after I slap them back in I'm praying for just enough "Ooomp" to finish this one hole. Given the cost of the drill (less sale price, less employee discount), vs rebuilding/replacing batteries, it's more cost-effective to just get a new outfit. I believe that's part of the "planned obsolescence" equation.

          Conal, I don't know if you've seen it, but if you decide to give it a shot, here's a start: http://www.instructables.com/id/Cordless-drill---Improving-the-battery/

          Wolf

          On Thu, 2009-09-10 at 15:19 -0400, nelsonhaynes@... wrote:

          > I've been contemplating this issue for a while. My Makita dills batteries are dead. Rebuilding the batteries cost more than the original package. New Makita tools are not the quality of the old ones. Rigid drills come with a lifetime warranty on the drill motor and the batteries. A new Rigid drill package with 2 batteries cost slightly more than two rebuilt batteries. Then again, my hand brace never runs out of power.
          >
          > Master Nigel
        • Mike King
          Powermatic 3520B on its way. Stoked....seriously stoked! Miguel
          Message 4 of 17 , Sep 10, 2009
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              Powermatic 3520B on its way.  Stoked....seriously stoked!
             
            Miguel


          • jljonsn9663
            May I be the first to say: WOOT! (and not just because I m getting your old one) Let me know when you need help setting up. Jeff
            Message 5 of 17 , Sep 10, 2009
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              May I be the first to say: WOOT! (and not just because I'm getting your old one)

              Let me know when you need help setting up.

              Jeff

              --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Mike King" <the_spanishpeacock@...> wrote:
              >
              > Powermatic 3520B on its way. Stoked....seriously stoked!
              >
              > Miguel
              >
              >
              > <http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=6200723/grpspId=1705126283/msgId
              > =11873/stime=1252617125/nc1=3848614/nc2=5807836/nc3=5191954>
              >
            • Bruce S. R. Lee
              A lot depends on the brand/model of battery and the company doing the re-pack (or you can DIY with some batteries) Makita batteries are a PITA as they are a
              Message 6 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                A lot depends on the brand/model of battery and the company doing the
                re-pack (or you can DIY with some batteries)

                Makita batteries are a PITA as they are a sealed unit - the repackers
                cut the outer case open with a 'hot knife', rebuild the pack & then
                -try- to weld the outer back together, with a variable amount of
                success - a friend has a few 9.6v Makitas that were rebuilt and at
                least one has fallen apart at the weld. Other brands such as the
                discontinued Triton cordless have the battery pack held together with
                screws, so it is very easy to DIY repack. It varies by brand & model.
                I also have a suspicion that some less common replacement batteries
                for older models are nearly dead due to self-discharge when you get them.

                A good repacked battery can out last & outperform the OEM battery if
                they use quality matched cells , specially so with 'bargain' brands
                which just use any old cells they can get cheap - on the other hand I
                have a Festo 9.6v drill that is around 15 years old and still holds a
                charge for a year or so on its original battery pack.

                One 'trick' that can revive an old battery is to put it in the
                freezer over night then let it thaw out before recharging. I'm
                guessing that this caused the crystals that form in the battery
                matrix to break down again into smaller bits, restoring the ability
                to hold a charge.

                regards
                Brusi of Orkney
                Rowany/Lochac
                Sydney/Australia.

                At 04:58 AM 11/09/2009, you wrote:


                >Anyone have it done?
                >
                >Happy with the results?
                >
                >Happy with the cost vs. buying new batteries?
                >
                >Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
                >
                >Aude Aliquid Dignum
                >' Dare Something Worthy '
              • Bill McNutt
                Hum. My grandmother s old deep freezer is practically empty out in the garage. From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                Message 7 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                  Hum.  My grandmother’s old “deep freezer” is practically empty out in the garage.

                   

                  From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce S. R. Lee
                  Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 4:08 AM
                  To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] OOP: rebuilding cordless tool batteries?

                   

                   

                  A lot depends on the brand/model of battery and the company doing the
                  re-pack (or you can DIY with some batteries)

                  Makita batteries are a PITA as they are a sealed unit - the repackers
                  cut the outer case open with a 'hot knife', rebuild the pack & then
                  -try- to weld the outer back together, with a variable amount of
                  success - a friend has a few 9.6v Makitas that were rebuilt and at
                  least one has fallen apart at the weld. Other brands such as the
                  discontinued Triton cordless have the battery pack held together with
                  screws, so it is very easy to DIY repack. It varies by brand & model.
                  I also have a suspicion that some less common replacement batteries
                  for older models are nearly dead due to self-discharge when you get them.

