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Re: Sink Drain

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  • Bruce Puckett
    Henry and Eric, I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink drain. I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to install it, but the
    Message 1 of 28 , Aug 16, 2005
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      Henry and Eric,
      I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
      drain. I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to install
      it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his through
      hull is slightly flexible on JoJo. Have you had any problems with
      possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole where
      the fitting is installed? Also, Eric, have you made this
      modification or did you go another route?

      Thanks,
      Bruce
      JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry
      Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
      > Eric
      >
      > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you want
      to
      > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size), click
      on the
      > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
      >
      > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with a sea
      cock,
      > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with any
      water
      > coming back in.
      >
      > Henry
      >
      > eo_ant wrote:
      >
      > >
      > > Henry,
      > >
      > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes listed as
      > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the way to
      get to
      > > full size.
      > >
      > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru hull
      fitting.
      > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run tubing
      directly to
      > > the drain?
      > >
      > > Eric
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
      > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
      > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose for the
      sink.
      > > See
      > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I mounted the
      thru
      > > hull.
      > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see better.
      Works
      > > good.
      > > >
      > > > Henry
      > > > http:// www.geocites.com/henry_ning
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > eo_ant wrote:
      > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a limp
      plastic jug.
      > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too close to
      the side to
      > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain below the
      sink.
      > > > >
      > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
      > > > >
      > > > > Eric
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > -----------------------------------------------------------------
      -------
      > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > >
      > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
      > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
      > > > >
      > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > > > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      > > > >
      > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
      subject=Unsubscribe>
      > > > >
      > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
      Terms of
      > > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > -----------------------------------------------------------------
      -------
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > >
      > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
      > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
      > >
      > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
      subject=Unsubscribe>
      > >
      > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
      > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
      > >
      > >
    • eo_ant
      Bruce, I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking about it backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting water into the boat
      Message 2 of 28 , Aug 17, 2005
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        Bruce,

        I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking about it
        backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting water
        into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the boat as
        the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far enough
        for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in rough
        water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded problem
        of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink. Many
        boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink as
        close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as practical.

        One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the far
        side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all the way
        over one opening would always be above the water level.

        The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard line up
        through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into the
        hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now passes
        through. No additional holes in the hull required.

        I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been on the
        back burner.

        My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of the mast
        support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently in the
        center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested that even
        if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard trunk it
        might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a notch
        out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut off the
        head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the nut and
        bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With the
        bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
        centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and install
        my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and lower the
        centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until I get
        the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the top of
        the trunk where the post is located.


        Eric


        --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
        <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
        > Henry and Eric,
        > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
        > drain. I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to install
        > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his through
        > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo. Have you had any problems with
        > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole where
        > the fitting is installed? Also, Eric, have you made this
        > modification or did you go another route?
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Bruce
        > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry
        > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
        > > Eric
        > >
        > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you want
        > to
        > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size), click
        > on the
        > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
        > >
        > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with a sea
        > cock,
        > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with any
        > water
        > > coming back in.
        > >
        > > Henry
        > >
        > > eo_ant wrote:
        > >
        > > >
        > > > Henry,
        > > >
        > > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes listed as
        > > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the way to
        > get to
        > > > full size.
        > > >
        > > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru hull
        > fitting.
        > > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run tubing
        > directly to
        > > > the drain?
        > > >
        > > > Eric
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
        > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
        > > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose for the
        > sink.
        > > > See
        > > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I mounted the
        > thru
        > > > hull.
        > > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see better.
        > Works
        > > > good.
        > > > >
        > > > > Henry
        > > > > http:// www.geocites.com/henry_ning
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > eo_ant wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a limp
        > plastic jug.
        > > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too close to
        > the side to
        > > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain below the
        > sink.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Eric
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > -----------------------------------------------------------------
        > -------
        > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
        > > > > >
        > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
        > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
        > > > > >
        > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > > > > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        > > > > >
        > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
        > subject=Unsubscribe>
        > > > > >
        > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
        > Terms of
        > > > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > -----------------------------------------------------------------
        > -------
        > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
        > > >
        > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
        > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
        > > >
        > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
        > subject=Unsubscribe>
        > > >
        > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
        > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
        > > >
        > > >
      • Henry Ning
        You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come in. The drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water would come in quite slowly.
        Message 3 of 28 , Aug 18, 2005
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          Message
          You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come in. The drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water would come in quite slowly.  Despite that I also put a rubber cork in the sink when we are out as a precaution. I have never had a problem with it.
           
          We got used to having a sink on our previous power boat so it gets used quite a bit. I shudder at the thought of that water draining into the bilge... and there's no way I wanted to deal with having it drain into a separate container and having to dump it all the time.
           
          Henry
          -----Original Message-----
          From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eo_ant
          Sent: August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
          To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain

          Bruce,

          I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking about it
          backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting water
          into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the boat as
          the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far enough
          for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in rough
          water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded problem
          of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink. Many
          boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink as
          close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as practical.

          One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the far
          side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all the way
          over one opening would always be above the water level.

          The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard line up
          through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into the
          hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now passes
          through. No additional holes in the hull required.

          I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been on the
          back burner.

          My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of the mast
          support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently in the
          center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested that even
          if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard trunk it
          might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a notch
          out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut off the
          head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the nut and
          bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With the
          bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
          centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and install
          my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and lower the
          centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until I get
          the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the top of
          the trunk where the post is located.


          Eric


          --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
          <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
          > Henry and Eric, 
          > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
          > drain.  I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to install
          > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his through
          > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo.  Have you had any problems with
          > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole where
          > the fitting is installed?  Also, Eric, have you made this
          > modification or did you go another route?
          >
          > Thanks,
          > Bruce
          > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry
          > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
          > > Eric
          > >
          > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you want
          > to
          > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size), click
          > on the
          > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
          > >
          > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with a sea
          > cock,
          > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with any
          > water
          > > coming back in.
          > >
          > > Henry
          > >
          > > eo_ant wrote:
          > >
          > > >
          > > > Henry,
          > > >
          > > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes listed as
          > > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the way to
          > get to
          > > > full size.
          > > >
          > > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru hull
          > fitting.
          > > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run tubing
          > directly to
          > > > the drain?
          > > >
          > > > Eric
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
          > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
          > > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose for the
          > sink.
          > > > See
          > > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I mounted the
          > thru
          > > > hull.
          > > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see better.
          > Works
          > > > good.
          > > > >
          > > > > Henry
          > > > > http:// www.geocites.com/henry_ning
          > > > >
          > > > >
          > > > > eo_ant wrote:
          > > > >
          > > > > >
          > > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a limp
          > plastic jug.
          > > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too close to
          > the side to
          > > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain below the
          > sink.
          > > > > >
          > > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
          > > > > >
          > > > > > Eric
          > > > > >
          > > > > >
          > > > > >
          > > > > >
          > > > > >
          > > > -----------------------------------------------------------------
          > -------
          > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > > > > >
          > > > > >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
          > > > > >       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
          > > > > >      
          > > > > >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > > > > >       macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > > > > >    
          > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
          > subject=Unsubscribe>
          > > > > >      
          > > > > >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
          > Terms of
          > > > > >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
          > > > > >
          > > > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > > > -----------------------------------------------------------------
          > -------
          > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > > >
          > > >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
          > > >       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
          > > >       
          > > >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > > >       macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > > >       <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
          > subject=Unsubscribe>
          > > >       
          > > >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
          > > >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
          > > >
          > > >


        • Bruce Puckett
          Henry, I bought a nylon through hull that needs a 3/4 inch hole and 1/2 inch hose. Is this the same size as you used or larger? I am just worried that after
          Message 4 of 28 , Aug 18, 2005
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            Henry,
            I bought a nylon through hull that needs a 3/4 inch hole and 1/2 inch
            hose. Is this the same size as you used or larger? I am just
            worried that after putting the through hull in, the hull will be
            weaker in that area. I trailer my boat a lot and I am constantly in
            different situations with docks. Just afraid if I come in and hit
            the dock on the through hull, it might be easier to crack the hull.
            Thanks to You and Eric for the info.

            Bruce


            --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
            <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
            > You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come in. The
            > drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water would
            come
            > in quite slowly. Despite that I also put a rubber cork in the sink
            when
            > we are out as a precaution. I have never had a problem with it.
            >
            > We got used to having a sink on our previous power boat so it gets
            used
            > quite a bit. I shudder at the thought of that water draining into
            the
            > bilge... and there's no way I wanted to deal with having it drain
            into a
            > separate container and having to dump it all the time.
            >
            > Henry
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
            > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eo_ant
            > Sent: August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
            > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
            >
            >
            > Bruce,
            >
            > I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking about it
            > backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting water
            > into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the boat as
            > the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far
            enough
            > for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in rough
            > water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded problem
            > of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink. Many
            > boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink as
            > close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as
            practical.
            >
            > One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the far
            > side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all the way
            > over one opening would always be above the water level.
            >
            > The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard line
            up
            > through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into the
            > hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now passes
            > through. No additional holes in the hull required.
            >
            > I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been on the
            > back burner.
            >
            > My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of the
            mast
            > support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently in the
            > center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested that
            even
            > if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard trunk it
            > might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a notch
            > out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut off the
            > head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the nut and
            > bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With the
            > bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
            > centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and install
            > my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and lower
            the
            > centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until I get
            > the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the top of
            > the trunk where the post is located.
            >
            >
            > Eric
            >
            >
            > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
            > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
            > > Henry and Eric,
            > > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
            > > drain. I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to
            install
            > > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his through
            > > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo. Have you had any problems
            with
            > > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole
            where
            > > the fitting is installed? Also, Eric, have you made this
            > > modification or did you go another route?
            > >
            > > Thanks,
            > > Bruce
            > > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry
            > > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
            > > > Eric
            > > >
            > > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you
            want
            > > to
            > > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size),
            click
            > > on the
            > > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
            > > >
            > > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with a
            sea
            > > cock,
            > > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with
            any
            > > water
            > > > coming back in.
            > > >
            > > > Henry
            > > >
            > > > eo_ant wrote:
            > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > Henry,
            > > > >
            > > > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes listed as
            > > > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the way
            to
            > > get to
            > > > > full size.
            > > > >
            > > > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru hull
            > > fitting.
            > > > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run tubing
            > > directly to
            > > > > the drain?
            > > > >
            > > > > Eric
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
            > > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
            > > > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose for
            the
            > > sink.
            > > > > See
            > > > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I mounted
            the
            > > thru
            > > > > hull.
            > > > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see
            better.
            > > Works
            > > > > good.
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Henry
            > > > > > http:// www.geocites.com/henry_ning
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > > eo_ant wrote:
            > > > > >
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a limp
            > > plastic jug.
            > > > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too close
            to
            > > the side to
            > > > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain below
            the
            > > sink.
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > Eric
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > >
            > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------
            ---
            > > -------
            > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
            > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > > > > > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > > > > > >
            > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
            > > subject=Unsubscribe>
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
            > > Terms of
            > > > > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
            > > > > > >
            > > > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------
            ---
            > > -------
            > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > > > >
            > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
            > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
            > > > >
            > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > > > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-
            unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
            > > subject=Unsubscribe>
            > > > >
            > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
            Terms of
            > > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
            > > > >
            > > > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > _____
            >
            > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
            >
            >
            >
            > * Visit your group "macgregor19sailboats
            > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats> " on the web.
            >
            >
            > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
            subject=Unsubsc
            > ribe>
            >
            >
            > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
            > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
            >
            >
            > _____
          • Chris
            I m with Henry for the exactly same reasons I put a thru-hull in for the sink. I mounted it low in the hull so that it wouldn t have any issues with hitting
            Message 5 of 28 , Aug 18, 2005
            • 0 Attachment
              I'm with Henry for the exactly same reasons I put a thru-hull in for
              the sink. I mounted it low in the hull so that it wouldn't have any
              issues with hitting the dock, but high enough above the water line
              so that it would only infrequently get water in it.

