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Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read the entire line at once?

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  • Karey Carbaugh
    Thanks John, Steve, and the others who have responded. I will mention this idea of a video camera conversion to OCR image. I suspect he will not be open to a
    Message 1 of 19 , Apr 29, 2002
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      Thanks John, Steve, and the others who have responded.
      I will mention this idea of a video camera conversion to OCR image. I
      suspect he will not be open to a word at a time if he isn't open to half
      the line at a time. His biggest concern is that if he cannot read the
      volume of documentation at a glance, as I understand it, he may be at risk
      of loosing his business that he owns which requires mountains of paper
      reading. These are all very good suggestions though which I will certainly
      pass along, as well as others if any come up.

      Thank you,
      Have a great day
      Karey

      Karey Carbaugh
      Project Manager
      IBM Global Services
      Boulder, CO 80301
      Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
      e-mail: Karey@...


      jn@... on 04/29/2002 03:46:00 PM

      Please respond to magnifiers@yahoogroups.com

      To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
      cc: jn@...
      Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
      the entire line at once?



      Hello again, Karey,

      Rather than a scanner, he could use a high-quality digital camera to
      photograph each whole page with an electronic image in memory, and then
      apply OCR to the image. Once the text is in electronic text form,
      there are many ways he could read it, but the fastest way would be
      using a rapid reader such as WordAloud. As his sight deteriorates
      he will be able to take in fewer words at a glance. He can continue
      to use WordAloud if his sight goes completely, because of the speech mode,
      which is good psychologically. There is no new hurdle to leap over.

      BTW, WordAloud has some skimming features - you can jump from
      sentence to sentence, paragraph to paragraph and heading to heading.

      Cheers,

      John
      --
      In message <OF8C29BE2F.2214639B-ON87256BAA.00546789@...>
      "Karey Carbaugh" writes:
      >
      >Thanks John and Laurie for your quick replies.
      >
      >I mentioned the idea of scanning in the documents that he needs to read.
      >The problem as he explained it to me is that he is the president of a
      small
      >company and reads several hundred pages a day and would be unable to scan
      >them all in to read them. I got the impression that he needs to visually
      >scan (or skim) the text and therefore needs to be able to visually "see"
      >the entire line at once. Where a normal sighted person can skim nearly a
      >whole page at once, he is interested in at least seeing a whole line at
      >once. Anything less would be a productivity detriment for him. I
      >expressed that I can appreciate his dificulty as I am not able to read
      >things nearly as fast as my sighted counterparts can skim them either.
      >This gentleman has recently begun to lose his sight and is trying to be
      >able to do things as much like he used to as possible. I also expressed
      >that it would take a fairly large display to be able to see the whole line
      >at once. He wondered, as did I, if a wide screen TV would work.
      >
      >I am glad you mentioned the Word Aloud program. I am interested in
      looking
      >at it for myself. If it truely can help read more quickly, this might
      >solve some of the problems I have faced with productivity. I will check
      >out both this product and the MagniReader.
      >
      >
      >
      >Thank you,
      >Have a great day
      >Karey
      >
      >Karey Carbaugh
      >Project Manager
      >IBM Global Services
      >Boulder, CO 80301
      >Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
      >e-mail: Karey@...

      --
      Access the word, access the world! -- Try our WordAloud software!!

      John Nissen, Cloudworld Ltd., Chiswick, London
      Tel: +44 (0) 845 458 3944 (local rate in the UK)
      Fax: +44 (0) 20 8742 8715
      Web: http://www.cloudworld.co.uk


      The Screen Magnifiers Homepage

      http://www.magnifiers.org



      To Post a message, send it to: magnifiers@...

      To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: magnifiers-unsubscribe@...

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    • Karey Carbaugh
      I also meant to ask if Word Aloud will read (and enlarge graphics. He didn t say so, but I think he may have graphics to deal with as well. We discussed
      Message 2 of 19 , Apr 29, 2002
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        I also meant to ask if Word Aloud will read (and enlarge graphics. He
        didn't say so, but I think he may have graphics to deal with as well. We
        discussed things like maps etc. which I believe are part of the paperwork
        he encounters.

        BTW, great suggestion on the same product in the event he looses all of his
        vision. At this point, he believes that is unlikely, but we all know that
        is a possibility.

        Thank you,
        Have a great day
        Karey

        Karey Carbaugh
        Project Manager
        IBM Global Services
        Boulder, CO 80301
        Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
        e-mail: Karey@...


        jn@... on 04/29/2002 03:46:00 PM

        Please respond to magnifiers@yahoogroups.com

        To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
        cc: jn@...
        Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
        the entire line at once?



