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RE: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Would like some info and help

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  • Andy Wander
    On a vertical mill, negative Z is AWAY from the spindle/chuck, NOT toward the spindle. On a lathe, negative Z is toward the spindle. Andy Wander ... From:
    Message 1 of 20 , Apr 1, 2012
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      On a vertical mill, negative Z is AWAY from the spindle/chuck, NOT toward the spindle.

      On a lathe, negative Z is toward the spindle.


      Andy Wander

      -----Original Message-----
      From: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony Smith
      Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2012 5:09 PM
      To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Would like some info and help

      > Now let's see if I understand correctly. The face of the chuck or the face of the
      > chuck jaws would be considered Z 0(zero) going to the right toward the tail
      > stock would be Z + (plus) lets say Z10 for the HF7X10 not using, or having the
      > tail stock mounted. So moving away from the chuck would be positive values.
      > Z0 to Z10. Moving toward the chuck would be negative values. -Z10 to -Z0.
      >
      > X axis would be X0 center line of chuck or bed-ways, +X values moves from
      > center line to the max value the cross slide can move out toward operator. For
      > HF7X10 probably somewhere near +X3.
      >
      > So anytime your cutting tool is moving INTO your stock, your going to be going
      > in -(negative value) on the X axis (cross slide moving away from
      > operator) and in a -(negative value) on the Z axis? Correct? Yes,No!
      >
      > Am I going in the right direction with my thinking?


      Your Z-axis is the spindle, negative is always towards the spindle, and positive away from it (mill is the same), so what you're thinking is correct.

      The origin is set by you, but is typically it's the right edge of your work piece. In most cases the Z coordinates used would be negative values.

      The origin for the X-axis is the spindle centerline, again as you were thinking. Movement on the X-axis is as you say, numbers getting bigger means the tool moves towards you, getting smaller means going away. However you don't really have negative X values, that means you've gone past the middle. (This is the case for your 7x10, industrial lathes with rear toolposts work in negative.)

      The way to view it is to say the numbers are the diameter of the work (the values for X are given in diameter, not radius), so moving the tool to a smaller number makes the diameter smaller. If you have a 10mm rod, and you move from 10 to 8, it will take a 1mm cut. Of course the tool is only 5mm from the center, and only moves 1mm, but you don't work with the radius and go from 5 to 4. Working with the diameter is how you do it manually anyway.

      It does make sense eventually, stickers on the lathe helps.

      Tony





      ------------------------------------

      www.machsupport.com - Web site AccessYahoo! Groups Links
    • Hood
      Negative Z is the same on a lathe or a mill. What you have to think about is the work and not the chuck. On both as you cut further into the work piece you are
      Message 2 of 20 , Apr 2, 2012
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        Negative Z is the same on a lathe or a mill. What you have to think about is the work and not the chuck. On both as you cut further into the work piece you are moving in a negative Z direction. In other words when the quill on a mill moves out is cutting deeper into your part and thus a negative Z, on a lathe the axis moving towards the work in the chuck is cutting further into the work so again is moving in a negative Z direction.
        On a lathe, just like on a mill, the end of the work material (or top surface on a mill) is normally set as Z zero in work coordinates.
        Hood

