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Re: Tamar's situation in Absalom's house

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  • finckean
    That Tamar got preganant from the liaison with Amnon is also the implication of Matthew 15:27: The dogs eat from the crumbs fallen from the table of their
    Message 1 of 34 , Jun 1, 2008
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      That Tamar got preganant from the liaison with Amnon is also the
      implication of Matthew 15:27: "The dogs eat from the crumbs fallen
      from the table of their masters". Logic dictates that the speaker -
      the Canaanite woman, eating fallen crumbs - imitates Bathsheba, who
      stood on the street showering from water falling from the roof-top
      (hanging gardens?) of the palace. See 2 Samuel 11:2, where NETS has
      correctly "he saw a woman bathing from the roof". And the demon-
      possessed "daughter", for whose healing the Canaanite petitioned, is
      none other than Tamar, who two chapters later in 2 Samuel was healed
      from her habitual menstrual impurity through the incurred pregnancy.
      Matthew 15:28: "And she was healed from that hour (HORA)" shifts the
      pregnancy to Bathsheba, who was impregnated not by David, but rather
      by Uriah five weeks previously, and who - at the time David spotted
      her - was enjoying the beginning of cessation of her periods. See
      11:4 NETS: "And she was purifying herself from her uncleanness"
      for "And she ended the five days of waiting for the onset of her
      peiodic defilement". HORA at Matthew 5:28 is the same word that
      appears in the Coptic of 2 Samuel 13:20, modifying XHHROUSA "acting
      like a widow". That - in turn - refers not to Tamar but rather to
      Bathsheba, of whom David heard (11:3 NETS)"Is not this Bersabee
      daughter of Eliab, wife of Ourias the Chettite". The speaker is not
      named, but it stands to reason that it was the same Ethiopian
      messenger who at 18:31-32 told David about Absalom's death. If so,
      he probably said in Ethiopian: WAORYO KETYAWI META "And Uriah the
      Chettite her husband". David misunderstood META "her husband" as
      Hebrew META "her dead one" and summoned her to comfort her over the
      loss. When the truth came out, Hebrews 11:35 "Women took from the
      resurrection their dead" was fulfilled (contra Sigrid).
      Andrew Fincke
    • Fr. John Whiteford
      I would ask the moderators to point out what, in the following comments is worthy of a serious response: That Tamar got preganant from the liaison with Amnon
      Message 34 of 34 , Jun 4, 2008
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        I would ask the moderators to point out what, in the following
        comments is worthy of a serious response:

        That Tamar got preganant from the liaison with Amnon is also the
        implication of Matthew 15:27: "The dogs eat from the crumbs fallen
        from the table of their masters". Logic dictates that the speaker -
        the Canaanite woman, eating fallen crumbs - imitates Bathsheba, who
        stood on the street showering from water falling from the roof-top
        (hanging gardens?) of the palace. See 2 Samuel 11:2, where NETS has
        correctly "he saw a woman bathing from the roof". And the demon-
        possessed "daughter", for whose healing the Canaanite petitioned, is
        none other than Tamar, who two chapters later in 2 Samuel was healed
        from her habitual menstrual impurity through the incurred pregnancy.
        Matthew 15:28: "And she was healed from that hour (HORA)" shifts the
        pregnancy to Bathsheba, who was impregnated not by David, but rather
        by Uriah five weeks previously, and who - at the time David spotted
        her - was enjoying the beginning of cessation of her periods. See
        11:4 NETS: "And she was purifying herself from her uncleanness"
        for "And she ended the five days of waiting for the onset of her
        peiodic defilement". HORA at Matthew 5:28 is the same word that
        appears in the Coptic of 2 Samuel 13:20, modifying XHHROUSA "acting
        like a widow". That - in turn - refers not to Tamar but rather to
        Bathsheba, of whom David heard (11:3 NETS)"Is not this Bersabee
        daughter of Eliab, wife of Ourias the Chettite". The speaker is not
        named, but it stands to reason that it was the same Ethiopian
        messenger who at 18:31-32 told David about Absalom's death. If so,
        he probably said in Ethiopian: WAORYO KETYAWI META "And Uriah the
        Chettite her husband". David misunderstood META "her husband" as
        Hebrew META "her dead one" and summoned her to comfort her over the
        loss. When the truth came out, Hebrews 11:35 "Women took from the
        resurrection their dead" was fulfilled (contra Sigrid).
        Andrew Fincke

        Of course, one could argue that Matthew 15:28 "And she was healed (i.e.
        was pregnant) from that hour" belongs after "And he lay with her" in
        11:4. But that is both physiologically indefensible (why an hour?) and
        contradicts verse 5, which sets the onset of the pregnancy to a point
        of time after her return to her house. On the contrary, Matthew
        added "from that hour" to exonerate David from guilt, since thereby he
        avoided the inference "And she returned to her house [and she waited
        five weeks] and she became pregnant and told David". No, she became
        aware of the pregnancy immediately upon arrival home and justified her
        attribution of paternity to David on the grounds of David's documented
        penchant for self-gratification (see 1 Samuel 20:26), the habit of the
        patriarchs to ejaculate on the ground (see Gen 38:9) and her having
        been the recipient of droppings from the palace-roof (verse 2), where
        David - admittedly had been walking when he spotted her (idem).
        Andrew Fincke
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