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Re: [mach1mach2cnc] Tool Turret or QCTP

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  • Steve Blackmore
    ... Yes - as long as there is no swarf or crap on the mating surfaces. Steve Blackmore --
    Message 1 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
      On Mon, 31 Mar 2008 22:31:09 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

      >Thanks Steve. One last question: is the repeatability accuracy of a QCTP good enough (compared to a turret)?

      Yes - as long as there is no swarf or crap on the mating surfaces.

      Steve Blackmore
      --
    • John Stevenson
      ... travel on your X axis. My EMCO lathe is a small table-top lathe with only 50mm of travel in the X, so I think I can t benefit much from this idea... ... I
      Message 2 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
        --- In mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Yosefi <yosefi83@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Ian,
        >
        > Thanks, nice link.
        > To use a tool plate like in the pill case demo you need a long
        travel on your X axis. My EMCO lathe is a small table-top lathe with
        only 50mm of travel in the X, so I think I can't benefit much from
        this idea...
        >
        > Daniel
        >

        I posted this the other day but it went MIA

        Daniels problem is that as stated above hiis machine is an Emco
        Compact, note the compact.
        There are aftermarket turrets out there that have 5 tools slots and a
        space for a Dickson quick change holder on the 6th.

        However these are big and even if they did one for a smaller lathe it
        wouldn't go on a compact.

        Industry uses front and back post for maximum number of tools but
        again you need a large travel to use these.

        Larger toolplates for more tools means a greater centre hight so
        again size matters.

        The long - short is there is no real alternative other than what has
        alreday beed evolved for a smaller machine.

        It's either use 3 or 4 normal tools or stand there and swap QC
        tooling as needed.

        John S.
      • Daniel Yosefi
        Thanks John. You got it exactly to the point! ... From: John Stevenson To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April
        Message 3 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
          Thanks John. You got it exactly to the point!



          ----- Original Message ----
          From: John Stevenson <john@...>
          To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Tuesday, April 1, 2008 10:12:42 AM
          Subject: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Tool Turret or QCTP

          --- In mach1mach2cnc@ yahoogroups. com, Daniel Yosefi <yosefi83@.. .>
          wrote:
          >
          > Ian,
          >
          > Thanks, nice link.
          > To use a tool plate like in the pill case demo you need a long
          travel on your X axis. My EMCO lathe is a small table-top lathe with
          only 50mm of travel in the X, so I think I can't benefit much from
          this idea...
          >
          > Daniel
          >

          I posted this the other day but it went MIA

          Daniels problem is that as stated above hiis machine is an Emco
          Compact, note the compact.
          There are aftermarket turrets out there that have 5 tools slots and a
          space for a Dickson quick change holder on the 6th.

          However these are big and even if they did one for a smaller lathe it
          wouldn't go on a compact.

          Industry uses front and back post for maximum number of tools but
          again you need a large travel to use these.

          Larger toolplates for more tools means a greater centre hight so
          again size matters.

          The long - short is there is no real alternative other than what has
          alreday beed evolved for a smaller machine.

          It's either use 3 or 4 normal tools or stand there and swap QC
          tooling as needed.

          John S.





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        • januseng
          Daniel, Ah only 50mm - should have looked it up at:- http://www.lathes.co.uk/emco/page11.html A turning tool can be used for diameter turning , faceing or
          Message 4 of 19 , Apr 1, 2008
            Daniel,

            Ah only 50mm - should have looked it up at:-
            http://www.lathes.co.uk/emco/page11.html
            A turning tool can be used for diameter turning , faceing or
            profiling, so, with a little creative ingenuity and using turning,
            screwcutting or grooving tools in the round holes in the turret, you
            should be able to avoid using a QCTP.

            Ian


            --- In mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Yosefi <yosefi83@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > Ian,
            >
            > Thanks, nice link.
            > To use a tool plate like in the pill case demo you need a long
            travel on your X axis. My EMCO lathe is a small table-top lathe with
            only 50mm of travel in the X, so I think I can't benefit much from
            this idea...
            >
            > Daniel
            >
            >
            >
            > ----- Original Message ----
            > From: januseng <yahoo@...>
            > To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 10:59:46 PM
            > Subject: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Tool Turret or QCTP
            >
            > Daniel,
            >
            > Have a look at the Omniturn site, lots of interesting examples.
            > In particular :-
            >
            > http://www.omni- turn.com/ Pages/Videos/ Video%20page. html
            >
            > The pill case demo has the "wow" factor.
            >
            > The toolplate on the Boxford is very versatile. With the toolposts
            > and some home brew collet holders, I can manage all my small jobs.
            > Mostly my runs are less than 100 off. For large production runs,
            one
            > could have the toolplate and it's tooling as an interchangeable
            item
            > for each job, cutting down the setup time.
            >
            > Ian
            >
            > --- In mach1mach2cnc@ yahoogroups. com, Daniel Yosefi <yosefi83@ .>
            > wrote:
            > >
            > > Hi Ian,
            > >
            > > WOW!! The tool plate is a very interesting idea, yet I can't see
            > how you can use more than 3 tools...?
            > >
            > >
            > > Thanks,
            > > Daniel
            > >
            > >
          • Andrey Lipavsky
            I m building a power supply and have a question on cap size. My toroidal transformer will supply 40V at 24A. Now, according to the standard cap formula, I
            Message 5 of 19 , Apr 2, 2008
              I'm building a power supply and have a question on cap size.

              My toroidal transformer will supply 40V at 24A. Now, according to the
              standard cap formula, I would need roughly 30K-uf to sustain the 55VDC at
              20A (derated to 80%).