              Bruce, I used the same thru-hull that it sounds like you have.
              When I used the 3/4" hole saw, it unfortunately made a hole a little
              bit larger than that. I also noted how thin the hull was there and
              got concerned with the installation. I compensated by buying some
              fiberglass impregnated resin at Home Depot and gooped it up a bit
              after installing the thru-hull using 3M 5200 and attaching the 1/2"
              line from the sink drain. It made something like a 4" inverted cone
              when I was done and I think that it was sufficiently strong at that
              point.

              -Chris

              --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
              <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
              > Henry,
              > I bought a nylon through hull that needs a 3/4 inch hole and 1/2
              inch
              > hose. Is this the same size as you used or larger? I am just
              > worried that after putting the through hull in, the hull will be
              > weaker in that area. I trailer my boat a lot and I am constantly
              in
              > different situations with docks. Just afraid if I come in and hit
              > the dock on the through hull, it might be easier to crack the hull.
              > Thanks to You and Eric for the info.
              >
              > Bruce
              >
              >
              > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
              > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
              > > You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come in.
              The
              > > drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water
              would
              > come
              > > in quite slowly. Despite that I also put a rubber cork in the
              sink
              > when
              > > we are out as a precaution. I have never had a problem with it.
              > >
              > > We got used to having a sink on our previous power boat so it
              gets
              > used
              > > quite a bit. I shudder at the thought of that water draining
              into
              > the
              > > bilge... and there's no way I wanted to deal with having it
              drain
              > into a
              > > separate container and having to dump it all the time.
              > >
              > > Henry
              > >
              > > -----Original Message-----
              > > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
              > > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eo_ant
              > > Sent: August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
              > > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
              > > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
              > >
              > >
              > > Bruce,
              > >
              > > I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking
              about it
              > > backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting
              water
              > > into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the
              boat as
              > > the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far
              > enough
              > > for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in
              rough
              > > water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded
              problem
              > > of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink.
              Many
              > > boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink as
              > > close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as
              > practical.
              > >
              > > One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the
              far
              > > side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all the
              way
              > > over one opening would always be above the water level.
              > >
              > > The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard
              line
              > up
              > > through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into
              the
              > > hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now
              passes
              > > through. No additional holes in the hull required.
              > >
              > > I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been on
              the
              > > back burner.
              > >
              > > My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of
              the
              > mast
              > > support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently in
              the
              > > center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested
              that
              > even
              > > if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard
              trunk it
              > > might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a
              notch
              > > out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut off
              the
              > > head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the nut
              and
              > > bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With
              the
              > > bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
              > > centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and
              install
              > > my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and
              lower
              > the
              > > centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until I
              get
              > > the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the
              top of
              > > the trunk where the post is located.
              > >
              > >
              > > Eric
              > >
              > >
              > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
              > > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
              > > > Henry and Eric,
              > > > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
              > > > drain. I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to
              > install
              > > > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his
              through
              > > > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo. Have you had any problems
              > with
              > > > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole
              > where
              > > > the fitting is installed? Also, Eric, have you made this
              > > > modification or did you go another route?
              > > >
              > > > Thanks,
              > > > Bruce
              > > > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com,
              Henry
              > > > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
              > > > > Eric
              > > > >
              > > > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you
              > want
              > > > to
              > > > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size),
              > click
              > > > on the
              > > > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
              > > > >
              > > > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with
              a
              > sea
              > > > cock,
              > > > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with
              > any
              > > > water
              > > > > coming back in.
              > > > >
              > > > > Henry
              > > > >
              > > > > eo_ant wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > > Henry,
              > > > > >
              > > > > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes
              listed as
              > > > > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the
              way
              > to
              > > > get to
              > > > > > full size.
              > > > > >
              > > > > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru hull
              > > > fitting.
              > > > > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run tubing
              > > > directly to
              > > > > > the drain?
              > > > > >
              > > > > > Eric
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
              > > > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
              > > > > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose
              for
              > the
              > > > sink.
              > > > > > See
              > > > > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I
              mounted
              > the
              > > > thru
              > > > > > hull.
              > > > > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see
              > better.
              > > > Works
              > > > > > good.
              > > > > > >
              > > > > > > Henry
              > > > > > > http:// www.geocites.com/henry_ning
              > > > > > >
              > > > > > >
              > > > > > > eo_ant wrote:
              > > > > > >
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a
              limp
              > > > plastic jug.
              > > > > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too
              close
              > to
              > > > the side to
              > > > > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain
              below
              > the
              > > > sink.
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > > Eric
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > -----------------------------------------------------------
              ---
              > ---
              > > > -------
              > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
              > > > > > > >
              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > > > > > > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
              > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
              Yahoo!
              > > > Terms of
              > > > > > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > > > > > -----------------------------------------------------------
              ---
              > ---
              > > > -------
              > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > > > > >
              > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
              > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
              > > > > >
              > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > > > > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-
              > unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
              > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
              > > > > >
              > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
              > Terms of
              > > > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
              > > > > >
              > > > > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > _____
              > >
              > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > * Visit your group "macgregor19sailboats
              > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats> " on the
              web.
              > >
              > >
              > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
              > subject=Unsubsc
              > > ribe>
              > >
              > >
              > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
              > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
              > >
              > >
              > > _____
            • Henry Ning
              It s also the same thru-hull that I used. I put an S loop in the hose going up to the sink drain. In the fall, before storing away the boat, I make sure I get
              Message 6 of 28 , Aug 19, 2005
              • 0 Attachment
                Message
                It's also the same thru-hull that I used. I put an S loop in the hose going up to the sink drain. In the fall, before storing away the boat, I make sure I get all the water out of the hose. Chris, I didn't have any trouble with the hole saw... it was a pretty snug fit. Instead of the 5200, I used 4200 in case I ever needed to replace the thru-hull. By the way, good idea on adding the extra resin for strength.... I got some POR-15 Resto Grip laying around... maybe I'll put a thick layer of that around the area.
                 
                Regards,
                Henry
                -----Original Message-----
                From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris
                Sent: August 18, 2005 6:09 PM
                To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain

                I'm with Henry for the exactly same reasons I put a thru-hull in for
                the sink.  I mounted it low in the hull so that it wouldn't have any
                issues with hitting the dock, but high enough above the water line
                so that it would only infrequently get water in it. 

                Bruce, I used the same thru-hull that it sounds like you have.  
                When I used the 3/4" hole saw, it unfortunately made a hole a little
                bit larger than that.  I also noted how thin the hull was there and
                got concerned with the installation.  I compensated by buying some
                fiberglass impregnated resin at Home Depot and gooped it up a bit
                after installing the thru-hull using 3M 5200 and attaching the 1/2"
                line from the sink drain.  It made something like a 4" inverted cone
                when I was done and I think that it was sufficiently strong at that
                point.

                -Chris

                --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                > Henry,
                > I bought a nylon through hull that needs a 3/4 inch hole and 1/2
                inch
                > hose.  Is this the same size as you used or larger?  I am just
                > worried that after putting the through hull in, the hull will be
                > weaker in that area. I trailer my boat a lot and I am constantly
                in
                > different situations with docks.  Just afraid if I come in and hit
                > the dock on the through hull, it might be easier to crack the hull.
                > Thanks to You and Eric for the info.
                >
                > Bruce
                >
                >
                > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                > > You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come in.
                The
                > > drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water
                would
                > come
                > > in quite slowly.  Despite that I also put a rubber cork in the
                sink
                > when
                > > we are out as a precaution. I have never had a problem with it.
                > > 
                > > We got used to having a sink on our previous power boat so it
                gets
                > used
                > > quite a bit. I shudder at the thought of that water draining
                into
                > the
                > > bilge... and there's no way I wanted to deal with having it
                drain
                > into a
                > > separate container and having to dump it all the time.
                > > 
                > > Henry
                > >
                > > -----Original Message-----
                > > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                > > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eo_ant
                > > Sent: August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
                > > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
                > >
                > >
                > > Bruce,
                > >
                > > I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking
                about it
                > > backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting
                water
                > > into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the
                boat as
                > > the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far
                > enough
                > > for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in
                rough
                > > water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded
                problem
                > > of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink.
                Many
                > > boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink as
                > > close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as
                > practical.
                > >
                > > One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the
                far
                > > side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all the
                way
                > > over one opening would always be above the water level.
                > >
                > > The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard
                line
                > up
                > > through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into
                the
                > > hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now
                passes
                > > through. No additional holes in the hull required.
                > >
                > > I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been on
                the
                > > back burner.
                > >
                > > My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of
                the
                > mast
                > > support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently in
                the
                > > center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested
                that
                > even
                > > if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard
                trunk it
                > > might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a
                notch
                > > out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut off
                the
                > > head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the nut
                and
                > > bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With
                the
                > > bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
                > > centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and
                install
                > > my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and
                lower
                > the
                > > centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until I
                get
                > > the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the
                top of
                > > the trunk where the post is located.
                > >
                > >
                > > Eric
                > >
                > >
                > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                > > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                > > > Henry and Eric, 
                > > > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
                > > > drain.  I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to
                > install
                > > > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his
                through
                > > > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo.  Have you had any problems
                > with
                > > > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole
                > where
                > > > the fitting is installed?  Also, Eric, have you made this
                > > > modification or did you go another route?
                > > >
                > > > Thanks,
                > > > Bruce
                > > > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com,
                Henry
                > > > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                > > > > Eric
                > > > >
                > > > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you
                > want
                > > > to
                > > > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size),
                > click
                > > > on the
                > > > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
                > > > >
                > > > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with
                a
                > sea
                > > > cock,
                > > > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with
                > any
                > > > water
                > > > > coming back in.
                > > > >
                > > > > Henry
                > > > >
                > > > > eo_ant wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Henry,
                > > > > >
                > > > > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes
                listed as
                > > > > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the
                way
                > to
                > > > get to
                > > > > > full size.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru hull
                > > > fitting.
                > > > > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run tubing
                > > > directly to
                > > > > > the drain?
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Eric
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
                > > > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                > > > > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose
                for
                > the
                > > > sink.
                > > > > > See
                > > > > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I
                mounted
                > the
                > > > thru
                > > > > > hull.
                > > > > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see
                > better.
                > > > Works
                > > > > > good.
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > Henry
                > > > > > > http:// www.geocites.com/henry_ning
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > eo_ant wrote:
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a
                limp
                > > > plastic jug.
                > > > > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too
                close
                > to
                > > > the side to
                > > > > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain
                below
                > the
                > > > sink.
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > > Eric
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > -----------------------------------------------------------
                ---
                > ---
                > > > -------
                > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                > > > > > > >      
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
                > > > > > > >      
                > > > > > > >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                > > > > > > >       macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                > > > > > > >    
                > > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
                > > > > > > >      
                > > > > > > >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
                Yahoo!
                > > > Terms of
                > > > > > > >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > -----------------------------------------------------------
                ---
                > ---
                > > > -------
                > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > > > > >
                > > > > >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                > > > > >       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
                > > > > >       
                > > > > >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                > > > > >       macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                > > > > >       <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-
                > unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
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                > > > > >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                > Terms of
                > > > > >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
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                > > > > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >   _____ 
                > >
                > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
                > >
                > >
                > >      
                > > *      Visit your group "macgregor19sailboats
                > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats> " on the
                web.
                > >  
                > >
                > > *      To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                > >  macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
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                > > ribe>
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                > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
                > >
                > >
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              • Joe Wilburn
                Henry, Is it your boat that has the wheel steering? Joe Henry Ning wrote: It s also the same thru-hull that I used. I put an S loop
                Message 7 of 28 , Aug 20, 2005
                • 0 Attachment
                  Henry,
                   
                  Is it your boat that has the wheel steering?
                   
