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Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing

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  • R Drake
    A handful of miscellaneous comments on this topic - First, from my (limited) experience, there doesn t seem to have been a tradition of congregational
    Message 1 of 20 , Jan 2, 2012
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      A handful of miscellaneous comments on this topic -

      First, from my (limited) experience, there doesn't seem to have been a tradition of congregational partsinging in RC churches in the US - don't know about elsewhere.  Oddly enough, it's the newer RC hymns where I've routinely seen harmony, whether on the page, or improvised by a congregation familiar with the songs.  Don't know why it can be done with a David Haas song but not a traditional hymn....  I haven't heard of RC or other mainline churches currently taking the position that it's distracting or otherwise a bad thing for the congregation to sing in harmony.  If you have, could you cite, please?  I'm interested...

      Second, while I strongly approve of teaching children to sing parts from notation, some of the denominations and churches with strong partsinging traditions have not sung from written notation in most cases, but rather from improvised harmony according to an understood musical style.  Personally, I value my ability to harmonize in several different styles at least as much as my ability to read music.

      Hymnals (for church use) with no tunes at all - the assumption is that the tunes were well-known, and either relatively invariable, or interchangeable within a meter as with the Scottish psalm tunes.  I understand that we Americans are the only ones who expect our hymn lyrics to be set within the musical staves - despite Eric Routley's complaints, it *is* possible to get both the structure and content of the words when it's done that way.  For singers, it means memorizing the music in the course of one verse (max - grrrrr), or assuming that the hymn will be used so often as to make all parts automatic.

      Robin Drake
      St Anne's Episcopal Church
      Northern Virginia - USA
       
      "Happiness is a how, not a what; a talent, not an object." - Hermann Hesse

      From: William Renwick <renwick@...>
      To: liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Monday, January 2, 2012 12:10 PM
      Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing

      Certainly participants should be able to have all the resources that they require!!  But I think that in some quarters there is a philosophy that somehow singing harmony in the congregation is not the correct idea of unity of spirit. --you are supposed to behave like sheep!!  There may even be the idea that the participant singing harmony will be carried away by the music and thus be detracted from the text.
      Of course I think these ideas are nonsense!! 

      I think that our children should all be taught to sing from notated harmony in schools and in churches.
      There are some wonderful traditions of congregational harmony in the reformed churches.
      The decline of congregational part-singing is also reflected in a decline of pure harmony in much of the new hymn-materials.

      On hymnals with no music; it is really the same principals as breviaries or prayer books without music; so that the devout laity can worship in their chamber.  A small pocket-book with all the texts is all that is needed.  This tradition goes back to the books of hours of the later middle ages.
      the English Hymnal (1906) remains my favourite; it was available in full music, melody only, and text only versions.

      Hymnals with music for the congregation hardly predate 1800.  There are a few, but hardly any in English.

      Any one know of a free hymnal that has the classic Roman Catholic Hymns of pre-Vatican II?



      William Renwick
      renwick@...
      School of the Arts
      McMaster University
      Hamilton Ontario CANADA L8S 4M2        http://www.humanities.mcmaster.ca/~renwick/wr.htm

         
    • Michael Thannisch
      That has been my gripe about projected hymns, no music. Shalom b Yeshua haMoshiach   +Mar Michael Abportus mjthannisch@sbcglobal.net Pastor, Congregation
      Message 2 of 20 , Jan 2, 2012
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        That has been my gripe about projected hymns, no music.


        Shalom b'Yeshua haMoshiach
         
        +Mar Michael Abportus
        Pastor, Congregation Benim Avraham
        http://www.freewebs.com/childrenofabraham/
        http://patriotstatesman.com/
        http://laportemorganspointshoreacresnews.webs.com/
        http://santoeastcemeteryassociation.webs.com/
        204 Sylvan Ave.
        La Porte, TX 77571
        281-867-9081 (home)
        281-867-0335 (office)
        832-266-8153 (mobile)
        281-867-0576 (fax)


        --- On Mon, 1/2/12, William Renwick <renwick@...> wrote:

        From: William Renwick <renwick@...>
        Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing
        To: liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Monday, January 2, 2012, 11:10 AM

         

        Certainly participants should be able to have all the resources that they require!! But I think that in some quarters there is a philosophy that somehow singing harmony in the congregation is not the correct idea of unity of spirit. --you are supposed to behave like sheep!! There may even be the idea that the participant singing harmony will be carried away by the music and thus be detracted from the text.
        Of course I think these ideas are nonsense!!

