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[medieval-leather] Re:REMOVE

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  • Jani & Shani International
    ... there are more than one wooden 8th century box from Orkney?) while looking up info on the Orkney Hood for my wife.  Unfortunately, I didn t copy either
    Message 1 of 13 , Dec 27, 1998
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      At 10:31 AM 12/26/99 -0600, you wrote:
      >Tarrach here.  I ran across the paper on this box last year (unless
      there are more than one wooden 8th century box from Orkney?) while looking up info on the Orkney Hood for my wife.  Unfortunately, I didn't copy either the paper and we seem to have misplaced the photocopy of the citation.  I know there is a picture of the reconstructed Orkney hood in: Foster S. (1996) Picts, Gaels and Scots.  B.T. Batsford Ltd., London which I assume will have the citation for the paper.  The box is in the same journal volume as the Orkney hood.  However, now for the bad news.  As I recall, the only thing left in the box was the wooden handles (no metal remains), and it was speculated that they were wood working or leather working tools based on handle shape.  It is however a nice paper to demonstrate early wood carving (with celtic spiral motifs) on small tool boxes. 
      >
      >>>> <jamesahowell@...> 12/24/99 12:24AM >>>
      > Greetings Fellow Leather Workers!
      >  I ran across something tonight while cleaning up in my attic
      (always a
      >dangerous occupation), and I thought I would post it and see if
      anyone
      >knows anything about it.  What I found was a photocopy page, from a
      book
      >I believe is titled _Celtic Art_.  The page is a captioned picture of
      a
      >wooden slide topped box, top missing with scroll work on the sides. 
      The
      >caption reads,
      >" CARVED WOODEN BOX
      >Birsay (Orkney), Scotland,
      >United Kingdom
      >8th-10th century AD
      >It contained the tools of
      >a leatherworker.
      >Length: 30 cm.
      >Royal Museum of Scotland,
      >Edinburgh."
      >
      > Does anyone know anything about this box, and of course, more to
      the
      >point, what it contained?  I would love to be able to replicate a
      Norse
      >leather worker's tool kit accurately.  Heck, I'd just love to know
      what
      >kind of tools they used-this is as close as I've come to finding info
      on
      >Norse leather working tools.
      >         Regards, James
      >
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    • Jani & Shani International
      ... books ... and ... pottery ... These ... looked ... books. ... really ... 1/2 , ... off ... Anglo-Scandinavian ... 17/6 ... extremely ... decorated ... her
      Message 2 of 13 , Dec 27, 1998
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        At 12:18 PM 12/26/99 -0500, you wrote:
        >>  A page size and number might help. Some of us have a number of
        books
        >> entitled Celtic Art. Bain's Book on celtic knotwork and Ruth
        and
        >> Vincent Megaw's books among others. The last incidentally has
        pottery
        >> replicas of a Celtic shoe and boot in it on different pages.
        These
        >> have stamped decoration btw. Some of the books are buried, I
        looked
        >> at several briefly. But that is a common title for various
        books.
        >>
        > Page 140, the pages appear to be about ten inches tall, can't
        really
        >tell how wide they are other than more than a little wider than 8
        1/2",
        >because the pages more or less fit on copier paper, but the edges run
        off
        >of the paper.
        >
        >> As far as tools go there is a bunch of them in
        Anglo-Scandinavian
        >> Ironwork from Coppergate - Archaeology of York - The Small Finds
        17/6
        >> including needles, awls and creasers. There is also an
        extremely
        >> good bit on medieval locks in it. By Patrick Ottaway. There are
        >> punches
        >> but they appear to be for metalwork as they don't have
        decorated
        >> ends and many are laminated steel and wrought iron.
        >>
        > Thanks Magnus, I have a friend who owns that one, I'll have to get
        her
        >to loan it to me.
        > Regards, James
        >
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      • jamesahowell@juno.com
        ... Page 140, the pages appear to be about ten inches tall, can t really tell how wide they are other than more than a little wider than 8 1/2 , because the
        Message 3 of 13 , Dec 26, 1999
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          > A page size and number might help. Some of us have a number of books
          > entitled Celtic Art. Bain's Book on celtic knotwork and Ruth and
          > Vincent Megaw's books among others. The last incidentally has pottery
          > replicas of a Celtic shoe and boot in it on different pages. These
          > have stamped decoration btw. Some of the books are buried, I looked
          > at several briefly. But that is a common title for various books.
          >
          Page 140, the pages appear to be about ten inches tall, can't really
          tell how wide they are other than more than a little wider than 8 1/2",
          because the pages more or less fit on copier paper, but the edges run off
          of the paper.