        Hello again, Karey,

        Rather than a scanner, he could use a high-quality digital camera to
        photograph each whole page with an electronic image in memory, and then
        apply OCR to the image. Once the text is in electronic text form,
        there are many ways he could read it, but the fastest way would be
        using a rapid reader such as WordAloud. As his sight deteriorates
        he will be able to take in fewer words at a glance. He can continue
        to use WordAloud if his sight goes completely, because of the speech mode,
        which is good psychologically. There is no new hurdle to leap over.

        BTW, WordAloud has some skimming features - you can jump from
        sentence to sentence, paragraph to paragraph and heading to heading.

        Cheers,

        John
        --
        In message <OF8C29BE2F.2214639B-ON87256BAA.00546789@...>
        "Karey Carbaugh" writes:
        >
        >Thanks John and Laurie for your quick replies.
        >
        >I mentioned the idea of scanning in the documents that he needs to read.
        >The problem as he explained it to me is that he is the president of a
        small
        >company and reads several hundred pages a day and would be unable to scan
        >them all in to read them. I got the impression that he needs to visually
        >scan (or skim) the text and therefore needs to be able to visually "see"
        >the entire line at once. Where a normal sighted person can skim nearly a
        >whole page at once, he is interested in at least seeing a whole line at
        >once. Anything less would be a productivity detriment for him. I
        >expressed that I can appreciate his dificulty as I am not able to read
        >things nearly as fast as my sighted counterparts can skim them either.
        >This gentleman has recently begun to lose his sight and is trying to be
        >able to do things as much like he used to as possible. I also expressed
        >that it would take a fairly large display to be able to see the whole line
        >at once. He wondered, as did I, if a wide screen TV would work.
        >
        >I am glad you mentioned the Word Aloud program. I am interested in
        looking
        >at it for myself. If it truely can help read more quickly, this might
        >solve some of the problems I have faced with productivity. I will check
        >out both this product and the MagniReader.
        >
        >
        >
        >Thank you,
        >Have a great day
        >Karey
        >
        >Karey Carbaugh
        >Project Manager
        >IBM Global Services
        >Boulder, CO 80301
        >Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
        >e-mail: Karey@...

        --
        Access the word, access the world! -- Try our WordAloud software!!

        John Nissen, Cloudworld Ltd., Chiswick, London
        Tel: +44 (0) 845 458 3944 (local rate in the UK)
        Fax: +44 (0) 20 8742 8715
        Web: http://www.cloudworld.co.uk


        The Screen Magnifiers Homepage

        http://www.magnifiers.org



        To Post a message, send it to: magnifiers@...

        To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: magnifiers-unsubscribe@...

        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      • Karey Carbaugh
        Sorry for the flurry of notes. I didn t read this one before I sent the last reply. This is also an excellent idea. Thanks Steve. Thank you, Have a great
        Message 3 of 19 , Apr 29, 2002
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          Sorry for the flurry of notes. I didn't read this one before I sent the
          last reply. This is also an excellent idea. Thanks Steve.

          Thank you,
          Have a great day
          Karey

          Karey Carbaugh
          Project Manager
          IBM Global Services
          Boulder, CO 80301
          Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
          e-mail: Karey@...


          Steven Whatley <swhatley@...> on 04/29/2002 12:19:05 PM

          Please respond to magnifiers@yahoogroups.com

          To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
          cc:
          Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
          the entire line at once?



          Hello,

          There are bar hand magnifiers. It is a long half cyllendar. I have one
          that is 12 inches long. It makes the letters taller but not wider. An
          example can be found at: http://www.shoplet.com/office/db/APO27555.html

          Will this help?
          Steven



          The Screen Magnifiers Homepage

          http://www.magnifiers.org



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        • Steven Whatley
          ... Most magnifier catalogs have them. I don t know of a good place to buy magnifiers online. But, I m sure there are some. I wish Science Products, Inc.
          Message 4 of 19 , Apr 29, 2002
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            On Mon, 29 Apr 2002, Karey Carbaugh wrote:
            > Sorry for the flurry of notes. I didn't read this one before I sent the
            > last reply. This is also an excellent idea. Thanks Steve.

            Most magnifier catalogs have them. I don't know of a good place to buy
            magnifiers online. But, I'm sure there are some. I wish Science
            Products, Inc. had a web store. I mentined it to them once but they did
            not express an interest in having a web presence.