                  Joe

                  Henry Ning <henry.ning@...> wrote:
                  It's also the same thru-hull that I used. I put an S loop in the hose going up to the sink drain. In the fall, before storing away the boat, I make sure I get all the water out of the hose. Chris, I didn't have any trouble with the hole saw... it was a pretty snug fit. Instead of the 5200, I used 4200 in case I ever needed to replace the thru-hull. By the way, good idea on adding the extra resin for strength.... I got some POR-15 Resto Grip laying around... maybe I'll put a thick layer of that around the area.
                   
                  Regards,
                  Henry
                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris
                  Sent: August 18, 2005 6:09 PM
                  To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain

                  I'm with Henry for the exactly same reasons I put a thru-hull in for
                  the sink.  I mounted it low in the hull so that it wouldn't have any
                  issues with hitting the dock, but high enough above the water line
                  so that it would only infrequently get water in it. 

                  Bruce, I used the same thru-hull that it sounds like you have.  
                  When I used the 3/4" hole saw, it unfortunately made a hole a little
                  bit larger than that.  I also noted how thin the hull was there and
                  got concerned with the installation.  I compensated by buying some
                  fiberglass impregnated resin at Home Depot and gooped it up a bit
                  after installing the thru-hull using 3M 5200 and attaching the 1/2"
                  line from the sink drain.  It made something like a 4" inverted cone
                  when I was done and I think that it was sufficiently strong at that
                  point.

                  -Chris

                  --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                  <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                  > Henry,
                  > I bought a nylon through hull that needs a 3/4 inch hole and 1/2
                  inch
                  > hose.  Is this the same size as you used or larger?  I am just
                  > worried that after putting the through hull in, the hull will be
                  > weaker in that area. I trailer my boat a lot and I am constantly
                  in
                  > different situations with docks.  Just afraid if I come in and hit
                  > the dock on the through hull, it might be easier to crack the hull.
                  > Thanks to You and Eric for the info.
                  >
                  > Bruce
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                  > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                  > > You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come in.
                  The
                  > > drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water
                  would
                  > come
                  > > in quite slowly.  Despite that I also put a rubber cork in the
                  sink
                  > when
                  > > we are out as a precaution. I have never had a problem with it.
                  > > 
                  > > We got used to having a sink on our previous power boat so it
                  gets
                  > used
                  > > quite a bit. I shudder at the thought of that water draining
                  into
                  > the
                  > > bilge... and there's no way I wanted to deal with having it
                  drain
                  > into a
                  > > separate container and having to dump it all the time.
                  > > 
                  > > Henry
                  > >
                  > > -----Original Message-----
                  > > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                  > > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eo_ant
                  > > Sent: August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
                  > > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                  > > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Bruce,
                  > >
                  > > I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking
                  about it
                  > > backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting
                  water
                  > > into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the
                  boat as
                  > > the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far
                  > enough
                  > > for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in
                  rough
                  > > water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded
                  problem
                  > > of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink.
                  Many
                  > > boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink as
                  > > close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as
                  > practical.
                  > >
                  > > One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the
                  far
                  > > side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all the
                  way
                  > > over one opening would always be above the water level.
                  > >
                  > > The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard
                  line
                  > up
                  > > through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into
                  the
                  > > hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now
                  passes
                  > > through. No additional holes in the hull required.
                  > >
                  > > I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been on
                  the
                  > > back burner.
                  > >
                  > > My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of
                  the
                  > mast
                  > > support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently in
                  the
                  > > center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested
                  that
                  > even
                  > > if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard
                  trunk it
                  > > might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a
                  notch
                  > > out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut off
                  the
                  > > head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the nut
                  and
                  > > bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With
                  the
                  > > bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
                  > > centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and
                  install
                  > > my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and
                  lower
                  > the
                  > > centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until I
                  get
                  > > the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the
                  top of
                  > > the trunk where the post is located.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Eric
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                  > > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                  > > > Henry and Eric, 
                  > > > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
                  > > > drain.  I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to
                  > install
                  > > > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his
                  through
                  > > > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo.  Have you had any problems
                  > with
                  > > > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole
                  > where
                  > > > the fitting is installed?  Also, Eric, have you made this
                  > > > modification or did you go another route?
                  > > >
                  > > > Thanks,
                  > > > Bruce
                  > > > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com,
                  Henry
                  > > > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                  > > > > Eric
                  > > > >
                  > > > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you
                  > want
                  > > > to
                  > > > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size),
                  > click
                  > > > on the
                  > > > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with
                  a
                  > sea
                  > > > cock,
                  > > > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with
                  > any
                  > > > water
                  > > > > coming back in.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Henry
                  > > > >
                  > > > > eo_ant wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Henry,
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes
                  listed as
                  > > > > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the
                  way
                  > to
                  > > > get to
                  > > > > > full size.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru hull
                  > > > fitting.
                  > > > > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run tubing
                  > > > directly to
                  > > > > > the drain?
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Eric
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
                  > > > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                  > > > > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose
                  for
                  > the
                  > > > sink.
                  > > > > > See
                  > > > > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I
                  mounted
                  > the
                  > > > thru
                  > > > > > hull.
                  > > > > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see
                  > better.
                  > > > Works
                  > > > > > good.
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > Henry
                  > > > > > > http:// www.geocites.com/henry_ning
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > eo_ant wrote:
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a
                  limp
                  > > > plastic jug.
                  > > > > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too
                  close
                  > to
                  > > > the side to
                  > > > > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain
                  below
                  > the
                  > > > sink.
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > Eric
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > -----------------------------------------------------------
                  ---
                  > ---
                  > > > -------
                  > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                  > > > > > > >      
                  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
                  > > > > > > >      
                  > > > > > > >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  > > > > > > >       macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > > > > > > >    
                  > > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                  > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
                  > > > > > > >      
                  > > > > > > >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
                  Yahoo!
                  > > > Terms of
                  > > > > > > >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > -----------------------------------------------------------
                  ---
                  > ---
                  > > > -------
                  > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                  > > > > >       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
                  > > > > >       
                  > > > > >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  > > > > >       macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > > > > >       <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-
                  > unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                  > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
                  > > > > >       
                  > > > > >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                  > Terms of
                  > > > > >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >   _____ 
                  > >
                  > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >      
                  > > *      Visit your group "macgregor19sailboats
                  > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats> " on the
                  web.
                  > >  
                  > >
                  > > *      To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  > >  macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                  > subject=Unsubsc
                  > > ribe>
                  > >  
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                  > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
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                • Ron Buckles
                  My wife had a good idea: Why not pump out the holding tank with a (or the) bilge pump. Then you simply run a hose over the side or out the hole for the
                  Message 8 of 28 , Aug 20, 2005
                  • 0 Attachment
                    My wife had a good idea:

                    Why not pump out the holding tank with a (or the) bilge pump. Then you
                    simply run a hose over the side or out the hole for the battery cables.

                    Ron

                    --- Henry Ning <henry.ning@...> wrote:

                    > It's also the same thru-hull that I used. I put an S loop in the hose
                    > going up to the sink drain. In the fall, before storing away the
                    > boat, I
                    > make sure I get all the water out of the hose. Chris, I didn't have
                    > any
                    > trouble with the hole saw... it was a pretty snug fit. Instead of the
                    > 5200, I used 4200 in case I ever needed to replace the thru-hull. By
                    > the
                    > way, good idea on adding the extra resin for strength.... I got some
                    > POR-15 Resto Grip laying around... maybe I'll put a thick layer of
                    > that
                    > around the area.
                    >
                    > Regards,
                    > Henry
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                    > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris
                    > Sent: August 18, 2005 6:09 PM
                    > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
                    >
                    >
                    > I'm with Henry for the exactly same reasons I put a thru-hull in for
                    > the sink. I mounted it low in the hull so that it wouldn't have any
                    > issues with hitting the dock, but high enough above the water line
                    > so that it would only infrequently get water in it.
                    >
                    > Bruce, I used the same thru-hull that it sounds like you have.
                    > When I used the 3/4" hole saw, it unfortunately made a hole a little
                    > bit larger than that. I also noted how thin the hull was there and
                    > got concerned with the installation. I compensated by buying some
                    > fiberglass impregnated resin at Home Depot and gooped it up a bit
                    > after installing the thru-hull using 3M 5200 and attaching the 1/2"
                    > line from the sink drain. It made something like a 4" inverted cone
                    > when I was done and I think that it was sufficiently strong at that
                    > point.
                    >
                    > -Chris
                    >
                    > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                    > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                    > > Henry,
                    > > I bought a nylon through hull that needs a 3/4 inch hole and 1/2
                    > inch
                    > > hose. Is this the same size as you used or larger? I am just
                    > > worried that after putting the through hull in, the hull will be
                    > > weaker in that area. I trailer my boat a lot and I am constantly
                    > in
                    > > different situations with docks. Just afraid if I come in and hit
                    > > the dock on the through hull, it might be easier to crack the hull.
                    > > Thanks to You and Eric for the info.
                    > >
                    > > Bruce
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                    > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                    > > > You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come in.
                    > The
                    > > > drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water
                    > would
                    > > come
                    > > > in quite slowly. Despite that I also put a rubber cork in the
                    > sink
                    > > when
                    > > > we are out as a precaution. I have never had a problem with it.
                    > > >
                    > > > We got used to having a sink on our previous power boat so it
                    > gets
                    > > used
                    > > > quite a bit. I shudder at the thought of that water draining
                    > into
                    > > the
                    > > > bilge... and there's no way I wanted to deal with having it
                    > drain
                    > > into a
                    > > > separate container and having to dump it all the time.
                    > > >
                    > > > Henry
                    > > >
                    > > > -----Original Message-----
                    > > > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                    > > > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eo_ant
                    > > > Sent: August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
                    > > > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                    > > > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Bruce,
                    > > >
                    > > > I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking
                    > about it
                    > > > backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting
                    > water
                    > > > into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the
                    > boat as
                    > > > the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far
                    > > enough
                    > > > for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in
                    > rough
                    > > > water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded
                    > problem
                    > > > of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink.
                    > Many
                    > > > boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink as
                    > > > close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as
                    > > practical.
                    > > >
                    > > > One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the
                    > far
                    > > > side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all the
                    > way
                    > > > over one opening would always be above the water level.
                    > > >
                    > > > The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard
                    > line
                    > > up
                    > > > through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into
                    > the
                    > > > hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now
                    > passes
                    > > > through. No additional holes in the hull required.
                    > > >
                    > > > I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been on
                    > the
                    > > > back burner.
                    > > >
                    > > > My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of
                    > the
                    > > mast
                    > > > support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently in
                    > the
                    > > > center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested
                    > that
                    > > even
                    > > > if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard
                    > trunk it
                    > > > might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a
                    > notch
                    > > > out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut off
                    > the
                    > > > head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the nut
                    > and
                    > > > bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With
                    > the
                    > > > bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
                    > > > centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and
                    > install
                    > > > my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and
                    > lower
                    > > the
                    > > > centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until I
                    > get
                    > > > the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the
                    > top of
                    > > > the trunk where the post is located.
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Eric
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                    > > > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                    > > > > Henry and Eric,
                    > > > > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
                    > > > > drain. I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to
                    > > install
                    > > > > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his
                    > through
                    > > > > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo. Have you had any problems
                    > > with
                    > > > > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole
                    > > where
                    > > > > the fitting is installed? Also, Eric, have you made this
                    > > > > modification or did you go another route?
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Thanks,
                    > > > > Bruce
                    > > > > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com,
                    > Henry
                    > > > > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                    > > > > > Eric
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you
                    > > want
                    > > > > to
                    > > > > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size),
                    > > click
                    > > > > on the
                    > > > > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with
                    > a
                    > > sea
                    > > > > cock,
                    > > > > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with
                    > > any
                    > > > > water
                    > > > > > coming back in.
                    >
                    === message truncated ===
                  • Henry Ning
                    Joe No, it s not my boat. A fella who I was corresponding with sent them to me. I posted them up since there was interest from people in the group in
                    Message 9 of 28 , Aug 20, 2005
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Message
                      Joe
                       
                      No, it's not my boat. A fella who I was corresponding with sent them to me. I posted them up since there was interest from people in the group in implementing wheel steering. Unfortunately I had a hard drive crash and I have lost all my saved e-mails and have since lost touch with the guy.
                       