        I think that our children should all be taught to sing from notated harmony in schools and in churches.
        There are some wonderful traditions of congregational harmony in the reformed churches.
        The decline of congregational part-singing is also reflected in a decline of pure harmony in much of the new hymn-materials.

        On hymnals with no music; it is really the same principals as breviaries or prayer books without music; so that the devout laity can worship in their chamber. A small pocket-book with all the texts is all that is needed. This tradition goes back to the books of hours of the later middle ages.
        the English Hymnal (1906) remains my favourite; it was available in full music, melody only, and text only versions.

        Hymnals with music for the congregation hardly predate 1800. There are a few, but hardly any in English.

        Any one know of a free hymnal that has the classic Roman Catholic Hymns of pre-Vatican II?

        William Renwick
        renwick@...
        School of the Arts
        McMaster University
        Hamilton Ontario CANADA L8S 4M2 http://www.humanities.mcmaster.ca/~renwick/wr.htm


      • Frank Senn
        My sense is that part singing was something done at home and not originally in churches. German chorales and French psalter tunes, for example, were sung in
        Message 3 of 20 , Jan 3, 2012
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          My sense is that part singing was something done at home and not originally in churches. German chorales and French psalter tunes, for example, were sung in unison in church services but composers provided parts that the family could sing around the table at home.  In the case of the chorales, stanzas sung in parts belonged to the choir and involved more complicated settings.  The organ could also spell both congregation and choir on multi-stanza hymns.  The Reformed tradition eschewed part-singing in church but Huguenot composers provided excellent part-wiriting of the psalms to be sung at home.  My guess is that what people enjoyed at home they wanted to do in church.  The English part-song tradition may have encouraged this in the denominational mix of America.  You don't find part singing among European Lutherans.

          Frank C. Senn 

          --- On Mon, 1/2/12, R Drake <hymncat@...> wrote:

          From: R Drake <hymncat@...>
          Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing
          To: "liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com" <liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com>
          Date: Monday, January 2, 2012, 8:05 PM

           

          A handful of miscellaneous comments on this topic -

          First, from my (limited) experience, there doesn't seem to have been a tradition of congregational partsinging in RC churches in the US - don't know about elsewhere.  Oddly enough, it's the newer RC hymns where I've routinely seen harmony, whether on the page, or improvised by a congregation familiar with the songs.  Don't know why it can be done with a David Haas song but not a traditional hymn....  I haven't heard of RC or other mainline churches currently taking the position that it's distracting or otherwise a bad thing for the congregation to sing in harmony.  If you have, could you cite, please?  I'm interested...

          Second, while I strongly approve of teaching children to sing parts from notation, some of the denominations and churches with strong partsinging traditions have not sung from written notation in most cases, but rather from improvised harmony according to an understood musical style.  Personally, I value my ability to harmonize in several different styles at least as much as my ability to read music.

          Hymnals (for church use) with no tunes at all - the assumption is that the tunes were well-known, and either relatively invariable, or interchangeable within a meter as with the Scottish psalm tunes.  I understand that we Americans are the only ones who expect our hymn lyrics to be set within the musical staves - despite Eric Routley's complaints, it *is* possible to get both the structure and content of the words when it's done that way.  For singers, it means memorizing the music in the course of one verse (max - grrrrr), or assuming that the hymn will be used so often as to make all parts automatic.

          Robin Drake
          St Anne's Episcopal Church
          Northern Virginia - USA
           
          "Happiness is a how, not a what; a talent, not an object." - Hermann Hesse

          From: William Renwick <renwick@...>
          To: liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Monday, January 2, 2012 12:10 PM
          Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing

          Certainly participants should be able to have all the resources that they require!!  But I think that in some quarters there is a philosophy that somehow singing harmony in the congregation is not the correct idea of unity of spirit. --you are supposed to behave like sheep!!  There may even be the idea that the participant singing harmony will be carried away by the music and thus be detracted from the text.
          Of course I think these ideas are nonsense!! 

