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anyone take notes on this?

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  • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
    anyone remember this chest? and take notes on it? I didn t..... Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim Hart Aude Aliquid Dignum Dare Something Worthy
    Message 1 of 13 , Dec 21 8:02 AM
      anyone remember this chest?

      and take notes on it?

      I didn't.....
       
      Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

      Aude Aliquid Dignum
      ' Dare Something Worthy '


    • Bobby Bourgoin (Robert du Bourg)
      Sorry… Robert du Bourg Sénéchal du Havre des Glaces Homme d’Arme de Lord Marek O’Brien _________________________________
      Message 2 of 13 , Dec 21 8:49 AM

        Sorry…

        Robert du Bourg

        Sénéchal du Havre des Glaces

        Homme d’Arme de Lord Marek O’Brien

        _________________________________

        bobby.bourgoin@...

        Bobby Bourgoin

        _________________________________

         

         

         


        From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
        Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 11:02 AM
        To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [MedievalSawdust] anyone take notes on this?

         

        anyone remember this chest?

        and take notes on it?

        I didn't.....

         

        Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

        Aude Aliquid Dignum
        ' Dare Something Worthy '

         

         

      • jay sabath
        Conal, From my notes: A rare late 14th century oak clamp front chest, with butterfly lockplate and chain and link strap hinges,with til inside, in perfect
        Message 3 of 13 , Dec 21 12:18 PM
          Conal,

          From my notes:

          A rare late 14th century oak clamp front chest, with butterfly lockplate and chain and link strap hinges,with til inside, in perfect condition.See ( Die gotischen Truhen der Luneburger Heideloster ) book for identical examples dating to the 1390's and with similar hinges and lockplates.
          Dimensions: 55.25" wide, 27" deep, 29.25" high


          Johannes Machiavelli


          On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 10:02 AM, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart <baronconal@...> wrote:

          anyone remember this chest?

          and take notes on it?

          I didn't.....
           
          Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

          Aude Aliquid Dignum
          ' Dare Something Worthy '





          --
          Lord Johannes Machiavelli
          Shire of Rokkehealden
          Kingdom of the Middle
        • Hall, Hayward
          How does that chain-and-link strap hinge work? What would be the purpose or advantage over a more ridged hinge? Looks like it would be rather irritating in
          Message 4 of 13 , Dec 21 6:01 PM
            How does that chain-and-link strap hinge work? What would be the purpose or advantage over a more ridged hinge? Looks like it would be rather irritating in use.

            Guillaume

            www.medievalocity.com


            ________________________________

            From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com on behalf of jay sabath
            Sent: Sun 12/21/2008 2:18 PM
            To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] anyone take notes on this?


            Conal,

            From my notes:

            A rare late 14th century oak clamp front chest, with butterfly lockplate and chain and link strap hinges,with til inside, in perfect condition.See ( Die gotischen Truhen der Luneburger Heideloster ) book for identical examples dating to the 1390's and with similar hinges and lockplates.
            Dimensions: 55.25" wide, 27" deep, 29.25" high


            Johannes Machiavelli



            On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 10:02 AM, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart <baronconal@...> wrote:




            anyone remember this chest?

            and take notes on it?

            I didn't.....


            Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

            Aude Aliquid Dignum
            ' Dare Something Worthy '







            --
            Lord Johannes Machiavelli
            Shire of Rokkehealden
            Kingdom of the Middle
          • AlbionWood
            Even stranger, it s in addition to a pin-hinge, therefore completely unnecessary. The experts undoubtedly know much more about this than I, but... that chest
            Message 5 of 13 , Dec 21 6:29 PM
              Even stranger, it's in addition to a pin-hinge, therefore completely unnecessary.  The experts undoubtedly know much more about this than I, but... that chest looks in awfully good condition... Why would it have chain-and-link strap hinges, in addition to pin-hinges?  Is a puzzlement.

              Hall, Hayward wrote:
              How does that chain-and-link strap hinge work?  What would be the purpose or advantage over a more ridged hinge?  Looks like it would be rather irritating in use.
               
              Guillaume
               
              www.medievalocity.com
               
              
              ________________________________
              
              From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com on behalf of jay sabath
              Sent: Sun 12/21/2008 2:18 PM
              To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] anyone take notes on this?
              