        --- In mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com, Andy Wander <awander@...> wrote:
        >
        > On a vertical mill, negative Z is AWAY from the spindle/chuck, NOT toward the spindle.
        >
        > On a lathe, negative Z is toward the spindle.
        >
        >
        > Andy Wander
        >
        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony Smith
        > Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2012 5:09 PM
        > To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: RE: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Would like some info and help
        >
        > > Now let's see if I understand correctly. The face of the chuck or the face of the
        > > chuck jaws would be considered Z 0(zero) going to the right toward the tail
        > > stock would be Z + (plus) lets say Z10 for the HF7X10 not using, or having the
        > > tail stock mounted. So moving away from the chuck would be positive values.
        > > Z0 to Z10. Moving toward the chuck would be negative values. -Z10 to -Z0.
        > >
        > > X axis would be X0 center line of chuck or bed-ways, +X values moves from
        > > center line to the max value the cross slide can move out toward operator. For
        > > HF7X10 probably somewhere near +X3.
        > >
        > > So anytime your cutting tool is moving INTO your stock, your going to be going
        > > in -(negative value) on the X axis (cross slide moving away from
        > > operator) and in a -(negative value) on the Z axis? Correct? Yes,No!
        > >
        > > Am I going in the right direction with my thinking?
        >
        >
        > Your Z-axis is the spindle, negative is always towards the spindle, and positive away from it (mill is the same), so what you're thinking is correct.
        >
        > The origin is set by you, but is typically it's the right edge of your work piece. In most cases the Z coordinates used would be negative values.
        >
        > The origin for the X-axis is the spindle centerline, again as you were thinking. Movement on the X-axis is as you say, numbers getting bigger means the tool moves towards you, getting smaller means going away. However you don't really have negative X values, that means you've gone past the middle. (This is the case for your 7x10, industrial lathes with rear toolposts work in negative.)
        >
        > The way to view it is to say the numbers are the diameter of the work (the values for X are given in diameter, not radius), so moving the tool to a smaller number makes the diameter smaller. If you have a 10mm rod, and you move from 10 to 8, it will take a 1mm cut. Of course the tool is only 5mm from the center, and only moves 1mm, but you don't work with the radius and go from 5 to 4. Working with the diameter is how you do it manually anyway.
        >
        > It does make sense eventually, stickers on the lathe helps.
        >
        > Tony
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        > www.machsupport.com - Web site AccessYahoo! Groups Links
        >
      • Tony Smith
        I should have stayed in bed, but yes, negative-Z is towards the work. Andy says the same thing, but that s what you get when trying to describe a lathe & mill
        Message 3 of 20 , Apr 2, 2012
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          I should have stayed in bed, but yes, negative-Z is towards the work. Andy
          says the same thing, but that's what you get when trying to describe a lathe
          & mill at the same time and avoiding generic statements (even though the
          generic statements are better).

          Tony



          > Negative Z is the same on a lathe or a mill. What you have to think about
          is the
          > work and not the chuck. On both as you cut further into the work piece you
          are
          > moving in a negative Z direction. In other words when the quill on a mill
          moves
          > out is cutting deeper into your part and thus a negative Z, on a lathe the
          axis
          > moving towards the work in the chuck is cutting further into the work so
          again is
          > moving in a negative Z direction.
          > On a lathe, just like on a mill, the end of the work material (or top
          surface on a
          > mill) is normally set as Z zero in work coordinates.
          > Hood
          >
          > --- In mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com, Andy Wander <awander@...>
          > wrote:
          > >
          > > On a vertical mill, negative Z is AWAY from the spindle/chuck, NOT
          toward the
          > spindle.
          > >
          > > On a lathe, negative Z is toward the spindle.
          > >
          > >
          > > Andy Wander
          > >
          > > -----Original Message-----
          > > From: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
          > > [mailto:mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony Smith
          > > Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2012 5:09 PM
          > > To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
          > > Subject: RE: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Would like some info and help
          > >
          > > > Now let's see if I understand correctly. The face of the chuck or
          > > > the face of the chuck jaws would be considered Z 0(zero) going to
          > > > the right toward the tail stock would be Z + (plus) lets say Z10 for
          > > > the HF7X10 not using, or having the tail stock mounted. So moving
          away
          > from the chuck would be positive values.
          > > > Z0 to Z10. Moving toward the chuck would be negative values. -Z10 to
          -Z0.
          > > >
          > > > X axis would be X0 center line of chuck or bed-ways, +X values moves
          > > > from center line to the max value the cross slide can move out
          > > > toward operator. For
          > > > HF7X10 probably somewhere near +X3.
          > > >
          > > > So anytime your cutting tool is moving INTO your stock, your going
          > > > to be going in -(negative value) on the X axis (cross slide moving
          > > > away from
          > > > operator) and in a -(negative value) on the Z axis? Correct? Yes,No!
          > > >
          > > > Am I going in the right direction with my thinking?
          > >
          > >
          > > Your Z-axis is the spindle, negative is always towards the spindle, and
          positive
          > away from it (mill is the same), so what you're thinking is correct.
          > >
          > > The origin is set by you, but is typically it's the right edge of your
          work piece.
          > In most cases the Z coordinates used would be negative values.
          > >
          > > The origin for the X-axis is the spindle centerline, again as you were
          > > thinking. Movement on the X-axis is as you say, numbers getting
          > > bigger means the tool moves towards you, getting smaller means going
          > > away. However you don't really have negative X values, that means
          > > you've gone past the middle. (This is the case for your 7x10,
          > > industrial lathes with rear toolposts work in negative.)
          > >
          > > The way to view it is to say the numbers are the diameter of the work
          (the
          > values for X are given in diameter, not radius), so moving the tool to a
          smaller
          > number makes the diameter smaller. If you have a 10mm rod, and you move
          > from 10 to 8, it will take a 1mm cut. Of course the tool is only 5mm from
          the
          > center, and only moves 1mm, but you don't work with the radius and go from
          5
          > to 4. Working with the diameter is how you do it manually anyway.
          > >
          > > It does make sense eventually, stickers on the lathe helps.
          > >
          > > Tony
        • Andy Wander
          Exactly. Andy Wander ... From: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Hood Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 3:22 AM To:
          Message 4 of 20 , Apr 2, 2012
          • 0 Attachment
            Exactly.