          I think that our children should all be taught to sing from notated harmony in schools and in churches.
          There are some wonderful traditions of congregational harmony in the reformed churches.
          The decline of congregational part-singing is also reflected in a decline of pure harmony in much of the new hymn-materials.

          On hymnals with no music; it is really the same principals as breviaries or prayer books without music; so that the devout laity can worship in their chamber.  A small pocket-book with all the texts is all that is needed.  This tradition goes back to the books of hours of the later middle ages.
          the English Hymnal (1906) remains my favourite; it was available in full music, melody only, and text only versions.

          Hymnals with music for the congregation hardly predate 1800.  There are a few, but hardly any in English.

          Any one know of a free hymnal that has the classic Roman Catholic Hymns of pre-Vatican II?



          William Renwick
          renwick@...
          School of the Arts
          McMaster University
          Hamilton Ontario CANADA L8S 4M2        http://www.humanities.mcmaster.ca/~renwick/wr.htm

             
        • dlewisaao@aol.com
          This may, then, explain why one finds hymnals with parts in Anglican and various Protestant churches in the US? David ... David Lewis dlewisaao@aol.com In a
          Message 4 of 20 , Jan 3, 2012
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            This may, then, explain why one finds hymnals with parts in Anglican and various Protestant churches in the US?
             
            David
             
            ---------------------------
            David Lewis
            dlewisaao@...
             
            In a message dated 1/3/2012 8:29:52 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, fcsenn@... writes:


            My sense is that part singing was something done at home and not originally in churches. German chorales and French psalter tunes, for example, were sung in unison in church services but composers provided parts that the family could sing around the table at home.  In the case of the chorales, stanzas sung in parts belonged to the choir and involved more complicated settings.  The organ could also spell both congregation and choir on multi-stanza hymns.  The Reformed tradition eschewed part-singing in church but Huguenot composers provided excellent part-wiriting of the psalms to be sung at home.  My guess is that what people enjoyed at home they wanted to do in church.  The English part-song tradition may have encouraged this in the denominational mix of America.  You don't find part singing among European Lutherans.

            Frank C. Senn 

            --- On Mon, 1/2/12, R Drake <hymncat@...> wrote:

            From: R Drake <hymncat@...>
            Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing
            To: "liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com" <liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com>
            Date: Monday, January 2, 2012, 8:05 PM

             

            A handful of miscellaneous comments on this topic -

            First, from my (limited) experience, there doesn't seem to have been a tradition of congregational partsinging in RC churches in the US - don't know about elsewhere.  Oddly enough, it's the newer RC hymns where I've routinely seen harmony, whether on the page, or improvised by a congregation familiar with the songs.  Don't know why it can be done with a David Haas song but not a traditional hymn....  I haven't heard of RC or other mainline churches currently taking the position that it's distracting or otherwise a bad thing for the congregation to sing in harmony.  If you have, could you cite, please?  I'm interested...

            Second, while I strongly approve of teaching children to sing parts from notation, some of the denominations and churches with strong partsinging traditions have not sung from written notation in most cases, but rather from improvised harmony according to an understood musical style.  Personally, I value my ability to harmonize in several different styles at least as much as my ability to read music.

            Hymnals (for church use) with no tunes at all - the assumption is that the tunes were well-known, and either relatively invariable, or interchangeable within a meter as with the Scottish psalm tunes.  I understand that we Americans are the only ones who expect our hymn lyrics to be set within the musical staves - despite Eric Routley's complaints, it *is* possible to get both the structure and content of the words when it's done that way.  For singers, it means memorizing the music in the course of one verse (max - grrrrr), or assuming that the hymn will be used so often as to make all parts automatic.

            Robin Drake
            St Anne's Episcopal Church
            Northern Virginia - USA
             
            "Happiness is a how, not a what; a talent, not an object." - Hermann Hesse

            From: William Renwick <renwick@...>
            To: liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Monday, January 2, 2012 12:10 PM
            Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing

            Certainly participants should be able to have all the resources that they require!!  But I think that in some quarters there is a philosophy that somehow singing harmony in the congregation is not the correct idea of unity of spirit. --you are supposed to behave like sheep!!  There may even be the idea that the participant singing harmony will be carried away by the music and thus be detracted from the text.
            Of course I think these ideas are nonsense!! 

