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Re: [medieval-leather] Ebay shoes

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  • R Lutz
    Well, the seller merely says EVOCATIVE OF THE MEDIEVAL PERIOD, not FROM THE MEDIEVAL PERIOD. Although he clearly tries to create that impression. He is sailing
    Message 1 of 9 , Apr 11, 2005
      Well, the seller merely says EVOCATIVE OF THE MEDIEVAL PERIOD, not FROM THE
      MEDIEVAL PERIOD.

      Although he clearly tries to create that impression. He is sailing very
      close to the wind !



      Rudi



      ----- Original Message -----
      From: <glendarob@...>
      To: <medieval-leather@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Monday, April 11, 2005 2:33 PM
      Subject: Re: [medieval-leather] Ebay shoes


      >
      > A professionally conserved leather piece from the 14th-15th century with a
      starting bid of 99p? If it were true, it'd be a bargain!
      >
      > There's an ooooold saying... Caveat Emptor.
      >
      > Glenda.
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Marc Carlson
      > To: medieval-leather@yahoogroups.com
      > Sent: Monday, April 11, 2005 11:25 PM
      > Subject: [medieval-leather] Ebay shoes
      >
      >
      >
      > Someone sent me this link this moening:
      > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7314415505
      >
      > Rather than the typical Marc rant on the evils of buying leather
      > artifact, I just thought I'd mention that I'm pretty sure these aren't
      > medieval :) (I.e. don't believe everything you pay for).
      >
      > Marc
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Links
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
    • Phlip
      Ene bichizh ogsen baina shuu... ... Looks to me like we have another burgeoning rip-off artist. We have a few who are trying to sell antique smithing tools ,
      Message 2 of 9 , Apr 11, 2005
        Ene bichizh ogsen baina shuu...

        > Someone sent me this link this moening:
        > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7314415505
        >
        > Rather than the typical Marc rant on the evils of buying leather
        > artifact, I just thought I'd mention that I'm pretty sure these aren't
        > medieval :) (I.e. don't believe everything you pay for).
        >
        > Marc

        Looks to me like we have another burgeoning rip-off artist. We have a few
        who are trying to sell "antique smithing tools", although the one that's
        particularly awful does a wonderful job of implying the tools are (pre)
        "Civil War antiques" without actually saying so.

        Any place there's money, there's a thief or a scammer.

        This particular shoe looks to me like one someone made recently, and maybe
        left in the back yard for a week or two.

        Saint Phlip,
        CoD

        "When in doubt, heat it up and hit it with a hammer."
        Blacksmith's credo.

        If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it is probably not a
        cat.

        Never a horse that cain't be rode,
        And never a rider who cain't be throwed....



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      • Marc Carlson
        ... Based on the other stuff that they are selling, I think they just are trying to make their stuff sound cooler, as opposed to actively scamming people --
        Message 3 of 9 , Apr 11, 2005
          --- In medieval-leather@yahoogroups.com, "Phlip" <phlip@9...> wrote:
          > Looks to me like we have another burgeoning rip-off artist...

          Based on the other stuff that they are selling, I think they just are
          trying to make their stuff sound cooler, as opposed to actively
          scamming people -- but then aI'm just trying to be optimistic :)

          Marc
        • Tim Bray
          You overlooked the title - Ultra rare MEDIEVAL Leather Child s Shoe And the caption - 14th - 15th Century And Rare and Complete Piece of MEDIEVAL Costume
          Message 4 of 9 , Apr 12, 2005
            You overlooked the title - "Ultra rare MEDIEVAL Leather Child's Shoe"
            And the caption - "14th - 15th Century"
            And "Rare and Complete Piece of MEDIEVAL Costume"

            Either the seller has been deceived, or is engaging in deception. No
            hair-splitting!

            At 02:46 PM 4/11/2005 +0100, you wrote:

            >Well, the seller merely says EVOCATIVE OF THE MEDIEVAL PERIOD, not FROM THE
            >MEDIEVAL PERIOD.
            >
            >Although he clearly tries to create that impression. He is sailing very
            >close to the wind !


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Marc Carlson
            ... Indeed. I will say that Evocative of the period is a good choice since it could mean that it s from the period and is evoking that essence, or simply
            Message 5 of 9 , Apr 12, 2005
              --- In medieval-leather@yahoogroups.com, "R Lutz" <rudilutz@y...> wrote:
              > Well, the seller merely says EVOCATIVE OF THE MEDIEVAL PERIOD, not
              > FROM THE MEDIEVAL PERIOD.
              > Although he clearly tries to create that impression. He is sailing
              > very close to the wind !