            Andy Wander

            -----Original Message-----
            From: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Hood
            Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 3:22 AM
            To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Would like some info and help

            Negative Z is the same on a lathe or a mill. What you have to think about is the work and not the chuck. On both as you cut further into the work piece you are moving in a negative Z direction. In other words when the quill on a mill moves out is cutting deeper into your part and thus a negative Z, on a lathe the axis moving towards the work in the chuck is cutting further into the work so again is moving in a negative Z direction.
            On a lathe, just like on a mill, the end of the work material (or top surface on a mill) is normally set as Z zero in work coordinates.
            Hood

            --- In mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com, Andy Wander <awander@...> wrote:
            >
            > On a vertical mill, negative Z is AWAY from the spindle/chuck, NOT toward the spindle.
            >
            > On a lathe, negative Z is toward the spindle.
            >
            >
            > Andy Wander
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony Smith
            > Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2012 5:09 PM
            > To: mach1mach2cnc@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: RE: [mach1mach2cnc] Re: Would like some info and help
            >
            > > Now let's see if I understand correctly. The face of the chuck or the face of the
            > > chuck jaws would be considered Z 0(zero) going to the right toward the tail
            > > stock would be Z + (plus) lets say Z10 for the HF7X10 not using, or having the
            > > tail stock mounted. So moving away from the chuck would be positive values.
            > > Z0 to Z10. Moving toward the chuck would be negative values. -Z10 to -Z0.
            > >
            > > X axis would be X0 center line of chuck or bed-ways, +X values moves from
            > > center line to the max value the cross slide can move out toward operator. For
            > > HF7X10 probably somewhere near +X3.
            > >
            > > So anytime your cutting tool is moving INTO your stock, your going to be going
            > > in -(negative value) on the X axis (cross slide moving away from
            > > operator) and in a -(negative value) on the Z axis? Correct? Yes,No!
            > >
            > > Am I going in the right direction with my thinking?
            >
            >
            > Your Z-axis is the spindle, negative is always towards the spindle, and positive away from it (mill is the same), so what you're thinking is correct.
            >
            > The origin is set by you, but is typically it's the right edge of your work piece. In most cases the Z coordinates used would be negative values.
            >
            > The origin for the X-axis is the spindle centerline, again as you were thinking. Movement on the X-axis is as you say, numbers getting bigger means the tool moves towards you, getting smaller means going away. However you don't really have negative X values, that means you've gone past the middle. (This is the case for your 7x10, industrial lathes with rear toolposts work in negative.)
            >
            > The way to view it is to say the numbers are the diameter of the work (the values for X are given in diameter, not radius), so moving the tool to a smaller number makes the diameter smaller. If you have a 10mm rod, and you move from 10 to 8, it will take a 1mm cut. Of course the tool is only 5mm from the center, and only moves 1mm, but you don't work with the radius and go from 5 to 4. Working with the diameter is how you do it manually anyway.
            >
            > It does make sense eventually, stickers on the lathe helps.
            >
            > Tony
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > www.machsupport.com - Web site AccessYahoo! Groups Links
            >




            ------------------------------------

            www.machsupport.com - Web site AccessYahoo! Groups Links
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