            I think that our children should all be taught to sing from notated harmony in schools and in churches.
            There are some wonderful traditions of congregational harmony in the reformed churches.
            The decline of congregational part-singing is also reflected in a decline of pure harmony in much of the new hymn-materials.

            On hymnals with no music; it is really the same principals as breviaries or prayer books without music; so that the devout laity can worship in their chamber.  A small pocket-book with all the texts is all that is needed.  This tradition goes back to the books of hours of the later middle ages.
            the English Hymnal (1906) remains my favourite; it was available in full music, melody only, and text only versions.

            Hymnals with music for the congregation hardly predate 1800.  There are a few, but hardly any in English.

            Any one know of a free hymnal that has the classic Roman Catholic Hymns of pre-Vatican II?



            William Renwick
            renwick@...
            School of the Arts
            McMaster University
            Hamilton Ontario CANADA L8S 4M2        http://www.humanities.mcmaster.ca/~renwick/wr.htm

               
          • Ian Gomersall
            David mentioned a pet peeve being missing out some stanzas. Thats a difficult one. In some cases one or two of the stanzas don t work at certain times while
            Message 5 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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              David mentioned a pet peeve being missing out some stanzas. 

              Thats a difficult one. In some cases one or two of the stanzas don't work at certain times while others do.
              Then some of the original hymns come from hymns which a really l o n g and we'd not want to sing the lot.

              But then if we miss out from the printed book I do glance over and ask myself why!

              Ian
              Bless your House: 20+C+M+B+12 See our church blog: www.stchrysostoms.wordpress.com 
            • Sean W. Reed
              The subject of missing stanzas is always interesting. That missing one from All Things Bright and Beautiful comes to mind! SWR
              Message 6 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                The subject of missing stanzas is always interesting. That missing one from "All Things Bright and Beautiful" comes to mind!


                SWR

                Ian Gomersall <ian.gomersall@...> wrote:

                >David mentioned a pet peeve being missing out some stanzas.
                >
                >Thats a difficult one. In some cases one or two of the stanzas don't work
                >at certain times while others do.
                >Then some of the original hymns come from hymns which a really l o n g and
                >we'd not want to sing the lot.
                >
                >But then if we miss out from the printed book I do glance over and ask
                >myself why!
                >
                >Ian
                >Bless your House: 20+C+M+B+12 See our church blog:
                >www.stchrysostoms.wordpress.com
              • Frank Senn
                There are also three stanzas in William How s For All the Saints that are routinely omitted from most hymnals.  Sometimes it s interesting to google
                Message 7 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                  There are also three stanzas in William How's "For All the Saints" that are routinely omitted from most hymnals.  Sometimes it's interesting to google favorite hymn lyrics to see what stanzas are omitted or how the originals have been amended.

                  Frank C. Senn

                  --- On Sun, 1/8/12, Sean W. Reed <anglican@...> wrote:

                  From: Sean W. Reed <anglican@...>
                  Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing
                  To: liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com
                  Date: Sunday, January 8, 2012, 3:32 PM

                   

                  The subject of missing stanzas is always interesting. That missing one from "All Things Bright and Beautiful" comes to mind!

                  SWR

                  Ian Gomersall <ian.gomersall@...> wrote:

                  >David mentioned a pet peeve being missing out some stanzas.
                  >
                  >Thats a difficult one. In some cases one or two of the stanzas don't work
                  >at certain times while others do.
                  >Then some of the original hymns come from hymns which a really l o n g and
                  >we'd not want to sing the lot.
                  >
                  >But then if we miss out from the printed book I do glance over and ask
                  >myself why!
                  >
                  >Ian
                  >Bless your House: 20+C+M+B+12 See our church blog:
                  >www.stchrysostoms.wordpress.com

                • Douglas Cowling
                  On 1/8/12 5:20 PM, Frank Senn wrote: There are also three stanzas in William How s For All the Saints that are routinely omitted
                  Message 8 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                    Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing On 1/8/12 5:20 PM, "Frank Senn" <fcsenn@...> wrote:

                    There are also three stanzas in William How's "For All the Saints" that are routinely omitted from most hymnals.  Sometimes it's interesting to google favorite hymn lyrics to see what stanzas are omitted or how the originals have been amended.