              Indeed. I will say that "Evocative of the period" is a good choice
              since it could mean that it's from the period and is evoking that
              essence, or simply that it looks lke it could be. However, with the
              description of "medieval" and "14th-15th century" I think it's pretty
              clear we are meant to assume that this was from the period.

              The more I look at it, the more I wish I could see it in person.
              These pictures reek. I like the overall shape of the shoe and the
              sole. It's a nice looking job, all in all.

              Marc
            • rmhowe
              ... A lot of the stuff coming out of the Netherlands currently is from backyard rubbish piles, which were huge and not all that pleasant to think about what
              Message 6 of 9 , Apr 19, 2005
                Marc Carlson wrote:

                >
                > Someone sent me this link this moening:
                > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7314415505
                >
                > Rather than the typical Marc rant on the evils of buying leather
                > artifact, I just thought I'd mention that I'm pretty sure these aren't
                > medieval :) (I.e. don't believe everything you pay for).
                >
                > Marc

                A lot of the stuff coming out of the Netherlands currently is from
                backyard rubbish piles, which were huge and not all that pleasant
                to think about what they were dug out of. Most of the stuff though
                is coming from the Balkans area currently, with some from Germany
                and Britain. I've seen some leather belts recently with a Raleigh
                dealer here from the Netherlands.

                By the way, nearly everything
                oriental you see these days is fake - particulary Chinese objects.
                Arrowheads, coins, locks, etc. Even bone objects in resin that is
                expertly antiqued sometimes with multiple patinas.
                I've collected oriental cash coins and tokens for nearly thirty
                five years and some of it fooled me at first until I began looking
                at it very closely and weighing the known gram weights for the
                silver coins. If you simply like the item buy it but don't expect
                it to be genuine anymore. They have flooded the market with high
                quality fakes of rare objects. It is very hard to differentiate
                real from fakes now. They cast from original objects and a pile
                of fakes will have multiple patinas on them. I'm beginning to
                think I'll have to see multiple layers of flaking copper oxides
                to be able to be certain it is genuine. I will say that mainland
                China and Japan dealers deliver extremely quickly. Like five
                days from Beijing. It takes weeks or months usually from Europe.

                A whole lot of eBay stuff in the antiquities section is misdescribed,
                wrongly attributed deliberately, really hyped up in descriptions.
                Sometimes they are off by a number of centuries.
                I highly suggest importing the photos and running them through
                a photo editor to view the details before bidding or buying.

                Two shipments I've
                bought from England have simply disappeared enroute or were deliberately
                not sent. I know three of us in Raleigh have had trouble with Elkins
                with items not arriving. I've got a dispute going with him currently
                via ebay.uk. Insured shipment I haven't even gotten my money back for.
                Won't reply to me or so far through eBay. In my experience the eBay/
                PayPal guarantee looks good but produces very little in refunds.
                I've bought a couple hundred auction lots and have been screwed
                on three. Two in England and one guy in Pennsylvania I am going to
                look up when I get back to Pittsburg. I probably won't get to
                Britain in the next seven years.

                Magnus, who does frequent those sellers but does not collect the
                sacred leather items.

                Incidentally if you search sussen for eBay dealers you will find some
                fairly nice damascus sax knife and dagger blades. Made in India
                but with about seventy layers in each. They take a good edge.
                I'm not sure how well it will last but I could shave the back of
                my hand with the Saxe knife when I got done honing it.
                You might care to build your own knife. These are less than half
                the price of western made damascus blades.
                I've bought two nice ones from him to handle and make the sheathes
                for. His stock changes but keep an eye on it. My other was a huge
                double edged dagger blade. Very well done. Shipped with dull edges
                so expect to do some sharpening. Seller is reliable.

                Many of the swords now on eBay that look like Windlass Steel
                Crafts/Museum Replicas are apparently being copied by someone
                else with substantially less quality, not that MR is always
                good - they have some clunkers and some nice items. I'd have
                to say I liked them better when they were selling Del Tin items.

                By the way, there is an absolutely excellent set of archaeological
                journals called the Bonner Jahrbuchs. I have bought three so far
                and they average over 700 pages. Numbers 190 and 195 contain
                extensive information on European Medieval Mirrors with many
                types I have never seen before in wood, metal and ivory/bone.
                One of them had information on medieval shoes from some
                excavation. Can't remember which just now. If they exist at a university
                near you I believe you would spend many days looking through a
                set and be well rewarded, even if the majority of the articles
                is in German. The British Museum told a friend of mine in England
                about my interest in mirrors and they sent partial bits of the
                large articles, and my friend had parts of them translated for
                me. But the two books contain about 120+ pages on them in
                addition to many other things. I wish I had access to the
                whole set because they do include leather items.
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