              
              Conal,
              
              >From my notes:
              
              A rare late 14th century oak clamp front chest, with butterfly lockplate and chain and link strap hinges,with til inside, in perfect condition.See ( Die gotischen Truhen der Luneburger Heideloster ) book for identical examples dating to the 1390's and with similar hinges and lockplates.
              Dimensions: 55.25" wide, 27" deep, 29.25" high
              
              
              Johannes Machiavelli
              
              
              
              On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 10:02 AM, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart <baronconal@...> wrote:
              
              
              	
              
              	anyone remember this chest?
              	
              	and take notes on it?
              	
              	I didn't.....
              	
              	 
              	Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart 
              	
              	Aude Aliquid Dignum 
              	' Dare Something Worthy ' 
              
              
              	
              
              
              
              
                
            • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
              there is another discussion going on HERE about that chest right now with pictures.... I wish we had more options here for that.... Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim
              Message 6 of 13 , Dec 21 8:10 PM

                there is another discussion going on HERE
                about that
                chest right now with pictures.... I wish we had more
                options here for that....



                Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                Aude Aliquid Dignum
                ' Dare Something Worthy '



                From: "Hall, Hayward" <hallh@...>
                To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 9:01:12 PM
                Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] anyone take notes on this?

                How does that chain-and-link strap hinge work? What would be the purpose or advantage over a more ridged hinge? Looks like it would be rather irritating in use.

                Guillaume

                www.medievalocity. com


                ____________ _________ _________ __

                From: medievalsawdust@ yahoogroups. com on behalf of jay sabath
                Sent: Sun 12/21/2008 2:18 PM
                To: medievalsawdust@ yahoogroups. com
                Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] anyone take notes on this?

                Conal,

                From my notes:

                A rare late 14th century oak clamp front chest, with butterfly lockplate and chain and link strap hinges,with til inside, in perfect condition.See ( Die gotischen Truhen der Luneburger Heideloster ) book for identical examples dating to the 1390's and with similar hinges and lockplates.
                Dimensions: 55.25" wide, 27" deep, 29.25" high

                Johannes Machiavelli

                On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 10:02 AM, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart <baronconal@yahoo. com> wrote:



                anyone remember this chest?

                and take notes on it?

                I didn't.....


                Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                Aude Aliquid Dignum
                ' Dare Something Worthy '



                --
                Lord Johannes Machiavelli
                Shire of Rokkehealden
                Kingdom of the Middle


              • AlbionWood
                Either the lock or the lid are later additions, because clearly the two do not work together. My bet is the lid is a replacement - it s just too perfect to be
                Message 7 of 13 , Dec 21 9:48 PM
                  Either the lock or the lid are later additions, because clearly the two do not work together.  My bet is the lid is a replacement - it's just too perfect to be original.  Hard to imagine how the edges on a chest lid from the 14th c. could be that sharp unless the thing sat unused virtually the whole time... The strap-hinges might have been added for decoration, or perhaps this was a lid from another chest.    There are also at least two repair pieces inserted into the stiles, you can see them in the photos.  Perhaps this chest has been more extensively rebuilt than the description indicates. I've never seen one with a lid that sloped front-to-back like that; perhaps the original pin-hinge was sawn off and replaced.

                  The floorboard is interesting as well.  Clamped-front chests join front-to-back, as this one does, so the floorboard grain has to run the same direction.  Usually the floor is made of several thin boards with tapered edges that fit into grooves in the front and back; sometimes the center floorboard is tenoned through to help tie the structure together.  In one of the photos, it looks like this chest has a single floorboard, more like what you see in boarded chests.

                  The more I look at those photos, the more skeptical I become about that "perfect condition 14th c." claim.

                  Cheers,
                  Tim


                  Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart wrote:

                  there is another discussion going on HERE
                  about that
                  chest right now with pictures.... I wish we had more
                  options here for that....

                • James Winkler
                  ... unnecessary. The experts undoubtedly know much more about this than I, but... that chest looks in awfully good condition... Why would it have
                  Message 8 of 13 , Dec 21 9:56 PM

                    >>

                    style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Even stranger, it's in addition to a pin-hinge, therefore completely unnecessary.  The experts undoubtedly know much more about this than I, but... that chest looks in awfully good condition... Why would it have chain-and-link strap hinges, in addition to pin-hinges?  Is a puzzlement.  <<

                    It’s possible that the chain-and-strap hinges are NOT original to the chest.  On the 14th c. chest I own there’s a false “lock plate” on the front… seems the Victorians had a penchant for ‘fixing’ things...  another possibility is that the strap hinge and lock plate (I assume there is an associated lock)…  was an “upgrade” to an older exiting chest to make it a bit more secure for the ‘till’…    actually… on closer look at the original chest… I’d almost bet on the latter as I’m not sure the strap and chain are actually a ‘hinge’ per se… but simply a way of securing the top…  I don’t see how it would really function as a hinge…

                    Chas.