                    None more interesting than Wesley’s “O For a Thousand Tongues to Sing”

                    How’s this for traditional and unaltered?

                    “O for a thousand tongues to sing
                    My great Redeemer’s praise,
                    The glories of my God and King,
                    The triumphs of His grace!
                     
                    Harlots and publicans and thieves
                    In holy triumph join!
                    Saved is the sinner that believes
                    From crimes as great as mine.
                     
                    Murd’rers and all ye hellish crew
                    In holy triumph join!
                    Believe the Saviour died for you;
                    For me the Saviour died.”

                    Doug Cowling
                    Director of Music
                    St. Philip's Church, Etobicoke
                    Toronto






                  • Fernanda or John Harrington
                    That should be, Murd rers and all ye hellish crew/Ye sons of lust and pride...
                    Message 9 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                      That should be, "Murd'rers and all ye hellish crew/Ye sons of lust and pride..."

                      On 01/08/2012 05:26 PM, Douglas Cowling wrote:
                       

                      On 1/8/12 5:20 PM, "Frank Senn" <fcsenn@...> wrote:

                      There are also three stanzas in William How's "For All the Saints" that are routinely omitted from most hymnals.  Sometimes it's interesting to google favorite hymn lyrics to see what stanzas are omitted or how the originals have been amended.

                      None more interesting than Wesley’s “O For a Thousand Tongues to Sing”

                      How’s this for traditional and unaltered?


                      “O for a thousand tongues to sing
                      My great Redeemer’s praise,
                      The glories of my God and King,
                      The triumphs of His grace!
                       
                      Harlots and publicans and thieves
                      In holy triumph join!
                      Saved is the sinner that believes
                      >From crimes as great as mine.
                       
                      Murd’rers and all ye hellish crew
                      In holy triumph join!
                      Believe the Saviour died for you;
                      For me the Saviour died.”

                      Doug Cowling
                      Director of Music
                      St. Philip's Church, Etobicoke
                      Toronto






                    • George Carlson
                      I sometimes think that great lyricist and composer/arranger, Mr. Alt. has made more contributions to all the hymnals than any save perhaps J. S. Bach! In
                      Message 10 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                        I sometimes think that great lyricist and composer/arranger, “Mr. Alt.” has made more “contributions” to all the hymnals than any save perhaps J. S. Bach!

                         

                        In omnibus pax,

                        George Carlson

                        St. Paul’s (TEC)

                        Murfreesboro, TN

                         

                      • dlewisaao@aol.com
                        My bone to pick is when a hymn simply is stopped with one stanza left to sing which would complete the message of the hymn. Omitting a stanza or two by
                        Message 11 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                          My bone to pick is when a hymn simply is stopped with one stanza left to sing which would complete the message of the hymn.  Omitting a stanza or two by premeditation does sometimes make sense, but that is another matter.
                           
                          David
                           
                          ---------------------------
                          David Lewis
                          dlewisaao@...
                           
                          In a message dated 1/8/2012 4:32:06 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, anglican@... writes:
                          The subject of missing stanzas is always interesting.   That missing one from "All Things Bright and Beautiful" comes to mind!


                          SWR

                          Ian Gomersall <ian.gomersall@...> wrote:

                          >David mentioned a pet peeve being missing out some stanzas.
                          >
                          >Thats a difficult one. In some cases one or two of the stanzas don't work
                          >at certain times while others do.
                          >Then some of the original hymns come from hymns which a really l o n g and
                          >we'd not want to sing the lot.
                          >
                          >But then if we miss out from the printed book I do glance over and ask
                          >myself why!
                          >
                          >Ian
                          >Bless your House: 20+C+M+B+12 See our church blog:
                          >www.stchrysostoms.wordpress.com


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                        • Scott Knitter
                          Agreed. I don t like having a hymn treated as mere traveling music. It s a prayer form.
                          Message 12 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                            Agreed. I don't like having a hymn treated as mere traveling music.
                            It's a prayer form.