                      Regards,
                      Henry
                       
                       
                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe Wilburn
                      Sent: August 20, 2005 3:56 AM
                      To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: RE: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain

                      Henry,
                       
                      Is it your boat that has the wheel steering?
                       
                      Joe

                      Henry Ning <henry.ning@...> wrote:
                      It's also the same thru-hull that I used. I put an S loop in the hose going up to the sink drain. In the fall, before storing away the boat, I make sure I get all the water out of the hose. Chris, I didn't have any trouble with the hole saw... it was a pretty snug fit. Instead of the 5200, I used 4200 in case I ever needed to replace the thru-hull. By the way, good idea on adding the extra resin for strength.... I got some POR-15 Resto Grip laying around... maybe I'll put a thick layer of that around the area.
                       
                      Regards,
                      Henry
                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris
                      Sent: August 18, 2005 6:09 PM
                      To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain

                      I'm with Henry for the exactly same reasons I put a thru-hull in for
                      the sink.  I mounted it low in the hull so that it wouldn't have any
                      issues with hitting the dock, but high enough above the water line
                      so that it would only infrequently get water in it. 

                      Bruce, I used the same thru-hull that it sounds like you have.  
                      When I used the 3/4" hole saw, it unfortunately made a hole a little
                      bit larger than that.  I also noted how thin the hull was there and
                      got concerned with the installation.  I compensated by buying some
                      fiberglass impregnated resin at Home Depot and gooped it up a bit
                      after installing the thru-hull using 3M 5200 and attaching the 1/2"
                      line from the sink drain.  It made something like a 4" inverted cone
                      when I was done and I think that it was sufficiently strong at that
                      point.

                      -Chris

                      --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                      <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                      > Henry,
                      > I bought a nylon through hull that needs a 3/4 inch hole and 1/2
                      inch
                      > hose.  Is this the same size as you used or larger?  I am just
                      > worried that after putting the through hull in, the hull will be
                      > weaker in that area. I trailer my boat a lot and I am constantly
                      in
                      > different situations with docks.  Just afraid if I come in and hit
                      > the dock on the through hull, it might be easier to crack the hull.
                      > Thanks to You and Eric for the info.
                      >
                      > Bruce
                      >
                      >
                      > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                      > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                      > > You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come in.
                      The
                      > > drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water
                      would
                      > come
                      > > in quite slowly.  Despite that I also put a rubber cork in the
                      sink
                      > when
                      > > we are out as a precaution. I have never had a problem with it.
                      > > 
                      > > We got used to having a sink on our previous power boat so it
                      gets
                      > used
                      > > quite a bit. I shudder at the thought of that water draining
                      into
                      > the
                      > > bilge... and there's no way I wanted to deal with having it
                      drain
                      > into a
                      > > separate container and having to dump it all the time.
                      > > 
                      > > Henry
                      > >
                      > > -----Original Message-----
                      > > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                      > > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eo_ant
                      > > Sent: August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
                      > > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                      > > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Bruce,
                      > >
                      > > I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking
                      about it
                      > > backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting
                      water
                      > > into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the
                      boat as
                      > > the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far
                      > enough
                      > > for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in
                      rough
                      > > water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded
                      problem
                      > > of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink.
                      Many
                      > > boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink as
                      > > close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as
                      > practical.
                      > >
                      > > One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the
                      far
                      > > side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all the
                      way
                      > > over one opening would always be above the water level.
                      > >
                      > > The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard
                      line
                      > up
                      > > through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into
                      the
                      > > hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now
                      passes
                      > > through. No additional holes in the hull required.
                      > >
                      > > I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been on
                      the
                      > > back burner.
                      > >
                      > > My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of
                      the
                      > mast
                      > > support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently in
                      the
                      > > center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested
                      that
                      > even
                      > > if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard
                      trunk it
                      > > might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a
                      notch
                      > > out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut off
                      the
                      > > head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the nut
                      and
                      > > bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With
                      the
                      > > bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
                      > > centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and
                      install
                      > > my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and
                      lower
                      > the
                      > > centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until I
                      get
                      > > the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the
                      top of
                      > > the trunk where the post is located.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Eric
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                      > > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                      > > > Henry and Eric, 
                      > > > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the sink
                      > > > drain.  I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to
                      > install
                      > > > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his
                      through
                      > > > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo.  Have you had any problems
                      > with
                      > > > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the hole
                      > where
                      > > > the fitting is installed?  Also, Eric, have you made this
                      > > > modification or did you go another route?
                      > > >
                      > > > Thanks,
                      > > > Bruce
                      > > > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com,
                      Henry
                      > > > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                      > > > > Eric
                      > > > >
                      > > > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo you
                      > want
                      > > > to
                      > > > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size),
                      > click
                      > > > on the
                      > > > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother with
                      a
                      > sea
                      > > > cock,
                      > > > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem with
                      > any
                      > > > water
                      > > > > coming back in.
                      > > > >
                      > > > > Henry
                      > > > >
                      > > > > eo_ant wrote:
                      > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > Henry,
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes
                      listed as
                      > > > > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the
                      way
                      > to
                      > > > get to
                      > > > > > full size.
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru hull
                      > > > fitting.
                      > > > > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run tubing
                      > > > directly to
                      > > > > > the drain?
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > Eric
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
                      > > > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                      > > > > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose
                      for
                      > the
                      > > > sink.
                      > > > > > See
                      > > > > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I
                      mounted
                      > the
                      > > > thru
                      > > > > > hull.
                      > > > > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see
                      > better.
                      > > > Works
                      > > > > > good.
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > Henry
                      > > > > > > http:// www.geocites.com/henry_ning
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > eo_ant wrote:
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a
                      limp
                      > > > plastic jug.
                      > > > > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too
                      close
                      > to
                      > > > the side to
                      > > > > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain
                      below
                      > the
                      > > > sink.
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > Eric
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > -----------------------------------------------------------
                      ---
                      > ---
                      > > > -------
                      > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                      > > > > > > >      
                      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
                      > > > > > > >      
                      > > > > > > >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                      > > > > > > >       macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                      > > > > > > >    
                      > > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                      > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
                      > > > > > > >      
                      > > > > > > >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
                      Yahoo!
                      > > > Terms of
                      > > > > > > >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > -----------------------------------------------------------
                      ---
                      > ---
                      > > > -------
                      > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                      > > > > >       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
                      > > > > >       
                      > > > > >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                      > > > > >       macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                      > > > > >       <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-
                      > unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                      > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
                      > > > > >       
                      > > > > >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                      > Terms of
                      > > > > >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >   _____ 
                      > >
                      > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >      
                      > > *      Visit your group "macgregor19sailboats
                      > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats> " on the
                      web.
                      > >  
                      > >
                      > > *      To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                      > >  macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                      > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                      > subject=Unsubsc
                      > > ribe>
                      > >  
                      > >
                      > > *      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                      > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >   _____


                      __________________________________________________
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                    • Bruce Puckett
                      Thanks for all the great ideas on the sink drain. I think I will beef up the side and and put the hole through. Bruce ... them to ... group ... crash ... with
                      Message 10 of 28 , Aug 21, 2005
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Thanks for all the great ideas on the sink drain. I think I will
                        beef up the side and and put the hole through.
                        Bruce