                  A good repacked battery can out last & outperform the OEM battery if
                  they use quality matched cells , specially so with 'bargain' brands
                  which just use any old cells they can get cheap - on the other hand I
                  have a Festo 9.6v drill that is around 15 years old and still holds a
                  charge for a year or so on its original battery pack.

                  One 'trick' that can revive an old battery is to put it in the
                  freezer over night then let it thaw out before recharging. I'm
                  guessing that this caused the crystals that form in the battery
                  matrix to break down again into smaller bits, restoring the ability
                  to hold a charge.

                  regards
                  Brusi of Orkney
                  Rowany/Lochac
                  Sydney/Australia.

                  At 04:58 AM 11/09/2009, you wrote:

                  >Anyone have it done?
                  >
                  >Happy with the results?
                  >
                  >Happy with the cost vs. buying new batteries?
                  >
                  >Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
                  >
                  >Aude Aliquid Dignum
                  >' Dare Something Worthy '

                • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                  One trick that can revive an old battery is to put it in the freezer over night then let it thaw out before recharging. I m guessing that this caused the
                  Message 8 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                    One 'trick' that can revive an old battery is to put it in the
                    freezer over night then let it thaw out before recharging. I'm
                    guessing that this caused the crystals that form in the battery
                    matrix to break down again into smaller bits, restoring the ability
                    to hold a charge.

                    hmmm.... It this is true it would be nice.....
                    Almost sounds too easy to be true.

                    Where did you hear this? I've seen a lot of
                    similar things claimed to be fact when they
                    are just urban legends or old wife's tales.

                    Anyone know if it is at least feasible?
                    ( I might try it anyway.... )
                     
                    Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                    Aude Aliquid Dignum
                    ' Dare Something Worthy '


                    __

                  • Bill McNutt
                    Well, I was building a bridge one very HOT pennsic, and the battery packs were discharging very quickly. I always try to have a spare charged, but we were
                    Message 9 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                      Well, I was building a bridge one very HOT pennsic, and the battery packs were discharging very quickly.  I always try to have a spare charged, but we were going through them too fast.  So I started storing them in the cooler.  Chilling them when they started to heat up helped them keep their charge longer.

                       

                      Not sure that’s relevant.

                       

                      On the other hand, if you already have a near-dead battery pack, it’s cheap enough to try it.

                       

                      Will

                       

                      From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                      Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 11:01 AM
                      To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] OOP: rebuilding cordless tool batteries?

                       

                       


                      One 'trick' that can revive an old battery is to put it in the
                      freezer over night then let it thaw out before recharging. I'm
                      guessing that this caused the crystals that form in the battery
                      matrix to break down again into smaller bits, restoring the ability
                      to hold a charge.

                      hmmm.... It this is true it would be nice.....
                      Almost sounds too easy to be true.

                      Where did you hear this? I've seen a lot of
                      similar things claimed to be fact when they
                      are just urban legends or old wife's tales.

                      Anyone know if it is at least feasible?
                      ( I might try it anyway.... )

                       

                      Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                      Aude Aliquid Dignum
                      ' Dare Something Worthy '

                       

                       

                      __

                       

                    • James Winkler
                      NiMH and NiCd batteries self discharge at a MUCH faster rate than alkaline batteries. In fact, at room temperature (about 70 degrees F) NiMH and NiCD
                      Message 10 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                        NiMH and NiCd batteries self discharge at a MUCH faster rate than alkaline batteries.  In fact, at "room temperature" (about 70 degrees F) NiMH and NiCD batteries will self discharge a few percent PER DAY.  Storing them at lower temperatures will slow their self discharge rate dramatically.  NiMH batteries stored at freezing will retain over 90% of their charge for  full month. So it might make sense to store them in a freezer.  If you do, it's best to bring them back to room temperature before using them.
                         
                        http://www.greenbatteries.com/batterymyths.html#Freezer
                         
                        other than that... every source I found about freezing batteries to 'revive' them seems to indicate that it's a myth...
                         
                        Chas.
                         
                         
                      • mary_ostler
                        I work in R&D at a Li-ion battery company. Cold storage slows the rate voltage discharge, and keeps the start impedance of batteries. It will not magically add
                        Message 11 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                          I work in R&D at a Li-ion battery company. Cold storage slows the rate voltage discharge, and keeps the start impedance of batteries. It will not magically add voltage out of thin air. Yes, there are ways of making electricity through tempature change (stirling engines..etc). It just doesn't work that way with batteries (Li-ion)

                          Mary O
                        • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                          Cool, a battery specialist! this is a handy list. just to be sure... I think the original suggestion was to freeze the battery to revive the battery sability
                          Message 12 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                            Cool, a battery specialist! this is a handy list.

