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Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

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  • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
    Baron Conal O hAirt / Jim Hart Aude Aliquid Dignum Dare Something Worthy ... From: Eric Hess To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com Sent:
    Message 1 of 26 , Oct 5, 2008
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      Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

      Aude Aliquid Dignum
      ' Dare Something Worthy '


      ----- Original Message ----
      From: Eric Hess <ejhess@...>
      To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Sunday, October 5, 2008 4:01:32 AM
      Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Re: enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

      --- In medievalsawdust@ yahoogroups. com, Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
      <baronconal@ ...> wrote:

      >
      > I've drilled a 1 1/4" hols into the center
      > section of a banner stand, using a spade bit
      > to about 5 inches deep
      >
      > The pole that were purchased for the banner
      > stands are 1 3/8 inch.
      >
      > Easy ideas for enlarging the hole? ( safely
      > and neatly? ) We are only talking about taking
      > off a 1/16 inch around the diameter of the hole.
      > I know it's not that much
      >
      > Looking for something that is not so time
      > consuming that buying new poles is not
      > a better idea....
      >
      > Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart
      >
      > Aude Aliquid Dignum
      > ' Dare Something Worthy '
      >

      Personally, I'd use a router and a circular hole with a guide
      bushing. Double-stick tape it to the top, enlarge the hole, and with
      the newly created large circle, go in with a forstner bit and take it
      to the full size. A pattern bit should do the trick nicely.


    • Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
      as a practical problem.... I could make them over.... Wouldn t be all that hard I just didn t want to waste the centers. Remember I did say easy in the
      Message 2 of 26 , Oct 5, 2008
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        as a practical problem....

        I could make them over.... Wouldn't be all that hard I just
        didn't want to waste the centers.

        Remember I did say 'easy' in the original question. There is
        a threshold for starting over. I'm just wondering if that point
        is where I think it is and was looking for other ideas. Something
        I may not have thought of.

        (  a detail I should have shared )
        I used a larger ( off the top of my head I do not recall the size )
        round-over router bit on the rim of the center hole already so
        there is not sharp edge to used to line up a router bit.

        I think I'm gonna plug the top of the hole and redrill with
        a new flat/spade bit ( I didn't have a 1 3/8" bit anyway so
        this was an excuse to buy a new one )


         
        Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

        Aude Aliquid Dignum
        ' Dare Something Worthy '


        ----- Original Message ----
        From: julian wilson <smnco37@...>
        To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Saturday, October 4, 2008 2:53:56 PM
        Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re:enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

        Um - my time is worth more to me than the cost of a replacement length of Dowelling.
        So, if it was me, as a professional woodworker, I'd either replace the staff dowelling, or make a new banner-base central workpiece.
        However, as a practical problem to solve - and given the equipment I have at my disposal , available in my workshop, - I think I'd set the workpiece up under my floor-standing- pillar-drill, - very carefully "centred" and well clamped in place, and - with the drill running at the kind of slow speed I use for drilling metal, - enlarge first section of the bore with a Forstner bit to the max depth of the bit-shank; - then change to a newly-sharpened flat-bit of the same size, but a long-shank, and finish the boring from the same end with that.
        Enlarging the first section of the bore with a Forstner bit will make lining-up the flat-bit for the second "pass" much easier.
        I certainly wouldn't try enlarging the bore with a hand-held power-tool.
        And the problem I see with trying to use a plunge-router  and a cutter with a bottom bearing is the depth available for the "plunge", plus the second-"set- up" to come at the undersized bore from the other end. Our questioner needed to go to a 5- or 6- inch total depth, IIRC.

        In service to the medieval Dream,
        Matthew Baker
        in the SCA
        [aka Julian Wilson, in 2008]

         


      • logan
        safest bet and sure to yield the best results. regards logan I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell. Harry S Truman
        Message 3 of 26 , Oct 5, 2008
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          safest bet and sure to yield the best results.

           

          regards

          logan

           

          "I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell."
          Harry S Truman

           

          "If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared"

          Niccolo Machiavelli

          www.ebonwoulfe.com


          From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
          Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 2:22 PM
          To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

           

          I've thought of that.... I was hoping to find an easy way to
          alter the hole instead of the pole....

          What do you guys think about plugging the hole
          with a piece of 1 1/4 and re-drilling?

          I'm not very confident about using a 1 3/8 spade bit
          without something for the point to hit and use as a
          'guide' to help keep it from catching and tearing up
          the hole....

           

          Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

          Aude Aliquid Dignum
          ' Dare Something Worthy '

           

           

          ----- Original Message ----
          From: Rebekah d'Avignon <rebekahdavignon@ yahoo.com>
          To: medievalsawdust@ yahoogroups. com
          Sent: Friday, October 3, 2008 1:11:40 PM
          Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

          That would work or you could hold a piece of sandpaper in one hand, wrap it around the end of the pole and turn the pole like sharpening a pencil. 1/16 of an inch isn't much.

