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Re: [liturgy-l] All Saints and the Departed

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  • Nathan Nettleton
    ... I think that in addition to the pastoral need for commemoration of the dead, the conflation of All Saints and All Souls is being influenced by the growing
    Message 1 of 33 , Nov 4, 2004
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      Doug wrote:
      >
      > What I find particulalry interesting
      > is the gradual transmigration of some elements of All Souls into the All
      > Saints liturgy with the departed being assimilated into the the cloud of
      > witnesses. Although we are far from seeing a revival of the intercession of
      > saints and for the departed, there does seem to be a pastoral need to
      > commemorate our dead in the public liturgy. Anyone else notice this
      > tendancy?

      I think that in addition to the pastoral need for commemoration of the dead, the
      conflation of All Saints and All Souls is being influenced by the growing
      recovery of the concept of the sainthood of all the faithful departed in
      traditions that do not have any formal process of canonisation. A distinction
      between the saints and the other faithful departed doesn't really make much
      sense for those outside the Roman communion with its formal differentiation of
      the two. While there is a third group, departed non-Christians, who might also
      be commemorated or prayed for on All-Souls, the conflation of the other two
      groups seems to me to be a natural one and to explain much of the transmigration
      Doug refers to.

      Peace and hope,

      Nathan

      _____________________________________
      Nathan Nettleton
      Pastor, South Yarra Community Baptist Church
      Melbourne, Australia
      mailto:nathan@...
      _____________________________________
    • cfortunato@aol.com
      ... The nearest, or the following? In my church, it is observed on the Sunday within the Octave. Actually, we do both, calling the Nov 1, The Feast of All
      Message 33 of 33 , Nov 12, 2004
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        >Technically the Church of England gives the option of transferring
        >All Saints to the nearest Sunday, it is not a requirement.

        The nearest, or the following? In my church, it is observed on the Sunday within the Octave. Actually, we do both, calling the Nov 1, "The Feast of All Saints" and the Sunday following "The Solemnity."

        Carl Fortunato
        Vestry
        Cathedral of St. John the Divine, NYC

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        ignatz.blogspot.com
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