                            just to be sure...

                            I think the original suggestion was to freeze the battery to
                            revive the battery's ability to retain a charge not to charge
                            the battery itself.


                            But I still bet that it is a myth.
                             
                            Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                            Aude Aliquid Dignum
                            ' Dare Something Worthy '



                            From: mary_ostler <42vince@...>
                            To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 11:31:58 AM
                            Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Re: OOP: rebuilding cordless tool batteries?

                             


                            I work in R&D at a Li-ion battery company. Cold storage slows the rate voltage discharge, and keeps the start impedance of batteries. It will not magically add voltage out of thin air. Yes, there are ways of making electricity through tempature change (stirling engines..etc) . It just doesn't work that way with batteries (Li-ion)

                            Mary O


                          • leaking pen
                            I do this with recharchables all the time, and it works, especially on nicd. however, i take it straight from the freezer to the charger. i have a friend
                            Message 13 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                              I do this with recharchables all the time, and it works, especially on
                              nicd. however, i take it straight from the freezer to the charger. i
                              have a friend that goes through a LOT of aa's, and he actually has his
                              recharger itself in the freezer.

                              On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 8:01 AM, Conal O'hAirt Jim
                              Hart<baronconal@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > One 'trick' that can revive an old battery is to put it in the
                              > freezer over night then let it thaw out before recharging. I'm
                              > guessing that this caused the crystals that form in the battery
                              > matrix to break down again into smaller bits, restoring the ability
                              > to hold a charge.
                              >
                              > hmmm.... It this is true it would be nice.....
                              > Almost sounds too easy to be true.
                              >
                              > Where did you hear this? I've seen a lot of
                              > similar things claimed to be fact when they
                              > are just urban legends or old wife's tales.
                              >
                              > Anyone know if it is at least feasible?
                              > ( I might try it anyway.... )
                              >
                              > Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
                              >
                              > Aude Aliquid Dignum
                              > ' Dare Something Worthy '
                              >
                              > __
                              >
                            • powell.sean@comcast.net
                              I have friends who race remote control cars on a competitive level. One makes it a point of storing his high performance batteries in a freezer chest. When
                              Message 14 of 17 , Sep 11, 2009
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                                I have friends who race remote control cars on a competitive level. One makes it a point of storing his high performance batteries in a freezer chest. When cold they have lower internal resistance so he can get more voltage out of them. but not necessarily more amperage. This might be what you are experiencing.

                                 

                                On a theoretical level you can freeze a battery cold enough that the chemical reaction dosn't take place... but thats more of an issue with wet batteries then dry.

                                 

                                I don't know much else other then when my batteries died they replacements cost more then a new drill so I used the opportunity to upgrade from 12v to 18v.

                                 

                                Sean

                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: "Bill McNutt" <mcnutt@...>
                                To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 11:12:33 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
                                Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] OOP: rebuilding cordless tool batteries?



                                Well, I was building a bridge one very HOT pennsic, and the battery packs were discharging very quickly.  I always try to have a spare charged, but we were going through them too fast.  So I started storing them in the cooler.  Chilling them when they started to heat up helped them keep their charge longer.

                                 

                                Not sure that’s relevant.

                                 

                                On the other hand, if you already have a near-dead battery pack, it’s cheap enough to try it.

                                 

                                Will

                              • Barbara Dodge
                                Woo HOOO! Another one joins the Mustard Monster Club! Enjoy, Barbara ... From: Mike King To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009
                                Message 15 of 17 , Sep 12, 2009
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                                  Woo HOOO! 
                                  Another one joins the Mustard Monster Club!
                                   
                                  Enjoy,
                                  Barbara
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  From: Mike King
                                  Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 5:27 PM
                                  Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Miguel gets a new toy

                                   

                                    Powermatic 3520B on its way.  Stoked....seriously stoked!
                                   
                                  Miguel


                                • n7bsn
                                  ... Enjoy....While I like the PM, I m happy with my Nova, at least until I save up the money for a Robust (played with one at the National AAW and have been in
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Sep 25, 2009
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                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                    > From: Mike King
                                    > To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 5:27 PM
                                    > Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Miguel gets a new toy
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Powermatic 3520B on its way. Stoked....seriously stoked!
                                    >
                                    >
                                    Enjoy....While I like the PM, I'm happy with my Nova, at least until I save up the money for a Robust (played with one at the National AAW and have been in lust ever since, but at ~$8K, they way I want it, I'm not going to have one tomorrow)

                                    Ralg
                                    AnTir
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