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[lxx] Re: FW: LXX Theology/Theologies

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  • Choufrine, Arkadi
    ... not as common as the Ps/Odes MSS, nevertheless come in slightly ahead of lectionaries at 15%. Thus, it seems that full texts of the OT were the exception
    Message 1 of 4 , Mar 8, 2000
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      > MSS containing single books of the OT, while
      not
      as common as the Ps/Odes MSS, nevertheless come in slightly ahead of
      lectionaries at 15%. Thus, it seems that full texts of the OT were the
      exception to the rule: the rule, on the contrary, for OT usage and
      familiarity would have been portions and excerpts, like the
      lectionaries.
      --------
      Dear James,

      It seems to me, that from what you are saying it follows that the full
      single books of the OT Scriptures were the rule to no less extent than the
      lectionaries. And when one has a library of single books, one has the
      "Biblia" (=lit. "little books", note the plural).

      Arkadi
    • Choufrine, Arkadi
      ... OT scriptures were (and still are) encountered by most people primarily in the context of worship. ... Thanks for you balanced and clarifying comments,
      Message 2 of 4 , Mar 8, 2000
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        > by and large the
        OT scriptures were (and still are) encountered by most people primarily
        in the context of worship.
        ----------
        Thanks for you balanced and clarifying comments, John.
        I would add that the case with the NT scriptures seems to be the same.

        Arkadi
      • james and tatiana miller
        Arkadi: I m open to what you re saying, but how can it be substantiated from the evidence? What if, for example, it were seen that individual books like, say,
        Message 3 of 4 , Mar 8, 2000
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          Arkadi:

          I'm open to what you're saying, but how can it be substantiated from the
          evidence? What if, for example, it were seen that individual books like,
          say, Gen, predominate percentage-wise among the MSS of indivudual books?
          Should we still conclude that this reflects a practice of cobbling together
          a full OT from parts? It seems to me that this too would militate against
          the idea that there were very many complete OT's (reflecting the range of
          the OT canon-lists, though put together book by book), floating around. I
          hope you would also admit that, even if statistics showed a fairly even
          distribution of individual OT books (i.e., representative of the major
          groupings like Wisdom, Prophets, Historical etc.) that it would be quite
          another thing to prove that these books had once formed part of a single
          library. Most of the MSS in the Verzeichnis are assigned dates, so
          consideration of the dating data could be used to confirm or exclude the
          probability that certain, single-book MSS formed part of a single library
          at one time. I'm willing to undertake some additional analysis of the MS
          evidence in VGHOT, if you're willing to propose some criteria according to
          which the case you urge can be falsified.

          Thanks, James
        • atombomb
          Blessed be God. ... You re welcome. The Orthodox Church has always taken a much more liturgical approach to scripture than has been the case in the West since
          Message 4 of 4 , Mar 8, 2000
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            Blessed be God.

            "Choufrine, Arkadi" wrote:
            >
            > > by and large the
            > OT scriptures were (and still are) encountered by most people primarily
            > in the context of worship.
            > ----------
            > Thanks for you balanced and clarifying comments, John.
            > I would add that the case with the NT scriptures seems to be the same.

            You're welcome.

            The Orthodox Church has always taken a much more liturgical approach to
            scripture than has been the case in the West since the Reformation, and
            this determines everything from the way we bind the books to the order
            we tend to read them.

            Thus with regard to the NT, the Gospels are enthroned on the altar of
            the church, as being the direct words of the incarnate God-- and for
            this reason, they are bound separately. The 'Apostol' is kept at the
            chanter's stand, as the words of the apostles are most often proclaimed
            either from there or from the middle of the church, and again, for this
            reason, it is bound separately as well. The Revelation of St. John is
            not read in church, but would be read in the refectory of a monastery,
            or privately; so normally you would find it only in a one-volume "New
            Testament". The entire canon of the NT is read during the course of a
            year in an Orthodox church, but there has always also been a great
            effort and earnest desire to read it assiduously in private, especially
            following the course of readings which are done in church-- and thus I
            believe you are more likely to find mss of the complete NT, than you
            will of the OT-- the main reasons probably being sheer bulk and relative
            importance within the Christian context. During Lent, we read through
            Genesis, Isaiah, and Proverbs, and it is recommended that people follow
            these readings privately as well as listening to them in church; the
            fathers are very strong on continually reading the holy scriptures
            privately. And it is simply impossible to understand our services, with
            their enormous bulk of hymnography, without thorough familiarity with
            the Old and New Testaments. The entire bible, even its obscure passages,
            really was to Orthodox culture what the Iliad and the Odyssey were to
            the ancients-- it provided the language, the diction, the terms, the
            metaphors, and the imagery that the Byzantines used to talk about
            literally anything and everything.

            Regards,

            John Burnett
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