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Re: [medieval-leather] Re: More hardening/treating stuff

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  • scout18
    Gday dunx, if you have access to creatures to make leather from then you may want to set up a tannery and do it yourself. maybe some brain dressed leather the
    Message 1 of 14 , Jul 8, 2002
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      Gday dunx, if you have access to creatures to make leather from then you may want to set up a tannery and do it yourself. maybe some brain dressed leather the way the north american natives went about it. Just a thought. Maybe make useful stuff from the chromed tanned and sell or trade for good veg. tanned.
    • Ron Charlotte
      ... Sad to say, the chrome tan process is pretty much designed to produce leather that doesn t get hard and stiff easily. You can boil the stuff and it stays
      Message 2 of 14 , Jul 8, 2002
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        At 10:56 AM 7/9/02 +1200, Dunx wrote:


        >I don't have any better ideas, though, as I have never heard of anyone
        >successfully hardening chrome-tanned leather.

        Has anyone? If it's been tried and failed, then I'd love to know so that I
        can reconsider my options on this (and tell my fellow leatherworkers here
        about it).

        Sad to say, the chrome tan process is pretty much designed to produce leather that doesn't get hard and stiff  easily.  You can boil the stuff and it stays pretty much as it is (that's one of the tests for chrome tan, when you can't tell because it's been dyed through).  Anything that makes it stiff and dense enough generally makes it either brittle, or the rivets just rip through the leather quickly.

        For what you want to do, the best use for chrome leather is making a coat of plates, using the leather to carry the plates.  Otherwise, unless it's really thick leather, lamellae is just not going to happen.


                 Ron Charlotte -- Gainesville, FL
                 ronch2@... OR afn03234@...

      • Bogue
        ... Hi folks, The reason Dunx uses chrome tanned is because that s what he s got. In the great economically depressed state of us unemployed in NZ we find
        Message 3 of 14 , Jul 8, 2002
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          At 10:39 AM 7/9/02, you wrote:
          >Message: 5
          > Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 07:55:37 +0200
          > From: Neil Carr <neil@...>
          >Subject: Re: More hardening/treating stuff
          >
          >Dunx wrote:
          >
          > > I'm playing around with a saucepan of soya oil (go figure - I'm broke) and
          > > boiling away at scraps of chrome-tanned leather (presuming so, anyway - the
          > > pieces have a distinctive grey core layer between the flesh and grain
          > > surfaces...). This creates a hardened edge with a still-flexible middle,
          > > depending on how long you cook it.
          > > ...
          > > Any ideas? Comments? Loving this hobby...
          > >
          > > Dunx
          > >
          >
          >"Why totture yourself" indeed? Start with veg-tan, rather than chrome, and
          >then you
          >can harden the lamellae with hot water. Would work best for the frogs, too.
          >Thomas


          Hi folks,

          The reason Dunx uses chrome tanned is because that's what he's got.
          In the great economically depressed state of us unemployed in NZ we find
          suitable vege tanned leather to be $120.00 a square metre which is far too
          expensive.
          Hey Dunx do what Dawson does and soak it in hot wax. Seems to work in most
          cases.
          When are you Norse boys coming down for a bash.
          Mail me off list. I might have a deal for ya.

          Bogue the Raven.
          Evermore.
        • scout18
          A coat oflates is good idea for you. I have seen several and they are very functional and can be made to look very nice.
          Message 4 of 14 , Jul 8, 2002
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            A coat oflates is good idea for you. I have seen several and they are very functional and can be made to look very nice.
          • Scott Szakonyi
            One of the huge byproducts of any leatherworkers is scrap. That s something I have many pounds of. I m willing to deal with you, but I suspect shipping from
            Message 5 of 14 , Jul 9, 2002
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              One of the huge byproducts of any leatherworkers is scrap.  That's something I have many pounds of.  I'm willing to deal with you, but I suspect shipping from the US might prove prohibitive.  Still, the offer stands.

              Scott

              http://www.thevikingtrader.net

                Dunx <dunx@...> wrote:


              >"Why totture yourself" indeed? Start with veg-tan, rather than chrome, and
              >then you can harden the lamellae with hot water. Would work best for the
              >frogs, too.
              >Thomas

              Wishing I had veg-tan. Lamentably, with my minimal income, my barter has
              thus far only scored me lots of chrome. The only veg-tan I have is in thin
              strips - not much use for armor....

              >>Any ideas? Comments? Loving this hobby...
              >I'm curious why you are using oil, which is usually used to *soften*
              >leather, not harden it.  I think what is happening is that you are simply
              >boiling the water out of the leather  - in other words, drying it - and
              >that's what is giving you the hard edges.

              Ah - that could be it.

              >I don't have any better ideas, though, as I have never heard of anyone
              >successfully hardening chrome-tanned leather.

              Has anyone? If it's been tried and failed, then I'd love to know so that I
              can reconsider my options on this (and tell my fellow leatherworkers here
              about it).

              >Have you tried soaking it
              >in paraffin wax?  Might stiffen it somewhat.

              Would that I had access to wax at present.

              >Probably easier just to make new lamellae out of veg-tanned and harden them!