            Later,
            Steven
          • Anja Torres
            I was in the same predicament as him. I wanted to read the whole page or at least the whole line. I have my own practice and have to go through loads of
            Message 5 of 19 , Apr 29, 2002
            • 0 Attachment
              I was in the same predicament as him. I wanted to read the whole page or at
              least the whole line. I have my own practice and have to go through loads
              of records, texts etc. As my vision went from X2 to X8 magnif. With
              Zoomtext, I had to give in and realize that my life had changed. Right now
              there is nothing that does exactly what he wants. I have 3 CCTVs, a
              miniviewer, 3 scanners, Kurtzweil, Windoweyes, name it, and I have it. I
              hired myself a reader (a live, human reader…..) and I use a large CCTV for
              graphics. The problem is that it is not the monitor size that decides the
              size of the document, it is the camera. Anja

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Karey Carbaugh [mailto:karey@...]
              Sent: Monday, April 29, 2002 3:44 PM
              To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read the
              entireline at once?


              Thanks John, Steve, and the others who have responded.
              I will mention this idea of a video camera conversion to OCR image. I
              suspect he will not be open to a word at a time if he isn't open to half
              the line at a time. His biggest concern is that if he cannot read the
              volume of documentation at a glance, as I understand it, he may be at risk
              of loosing his business that he owns which requires mountains of paper
              reading. These are all very good suggestions though which I will certainly
              pass along, as well as others if any come up.

              Thank you,
              Have a great day
              Karey

              Karey Carbaugh
              Project Manager
              IBM Global Services
              Boulder, CO 80301
              Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
              e-mail: Karey@...


              jn@... on 04/29/2002 03:46:00 PM

              Please respond to magnifiers@yahoogroups.com

              To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
              cc: jn@...
              Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
              the entire line at once?



              Hello again, Karey,

              Rather than a scanner, he could use a high-quality digital camera to
              photograph each whole page with an electronic image in memory, and then
              apply OCR to the image. Once the text is in electronic text form,
              there are many ways he could read it, but the fastest way would be
              using a rapid reader such as WordAloud. As his sight deteriorates
              he will be able to take in fewer words at a glance. He can continue
              to use WordAloud if his sight goes completely, because of the speech mode,
              which is good psychologically. There is no new hurdle to leap over.

              BTW, WordAloud has some skimming features - you can jump from
              sentence to sentence, paragraph to paragraph and heading to heading.

              Cheers,

              John
              --
              In message <OF8C29BE2F.2214639B-ON87256BAA.00546789@...>
              "Karey Carbaugh" writes:
              >
              >Thanks John and Laurie for your quick replies.
              >
              >I mentioned the idea of scanning in the documents that he needs to read.
              >The problem as he explained it to me is that he is the president of a
              small
              >company and reads several hundred pages a day and would be unable to scan
              >them all in to read them. I got the impression that he needs to visually
              >scan (or skim) the text and therefore needs to be able to visually "see"
              >the entire line at once. Where a normal sighted person can skim nearly a
              >whole page at once, he is interested in at least seeing a whole line at
              >once. Anything less would be a productivity detriment for him. I
              >expressed that I can appreciate his dificulty as I am not able to read
              >things nearly as fast as my sighted counterparts can skim them either.
              >This gentleman has recently begun to lose his sight and is trying to be
              >able to do things as much like he used to as possible. I also expressed
              >that it would take a fairly large display to be able to see the whole line
              >at once. He wondered, as did I, if a wide screen TV would work.
              >
              >I am glad you mentioned the Word Aloud program. I am interested in
              looking
              >at it for myself. If it truely can help read more quickly, this might
              >solve some of the problems I have faced with productivity. I will check
              >out both this product and the MagniReader.
              >
              >
              >
              >Thank you,
              >Have a great day
              >Karey
              >
              >Karey Carbaugh
              >Project Manager
              >IBM Global Services
              >Boulder, CO 80301
              >Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
              >e-mail: Karey@...

              --
              Access the word, access the world! -- Try our WordAloud software!!

              John Nissen, Cloudworld Ltd., Chiswick, London
              Tel: +44 (0) 845 458 3944 (local rate in the UK)
              Fax: +44 (0) 20 8742 8715
              Web: http://www.cloudworld.co.uk


              The Screen Magnifiers Homepage

              http://www.magnifiers.org



              To Post a message, send it to: magnifiers@...

              To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: magnifiers-unsubscribe@...

              Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/






              The Screen Magnifiers Homepage

              http://www.magnifiers.org



              To Post a message, send it to: magnifiers@...