          > As far as tools go there is a bunch of them in Anglo-Scandinavian
          > Ironwork from Coppergate - Archaeology of York - The Small Finds 17/6
          > including needles, awls and creasers. There is also an extremely
          > good bit on medieval locks in it. By Patrick Ottaway. There are
          > punches
          > but they appear to be for metalwork as they don't have decorated
          > ends and many are laminated steel and wrought iron.
          >
          Thanks Magnus, I have a friend who owns that one, I'll have to get her
          to loan it to me.
          Regards, James
        • David Horvath
          Hi! Tarrach here. I checked out the info on the Orkney hood on the net and found the reference I was looking for. It is: Proceedings of the Society of
          Message 4 of 13 , Dec 27, 1999
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            Hi! Tarrach here. I checked out the info on the Orkney hood on the net and found the reference I was looking for. It is: Proceedings of the Society of Antiquaries of Scotland vol. 86. I still don't know the page number of the artical on the box, but I am pretty sure it is in the same volume.
          • jamesahowell@juno.com
            ... Strangely, enough, I believe I have a copy of the stuff on the Orkney Hood, but the section I have is just textile finds-nothing at all about the box. If
            Message 5 of 13 , Dec 27, 1999
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              > Hi! Tarrach here. I checked out the info on the Orkney hood on the
              > net and found the reference I was looking for. It is: Proceedings
              > of the Society of Antiquaries of Scotland vol. 86. I still don't
              > know the page number of the artical on the box, but I am pretty sure
              > it is in the same volume.
              >
              Strangely, enough, I believe I have a copy of the stuff on the Orkney
              Hood, but the section I have is just textile finds-nothing at all about
              the box. If you are going off of the article listed above (From the
              early fifties) I was informed a couple of years ago that the Orkney Hood
              had been carbon dated after the article was written and dated to the
              Bronze Age. I would give you more specifics, but that particular book of
              mine is out on loan right now. Let me know if you need further info and
              I'll get it back.
              Regards, Finnr
            • David Horvath
              Opps! seems I have miss-comunicated. The paper discussing the box is not in the same article as the orkney hood but rather in the same Volume of the
              Message 6 of 13 , Dec 28, 1999
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                Opps! seems I have miss-comunicated. The paper discussing the box is not in the same article as the orkney hood but rather in the same Volume of the Proceedings of the Society of Antiquaries of Scotland that the paper on the Orkney hood is in. (yes, the one 1951-52). Actually I had heard that the Orkney hood was recently carbon dated (thanks to Thora Sharptooth!) with dates between 250 and 615 AD.

                Hope this clears this bit up :-)

                Tarrach
                >>> <jamesahowell@...> 12/27/99 12:47PM >>>
                > Hi! Tarrach here. I checked out the info on the Orkney hood on the
                > net and found the reference I was looking for. It is: Proceedings
                > of the Society of Antiquaries of Scotland vol. 86. I still don't
                > know the page number of the artical on the box, but I am pretty sure
                > it is in the same volume.
                >
                Strangely, enough, I believe I have a copy of the stuff on the Orkney
                Hood, but the section I have is just textile finds-nothing at all about
                the box. If you are going off of the article listed above (From the
                early fifties) I was informed a couple of years ago that the Orkney Hood
                had been carbon dated after the article was written and dated to the
                Bronze Age. I would give you more specifics, but that particular book of
                mine is out on loan right now. Let me know if you need further info and
                I'll get it back.
                Regards, Finnr



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              • jamesahowell@juno.com
                ... No, I understood that it was not the same article but the same volume. I was given a copy of the article by a friend of mine some time ago-I just didn t
                Message 7 of 13 , Dec 28, 1999
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                  > Opps! seems I have miss-comunicated. The paper discussing the box is
                  > not in the same article as the orkney hood but rather in the same
                  > Volume of the Proceedings of the Society of Antiquaries of Scotland
                  > that the paper on the Orkney hood is in. (yes, the one 1951-52).
                  > Actually I had heard that the Orkney hood was recently carbon dated
                  > (thanks to Thora Sharptooth!) with dates between 250 and 615 AD.
                  >
                  > Hope this clears this bit up :-)
                  >
                  No, I understood that it was not the same article but the same volume.
                  I was given a copy of the article by a friend of mine some time ago-I
                  just didn't have the rest of that volume (rats!).
                  Thora, can you shed more light on the dating issue of the hood? I
                  received my Bronze age date from a source that I have been given reason
                  to believe is not as reliable as one might wish. Also, do you know if
                  the Rogart Tunic has ever been reliably dated (same article)?
                  Regards, Finnr the ever Curious
                • Mike Fuchs
                  Message 8 of 13 , May 22, 2000
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                    >>> advancesportsinfo.com@... 05/22/00 05:00AM >>>
                  • Whitney Dickinson
                    ... From: advancesportsinfo.com@sportsmail.com [mailto:advancesportsinfo.com@sportsmail.com] Sent: Monday, May 22, 2000 3:01 AM Subject: [medieval-leather]
                    Message 9 of 13 , May 22, 2000
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                      Subject: [medieval-leather] Advance Sports Infformation Newsletter- 05/15/00

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