          Joseph Paul <josephnjody@ sbcglobal. net> wrote:

          Thin down the poles with a spoke shave and mark "This end up" on the other end.

           

          Jamie Blackrose

          -----Original Message-----
          From: medievalsawdust@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:medievalsaw dust@yahoogroups .com]On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
          Sent: Friday, October 03, 2008 12:16 PM
          To: medievalsawdust@ yahoogroups. com
          Subject: [MedievalSawdust] enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

          I've drilled a 1 1/4" hols into the center
          section of a banner stand, using a spade bit
          to about 5 inches deep

          The pole that were purchased for the banner
          stands are 1 3/8 inch.

          Easy ideas for enlarging the hole? ( safely
          and neatly? ) We are only talking about taking
          off a 1/16 inch around the diameter of the hole.
          I know it's not that much

          Looking for something that is not so time
          consuming that buying new poles is not
          a better idea.... 

           

          Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

          Aude Aliquid Dignum

          ' Dare Something Worthy '



          RdA

          Tools alone do not a craftsman make.

           

        • James Winkler
          Well... let s see: A: highly trained termites B: rat-tail rasp C: *really* careful work with a very narrow chisle D: do that shave the spoke thing... best
          Message 4 of 26 , Oct 5, 2008
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            Well... let's see:
             
            A: highly trained termites
            B: rat-tail rasp
            C: *really* careful work with a very narrow chisle
            D: do that "shave the spoke" thing...  best option in my opinion
            ...
             
            Of course... there is the semi-excessive path of making a thin tapered dowel on the ol' lathe and then doing that sand paper trick (with a hole drilled through the taper so that you can fix a shank in there to mount to your drill press)...
             
            F: A combination of the semi-excessive path followed by careful application of "B" to remove the "hump" that would be left in the center of the bore..
             
            ... ummm HOW thick is the piece you drilled undersized???
             
            G: Laser (... ok... THAT is excessive... but would be cool...)
            H: Ummm...  you could BURN IT with a heated rod of the right size...
            I:  Use a twist bit and REAL careful centering of a well secured workpiece.   Center by mounting the original drill bit in the drill...  insert in existing hole...  clamp... remove existing... insert twist drill...  bore...
             
            ... 'about all I can come up with at the moment...
             
            ... of course, you could always accidently misplace the original piece and simply remake it... ;-)
             
            J:  Ummm...  you could PLUG the orginal holes (glue in the plug)... and THEN re-drill...
             
            ... nope... that's about it...  I'm kinda' out of ideas at this point... 
             
            K:  you could...  ummm... nope... that wouldn't work...  never mind...
             
             
             
            Chas.
          • Wolf
            On Sun, 2008-10-05 at 12:42 -0500, James Winkler wrote: ... What, a small thermo-nuclear device? That d work, but if you mis-calculate just a tiny bit,
            Message 5 of 26 , Oct 5, 2008
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              On Sun, 2008-10-05 at 12:42 -0500, James Winkler wrote:

              <snip>
              >
              > K: you could... ummm... nope... that wouldn't work... never mind...
              >
              >
              >
              > Chas.
              >

              What, a small thermo-nuclear device? That'd work, but if you
              mis-calculate just a tiny bit, all you'd end up with is glow-in-the-dark
              toothpicks...
            • Royce
              That d be real cool. I d buy those.. You can never find a good toothpick late at night when ya reeeaaaalllly need one. Bercilak From:
              Message 6 of 26 , Oct 5, 2008
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                That’d be real cool…

                 

                I’d buy those..  You can never find a good toothpick late at night when ya reeeaaaalllly need one…

                 

                Bercilak

                 

                 

                From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wolf
                Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 7:08 PM
                To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

                 

                On Sun, 2008-10-05 at 12:42 -0500, James Winkler wrote:

                <snip>

                >
                > K: you could... ummm... nope... that wouldn't work... never mind...
                >
                >
                >
                > Chas.
                >

                What, a small thermo-nuclear device? That'd work, but if you
                mis-calculate just a tiny bit, all you'd end up with is glow-in-the-dark
                toothpicks...

              • James Winkler
                mind reader!!! ;-) Chas. ================== On Sun, 2008-10-05 at 12:42 -0500, James Winkler wrote: ... What, a small thermo-nuclear device? That d
                Message 7 of 26 , Oct 5, 2008
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                  … mind reader!!!     ;-)

                   

                  Chas.

                  ==================

                  On Sun, 2008-10-05 at 12:42 -0500, James Winkler wrote:

                  <snip>

                  >
                  > K: you could... ummm... nope... that wouldn't work... never mind...
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Chas.
                  >

                  What, a small thermo-nuclear device? That'd work, but if you
                  mis-calculate just a tiny bit, all you'd end up with is glow-in-the-dark
                  toothpicks...