              My question is why none of the over-the-counter power supplies in this VA
              bracket seem to use so much capacitance? Is this really overkill or are
              they just cutting corners?

              Thanks,
              Andrey Lipavsky
              Essex Jewelers
              490 E. McMillan St.
              Studio 205
              Cincinnati, OH 45206
              (513) 826-0240
              www.essexjewelers.com
            • Brian Foley
              Hi, well there are formuleas and then there is good enough, and then cheap enough....the best i can say is more capacitance wont hurt.....something around
              Message 6 of 19 , Apr 3, 2008
                Hi, well there are formuleas and then there is good enough, and then cheap
                enough....the best i can say is more capacitance wont hurt.....something
                around 33,000 uf to 40,000 uf should be fine, however i want to see 60 volt
                caps so unloaded the cap wont be overvolted...even a bit higher is a little
                more safety margin........however more expense....
                if i was building i would get 65 or 70 volts, and look for something
                33,000uf or a few thousand more up to 40,000 uf..
                once you get beyond 40,000 then you need to think about soft start.......to
                limit the inrush current(turn on current).....
                i am available most anytime to chat off line, i suspect its a power supply
                for a cnc machine. cul brian f.


                www.genapro.com
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "Andrey Lipavsky" <alipavsky@...>
                To: <mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2008 10:59 PM
                Subject: [mach1mach2cnc] Power supply caps


                > I'm building a power supply and have a question on cap size.
                >
                > My toroidal transformer will supply 40V at 24A. Now, according to the
                > standard cap formula, I would need roughly 30K-uf to sustain the 55VDC at
                > 20A (derated to 80%).
                >
                > My question is why none of the over-the-counter power supplies in this VA
                > bracket seem to use so much capacitance? Is this really overkill or are
                > they just cutting corners?
                >
                > Thanks,
                > Andrey Lipavsky
                > Essex Jewelers
                > 490 E. McMillan St.
                > Studio 205
                > Cincinnati, OH 45206
                > (513) 826-0240
                > www.essexjewelers.com
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > www.machsupport.com - Web site AccessYahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > --
                > No virus found in this incoming message.
                > Checked by AVG.
                > Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.22.4/1355 - Release Date: 4/1/2008
                5:37 PM
                >
                >
              • metlmunchr
                Another option is to use a groove-turn tool, also called a multi- directional turning tool (MDTT). Iscar and Seco both make them and I imagine others do too.
                Message 7 of 19 , Apr 6, 2008
                  Another option is to use a groove-turn tool, also called a multi-
                  directional turning tool (MDTT). Iscar and Seco both make them and I
                  imagine others do too. You can face, turn, groove, and part with
                  them. Inserts are available with both flat face and corner radii,
                  and with full radius for doing parts with concave radii.

                  I use the Iscar version because it uses double ended inserts where
                  some of the others have only single end inserts, and both are about
                  the same price. The inserts look expensive at first, at around $12
                  to $14 each, but I ran one job where I used one for the OD profile on
                  about 18,000 aluminum castings, and the entire job only used one box
                  of 10 inserts.

                  That job ran on a twin turret lathe with 20 tool positions but I used
                  the MDTT to take the place of 3 tools and 2 toolchanges per part. If
                  the turning side of Mach has the ability to assign multiple offsets
                  to the same tool, like T0101 and T0111 where 01 and 11 are different
                  offset pairs for tool #1, then you can have one Z offset for the
                  leading edge of the tool and another for the trailing edge such that
                  you can program directly from part dimensions instead of having to
                  allow for the width of the tool in programming the trailing edge
                  where the tool is acting like a left hand tool. Obviously you have
                  to program the offset change as necessary, but many controls have the
                  ability to handle an offset change on the fly without returning to
                  the toolchange position.
                • Daniel Yosefi
                  That is an interesting approach. Do you know what is the smallest holder available? Thanks, Daniel ... From: metlmunchr To:
                  Message 8 of 19 , Apr 6, 2008
                    That is an interesting approach. Do you know what is the smallest holder available?

                    Thanks,
                    Daniel



                    ----- Original Message ----
                    From: metlmunchr <metlmunchr@...>
                    To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Sunday, April 6, 2008 9:36:20 AM
                    Subject: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Tool Turret or QCTP

                    Another option is to use a groove-turn tool, also called a multi-
                    directional turning tool (MDTT). Iscar and Seco both make them and I
                    imagine others do too. You can face, turn, groove, and part with
                    them. Inserts are available with both flat face and corner radii,
                    and with full radius for doing parts with concave radii.

                    I use the Iscar version because it uses double ended inserts where
                    some of the others have only single end inserts, and both are about
                    the same price. The inserts look expensive at first, at around $12
                    to $14 each, but I ran one job where I used one for the OD profile on
                    about 18,000 aluminum castings, and the entire job only used one box
                    of 10 inserts.

                    That job ran on a twin turret lathe with 20 tool positions but I used
                    the MDTT to take the place of 3 tools and 2 toolchanges per part. If
                    the turning side of Mach has the ability to assign multiple offsets
                    to the same tool, like T0101 and T0111 where 01 and 11 are different
                    offset pairs for tool #1, then you can have one Z offset for the
                    leading edge of the tool and another for the trailing edge such that
                    you can program directly from part dimensions instead of having to
                    allow for the width of the tool in programming the trailing edge
                    where the tool is acting like a left hand tool. Obviously you have
                    to program the offset change as necessary, but many controls have the
                    ability to handle an offset change on the fly without returning to
                    the toolchange position.





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