                        --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                        <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                        > Joe
                        >
                        > No, it's not my boat. A fella who I was corresponding with sent
                        them to
                        > me. I posted them up since there was interest from people in the
                        group
                        > in implementing wheel steering. Unfortunately I had a hard drive
                        crash
                        > and I have lost all my saved e-mails and have since lost touch
                        with the
                        > guy.
                        >
                        > Regards,
                        > Henry
                        >
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                        > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe
                        Wilburn
                        > Sent: August 20, 2005 3:56 AM
                        > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: RE: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Henry,
                        >
                        > Is it your boat that has the wheel steering?
                        >
                        > Joe
                        >
                        > Henry Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                        >
                        > It's also the same thru-hull that I used. I put an S loop in the
                        hose
                        > going up to the sink drain. In the fall, before storing away the
                        boat, I
                        > make sure I get all the water out of the hose. Chris, I didn't
                        have any
                        > trouble with the hole saw... it was a pretty snug fit. Instead of
                        the
                        > 5200, I used 4200 in case I ever needed to replace the thru-hull.
                        By the
                        > way, good idea on adding the extra resin for strength.... I got
                        some
                        > POR-15 Resto Grip laying around... maybe I'll put a thick layer of
                        that
                        > around the area.
                        >
                        > Regards,
                        > Henry
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                        > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris
                        > Sent: August 18, 2005 6:09 PM
                        > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
                        >
                        >
                        > I'm with Henry for the exactly same reasons I put a thru-hull in
                        for
                        > the sink. I mounted it low in the hull so that it wouldn't have
                        any
                        > issues with hitting the dock, but high enough above the water line
                        > so that it would only infrequently get water in it.
                        >
                        > Bruce, I used the same thru-hull that it sounds like you have.
                        > When I used the 3/4" hole saw, it unfortunately made a hole a
                        little
                        > bit larger than that. I also noted how thin the hull was there
                        and
                        > got concerned with the installation. I compensated by buying some
                        > fiberglass impregnated resin at Home Depot and gooped it up a bit
                        > after installing the thru-hull using 3M 5200 and attaching the
                        1/2"
                        > line from the sink drain. It made something like a 4" inverted
                        cone
                        > when I was done and I think that it was sufficiently strong at
                        that
                        > point.
                        >
                        > -Chris
                        >
                        > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                        > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                        > > Henry,
                        > > I bought a nylon through hull that needs a 3/4 inch hole and 1/2
                        > inch
                        > > hose. Is this the same size as you used or larger? I am just
                        > > worried that after putting the through hull in, the hull will be
                        > > weaker in that area. I trailer my boat a lot and I am constantly
                        > in
                        > > different situations with docks. Just afraid if I come in and
                        hit
                        > > the dock on the through hull, it might be easier to crack the
                        hull.
                        > > Thanks to You and Eric for the info.
                        > >
                        > > Bruce
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                        > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                        > > > You would have to be lean over quite a bit for water to come
                        in.
                        > The
                        > > > drain hole is also small (at least on my boat) so the water
                        > would
                        > > come
                        > > > in quite slowly. Despite that I also put a rubber cork in the
                        > sink
                        > > when
                        > > > we are out as a precaution. I have never had a problem with it.
                        > > >
                        > > > We got used to having a sink on our previous power boat so it
                        > gets
                        > > used
                        > > > quite a bit. I shudder at the thought of that water draining
                        > into
                        > > the
                        > > > bilge... and there's no way I wanted to deal with having it
                        > drain
                        > > into a
                        > > > separate container and having to dump it all the time.
                        > > >
                        > > > Henry
                        > > >
                        > > > -----Original Message-----
                        > > > From: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                        > > > [mailto:macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                        eo_ant
                        > > > Sent: August 17, 2005 12:15 PM
                        > > > To: macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com
                        > > > Subject: [macgregor19sailboats] Re: Sink Drain
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > Bruce,
                        > > >
                        > > > I was going to go ahead and install one, but after thinking
                        > about it
                        > > > backed off from the idea. There is always some risk of getting
                        > water
                        > > > into the boat if the through hull is on the same side of the
                        > boat as
                        > > > the sink. While the boat might not normally be healed over far
                        > > enough
                        > > > for that to be a problem. Catching a large wave broadside in
                        > rough
                        > > > water might be enough to do it. Then you have the compounded
                        > problem
                        > > > of being knocked down and of water coming in through the sink.
                        > Many
                        > > > boat designs try to eliminate this problem by placing the sink
                        as
                        > > > close to the center of the boat as possible and as high as
                        > > practical.
                        > > >
                        > > > One solution on the M19 would be to pass the drain hose to the
                        > far
                        > > > side of the boat under the V berth. Even if it wass laid all
                        the
                        > way
                        > > > over one opening would always be above the water level.
                        > > >
                        > > > The solution I have in mind now is the reroute the centerboard
                        > line
                        > > up
                        > > > through the mast support post and then put the sink drain into
                        > the
                        > > > hole in the centerboard trunk that the centerboard line now
                        > passes
                        > > > through. No additional holes in the hull required.
                        > > >
                        > > > I've been very busy with work lately. So boat mods have been
                        on
                        > the
                        > > > back burner.
                        > > >
                        > > > My plan is to route a length of 1/8" SS pipe up the center of
                        > the
                        > > mast
                        > > > support post. The OD is almost the same as the bolt currently
                        in
                        > the
                        > > > center of the mast support plate. Some testing has suggested
                        > that
                        > > even
                        > > > if I could get the mast support post off of the centerboard
                        > trunk it
                        > > > might be very difficult to put it back. So my plan is to cut a
                        > notch
                        > > > out of one side of the bottom of the mast support post, cut
                        off
                        > the
                        > > > head of the bolt at the top of the post and then remove the
                        nut
                        > and
                        > > > bolt through the notch at the bottom of the support post. With
                        > the
                        > > > bolt out of the way I can then drill a hole in the top of the
                        > > > centerboard trunk in the middle of the mast support post and
                        > install
                        > > > my 1/8" SS pipe through which the line will run to raise and
                        > lower
                        > > the
                        > > > centerboard. I won't know how practical that approach is until
                        I
                        > get
                        > > > the centerboard out and can see how much room there is at the
                        > top of
                        > > > the trunk where the post is located.
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > Eric
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Puckett"
                        > > > <mac19sailor@y...> wrote:
                        > > > > Henry and Eric,
                        > > > > I really liked the idea of a through hull fitting for the
                        sink
                        > > > > drain. I picked up a through hull and was getting ready to
                        > > install
                        > > > > it, but the area where it looks like Henry installed his
                        > through
                        > > > > hull is slightly flexible on JoJo. Have you had any
                        problems
                        > > with
                        > > > > possible bumping a dock and cracking the hull around the
                        hole
                        > > where
                        > > > > the fitting is installed? Also, Eric, have you made this
                        > > > > modification or did you go another route?
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Thanks,
                        > > > > Bruce
                        > > > > JoJo 93 Mac 19--- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com,
                        > Henry
                        > > > > Ning <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                        > > > > > Eric
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > When you go into my album, click on that thumbnail photo
                        you
                        > > want
                        > > > > to
                        > > > > > see, it will then show the individual photo (screen size),
                        > > click
                        > > > > on the
                        > > > > > picture again and you will get a full size photo.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Yeah, I used a nylon thru hull fitting. I didn't bother
                        with
                        > a
                        > > sea
                        > > > > cock,
                        > > > > > it's way above the water line. Have never had a problem
                        with
                        > > any
                        > > > > water
                        > > > > > coming back in.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Henry
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > eo_ant wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > Henry,
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > How do you view an image full size? I see file sizes
                        > listed as
                        > > > > > > thumbnail, screen, and full size, but haven't found the
                        > way
                        > > to
                        > > > > get to
                        > > > > > > full size.
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > Looks like you must have used a plastic or nylon thru
                        hull
                        > > > > fitting.
                        > > > > > > Did you use a sea cock on the inside or did you run
                        tubing
                        > > > > directly to
                        > > > > > > the drain?
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > Eric
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Henry Ning
                        > > > > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                        > > > > > > > Actually, I was able to add a thru hull and drain hose
                        > for
                        > > the
                        > > > > sink.
                        > > > > > > See
                        > > > > > > > a picture under Henry in photo section of where I
                        > mounted
                        > > the
                        > > > > thru
                        > > > > > > hull.
                        > > > > > > > Sorry about the quality... look at it full size to see
                        > > better.
                        > > > > Works
                        > > > > > > good.
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > Henry
                        > > > > > > > http:// <http:///> www.geocites.com/henry_ning
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > eo_ant wrote:
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > The drain on the sink looks pretty funky. Goes to a
                        > limp
                        > > > > plastic jug.
                        > > > > > > > > Looks like the sink might be a little low and too
                        > close
                        > > to
                        > > > > the side to
                        > > > > > > > > simply put in a through hull fitting for the drain
                        > below
                        > > the
                        > > > > sink.
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > Has anyone found a good solution?
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > Eric
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------
                        --
                        > ---
                        > > ---
                        > > > > -------
                        > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email
                        to:
                        > > > > > > > > macgregor19sailboats-
                        unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                        > > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
                        > Yahoo!
                        > > > > Terms of
                        > > > > > > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------
                        --
                        > ---
                        > > ---
                        > > > > -------
                        > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                        > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/macgregor19sailboats/
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                        > > > > > > macgregor19sailboats-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        > > > > > > <mailto:macgregor19sailboats-
                        > > unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
                        > > > > subject=Unsubscribe>
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                        > > Terms of
                        > > > > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > _____
                        > > >
                        > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
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                      • Chris
                        In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I could wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle modification to the rudders. In the
                        Message 11 of 28 , Aug 22, 2005
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                          In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I could
                          wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle modification
                          to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would notice
                          alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the front-
                          top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when the
                          rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot would
                          create the localized higher water pressure that would force water up
                          the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was motoring
                          with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the transom
                          to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this point
                          on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to produce
                          a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight 4"
                          electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I have ever
                          done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past weekend, I
                          notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area and was
                          pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of gear
                          on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at this
                          point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However, I'm
                          pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and noticed
                          any benefits?

                          Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink drain
                          line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain. It
                          looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence of
                          wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only thing
                          about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water (ie at
                          least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start working.

                          -Chris
                        • Ron Buckles
                          Chris, How about a picture of you modified rudder? Thanks, Ron
                          Message 12 of 28 , Aug 22, 2005
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                            Chris,

                            How about a picture of you modified rudder?

                            Thanks,
                            Ron

                            --- Chris <cbhinkel2@...> wrote:

                            > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I could
                            > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle modification
                            > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would notice
                            >
                            > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the front-
                            > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when the
                            > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot would
                            > create the localized higher water pressure that would force water up
                            > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was motoring
                            > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the transom
                            > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this point
                            > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to produce
                            > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight 4"
                            > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I have ever
                            >
                            > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past weekend, I
                            > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area and was
                            > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of gear
                            > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at this
                            > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However, I'm
                            > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and noticed
                            > any benefits?
                            >
                            > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink drain
                            > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain. It
                            > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence of
                            > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only thing
                            > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water (ie at
                            >
                            > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start working.
                            >
                            > -Chris
                            >
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                          • Chris
                            Hi Ron, I ll get some more pictures up of my boat once I achieve some closure on the remaining the projects I have going on with it. (at which point I will be
                            Message 13 of 28 , Aug 22, 2005
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                              Hi Ron,

                              I'll get some more pictures up of my boat once I achieve some
                              closure on the remaining the projects I have going on with it. (at
                              which point I will be able to document everthing.) I should be
                              there in about a month or so.

                              To give you a head start on that, I basically made that top-flat
                              rudder area (I think everyone knows what I'm talking about here) the
                              same general shape as the leading edge of the rudders when they are
                              down. There was sufficient beefiness in the fiberglass to grind
                              that spot down. After I did that, I sanded with heavy grit
                              sandpaper to smooth everything out. I finished it by painting the
                              exposed fiberglass resin using a good marine polyurethane paint and
                              went from there.

                              -Chris


                              --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Ron Buckles
                              <ronbuckles@y...> wrote:
                              > Chris,
                              >
                              > How about a picture of you modified rudder?
                              >
                              > Thanks,
                              > Ron
                              >
                              > --- Chris <cbhinkel2@c...> wrote:
                              >
                              > > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I
                              could
                              > > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                              modification
                              > > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would
                              notice
                              > >
                              > > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the
                              front-
                              > > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when
                              the
                              > > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot
                              would
                              > > create the localized higher water pressure that would force
                              water up
                              > > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was
                              motoring
                              > > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the
                              transom
                              > > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this
                              point
                              > > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                              produce
                              > > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight 4"
                              > > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I have
                              ever
                              > >
                              > > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past weekend,
                              I
                              > > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area and
                              was
                              > > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of
                              gear
                              > > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at
                              this
                              > > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However,
                              I'm
                              > > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                              noticed
                              > > any benefits?
                              > >
                              > > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink
                              drain
                              > > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain.
                              It
                              > > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence
                              of
                              > > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only
                              thing
                              > > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water
                              (ie at
                              > >
                              > > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start
                              working.
                              > >
                              > > -Chris
                              > >
                              > >
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                              > > --------------------~-->
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                            • Ron Buckles
                              Hi all, I wonder if this work with the Idasailor rudders? Ron
                              Message 14 of 28 , Aug 22, 2005
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                                Hi all,

                                I wonder if this work with the Idasailor rudders?

                                Ron

                                --- Chris <cbhinkel2@...> wrote:

                                > Hi Ron,
                                >
                                > I'll get some more pictures up of my boat once I achieve some
                                > closure on the remaining the projects I have going on with it. (at
                                > which point I will be able to document everthing.) I should be
                                > there in about a month or so.
                                >
                                > To give you a head start on that, I basically made that top-flat
                                > rudder area (I think everyone knows what I'm talking about here) the
                                > same general shape as the leading edge of the rudders when they are
                                > down. There was sufficient beefiness in the fiberglass to grind
                                > that spot down. After I did that, I sanded with heavy grit
                                > sandpaper to smooth everything out. I finished it by painting the
                                > exposed fiberglass resin using a good marine polyurethane paint and
                                > went from there.
                                >
                                > -Chris
                                >
                                >
                                > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, Ron Buckles
                                > <ronbuckles@y...> wrote:
                                > > Chris,
                                > >
                                > > How about a picture of you modified rudder?
                                > >
                                > > Thanks,
                                > > Ron
                                > >
                                > > --- Chris <cbhinkel2@c...> wrote:
                                > >
                                > > > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I
                                > could
                                > > > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                                > modification
                                > > > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would
                                > notice
                                > > >
                                > > > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the
                                > front-
                                > > > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when
                                > the
                                > > > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot
                                > would
                                > > > create the localized higher water pressure that would force
                                > water up
                                > > > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was
                                > motoring
                                > > > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the
                                > transom
                                > > > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this
                                > point
                                > > > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                                > produce
                                > > > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight 4"
                                > > > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I have
                                > ever
                                > > >
                                > > > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past weekend,
                                > I
                                > > > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area and
                                > was
                                > > > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of
                                > gear
                                > > > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at
                                > this
                                > > > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However,
                                > I'm
                                > > > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                                > noticed
                                > > > any benefits?
                                > > >
                                > > > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink
                                > drain
                                > > > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain.
                                > It
                                > > > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence
                                > of
                                > > > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only
                                > thing
                                > > > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water
                                > (ie at
                                > > >
                                > > > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start
                                > working.
                                > > >
                                > > > -Chris
                                > > >
                                > > >
                                > > >
                                > > >
                                > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                                > > > --------------------~-->
                                > > > Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your
                                > home
                                > > > page
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                              • eo_ant
                                As I understand my conversation with the dealer an even further improvement could be made by using some custom made metal brackets to move the rudders pivot
                                Message 15 of 28 , Aug 23, 2005
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                                  As I understand my conversation with the dealer an even further
                                  improvement could be made by using some custom made metal brackets to
                                  move the rudders' pivot points aft. Then larger rudders could be used
                                  for sailing or motoring slowly, and they could be pulled all of the
                                  way out of the water while motoring fast. In other words a similar
                                  setup to the newer Mac motorsailors.