                     

                  • James Winkler
                    Ya know. I m also fascinated by the geometry of the pin hinge. anybody else fascinated by the way the arm piece is shaped??? Chas.
                    Message 9 of 13 , Dec 21 9:58 PM

                      Ya’ know… I’m also fascinated by the geometry of the pin hinge…   anybody else fascinated by the way the “arm” piece is shaped???

                       

                      Chas.

                    • AlbionWood
                      Yes, it s very elegant! James Winkler wrote: Ya know Im also fascinated by the geometry of the pin hinge anybody else fascinated by the way the arm piece is
                      Message 10 of 13 , Dec 21 10:09 PM
                        Yes, it's very elegant!

                        James Winkler wrote:

                        Ya’ know… I’m also fascinated by the geometry of the pin hinge…   anybody else fascinated by the way the “arm” piece is shaped???

                         

                        Chas.

                        _
                      • Hall, Hayward
                        Good point. My original thougth was that it was simply for added later for security since the pin-hinge could be easily broken. Since another hinge wouldnt
                        Message 11 of 13 , Dec 22 8:28 PM
                          Good point.  My original thougth was that it was simply for added later for security since the pin-hinge could be easily broken.  Since another hinge wouldnt pivot at the same point, the chain/link would allow it to move yet be tight when closed.


                          From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com on behalf of AlbionWood
                          Sent: Sun 12/21/2008 8:29 PM
                          To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] anyone take notes on this?

                          Even stranger, it's in addition to a pin-hinge, therefore completely unnecessary.  The experts undoubtedly know much more about this than I, but... that chest looks in awfully good condition... Why would it have chain-and-link strap hinges, in addition to pin-hinges?  Is a puzzlement.

                          Hall, Hayward wrote:
                          How does that chain-and-link strap hinge work?  What would be the purpose or advantage over a more ridged hinge?  Looks like it would be rather irritating in use.
                           
                          Guillaume
                           
                          www.medievalocity.com
                           
                          
                          ________________________________
                          
                          From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com on behalf of jay sabath
                          Sent: Sun 12/21/2008 2:18 PM
                          To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] anyone take notes on this?
                          
                          
                          Conal,
                          
                          >From my notes:
                          
                          A rare late 14th century oak clamp front chest, with butterfly lockplate and chain and link strap hinges,with til inside, in perfect condition.See ( Die gotischen Truhen der Luneburger Heideloster ) book for identical examples dating to the 1390's and with similar hinges and lockplates.
                          Dimensions: 55.25" wide, 27" deep, 29.25" high
                          
                          
                          Johannes Machiavelli
                          
                          
                          
                          On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 10:02 AM, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart <baronconal@...> wrote:
                          
                          
                          	
                          
                          	anyone remember this chest?
                          	
                          	and take notes on it?
                          	
                          	I didn't.....
                          	
                          	 
                          	Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart 
                          	
                          	Aude Aliquid Dignum 
                          	' Dare Something Worthy ' 
                          
                          
                          	
                          
                          
                          
                          
                            
                        • Alex Flinsch
                          ... It looks like it was designed to allow the lid to be locked into an upright position while the chest is opened. -- Alex / AB2RC My rechargeable batteries
                          Message 12 of 13 , Dec 31 4:53 AM

                            On Dec 22, 2008, at 12:58 AM, James Winkler wrote:

                            Ya’ know… I’m also fascinated by the geometry of the pin hinge…   anybody else fascinated by the way the “arm” piece is shaped???
                             

                            It looks like it was designed to allow the lid to be "locked" into an upright position while the chest is opened.




                            --
                            Alex / AB2RC
                            My rechargeable batteries are revolting.


                          • James Winkler
                            Yea... that s what I was thinking... Don t think I ve ever seen a medieval chest designed to do that... cool... Chas. On Dec 22, 2008, at 12:58 AM, James
                            Message 13 of 13 , Dec 31 9:23 AM
                              Yea...  that's what I was thinking...  Don't think I've ever seen a medieval chest designed to do that...   cool...
                              Chas.
                               

                               






                              On Dec 22, 2008, at 12:58 AM, James Winkler wrote:

                              Ya’ know… I’m also fascinated by the geometry of the pin hinge…   anybody else fascinated by the way the “arm” piece is shaped???
                               

                              It looks like it was designed to allow the lid to be "locked" into an upright position while the chest is opened.




                              --
                              Alex / AB2RC
                              My rechargeable batteries are revolting.



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