                            On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 9:02 PM, <dlewisaao@...> wrote:

                            > My bone to pick is when a hymn simply is stopped with one stanza left to sing which would complete the message of the hymn.  Omitting a stanza or two by premeditation does sometimes make sense, but that is another matter.
                          • Michael Thannisch
                            It is.  We vary some of the stanzas in hymns according to season.  For example, some Christmas Hymns mention the three wise men.  We usually leave out those
                            Message 13 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                              It is.  We vary some of the stanzas in hymns according to season.  For example, some Christmas Hymns mention the three wise men.  We usually leave out those stanzas during the 12 days of Christmas, and use them for Epiphany. 

                              Shalom b'Yeshua haMoshiach
                               
                              +Mar Michael Abportus
                              Pastor, Congregation Benim Avraham
                              http://www.freewebs.com/childrenofabraham/
                              http://patriotstatesman.com/
                              http://laportemorganspointshoreacresnews.webs.com/
                              http://santoeastcemeteryassociation.webs.com/
                              204 Sylvan Ave.
                              La Porte, TX 77571
                              281-867-9081 (home)
                              281-867-0335 (office)
                              832-266-8153 (mobile)
                              281-867-0576 (fax)


                              --- On Sun, 1/8/12, Ian Gomersall <ian.gomersall@...> wrote:

                              From: Ian Gomersall <ian.gomersall@...>
                              Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing
                              To: liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com
                              Date: Sunday, January 8, 2012, 2:49 PM

                               

                              David mentioned a pet peeve being missing out some stanzas. 


                              Thats a difficult one. In some cases one or two of the stanzas don't work at certain times while others do.
                              Then some of the original hymns come from hymns which a really l o n g and we'd not want to sing the lot.

                              But then if we miss out from the printed book I do glance over and ask myself why!

                              Ian
                              Bless your House: 20+C+M+B+12 See our church blog: www.stchrysostoms.wordpress.com 
                            • Michael Thannisch
                              Sounds like some good verses to add back in. Shalom b Yeshua haMoshiach   +Mar Michael Abportus mjthannisch@sbcglobal.net Pastor, Congregation Benim
                              Message 14 of 20 , Jan 8, 2012
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                                Sounds like some good verses to add back in.

                                Shalom b'Yeshua haMoshiach
                                 
                                +Mar Michael Abportus
                                Pastor, Congregation Benim Avraham
                                http://www.freewebs.com/childrenofabraham/
                                http://patriotstatesman.com/
                                http://laportemorganspointshoreacresnews.webs.com/
                                http://santoeastcemeteryassociation.webs.com/
                                204 Sylvan Ave.
                                La Porte, TX 77571
                                281-867-9081 (home)
                                281-867-0335 (office)
                                832-266-8153 (mobile)
                                281-867-0576 (fax)


                                --- On Sun, 1/8/12, Douglas Cowling <cowling.douglas@...> wrote:

                                From: Douglas Cowling <cowling.douglas@...>
                                Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Catholic hymnals etc and singing
                                To: liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com
                                Date: Sunday, January 8, 2012, 4:26 PM

                                 

                                On 1/8/12 5:20 PM, "Frank Senn" <fcsenn@...> wrote:

                                There are also three stanzas in William How's "For All the Saints" that are routinely omitted from most hymnals.  Sometimes it's interesting to google favorite hymn lyrics to see what stanzas are omitted or how the originals have been amended.

                                None more interesting than Wesley’s “O For a Thousand Tongues to Sing”

                                How’s this for traditional and unaltered?


                                “O for a thousand tongues to sing
                                My great Redeemer’s praise,
                                The glories of my God and King,
                                The triumphs of His grace!
                                 
                                Harlots and publicans and thieves
                                In holy triumph join!
                                Saved is the sinner that believes
                                From crimes as great as mine.
                                 
                                Murd’rers and all ye hellish crew
                                In holy triumph join!
                                Believe the Saviour died for you;
                                For me the Saviour died.”

                                Doug Cowling
                                Director of Music
                                St. Philip's Church, Etobicoke
                                Toronto






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