              Damn straight - now anyone know where I can get dirt-cheap sheets of
              veg-tan in New Zealand? :o)

              Dunx
              wondering if he shouldn't be tanning stuff himself
              and realising that an apartment block is not the best place to set up a
              tannery...


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            • robertgarnettnzl@netscape.net
              Hi All, ... The short answer is you can t. The longer answer is if you can wonder around garage sales, second hand shops and flea markets you can sometimes get
              Message 6 of 14 , Jul 9, 2002
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                Hi All,

                >Damn straight - now anyone know where I can get dirt-cheap sheets of
                >veg-tan in New Zealand? :o)

                The short answer is you can't. The longer answer is if you can wonder around garage sales, second hand shops and flea markets you can sometimes get some real bargains. I got a half hide for $5 last week.

                Duncan Kerr.
                Barony of Southron Gaard.
                Caid.


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              • robertgarnettnzl@netscape.net
                Hi All, ... We complain about $12-20 squire foot you guys should come down here and do some leather shopping. Duncan Kerr. Barony of Southron Gaard. Caid. Aka
                Message 7 of 14 , Jul 9, 2002
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                  Hi All,

                  >The reason Dunx uses chrome tanned is because that's what he's got.
                  >In the great economically depressed state of us unemployed in NZ we find
                  >suitable vege tanned leather to be $120.00 a square metre which is far too expensive.

                  We complain about $12-20 squire foot you guys should come down here and do some leather shopping.

                  Duncan Kerr.
                  Barony of Southron Gaard.
                  Caid.
                  Aka
                  Robert Garnett
                  Christchurch
                  New Zealand.


                  __________________________________________________________________
                  Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/

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                • Neil Carr
                  ... Unless I m mistaken, 1 sq. m almost is 11 sq. feet so $12-20/sq. ft translates from almost $130 to $220/sq. m. Maybe you should be going up there (it s
                  Message 8 of 14 , Jul 9, 2002
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                    robertgarnettnzl@... wrote:

                    > Hi All,
                    >
                    > >The reason Dunx uses chrome tanned is because that's what he's got.
                    > >In the great economically depressed state of us unemployed in NZ we find
                    > >suitable vege tanned leather to be $120.00 a square metre which is far too expensive.
                    >
                    > We complain about $12-20 squire foot you guys should come down here and do some leather shopping.
                    >

                    Unless I'm mistaken, 1 sq. m almost is 11 sq. feet
                    so $12-20/sq. ft translates from almost $130 to $220/sq. m.

                    Maybe you should be going up there (it's the same dollar N & S, yes)?

                    Thomas
                    --
                    Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
                    Ah..I miss the good old days when childrens films were designed to scare them into submission instead of sell action figures.
                    --Poster on SDMB
                  • Adam Smith
                    I think this should be put into a bit of perspective; the NZ and Australian dollar are equivalent to about 50 - 57 cents US or 75 - 85 cents Canadian.
                    Message 9 of 14 , Jul 9, 2002
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                      I think this should be put into a bit of perspective; the NZ and Australian dollar are equivalent to about 50 - 57 cents US or 75 - 85 cents Canadian. Translated, this puts the veg at $6-10 a sq. ft. US, which, while a little pricey, is not completely out of line for finer veg.
                       
                      cheers,
                      Adam
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 5:12 PM
                      Subject: RE: [medieval-leather] Re: More hardening/treating stuff

                      Hi All,

                      >The reason Dunx uses chrome tanned is because that's what he's got.
                      >In the great economically depressed state of us unemployed in NZ we find
                      >suitable vege tanned leather to be $120.00 a square metre which is far too expensive.

                      We complain about $12-20 squire foot you guys should come down here and do some leather shopping.

                      Duncan Kerr.
                      Barony of Southron Gaard.
                      Caid.
                      Aka
                      Robert Garnett
                      Christchurch
                      New Zealand.
                    • Grooby, Peter
                      ... $12/sq foot would be expensive. The last vege tanned stuff I got at the local CHCH store Lapco was $6/sq foot. Which is about $65/sq m Vitale
                      Message 10 of 14 , Jul 9, 2002
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                        > Subject: Re: Re: More hardening/treating stuff
                        >
                        > robertgarnettnzl@... wrote:
                        >
                        > > Hi All,
                        > >
                        > > >The reason Dunx uses chrome tanned is because that's what he's got.
                        > > >In the great economically depressed state of us unemployed in NZ we
                        > find
                        > > >suitable vege tanned leather to be $120.00 a square metre which is far
                        > too expensive.
                        > >
                        > > We complain about $12-20 squire foot you guys should come down here and
                        > do some leather shopping.
                        > >
                        >
                        > Unless I'm mistaken, 1 sq. m almost is 11 sq. feet
                        > so $12-20/sq. ft translates from almost $130 to $220/sq. m.
                        >
                        > Maybe you should be going up there (it's the same dollar N & S, yes)?
                        >
                        $12/sq foot would be expensive.

                        The last vege tanned stuff I got at the local CHCH store Lapco was
                        $6/sq foot.
                        Which is about $65/sq m

                        Vitale


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