              To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: magnifiers-unsubscribe@...

              Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
              <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Steven Whatley
              Hi all, When this thread first started, an image popped up in my head. Have you seen those long message boards made of red LEDs that shows text scrolling
              Message 6 of 19 , Apr 30, 2002
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi all,

                When this thread first started, an image popped up in my head. Have you
                seen those long message boards made of red LEDs that shows text scrolling
                across? I can imagine hooking a CCTV camera to that and read one line at
                a time. But, I odn't think this would be to practical nor cost effecient.

                Later,
                Steven
              • Karey Carbaugh
                Hmmm, an interesting image. I hadn t thought of this, and while this individual told me that cost was not an issue, I agree that this is probably not the most
                Message 7 of 19 , Apr 30, 2002
                • 0 Attachment
                  Hmmm, an interesting image. I hadn't thought of this, and while this
                  individual told me that cost was not an issue, I agree that this is
                  probably not the most cost-effective method, and I'm not sure it is a
                  practical solution, especially in an office setting.

                  Thanks Anja for your wisdom, you and others are confirming what I suspected
                  from the first conversation I had with this gentleman. I had never met him
                  before, and I told him I didn't hold out much hope of solving the problem
                  in the manner he wanted, but that I would give it a good try. You are
                  right in that the camera is what really controls how much is on the screen.
                  With a very large screen (say a 52" screen) a person could get by with much
                  less magnification from the camera, but if the camera is not a wide angle
                  camera, you still won't get the whole line across. I had even suggested to
                  him that he consider a projector that could project up to an entire wall of
                  an image. There are even some projectors specifically designed to get a
                  whole line (or in some cases a whole page) at a time. If he had a big
                  enough wall, he could see the whole page at once.

                  I don't know the type of business this person has, but I think much of what
                  he deals with is legal documents. So, I think the comments I am hearing
                  are very good. He may do well to begin shifting his expectations and ways
                  of doing things in order to maintain his livelihood. While I have been
                  low-vision all of my life (and I guess it is a blessing that my vision
                  hasn't and isn't expected to deteriorate), I can certainly appreciate the
                  frustration he is going through.

                  Thank you,
                  Have a great day
                  Karey

                  Karey Carbaugh
                  Project Manager
                  IBM Global Services
                  Boulder, CO 80301
                  Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
                  e-mail: Karey@...


                  Steven Whatley <swhatley@...> on 04/30/2002 07:18:02 AM

                  Please respond to magnifiers@yahoogroups.com

                  To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                  cc:
                  Subject: RE: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
                  the entireline at once?



                  Hi all,

                  When this thread first started, an image popped up in my head. Have you
                  seen those long message boards made of red LEDs that shows text scrolling
                  across? I can imagine hooking a CCTV camera to that and read one line at
                  a time. But, I odn't think this would be to practical nor cost effecient.

                  Later,
                  Steven



                  The Screen Magnifiers Homepage

                  http://www.magnifiers.org



                  To Post a message, send it to: magnifiers@...

                  To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: magnifiers-unsubscribe@...

                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                • Michael Wigle
                  I would still strongly recommend you look at the Clarity AF CCTV since if it is used with a large TV it is the most likely device to do what he wants. However,
                  Message 8 of 19 , Apr 30, 2002
                  • 0 Attachment
                    I would still strongly recommend you look at the Clarity AF CCTV since if it
                    is used with a large TV it is the most likely device to do what he wants.
                    However, the other thing you may want to discuss with your client would be a
                    way for him to delegate the work. Having an assistant that could be taught
                    to skim quickly for the key words he's looking for to read more in-depth may
                    be a good alternative. One thing you need to realize with OCR software of
                    any kind is that he's not likely going to like the time it takes to scan in
                    using a scanner and then do the OCR and then still have to skim that page.
                    OCR software also will not read pictures (nothing can read a picture) but
                    some of them will enlarge the picture and include it with the original text.
                    If any of this paperwork is coming from elctronic format originally he may
                    also want to look at inexpensive text to speech software to quickly read the
                    documents while he does other things. I know my manager often has someone
                    skimming for pertinent information and reading aloud while he does other
                    things and also uses the DocReader in ZoomText to read electronic paperwork
                    while he does other things. Just a few more ideas on top of the slew you
                    already have.