                   

                • Ted Kocot
                  Just so I know, is this end grain we re cutting? Is it through or stopped? If you have a bit of the right size, I d kind of use your idea, only I d cut a kerf
                  Message 8 of 26 , Oct 6, 2008
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                    Just so I know, is this end grain we're cutting? Is it through or
                    stopped?

                    If you have a bit of the right size, I'd kind of use your idea, only
                    I'd cut a kerf in the end of my piece of dowel (and drill a hole
                    though the bottom) and then attach this plug to my drill bit. It will
                    have to be pretty carefully centered but it will save you having to
                    drill out all that wood twice.

                    If you don't have the drill bit, what I would try is making something
                    like a scratch stock out of a cheap Xacto-gouge blade and a piece of
                    one inch dowel.

                    Avery
                  • Alessandro dEste
                    ... Chas could you exsplain this. Sandro
                    Message 9 of 26 , Oct 6, 2008
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                      --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, James Winkler <jrwinkler@...>
                      wrote:

                      > D: do that "shave the spoke" thing... best option in my opinion
                      > ...

                      > Chas.
                      >

                      Chas could you exsplain this.
                      Sandro
                    • James Winkler
                      ;-) The spoke shave thing I refered to was basically using a spoke shave to taper the ends of the dowels to fit the existing holes rather than enlarging
                      Message 10 of 26 , Oct 6, 2008
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                        ;-)    The “spoke shave thing” I refered to was basically using a spoke shave to taper the ends of the dowels to fit the existing holes rather than enlarging the holes…   (-:    Not exactly the desired form of solution… but a practical one none the less…

                         

                        Commercial tapered reamers *might* be useful… but most of them I’ve seen have a relatively sever taper…  my suggestion  for turning a taper was to make it gentle enough that, by working from both sides of the plank, you’d have minimal material in the center to remove  (running a taper in from both sides of the hole would create a bit of an “hourglass” effect on the hole.  

                         

                        Chas.

                         

                        ==================

                        > D: do that "shave the spoke" thing... best option in my opinion
                        > ...

                        > Chas.
                        >

                        Chas could you exsplain this.
                        Sandro

                         

                      • Bill Schongar (bschonga)
                        Use a 1 drum sander chucked in a drill or a drill press. Or if you have some of the old pole, glue it into the old hole and then redrill. -Liam
                        Message 11 of 26 , Oct 6, 2008
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                          Use a 1" drum sander chucked in a drill or a drill press.
                           
                          Or if you have some of the "old" pole, glue it into the old hole and then redrill.
                           
                          -Liam
                           
                           
                           


                          From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart
                          Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 8:10 AM
                          To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re:enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

                          as a practical problem....

                          I could make them over.... Wouldn't be all that hard I just
                          didn't want to waste the centers.

                          Remember I did say 'easy' in the original question. There is
                          a threshold for starting over. I'm just wondering if that point
                          is where I think it is and was looking for other ideas. Something
                          I may not have thought of.

                          (  a detail I should have shared )
                          I used a larger ( off the top of my head I do not recall the size )
                          round-over router bit on the rim of the center hole already so
                          there is not sharp edge to used to line up a router bit.

                          I think I'm gonna plug the top of the hole and redrill with
                          a new flat/spade bit ( I didn't have a 1 3/8" bit anyway so
                          this was an excuse to buy a new one )


                           
                          Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

                          Aude Aliquid Dignum
                          ' Dare Something Worthy '


                          ----- Original Message ----
                          From: julian wilson <smnco37@yahoo. co.uk>
                          To: medievalsawdust@ yahoogroups. com
                          Sent: Saturday, October 4, 2008 2:53:56 PM
                          Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re:enlarging a 1 1/4 inch hole

                          Um - my time is worth more to me than the cost of a replacement length of Dowelling.
                          So, if it was me, as a professional woodworker, I'd either replace the staff dowelling, or make a new banner-base central workpiece.
                          However, as a practical problem to solve - and given the equipment I have at my disposal , available in my workshop, - I think I'd set the workpiece up under my floor-standing- pillar-drill, - very carefully "centred" and well clamped in place, and - with the drill running at the kind of slow speed I use for drilling metal, - enlarge first section of the bore with a Forstner bit to the max depth of the bit-shank; - then change to a newly-sharpened flat-bit of the same size, but a long-shank, and finish the boring from the same end with that.
                          Enlarging the first section of the bore with a Forstner bit will make lining-up the flat-bit for the second "pass" much easier.
                          I certainly wouldn't try enlarging the bore with a hand-held power-tool.
                          And the problem I see with trying to use a plunge-router  and a cutter with a bottom bearing is the depth available for the "plunge", plus the second-"set- up" to come at the undersized bore from the other end. Our questioner needed to go to a 5- or 6- inch total depth, IIRC.

                          In service to the medieval Dream,
                          Matthew Baker
                          in the SCA
                          [aka Julian Wilson, in 2008]


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