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Re: [liturgy-l] Question regarding Benediction

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  • dlewisaao@aol.com
    Yes, another option would be to add a server for this purpose, but (1) we are already using 6 acolytes (SD, MC, TH, CR, AC, AC) for most of the year and 5 (no
    Message 1 of 17 , Apr 1, 2009
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      Yes, another option would be to add a server for this purpose, but (1) we
      are already using 6 acolytes (SD, MC, TH, CR, AC, AC) for most of the year and 5
      (no SD) "off season" and (2) there is the challenge of space.

      David


      In a message dated 3/31/2009 11:01:56 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
      skreed1@... writes:

      The credence works, or if people are not a problem simply have a server vest
      and come in for the sole purpose of handling the HV in conjunction with the
      MC.

      It could be nothing more than the MC walking over and handing it to him.


      SWR
      Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

      -----Original Message-----
      From: dlewisaao@...

      Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 20:48:46
      To: <liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com>
      Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Question regarding Benediction


      Very helpful. We fold the humeral veil in the way that you describe.
      However, the size and arrangement of the sanctuary in my parish church
      would
      preclude our having a cope stand, and the fact that the subdeacon and
      officiant
      and deacon are all awaiting the MC's signal for them to kneel after the MC
      takes the humeral veil from the officiant means that the MC has very little
      time
      to deal with the humeral veil at that point. If we could simply place it
      over the credence, which is only a few steps to the right of the MC, w/o
      the MC
      turning his back to the Sacrament not being an issue, that would work.

      David


      In a message dated 3/31/2009 7:06:19 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
      skreed1@... writes:

      I think you have to separate what is required from what is incidental and
      go
      from there.

      What is required is :

      A Humeral Veil to be used

      The HV to be carefully handled to prevent damage

      The process of storing and putting on and off the HV to be smooth.

      Prior to use, if each end of the HV is allowed to fold upon itself
      "accordion style" leaving the center of the back upward, the whole veil
      takes up less
      space and it easier to handle and place on the officiant.

      Simply pick up the "stack" holding the morse side upward and carry to the
      officiant.

      After placing over his shoulders, allow each end of the "accordion stack"
      to
      drop.

      So far you have eliminated a large long storage problem. Folded in this
      manner it should not take up space much larger than a square yard at the
      most.

      After removing, fold and simply and as few times as possible, and drape
      over
      a convenient object, unless you have a cope stand, which is what we tend to
      use, then no folding is necessary.

      We recently acquired a cope stand, and if you don't have one, it is well
      worth having one made. I would be glad to send picture if you would like.



      SWR
      Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

      -----Original Message-----
      From: dlewisaao@...

      Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:41:40
      To: <liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com>
      Subject: Re: [liturgy-l] Question regarding Benediction


      We're in a physical arrangement where the only space for a lectern on the
      same side as the MC is the lectern used by the officiant at Evensong. (I
      must
      note that because our sacristy is to the left side of the sanctuary, in
      recent years we have found it best to have the MC on the right side and the


      thurifer on the left side during Benediction.) If we were to use this
      lectern for
      the humeral veil, we would have to move it a few feet toward the nave and
      then have someone drape the humeral veil on it - between Evensong &
      Benediction,
      probably when the minister(s) are at the Lady Altar for the Marian
      antiphon
      etc. And we have the complication that during Eastertide the lectern has
      a

      fall over its reading surface that hangs in front and in back and would
      add
      to
      the complexity of shifting the lectern.

      Our credence is on the nave side of the sedilia, rather than with the two
      being in reverse positions, again simply because of our architecture.
      Here,
      were could place the humeral veil on the credence, except for two
      complications: (1) the two acolytes' candles are on the back side of the
      credence during
      Evensong, so we would have to fold the humeral veil and even then risk
      getting wax on it, and/or (2) we could put the humeral veil on the
      otherwise unused
      credence once it is removed from the priest's shoulders, except that our
      credence is at a place about even with the altar steps and thus the MC
      would
      effectively be turning his back to the Exposed Sacrament.