                    Michael Wigle
                    Computer Access Specialist
                    Cincinnati Association for the Blind


                    ----Original Message Follows----
                    From: "Karey Carbaugh" <karey@...>
                    Reply-To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                    To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read the
                    entire line at once?
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                    Thanks John, Steve, and the others who have responded.
                    I will mention this idea of a video camera conversion to OCR image. I
                    suspect he will not be open to a word at a time if he isn't open to half
                    the line at a time. His biggest concern is that if he cannot read the
                    volume of documentation at a glance, as I understand it, he may be at risk
                    of loosing his business that he owns which requires mountains of paper
                    reading. These are all very good suggestions though which I will certainly
                    pass along, as well as others if any come up.

                    Thank you,
                    Have a great day
                    Karey

                    Karey Carbaugh
                    Project Manager
                    IBM Global Services
                    Boulder, CO 80301
                    Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
                    e-mail: Karey@...


                    jn@... on 04/29/2002 03:46:00 PM

                    Please respond to magnifiers@yahoogroups.com

                    To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                    cc: jn@...
                    Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
                    the entire line at once?



                    Hello again, Karey,

                    Rather than a scanner, he could use a high-quality digital camera to
                    photograph each whole page with an electronic image in memory, and then
                    apply OCR to the image. Once the text is in electronic text form,
                    there are many ways he could read it, but the fastest way would be
                    using a rapid reader such as WordAloud. As his sight deteriorates
                    he will be able to take in fewer words at a glance. He can continue
                    to use WordAloud if his sight goes completely, because of the speech mode,
                    which is good psychologically. There is no new hurdle to leap over.

                    BTW, WordAloud has some skimming features - you can jump from
                    sentence to sentence, paragraph to paragraph and heading to heading.

                    Cheers,

                    John
                    --
                    In message <OF8C29BE2F.2214639B-ON87256BAA.00546789@...>
                    "Karey Carbaugh" writes:
                    >
                    >Thanks John and Laurie for your quick replies.
                    >
                    >I mentioned the idea of scanning in the documents that he needs to read.
                    >The problem as he explained it to me is that he is the president of a
                    small
                    >company and reads several hundred pages a day and would be unable to scan
                    >them all in to read them. I got the impression that he needs to visually
                    >scan (or skim) the text and therefore needs to be able to visually "see"
                    >the entire line at once. Where a normal sighted person can skim nearly a
                    >whole page at once, he is interested in at least seeing a whole line at
                    >once. Anything less would be a productivity detriment for him. I
                    >expressed that I can appreciate his dificulty as I am not able to read
                    >things nearly as fast as my sighted counterparts can skim them either.
                    >This gentleman has recently begun to lose his sight and is trying to be
                    >able to do things as much like he used to as possible. I also expressed
                    >that it would take a fairly large display to be able to see the whole line
                    >at once. He wondered, as did I, if a wide screen TV would work.
                    >
                    >I am glad you mentioned the Word Aloud program. I am interested in
                    looking
                    >at it for myself. If it truely can help read more quickly, this might
                    >solve some of the problems I have faced with productivity. I will check
                    >out both this product and the MagniReader.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >Thank you,
                    >Have a great day
                    >Karey
                    >
                    >Karey Carbaugh
                    >Project Manager
                    >IBM Global Services
                    >Boulder, CO 80301
                    >Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
                    >e-mail: Karey@...

                    --
                    Access the word, access the world! -- Try our WordAloud software!!

                    John Nissen, Cloudworld Ltd., Chiswick, London
                    Tel: +44 (0) 845 458 3944 (local rate in the UK)
                    Fax: +44 (0) 20 8742 8715
                    Web: http://www.cloudworld.co.uk


                    The Screen Magnifiers Homepage

                    http://www.magnifiers.org



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                  • jn@tommy.demon.co.uk
                    Hi Anja, ... name it, and I have it. Have you tried any serial presentation systems? I find I can read very fast - though I m a bit dyslexic I can manage
                    Message 9 of 19 , Apr 30, 2002
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Hi Anja,

                      "... name it, and I have it."

                      Have you tried any serial presentation systems? I find I can read very
                      fast - though I'm a bit dyslexic I can manage 500 wpm comfortably.
                      WordAloud allows you to blow up the text to over 100 point, i.e. about
                      1" high characters, on the screen, and you've a choice of colour
                      of text and background. Providing you can take in the longer words
                      at a glance, i.e. without needing to scan across with your eyes, you
                      should be able to read from the screen as fast as a sighted person,
                      and read a lot faster than the average sighted person can from the
                      printed page!