                                  I got the impression that at least one Mac19 was modified in this way
                                  some time ago with good success.

                                  I believe the IdaSailor rudders are made from a solid piece of some
                                  type of plastic. So they could be shaped as much as you want without
                                  compromising the structure. And because they are slightly larger and
                                  better shaped than the original M19 rudders offer performance
                                  improvements without the more extensive modifications required to move
                                  the rudders aft.

                                  Eric


                                  --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                  wrote:
                                  > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I could
                                  > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle modification
                                  > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would notice
                                  > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the front-
                                  > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when the
                                  > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot would
                                  > create the localized higher water pressure that would force water up
                                  > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was motoring
                                  > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the transom
                                  > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this point
                                  > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to produce
                                  > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight 4"
                                  > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I have ever
                                  > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past weekend, I
                                  > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area and was
                                  > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of gear
                                  > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at this
                                  > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However, I'm
                                  > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and noticed
                                  > any benefits?
                                  >
                                  > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink drain
                                  > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain. It
                                  > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence of
                                  > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only thing
                                  > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water (ie at
                                  > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start working.
                                  >
                                  > -Chris
                                • Henry Ning
                                  Chris Great ideal. Let s see pictures. BTW, where did you drill holes in the transom? I ve been thinking of removing my rudders altogether, along with the
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Aug 23, 2005
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                                    Chris

                                    Great ideal. Let's see pictures. BTW, where did you drill holes in
                                    the transom?

                                    I've been thinking of removing my rudders altogether, along with the
                                    crossbars and the tiller. Lately we haven't been sailing that much
                                    anyway... and now that we don't have a slip anymore, it's a hassle
                                    having to put the mast up and down.

                                    Regards,
                                    Henry

                                    --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                    wrote:
                                    > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I could
                                    > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                                    modification
                                    > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would
                                    notice
                                    > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the
                                    front-
                                    > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when the
                                    > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot
                                    would
                                    > create the localized higher water pressure that would force water
                                    up
                                    > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was motoring
                                    > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the transom
                                    > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this point
                                    > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                                    produce
                                    > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight 4"
                                    > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I have
                                    ever
                                    > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past weekend, I
                                    > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area and
                                    was
                                    > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of
                                    gear
                                    > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at
                                    this
                                    > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However, I'm
                                    > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                                    noticed
                                    > any benefits?
                                    >
                                    > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink drain
                                    > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain. It
                                    > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence of
                                    > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only
                                    thing
                                    > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water (ie
                                    at
                                    > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start
                                    working.
                                    >
                                    > -Chris
                                  • Chris
                                    Henry, I eyeballed a couple of pictures in the photos section and went from there to drill the holes in the transom. I don t know about other people s boats,
                                    Message 17 of 28 , Aug 23, 2005
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                                      Henry,

                                      I eyeballed a couple of pictures in the photos section and went from
                                      there to drill the holes in the transom. I don't know about other
                                      people's boats, but my rudder pockets in my 1992 Mac19 end halfway up
                                      the transom. The holes I drilled are about 4-6" below the top lip of
                                      the rudder pockets.

                                      And like you, I only sail a small fraction of the time when I use my
                                      Mac19. This is one of the big reasons why I bought this boat as I
                                      mostly keep my mast stowed in the cabin vs. with my old 26X I had to
                                      always rig the boat. The difference here is I can pull into the ramp
                                      area and directly launch my Mac19 vs about the 45 minutes of time to
                                      rig/de-rig my 26X with its roller furling. Going fishing or just
                                      doing the boat camping thing has been much more enjoyable.

                                      IMHO, I would be hesitant to remove the rudders all together,
                                      especially if your outboard motor doesn't have full steering
                                      capabilities. Even when the rudders are up, they still have quite a
                                      bit of steering force. You just can't use them at higher speeds or
                                      put too much force on the tiller. Also, you can only back up at idle
                                      speeds. Overall, I'm pretty happy with how my slow speed steering
                                      system works now with the centerboard fully down, the rudders being
                                      up (and them not providing any undo drag when motoring fast). This
                                      is especially important for when you are trying to tie yourself up to
                                      string line at Catalina between two boats only 16ft apart. I was
                                      able to do that for the first time all by myself this past weekend
                                      with little apprehension to bump into my new temporary neighbors. :>)

                                      -Chris




                                      --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                                      <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                                      > Chris
                                      >
                                      > Great ideal. Let's see pictures. BTW, where did you drill holes in
                                      > the transom?
                                      >
                                      > I've been thinking of removing my rudders altogether, along with
                                      the
                                      > crossbars and the tiller. Lately we haven't been sailing that much
                                      > anyway... and now that we don't have a slip anymore, it's a hassle
                                      > having to put the mast up and down.
                                      >
                                      > Regards,
                                      > Henry
                                      >
                                      > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                      <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                      > wrote:
                                      > > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I
                                      could
                                      > > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                                      > modification
                                      > > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would
                                      > notice
                                      > > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the
                                      > front-
                                      > > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when
                                      the
                                      > > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot
                                      > would
                                      > > create the localized higher water pressure that would force water
                                      > up
                                      > > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was
                                      motoring
                                      > > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the
                                      transom
                                      > > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this
                                      point
                                      > > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                                      > produce
                                      > > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight 4"
                                      > > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I have
                                      > ever
                                      > > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past weekend,
                                      I
                                      > > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area and
                                      > was
                                      > > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of
                                      > gear
                                      > > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at
                                      > this
                                      > > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However,
                                      I'm
                                      > > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                                      > noticed
                                      > > any benefits?
                                      > >
                                      > > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink
                                      drain
                                      > > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain.
                                      It
                                      > > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence of
                                      > > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only
                                      > thing
                                      > > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water
                                      (ie
                                      > at
                                      > > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start
                                      > working.
                                      > >
                                      > > -Chris
                                    • eo_ant
                                      Chris & Henry, If you aren t using the boat for sailing, aren t there better choices for power boat only usuage? Why would you choose a M19 instead of a boat
                                      Message 18 of 28 , Aug 23, 2005
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                                        Chris & Henry,

                                        If you aren't using the boat for sailing, aren't there better choices
                                        for power boat only usuage? Why would you choose a M19 instead of a
                                        boat designed only for power? With a power boat you wouldn't have to
                                        bother with the mast at all or any of the other fittings required only
                                        for sailing. Just curious.

                                        Eric



                                        --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                        wrote:
                                        > Henry,
                                        >
                                        > I eyeballed a couple of pictures in the photos section and went from
                                        > there to drill the holes in the transom. I don't know about other
                                        > people's boats, but my rudder pockets in my 1992 Mac19 end halfway up
                                        > the transom. The holes I drilled are about 4-6" below the top lip of
                                        > the rudder pockets.
                                        >
                                        > And like you, I only sail a small fraction of the time when I use my
                                        > Mac19. This is one of the big reasons why I bought this boat as I
                                        > mostly keep my mast stowed in the cabin vs. with my old 26X I had to
                                        > always rig the boat. The difference here is I can pull into the ramp
                                        > area and directly launch my Mac19 vs about the 45 minutes of time to
                                        > rig/de-rig my 26X with its roller furling. Going fishing or just
                                        > doing the boat camping thing has been much more enjoyable.
                                        >
                                        > IMHO, I would be hesitant to remove the rudders all together,
                                        > especially if your outboard motor doesn't have full steering
                                        > capabilities. Even when the rudders are up, they still have quite a
                                        > bit of steering force. You just can't use them at higher speeds or
                                        > put too much force on the tiller. Also, you can only back up at idle
                                        > speeds. Overall, I'm pretty happy with how my slow speed steering
                                        > system works now with the centerboard fully down, the rudders being
                                        > up (and them not providing any undo drag when motoring fast). This
                                        > is especially important for when you are trying to tie yourself up to
                                        > string line at Catalina between two boats only 16ft apart. I was
                                        > able to do that for the first time all by myself this past weekend
                                        > with little apprehension to bump into my new temporary neighbors. :>)
                                        >
                                        > -Chris
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                                        > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                                        > > Chris
                                        > >
                                        > > Great ideal. Let's see pictures. BTW, where did you drill holes in
                                        > > the transom?
                                        > >
                                        > > I've been thinking of removing my rudders altogether, along with
                                        > the
                                        > > crossbars and the tiller. Lately we haven't been sailing that much
                                        > > anyway... and now that we don't have a slip anymore, it's a hassle
                                        > > having to put the mast up and down.
                                        > >
                                        > > Regards,
                                        > > Henry
                                        > >
                                        > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                        > <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                        > > wrote:
                                        > > > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I
                                        > could
                                        > > > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                                        > > modification
                                        > > > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would
                                        > > notice
                                        > > > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the
                                        > > front-
                                        > > > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when
                                        > the
                                        > > > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot
                                        > > would
                                        > > > create the localized higher water pressure that would force water
                                        > > up
                                        > > > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was
                                        > motoring
                                        > > > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the
                                        > transom
                                        > > > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this
                                        > point
                                        > > > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                                        > > produce
                                        > > > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight 4"
                                        > > > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I have
                                        > > ever
                                        > > > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past weekend,
                                        > I
                                        > > > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area and
                                        > > was
                                        > > > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of
                                        > > gear
                                        > > > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at
                                        > > this
                                        > > > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However,
                                        > I'm
                                        > > > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                                        > > noticed
                                        > > > any benefits?
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink
                                        > drain
                                        > > > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain.
                                        > It
                                        > > > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence of
                                        > > > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only
                                        > > thing
                                        > > > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water
                                        > (ie
                                        > > at
                                        > > > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start
                                        > > working.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > -Chris
                                      • Chris
                                        Eric, I didn t buy a dedicated powerboat because you essentially can t sail other powerboats. I didn t say I was not using the boat at all for sailing, it s
                                        Message 19 of 28 , Aug 23, 2005
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          Eric,

                                          I didn't buy a dedicated powerboat because you essentially can't sail
                                          other powerboats.