      Right now, the humeral veil is placed on the steps in a place convenient to

      the MC, and is placed back there after being used often in an only roughly
      folded way. This works, except that we are now using large humeral veils
      and
      it is difficult to do anything other than only roughly fold them before
      replacement on the steps - so we are looking for a better way to do it.
      Are we
      really ok or should we keep looking? Any comments on the proposed
      solutions to
      date?

      David


      In a message dated 3/31/2009 3:57:59 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
      scottknitter@... writes:

      On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 2:36 PM, <dlewisaao@...> wrote:
      > Obviously addressed to the niche of RC and Anglican parishes that do
      > Benediction of the Most Blessed Sacrament:
      >
      > (1) Where is the humeral veil placed before the beginning of the
      liturgy?

      It's draped over a wooden lectern near the sacristy door and sedilia
      (the lectern used by the celebrant at Low Mass).

      > (2) When it is taken off the Officiant, where is it put (by the MC)? Is
      > there any worry about folding it neatly, noting that it is probable that

      at
      > least the Officiant is waiting for the MC to signal him/the altar party
      to
      kneel?

      It is put back on that lectern, which merely involves laying it over
      the top in a way that it will stay there, and it's not too tricky to
      do that because of the shape and size of the lectern and the angle of
      its top.

      There's a bit of an awkward pause at the donning and putting off of
      the humeral veil, but there are longer pauses while the priest fiddles
      with the lunette to get it to stay in the monstrance, and again to get
      it out of the monstrance later. Some places have lots of organ
      improvisation to cover these things; we just wait in silence.


      --
      Scott R. Knitter
      Edgewater, Chicago, Illinois USA


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    • karen marshall
      Thank you Scott. I am used to contemplative prayer, and mediation, and praying the rosary using the Jesus prayer but not benediction as I am not from that
      Message 2 of 17 , Apr 2, 2009
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        Thank you Scott. I am used to contemplative prayer, and mediation,
        and praying the rosary using the Jesus prayer but not benediction as
        I am not from that tradition. I recently was in retreat with some
        Franciscan Friars in Northumberland and experienced Benediction with
        them and it gave me lots of food for thought. John Mcquarrie's article
        is useful.
        best wishes
        karen
        On 31 Mar 2009, at 21:12, Scott Knitter wrote:

        > Here's an excellent introduction, with some of theologian John
        > Macquarrie's insights:
        >
        > http://fullhomelydivinity.org/benediction.htm
        >
        > On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 3:08 PM, karen marshall
        > <deardollydenton@...> wrote:
        > > I'm glad that this has come up. I have not met with Benediction
        > until
        > > recently. I don't really understand it. Perhaps I am not meant to, I
        > > don't know. PLease will someone help me with some insights.
        >
        > --
        > Scott R. Knitter
        > Edgewater, Chicago, Illinois USA
        >
        >



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      • James Morgan
        David, I have the solution for all your liturgical woes, but it is, I fear, very expensive. You will have to remodel your entire sanctuary. Rdr. James
        Message 3 of 17 , Apr 2, 2009
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          David, I have the solution for all your liturgical woes, but it is, I fear, very expensive. You will have to remodel your entire sanctuary.
          Rdr. James

          --- In liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com, dlewisaao@... wrote:
          >
          > Yes, another option would be to add a server for this purpose, but (1) we are already using 6 acolytes (SD, MC, TH, CR, AC, AC) for most of the year and 5(no SD) "off season" and (2) there is the challenge of space.
          >
          > David
        • dlewisaao@aol.com
          True. Like most places, some liturgical decisions are heavily influenced by architecture! David In a message dated 4/2/2009 5:49:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight
          Message 4 of 17 , Apr 2, 2009
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            True. Like most places, some liturgical decisions are heavily influenced by
            architecture!

            David


            In a message dated 4/2/2009 5:49:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
            rdrjames@... writes:

            David, I have the solution for all your liturgical woes, but it is, I fear,
            very expensive. You will have to remodel your entire sanctuary.
            Rdr. James

            --- In liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com, dlewisaao@... wrote:
            >
            > Yes, another option would be to add a server for this purpose, but (1) we
            are already using 6 acolytes (SD, MC, TH, CR, AC, AC) for most of the year
            and 5(no SD) "off season" and (2) there is the challenge of space.
            >
            > David




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