                      Cheers,

                      John
                      --
                      In message <LOBBKFHBKEAKHCBKMKLBOEAOCIAA.anjatorres@...> "Anja Torres"
                      writes:

                      >I was in the same predicament as him. I wanted to read the whole page or at
                      >least the whole line. I have my own practice and have to go through loads
                      >of records, texts etc. As my vision went from X2 to X8 magnif. With
                      >Zoomtext, I had to give in and realize that my life had changed. Right now
                      >there is nothing that does exactly what he wants. I have 3 CCTVs, a
                      >miniviewer, 3 scanners, Kurtzweil, Windoweyes, name it, and I have it. I
                      >hired myself a reader (a live, human reader…..) and I use a large CCTV fo>r
                      >graphics. The problem is that it is not the monitor size that decides the
                      >size of the document, it is the camera. Anja

                      --
                      Access the word, access the world! -- Try our WordAloud software!!

                      John Nissen, Cloudworld Ltd., Chiswick, London
                      Tel: +44 (0) 845 458 3944 (local rate in the UK)
                      Fax: +44 (0) 20 8742 8715
                      Web: http://www.cloudworld.co.uk
                    • Karey Carbaugh
                      Thanks Michael, There have been a slew of responses to this (scattered in with a lot of my normal mail), and I had overlooked your previous append. I think
                      Message 10 of 19 , Apr 30, 2002
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Thanks Michael,
                        There have been a slew of responses to this (scattered in with a lot
                        of my normal mail), and I had overlooked your previous append. I think
                        this is a great idea and the Clarity AF CCTV might give him an interim
                        approach as he moves to some of these other thoughts. This is the first
                        time I have ever really asked a broad question like this on here and I
                        thought I might get a lot of responses. I learned of this person through
                        the American Council of the Blind, and while I have no real connection to
                        him, his needs were interesting to me. I have also gotten some great ideas
                        to help me solve some of the problems I face as well. Your idea of having
                        someone (or a doc reader) to read while he does other things is a great
                        one. I do that a lot myself. Unfortunately, the impression that I got is
                        that most of his documents are not, and will not be, in electronic form.
                        And, you are right in that he has already said that scanning them in would
                        be too cumbersome given the amount he deals with.

                        Thank you,
                        Have a great day
                        Karey

                        Karey Carbaugh
                        Project Manager
                        IBM Global Services
                        Boulder, CO 80301
                        Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
                        e-mail: Karey@...


                        "Michael Wigle" <michaelwigle@...> on 04/30/2002 10:06:06 AM

                        Please respond to magnifiers@yahoogroups.com

                        To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                        cc:
                        Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
                        the entire line at once?



                        I would still strongly recommend you look at the Clarity AF CCTV since if
                        it
                        is used with a large TV it is the most likely device to do what he wants.
                        However, the other thing you may want to discuss with your client would be
                        a
                        way for him to delegate the work. Having an assistant that could be taught
                        to skim quickly for the key words he's looking for to read more in-depth
                        may
                        be a good alternative. One thing you need to realize with OCR software of
                        any kind is that he's not likely going to like the time it takes to scan in
                        using a scanner and then do the OCR and then still have to skim that page.
                        OCR software also will not read pictures (nothing can read a picture) but
                        some of them will enlarge the picture and include it with the original
                        text.
                        If any of this paperwork is coming from elctronic format originally he may
                        also want to look at inexpensive text to speech software to quickly read
                        the
                        documents while he does other things. I know my manager often has someone
                        skimming for pertinent information and reading aloud while he does other
                        things and also uses the DocReader in ZoomText to read electronic paperwork
                        while he does other things. Just a few more ideas on top of the slew you
                        already have.

                        Michael Wigle
                        Computer Access Specialist
                        Cincinnati Association for the Blind


                        ----Original Message Follows----
                        From: "Karey Carbaugh" <karey@...>
                        Reply-To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                        To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
                        the
                        entire line at once?
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                        Thanks John, Steve, and the others who have responded.
                        I will mention this idea of a video camera conversion to OCR image.
                        I
                        suspect he will not be open to a word at a time if he isn't open to half
                        the line at a time. His biggest concern is that if he cannot read the
                        volume of documentation at a glance, as I understand it, he may be at risk
                        of loosing his business that he owns which requires mountains of paper
                        reading. These are all very good suggestions though which I will certainly
                        pass along, as well as others if any come up.

                        Thank you,
                        Have a great day
                        Karey

                        Karey Carbaugh
                        Project Manager
                        IBM Global Services
                        Boulder, CO 80301
                        Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
                        e-mail: Karey@...