                                          I didn't say I was not using the boat at all for sailing, it's just
                                          not my primary choice right now for me. Summertime is my fishing and
                                          Catalina season. I prefer to sail more in the winter season when the
                                          winds are more brisk in my area. Also, I'm midway through a
                                          restoration with the rigging and sail upgrades planned as the last
                                          stage of my Mac19 project. I'll sail it more once I get it optimized
                                          and more enjoyable for me to sail. :>)

                                          -Chris

                                          --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "eo_ant" <eric@h...>
                                          wrote:
                                          > Chris & Henry,
                                          >
                                          > If you aren't using the boat for sailing, aren't there better
                                          choices
                                          > for power boat only usuage? Why would you choose a M19 instead of a
                                          > boat designed only for power? With a power boat you wouldn't have to
                                          > bother with the mast at all or any of the other fittings required
                                          only
                                          > for sailing. Just curious.
                                          >
                                          > Eric
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                          <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                          > wrote:
                                          > > Henry,
                                          > >
                                          > > I eyeballed a couple of pictures in the photos section and went
                                          from
                                          > > there to drill the holes in the transom. I don't know about
                                          other
                                          > > people's boats, but my rudder pockets in my 1992 Mac19 end
                                          halfway up
                                          > > the transom. The holes I drilled are about 4-6" below the top
                                          lip of
                                          > > the rudder pockets.
                                          > >
                                          > > And like you, I only sail a small fraction of the time when I use
                                          my
                                          > > Mac19. This is one of the big reasons why I bought this boat as
                                          I
                                          > > mostly keep my mast stowed in the cabin vs. with my old 26X I had
                                          to
                                          > > always rig the boat. The difference here is I can pull into the
                                          ramp
                                          > > area and directly launch my Mac19 vs about the 45 minutes of time
                                          to
                                          > > rig/de-rig my 26X with its roller furling. Going fishing or just
                                          > > doing the boat camping thing has been much more enjoyable.
                                          > >
                                          > > IMHO, I would be hesitant to remove the rudders all together,
                                          > > especially if your outboard motor doesn't have full steering
                                          > > capabilities. Even when the rudders are up, they still have
                                          quite a
                                          > > bit of steering force. You just can't use them at higher speeds
                                          or
                                          > > put too much force on the tiller. Also, you can only back up at
                                          idle
                                          > > speeds. Overall, I'm pretty happy with how my slow speed
                                          steering
                                          > > system works now with the centerboard fully down, the rudders
                                          being
                                          > > up (and them not providing any undo drag when motoring fast).
                                          This
                                          > > is especially important for when you are trying to tie yourself
                                          up to
                                          > > string line at Catalina between two boats only 16ft apart. I was
                                          > > able to do that for the first time all by myself this past
                                          weekend
                                          > > with little apprehension to bump into my new temporary
                                          neighbors. :>)
                                          > >
                                          > > -Chris
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                                          > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                                          > > > Chris
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Great ideal. Let's see pictures. BTW, where did you drill holes
                                          in
                                          > > > the transom?
                                          > > >
                                          > > > I've been thinking of removing my rudders altogether, along
                                          with
                                          > > the
                                          > > > crossbars and the tiller. Lately we haven't been sailing that
                                          much
                                          > > > anyway... and now that we don't have a slip anymore, it's a
                                          hassle
                                          > > > having to put the mast up and down.
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Regards,
                                          > > > Henry
                                          > > >
                                          > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                          > > <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                          > > > wrote:
                                          > > > > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I
                                          > > could
                                          > > > > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                                          > > > modification
                                          > > > > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I
                                          would
                                          > > > notice
                                          > > > > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from
                                          the
                                          > > > front-
                                          > > > > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water
                                          when
                                          > > the
                                          > > > > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder
                                          flatspot
                                          > > > would
                                          > > > > create the localized higher water pressure that would force
                                          water
                                          > > > up
                                          > > > > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was
                                          > > motoring
                                          > > > > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the
                                          > > transom
                                          > > > > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this
                                          > > point
                                          > > > > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                                          > > > produce
                                          > > > > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight
                                          4"
                                          > > > > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I
                                          have
                                          > > > ever
                                          > > > > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past
                                          weekend,
                                          > > I
                                          > > > > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area
                                          and
                                          > > > was
                                          > > > > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs
                                          of
                                          > > > gear
                                          > > > > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at
                                          at
                                          > > > this
                                          > > > > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better.
                                          However,
                                          > > I'm
                                          > > > > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                                          > > > noticed
                                          > > > > any benefits?
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink
                                          > > drain
                                          > > > > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the
                                          drain.
                                          > > It
                                          > > > > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any
                                          evidence of
                                          > > > > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The
                                          only
                                          > > > thing
                                          > > > > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of
                                          water
                                          > > (ie
                                          > > > at
                                          > > > > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start
                                          > > > working.
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > -Chris
                                        • Henry Ning
                                          Eric I had a 23ft cuddy cabin powerboat before the M19. That big V8 mercruiser used more gas in one day than what I would use in the M19 all season. It was
                                          Message 20 of 28 , Aug 24, 2005
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Eric

                                            I had a 23ft cuddy cabin powerboat before the M19. That big V8
                                            mercruiser used more gas in one day than what I would use in the M19
                                            all season. It was also loud.
                                            The powerboat was too big for me to tow with my pathfinder (which can
                                            easily tow the M19) so I had to pay for the beginning of season
                                            launch and end of season haul-out. It won't fit in my garage so I had
                                            to pay for winter storage. I had to pay for a slip in the summer. I
                                            also had to pay for end of season maintenance, winterizing and shrink
                                            wrapping. The M19 fits nicely in my garage. I can do the motor
                                            maintenance and winterizing myself. I can also work on mods in
                                            comfort.
                                            The M19 also has better interior accomodation that any 23 ft cuddy
                                            cabin's that I have seen so far.
                                            However, the powerboat definitely had a nicer and roomery cockpit. It
                                            was great for entertaining family and friends, but because we boat on
                                            Lake Ontario (which can get and is usually a little rougher than the
                                            smaller inland lakes), there was always someone who would get
                                            seasick. So most people come the first time and then never again.
                                            Since we have already run through everyone we know, the cockpit size
                                            of the M19 is perfect just for us (wife and son).
                                            Most of these things probably wouldn't be an issue if I was fairly
                                            well to do, but I'm not, so the M19 fits my finances and needs
                                            perfectly... better than any other 19ft boat. Plus we still like to
                                            sail occasionally.

                                            Regards,
                                            Henry


                                            --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "eo_ant" <eric@h...>
                                            wrote:
                                            > Chris & Henry,
                                            >
                                            > If you aren't using the boat for sailing, aren't there better
                                            choices
                                            > for power boat only usuage? Why would you choose a M19 instead of a
                                            > boat designed only for power? With a power boat you wouldn't have to
                                            > bother with the mast at all or any of the other fittings required
                                            only
                                            > for sailing. Just curious.
                                            >
                                            > Eric
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                            <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                            > wrote:
                                            > > Henry,
                                            > >
                                            > > I eyeballed a couple of pictures in the photos section and went
                                            from
                                            > > there to drill the holes in the transom. I don't know about
                                            other
                                            > > people's boats, but my rudder pockets in my 1992 Mac19 end
                                            halfway up
                                            > > the transom. The holes I drilled are about 4-6" below the top
                                            lip of
                                            > > the rudder pockets.
                                            > >
                                            > > And like you, I only sail a small fraction of the time when I use
                                            my
                                            > > Mac19. This is one of the big reasons why I bought this boat as
                                            I
                                            > > mostly keep my mast stowed in the cabin vs. with my old 26X I had
                                            to
                                            > > always rig the boat. The difference here is I can pull into the
                                            ramp
                                            > > area and directly launch my Mac19 vs about the 45 minutes of time
                                            to
                                            > > rig/de-rig my 26X with its roller furling. Going fishing or just
                                            > > doing the boat camping thing has been much more enjoyable.
                                            > >
                                            > > IMHO, I would be hesitant to remove the rudders all together,
                                            > > especially if your outboard motor doesn't have full steering
                                            > > capabilities. Even when the rudders are up, they still have
                                            quite a
                                            > > bit of steering force. You just can't use them at higher speeds
                                            or
                                            > > put too much force on the tiller. Also, you can only back up at
                                            idle
                                            > > speeds. Overall, I'm pretty happy with how my slow speed
                                            steering
                                            > > system works now with the centerboard fully down, the rudders
                                            being
                                            > > up (and them not providing any undo drag when motoring fast).
                                            This
                                            > > is especially important for when you are trying to tie yourself
                                            up to
                                            > > string line at Catalina between two boats only 16ft apart. I was
                                            > > able to do that for the first time all by myself this past
                                            weekend
                                            > > with little apprehension to bump into my new temporary
                                            neighbors. :>)
                                            > >
                                            > > -Chris
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                                            > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                                            > > > Chris
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Great ideal. Let's see pictures. BTW, where did you drill holes
                                            in
                                            > > > the transom?
                                            > > >
                                            > > > I've been thinking of removing my rudders altogether, along
                                            with
                                            > > the
                                            > > > crossbars and the tiller. Lately we haven't been sailing that
                                            much
                                            > > > anyway... and now that we don't have a slip anymore, it's a
                                            hassle
                                            > > > having to put the mast up and down.
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Regards,
                                            > > > Henry
                                            > > >
                                            > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                            > > <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                            > > > wrote:
                                            > > > > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I
                                            > > could
                                            > > > > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                                            > > > modification
                                            > > > > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I
                                            would
                                            > > > notice
                                            > > > > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from
                                            the
                                            > > > front-
                                            > > > > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water
                                            when
                                            > > the
                                            > > > > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder
                                            flatspot
                                            > > > would
                                            > > > > create the localized higher water pressure that would force
                                            water
                                            > > > up
                                            > > > > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was
                                            > > motoring
                                            > > > > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the
                                            > > transom
                                            > > > > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this
                                            > > point
                                            > > > > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                                            > > > produce
                                            > > > > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight
                                            4"
                                            > > > > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I
                                            have
                                            > > > ever
                                            > > > > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past
                                            weekend,
                                            > > I
                                            > > > > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area
                                            and
                                            > > > was
                                            > > > > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs
                                            of
                                            > > > gear
                                            > > > > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at
                                            at
                                            > > > this
                                            > > > > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better.
                                            However,
                                            > > I'm
                                            > > > > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                                            > > > noticed
                                            > > > > any benefits?
                                            > > > >
                                            > > > > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink
                                            > > drain
                                            > > > > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the
                                            drain.
                                            > > It
                                            > > > > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any
                                            evidence of
                                            > > > > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The
                                            only
                                            > > > thing
                                            > > > > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of
                                            water
                                            > > (ie
                                            > > > at
                                            > > > > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start
                                            > > > working.
                                            > > > >
                                            > > > > -Chris
                                          • Ron Buckles
                                            Logic and reasoning strikes again! Ron ... === message truncated ===
                                            Message 21 of 28 , Aug 24, 2005
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              Logic and reasoning strikes again!
                                              Ron

                                              --- Henry Ning <henry.ning@...> wrote:

                                              > Eric
                                              >
                                              > I had a 23ft cuddy cabin powerboat before the M19. That big V8
                                              > mercruiser used more gas in one day than what I would use in the M19
                                              > all season. It was also loud.
                                              > The powerboat was too big for me to tow with my pathfinder (which can
                                              >
                                              > easily tow the M19) so I had to pay for the beginning of season
                                              > launch and end of season haul-out. It won't fit in my garage so I had
                                              >
                                              > to pay for winter storage. I had to pay for a slip in the summer. I
                                              > also had to pay for end of season maintenance, winterizing and shrink
                                              >
                                              > wrapping. The M19 fits nicely in my garage. I can do the motor
                                              > maintenance and winterizing myself. I can also work on mods in
                                              > comfort.
                                              > The M19 also has better interior accomodation that any 23 ft cuddy
                                              > cabin's that I have seen so far.
                                              > However, the powerboat definitely had a nicer and roomery cockpit. It
                                              >
                                              > was great for entertaining family and friends, but because we boat on
                                              >
                                              > Lake Ontario (which can get and is usually a little rougher than the
                                              > smaller inland lakes), there was always someone who would get
                                              > seasick. So most people come the first time and then never again.
                                              > Since we have already run through everyone we know, the cockpit size
                                              > of the M19 is perfect just for us (wife and son).
                                              > Most of these things probably wouldn't be an issue if I was fairly
                                              > well to do, but I'm not, so the M19 fits my finances and needs
                                              > perfectly... better than any other 19ft boat. Plus we still like to
                                              > sail occasionally.
                                              >
                                              > Regards,
                                              > Henry
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "eo_ant" <eric@h...>
                                              > wrote:
                                              > > Chris & Henry,
                                              > >
                                              > > If you aren't using the boat for sailing, aren't there better
                                              > choices
                                              > > for power boat only usuage? Why would you choose a M19 instead of a
                                              > > boat designed only for power? With a power boat you wouldn't have
                                              > to
                                              > > bother with the mast at all or any of the other fittings required
                                              > only
                                              > > for sailing. Just curious.
                                              > >
                                              > > Eric
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                              > <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                              > > wrote:
                                              > > > Henry,
                                              > > >
                                              > > > I eyeballed a couple of pictures in the photos section and went
                                              > from
                                              > > > there to drill the holes in the transom. I don't know about
                                              > other
                                              > > > people's boats, but my rudder pockets in my 1992 Mac19 end
                                              > halfway up
                                              > > > the transom. The holes I drilled are about 4-6" below the top
                                              > lip of
                                              > > > the rudder pockets.
                                              > > >
                                              > > > And like you, I only sail a small fraction of the time when I use
                                              >
                                              > my
                                              > > > Mac19. This is one of the big reasons why I bought this boat as
                                              > I
                                              > > > mostly keep my mast stowed in the cabin vs. with my old 26X I had
                                              >
                                              > to
                                              > > > always rig the boat. The difference here is I can pull into the
                                              > ramp
                                              > > > area and directly launch my Mac19 vs about the 45 minutes of time
                                              >
                                              > to
                                              > > > rig/de-rig my 26X with its roller furling. Going fishing or just
                                              >
                                              > > > doing the boat camping thing has been much more enjoyable.
                                              > > >
                                              > > > IMHO, I would be hesitant to remove the rudders all together,
                                              > > > especially if your outboard motor doesn't have full steering
                                              > > > capabilities. Even when the rudders are up, they still have
                                              > quite a
                                              > > > bit of steering force. You just can't use them at higher speeds
                                              > or
                                              > > > put too much force on the tiller. Also, you can only back up at
                                              > idle
                                              > > > speeds. Overall, I'm pretty happy with how my slow speed
                                              > steering
                                              > > > system works now with the centerboard fully down, the rudders
                                              > being
                                              > > > up (and them not providing any undo drag when motoring fast).
                                              > This
                                              > > > is especially important for when you are trying to tie yourself
                                              > up to
                                              > > > string line at Catalina between two boats only 16ft apart. I was
                                              >
                                              > > > able to do that for the first time all by myself this past
                                              > weekend
                                              > > > with little apprehension to bump into my new temporary
                                              > neighbors. :>)
                                              > > >
                                              > > > -Chris
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                                              > > > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                                              > > > > Chris
                                              > > > >
                                              > > > > Great ideal. Let's see pictures. BTW, where did you drill holes
                                              >
                                              > in
                                              > > > > the transom?
                                              > > > >
                                              > > > > I've been thinking of removing my rudders altogether, along
                                              > with
                                              > > > the
                                              > > > > crossbars and the tiller. Lately we haven't been sailing that
                                              > much
                                              > > > > anyway... and now that we don't have a slip anymore, it's a
                                              > hassle
                                              > > > > having to put the mast up and down.
                                              > > > >
                                              > > > > Regards,
                                              > > > > Henry
                                              > > > >
                                              > > > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                              > > > <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                              > > > > wrote:
                                              > > > > > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I
                                              > > > could
                                              > > > > > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                                              > > > > modification
                                              > > > > > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I
                                              > would
                                              > > > > notice
                                              > > > > > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from
                                              > the
                                              > > > > front-
                                              > > > > > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water
                                              > when
                                              > > > the
                                              > > > > > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder
                                              > flatspot
                                              > > > > would
                                              > > > > > create the localized higher water pressure that would force
                                              > water
                                              > > > > up
                                              > > > > > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was
                                              > > > motoring
                                              > > > > > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the
                                              > > > transom
                                              > > > > > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this
                                              >
                                              > > > point
                                              > > > > > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                                              > > > > produce
                                              > > > > > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight
                                              >
                                              > 4"
                                              > > > > > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I
                                              > have
                                              > > > > ever
                                              > > > > > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past
                                              > weekend,
                                              > > > I
                                              > > > > > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area
                                              > and
                                              > > > > was
                                              > > > > > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs
                                              > of
                                              > > > > gear
                                              > > > > > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at
                                              > at
                                              > > > > this
                                              > > > > > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better.
                                              > However,
                                              > > > I'm
                                              > > > > > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                                              > > > > noticed
                                              > > > > > any benefits?
                                              > > > > >
                                              > > > > > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink
                                              >
                                              > > > drain
                                              > > > > > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the
                                              > drain.
                                              > > > It
                                              > > > > > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any
                                              > evidence of
                                              > > > > > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The
                                              > only
                                              > > > > thing
                                              >
                                              === message truncated ===
                                            • Henry Ning
                                              Chris Hmmm, that s interesting, so you didn t have a factory pre-drilled hole in the transom just above each rudder? You know, I find it difficult enough as it
                                              Message 22 of 28 , Aug 24, 2005
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                                                Chris

                                                Hmmm, that's interesting, so you didn't have a factory pre-drilled
                                                hole in the transom just above each rudder?

                                                You know, I find it difficult enough as it is to setup and raise the
                                                mast on land, I couldn't imagine having to do it out on the water.
                                                Just out of curiosity, have you tried it yet (on the water)? You are
                                                definitely right about the 45 minutes time saving... if I want to get
                                                out on the water (espescially after work), I want to be underway
                                                quickly.

                                                My boat does have full steering capability with the motor so I don't
                                                think not have the rudders will be an issue. I admit that it is
                                                easier to dock with the rudders since without them in order to steer
                                                you have to turn the motor and then give a little gas (going quickly
                                                from neutral into gear and back to neutral is usually enough). I have
                                                master the art of docking on my previous 23ft powerboat, so the
                                                smaller M19 is a piece of cake (even without using the rudders). Heh
                                                heh, I can still remember the first month when we got the powerboat,
                                                my stomach would be in knots each time we venture out knowing that
                                                eventually we had to come back and have to attempt to dock... I sure
                                                provided some laughs to the marina. :-)

                                                Regards,
                                                Henry

                                                --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                                wrote:
                                                > Henry,
                                                >
                                                > I eyeballed a couple of pictures in the photos section and went
                                                from
                                                > there to drill the holes in the transom. I don't know about other
                                                > people's boats, but my rudder pockets in my 1992 Mac19 end halfway
                                                up
                                                > the transom. The holes I drilled are about 4-6" below the top lip
                                                of
                                                > the rudder pockets.
                                                >
                                                > And like you, I only sail a small fraction of the time when I use
                                                my
                                                > Mac19. This is one of the big reasons why I bought this boat as I
                                                > mostly keep my mast stowed in the cabin vs. with my old 26X I had
                                                to
                                                > always rig the boat. The difference here is I can pull into the
                                                ramp
                                                > area and directly launch my Mac19 vs about the 45 minutes of time
                                                to
                                                > rig/de-rig my 26X with its roller furling. Going fishing or just
                                                > doing the boat camping thing has been much more enjoyable.
                                                >
                                                > IMHO, I would be hesitant to remove the rudders all together,
                                                > especially if your outboard motor doesn't have full steering
                                                > capabilities. Even when the rudders are up, they still have quite
                                                a
                                                > bit of steering force. You just can't use them at higher speeds or
                                                > put too much force on the tiller. Also, you can only back up at
                                                idle
                                                > speeds. Overall, I'm pretty happy with how my slow speed steering
                                                > system works now with the centerboard fully down, the rudders being
                                                > up (and them not providing any undo drag when motoring fast). This
                                                > is especially important for when you are trying to tie yourself up
                                                to
                                                > string line at Catalina between two boats only 16ft apart. I was
                                                > able to do that for the first time all by myself this past weekend
                                                > with little apprehension to bump into my new temporary
                                                neighbors. :>)
                                                >
                                                > -Chris
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Henry Ning"
                                                > <henry.ning@s...> wrote:
                                                > > Chris
                                                > >
                                                > > Great ideal. Let's see pictures. BTW, where did you drill holes
                                                in
                                                > > the transom?
                                                > >
                                                > > I've been thinking of removing my rudders altogether, along with
                                                > the
                                                > > crossbars and the tiller. Lately we haven't been sailing that
                                                much
                                                > > anyway... and now that we don't have a slip anymore, it's a
                                                hassle
                                                > > having to put the mast up and down.
                                                > >
                                                > > Regards,
                                                > > Henry
                                                > >
                                                > > --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, "Chris"
                                                > <cbhinkel2@c...>
                                                > > wrote:
                                                > > > In the pursuit of the highest possible motoring speed that I
                                                > could
                                                > > > wring out of my Mac19, I thought I would try a a subtle
                                                > > modification
                                                > > > to the rudders. In the past, when I motoring quickly, I would
                                                > > notice
                                                > > > alot of backspray that was splashing onto the transom from the
                                                > > front-
                                                > > > top-flat portion of the rudder that was still in the water when
                                                > the
                                                > > > rudders were up. Also, I speculated that this rudder flatspot
                                                > > would
                                                > > > create the localized higher water pressure that would force
                                                water
                                                > > up
                                                > > > the rudder pockets as that only happened to me when I was
                                                > motoring
                                                > > > with the rudders up. I have since drilled the holes in the
                                                > transom
                                                > > > to alleviate this problem and my bilge has been dry from this
                                                > point
                                                > > > on. Anyhow, I decided to grind this rudder flatspot down to
                                                > > produce
                                                > > > a much more hydrodynamic shape using my $14.99 Harbor Freight
                                                4"
                                                > > > electric grinder (that was the best spent money on a tool I
                                                have
                                                > > ever
                                                > > > done!). When I was motoring over to Catalina this past
                                                weekend,
                                                > I
                                                > > > notice a much more streamline water pattern around this area
                                                and
                                                > > was
                                                > > > pretty satisfied with the results. Since I had about 300lbs of
                                                > > gear
                                                > > > on board at thsi time, I can't say this help my top speed at at
                                                > > this
                                                > > > point. If it did, it only might be slightly better. However,
                                                > I'm
                                                > > > pretty sure it wouldn't hurt. Has anyone else done this and
                                                > > noticed
                                                > > > any benefits?
                                                > > >
                                                > > > Henry, I also put an extra length "S" bends into my 1/2" sink
                                                > drain
                                                > > > line to help prevent any seawater from backing into the drain.
                                                > It
                                                > > > looks like it works pretty well as I haven't seen any evidence
                                                of
                                                > > > wetness in the sink after some good heeling moments. The only
                                                > > thing
                                                > > > about doing this is you need have a sufficient amount of water
                                                > (ie
                                                > > at
                                                > > > least a cup's amount )in the sink to get the drain to start
                                                > > working.
                                                > > >
                                                > > > -Chris
                                              • mike fortuna
                                                I ve tried several over the counter drugs, the bands and even an expensive wristwatch that shocked you (VERY unpleasant) and none worked as well as just taking
                                                Message 23 of 28 , Aug 25, 2005
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                                                  I've tried several over the counter drugs, the bands
                                                  and even an expensive wristwatch that shocked you
                                                  (VERY unpleasant) and none worked as well as just
                                                  taking about 1/2 teaspoon of powdered Ginger washed
                                                  down with some liquid. Even helps AFTER you start
                                                  getting seasick, cheap and no side effects. Worth a
                                                  try. Haven't tried the scopolomine patches worn near
                                                  the ear but I imagine they have side effects. Mike



                                                  ____________________________________________________
                                                  Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
                                                  http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
                                                • eo_ant
                                                  Perhaps a more agreeable way of taking ginger are ginger snap cookies. Trader Joes sells a triple ginger snap that contains 3 forms of ginger. Eric
                                                  Message 24 of 28 , Aug 29, 2005
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    Perhaps a more agreeable way of taking ginger are ginger snap cookies.
                                                    Trader Joes sells a triple ginger snap that contains 3 forms of ginger.

                                                    Eric


                                                    --- In macgregor19sailboats@yahoogroups.com, mike fortuna
                                                    <angelwilliams69@y...> wrote:
                                                    > I've tried several over the counter drugs, the bands
                                                    > and even an expensive wristwatch that shocked you
                                                    > (VERY unpleasant) and none worked as well as just
                                                    > taking about 1/2 teaspoon of powdered Ginger washed
                                                    > down with some liquid. Even helps AFTER you start
                                                    > getting seasick, cheap and no side effects. Worth a
                                                    > try. Haven't tried the scopolomine patches worn near
                                                    > the ear but I imagine they have side effects. Mike
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > ____________________________________________________
                                                    > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
                                                    > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
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