                        jn@... on 04/29/2002 03:46:00 PM

                        Please respond to magnifiers@yahoogroups.com

                        To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                        cc: jn@...
                        Subject: Re: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
                        the entire line at once?



                        Hello again, Karey,

                        Rather than a scanner, he could use a high-quality digital camera to
                        photograph each whole page with an electronic image in memory, and then
                        apply OCR to the image. Once the text is in electronic text form,
                        there are many ways he could read it, but the fastest way would be
                        using a rapid reader such as WordAloud. As his sight deteriorates
                        he will be able to take in fewer words at a glance. He can continue
                        to use WordAloud if his sight goes completely, because of the speech mode,
                        which is good psychologically. There is no new hurdle to leap over.

                        BTW, WordAloud has some skimming features - you can jump from
                        sentence to sentence, paragraph to paragraph and heading to heading.

                        Cheers,

                        John
                        --
                        In message <OF8C29BE2F.2214639B-ON87256BAA.00546789@...>
                        "Karey Carbaugh" writes:
                        >
                        >Thanks John and Laurie for your quick replies.
                        >
                        >I mentioned the idea of scanning in the documents that he needs to read.
                        >The problem as he explained it to me is that he is the president of a
                        small
                        >company and reads several hundred pages a day and would be unable to scan
                        >them all in to read them. I got the impression that he needs to visually
                        >scan (or skim) the text and therefore needs to be able to visually "see"
                        >the entire line at once. Where a normal sighted person can skim nearly a
                        >whole page at once, he is interested in at least seeing a whole line at
                        >once. Anything less would be a productivity detriment for him. I
                        >expressed that I can appreciate his dificulty as I am not able to read
                        >things nearly as fast as my sighted counterparts can skim them either.
                        >This gentleman has recently begun to lose his sight and is trying to be
                        >able to do things as much like he used to as possible. I also expressed
                        >that it would take a fairly large display to be able to see the whole
                        line
                        >at once. He wondered, as did I, if a wide screen TV would work.
                        >
                        >I am glad you mentioned the Word Aloud program. I am interested in
                        looking
                        >at it for myself. If it truely can help read more quickly, this might
                        >solve some of the problems I have faced with productivity. I will check
                        >out both this product and the MagniReader.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >Thank you,
                        >Have a great day
                        >Karey
                        >
                        >Karey Carbaugh
                        >Project Manager
                        >IBM Global Services
                        >Boulder, CO 80301
                        >Phone: (303) 939-3355 IBM T/L: 263-3355
                        >e-mail: Karey@...

                        --
                        Access the word, access the world! -- Try our WordAloud software!!

                        John Nissen, Cloudworld Ltd., Chiswick, London
                        Tel: +44 (0) 845 458 3944 (local rate in the UK)
                        Fax: +44 (0) 20 8742 8715
                        Web: http://www.cloudworld.co.uk


                        The Screen Magnifiers Homepage

                        http://www.magnifiers.org



                        To Post a message, send it to: magnifiers@...

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                      • Anja Torres
                        Hello John, maybe I spoke too soon, maybe I do not have it all. I do not know what a serial presentation system is. When I use Zoom Text I get dizzy after a
                        Message 11 of 19 , May 18, 2002
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Hello John, maybe I spoke too soon, maybe I do not have it all. I do not
                          know what a serial presentation system is. When I use Zoom Text I get dizzy
                          after a couple of minutes, and I do not like Window Eyes because I cannot
                          track with it. CCTVs also make me seasick. That is why I opted for a human
                          reader. Please let me know where to learn more sbout it. Thank you. anja

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: jn@... [mailto:jn@...]
                          Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2002 9:09 AM
                          To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                          Cc: jn@...
                          Subject: RE: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
                          theentireline at once?

                          Hi Anja,

                          "... name it, and I have it."

                          Have you tried any serial presentation systems? I find I can read very
                          fast - though I'm a bit dyslexic I can manage 500 wpm comfortably.
                          WordAloud allows you to blow up the text to over 100 point, i.e. about
                          1" high characters, on the screen, and you've a choice of colour
                          of text and background. Providing you can take in the longer words
                          at a glance, i.e. without needing to scan across with your eyes, you
                          should be able to read from the screen as fast as a sighted person,
                          and read a lot faster than the average sighted person can from the
                          printed page!

                          Cheers,

                          John
                          --
                          In message <LOBBKFHBKEAKHCBKMKLBOEAOCIAA.anjatorres@...> "Anja Torres"
                          writes:

                          >I was in the same predicament as him. I wanted to read the whole page or at
                          >least the whole line. I have my own practice and have to go through loads
                          >of records, texts etc. As my vision went from X2 to X8 magnif. With
                          >Zoomtext, I had to give in and realize that my life had changed. Right now
                          >there is nothing that does exactly what he wants. I have 3 CCTVs, a
                          >miniviewer, 3 scanners, Kurtzweil, Windoweyes, name it, and I have it. I
                          >hired myself a reader (a live, human reader…..) and I use a large CCTV fo>r
                          >graphics. The problem is that it is not the monitor size that decides the
                          >size of the document, it is the camera. Anja

                          --
                          Access the word, access the world! -- Try our WordAloud software!!

                          John Nissen, Cloudworld Ltd., Chiswick, London
                          Tel: +44 (0) 845 458 3944 (local rate in the UK)
                          Fax: +44 (0) 20 8742 8715
                          Web: http://www.cloudworld.co.uk



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                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • jn@tommy.demon.co.uk
                          Hello Anja, Speech is a serial audio presentation system, since words are spoken in succession. You hear one word, then the next, and so on. A serial visual
                          Message 12 of 19 , May 20, 2002
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Hello Anja,

                            Speech is a serial audio presentation system, since words are spoken
                            in succession. You hear one word, then the next, and so on.
                            A serial visual presentation system is when words are displayed in
                            succession. You are shown one word, then the next and so on.
                            Because only one word is displayed at a time, it is possible to
                            magnify the words until the whole width of the screen is used.
                            But the important thing is to have the size of characters such that you
                            can take in each whole word at a glance. So you don't have to
                            move your eyes from side to side. That is why rapid reading is
                            possible. I suspect your dizziness comes from the words swimming
                            about across the screen. With a serial presentation system each
                            word is frozen on the screen until replaced by the next word.

                            To try a serial presentation system, try downloading WordAloud
                            from www.wordaloud.co.uk. In this system, the visual presentation
                            can be coupled speech (audio presentation), such that you see each
                            word as it is spoken. If you turn off the speech (by setting the
                            mode to "text" in the options box), you can use WordAloud as a
                            rapid reader. And you can of course use it in any language with
                            the Latin alphabet (as supported by HTML).

                            BTW, when not couple to speech, the time that each word is display
                            depend on the length of word, when WordAloud is playing through
                            the text. You can adjust this speed from 10 wpm (words per minute)
                            up to 1000 wpm. Alternatively at the "word level" you can step
                            through the words using the Right arrow/cursor key.

                            Have a go! Let us know how fast you can read, and whether you
                            avoid the dizzy feeling.

                            Cheers from Chiswick,

                            John
                            --
                            In message <LOBBKFHBKEAKHCBKMKLBGEEACIAA.anjatorres@...>
                            "Anja Torres" writes:

                            >Hello John, maybe I spoke too soon, maybe I do not have it all. I do not
                            >know what a serial presentation system is. When I use Zoom Text I get dizzy
                            >after a couple of minutes, and I do not like Window Eyes because I cannot
                            >track with it. CCTVs also make me seasick. That is why I opted for a human
                            >reader. Please let me know where to learn more sbout it. Thank you. anja
                            >
                            >-----Original Message-----
                            >From: jn@... [mailto:jn@...]
                            >Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2002 9:09 AM
                            >To: magnifiers@yahoogroups.com
                            >Cc: jn@...
                            >Subject: RE: [magnifiers] Does anyone know of an enlarger that will read
                            >theentireline at once?
                            >
                            >Hi Anja,
                            >
                            >"... name it, and I have it."
                            >
                            >Have you tried any serial presentation systems? I find I can read very
                            >fast - though I'm a bit dyslexic I can manage 500 wpm comfortably.
                            >WordAloud allows you to blow up the text to over 100 point, i.e. about
                            >1" high characters, on the screen, and you've a choice of colour
                            >of text and background. Providing you can take in the longer words
                            >at a glance, i.e. without needing to scan across with your eyes, you
                            >should be able to read from the screen as fast as a sighted person,
                            >and read a lot faster than the average sighted person can from the
                            >printed page!
                            >
                            >Cheers,
                            >
                            >John

                            --
                            John Nissen, Cloudworld Ltd., Chiswick, London
                            Tel: +44 (0) 845 458 3944 (local rate in the UK)
                            Fax: +44 (0) 20 8742 8715
                            Web: http://www.cloudworld.co.uk
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